NTL Routing - YET AGAIN!

DemonOfTheFall

NTL seem to have changed their routing AGAIN for me.

Now half my UK connections have 200+ ping and the rest have a 50 ping.


tracert 83.142.230.110

Tracing route to 83.142.230.110 over a maximum of 30 hops

1 1 ms 1 ms 1 ms 089-100-042245.ntlworld.ie [89.100.42.245]
2 45 ms 74 ms 16 ms 10.91.64.1
3 67 ms 46 ms 46 ms 089-101-162009.ntlworld.ie [89.101.162.9]
4 14 ms 57 ms 21 ms dbln-t2core-a-ge-2-2-0-0.aorta.net [213.46.165.9
]
5 41 ms 64 ms 39 ms uk-lon01a-rd2-pos-1-2.aorta.net [213.46.160.17]

6 23 ms 52 ms 40 ms uk-lon01a-rd1-10ge-7-0.aorta.net [213.46.174.33]

7 19 ms 104 ms 22 ms uk-lon01a-ri1-pos-5-0.aorta.net [213.46.174.162]

8 198 ms 186 ms 234 ms LINX-gw12.UK.net.dtag.de [195.66.224.137]
9 213 ms 221 ms 239 ms 217.239.39.230
10 212 ms 203 ms 216 ms 217.6.48.238
11 184 ms 187 ms 188 ms ge-1-21_22.kit.sov.lon.rapidswitch.com [87.117.2
14.22]
12 196 ms 183 ms 194 ms 83.142.230.110

Trace complete.


Who do these geniuses employ to work out their routing for them !?

Boards routes through Amsterdam for me STILL. Jolt in the uk has a shorter trip, since that only routes through london....

Seriously, what are they playing at with their laughable excuse for a network ?

layke

DemonOfTheFall wrote:

Who do these geniuses employ to work out their routing for them !?

Routers, or more importantly a lil protocol called RIP2.

I don't know if Aorta.net (where your having problems) is actually part of NTL's network or if in fact they peer with another ISP that may have a dodgy config.

Usually routers update their tables and pick a different route but that depends on how frequent they update.

For all you know their main line is down for maintenance/upgrade and your using a different route then the norm.

DemonOfTheFall

I would hav thought that it was dtag.de causing the problem, seen as thats in Germany and I'm pinging a UK site...

Astro1996

C:\>tracert 83.142.230.110

Tracing route to 83.142.230.110 over a maximum of 30 hops

1 27 ms 64 ms 8 ms
2 9 ms 59 ms 40 ms 089-101-162045.ntlworld.ie [89.101.162.45]
3 100 ms 170 ms 10 ms dbln-t2core-b-ge-2-2-0-0.aorta.net [213.46.165.1
7]
4 130 ms 70 ms 70 ms nl-ams05a-rd1-pos-13-0.aorta.net [213.46.160.13]

5 102 ms 50 ms 86 ms nl-ams09a-ri1-ge-5-0.aorta.net [213.46.183.81]
6 54 ms 72 ms 44 ms ge-3-1-7.ams11.ip.tiscali.net [213.200.75.57]
7 111 ms 129 ms 111 ms so-3-1-0.lon22.ip.tiscali.net [213.200.80.30]
8 141 ms 107 ms 119 ms rapidswitch-gw1.ip.tiscali.net [213.200.79.210]

9 123 ms 102 ms 144 ms ge-2-21_22.kit.sov.lon.rapidswitch.com [87.117.2
14.26]
10 120 ms 101 ms 103 ms 83.142.230.110

Trace complete.

DemonOfTheFall

I'm still going through dtag.de but pings are back down to 50ms levels now... How odd.

bk

aorta.net looks like it is UPC's backbone network:

http://www.ipv6.aorta.net/

DemonOfTheFall

LOL! What a micky-mouse web page. Looks like 1 guy's blog, combined with a supposedly international-grade IP transit network.

layke

hehe, well in all honesty they can setup static IP addressing but you gotta remember you may have 3 hops and your trip time will be 500ms or you can go over 10 and it will be 50ms. Hops make FA difference.

On your original tracert your ping doubles in the UK and then for some bizarre reson gets sent to Germany where it goed bananas? It could be the way NTL used to work here. If you were with say Esat you'd route up north first, then to Eircom, then to the UK NTL network then back to Ireland. It used to be a bloody mess although things have improved over the years and ISP's are now peering with each other to shorten the trips.

TimTim

layke wrote:

Routers, or more importantly a lil protocol called RIP2.

Isn't RIP2 a little limiting for a international network? I would of thought BGP would be what all ISP's are using these days.

nickhilliard

layke wrote:

Routers, or more importantly a lil protocol called RIP2.

Heh, what a hoot! RIP2 is what you might use on your linksys or your netgear box at home. Aorta - like all other service providers, bar none - use BGP4 for exterior routing.

I don't know if Aorta.net (where your having problems) is actually part of NTL's network or if in fact they peer with another ISP that may have a dodgy config.

NTL Ireland has been owned for several months by Liberty Global, who plan to change their trading brand to UPC at some stage shortly. Aorta is the name of the network used by UPC's different operations in the different countries they serve.

Usually routers update their tables and pick a different route but that depends on how frequent they update.

For all you know their main line is down for maintenance/upgrade and your using a different route then the norm.

Oh my.

Look, layke, could I suggest that before posting this sort of crap, you get some clue on what you're talking about?

Incidentally, UPC's connectivity to other irish networks should improve shortly, as will their general connectivity to locations outside Ireland. It's just that they are still building new infrastructure over here, post the Liberty Global buyout, and this sort of thing takes time. Trust me - there are quite a few smart people working in Aorta, and a bunch of them are directly involved in the IE build.

And www.ipv6.aorta.net isn't UPC's main web page, or even their main NOC web page. It's their public IPv6 network web page, and that's just going to end up pretty much at the bottom of the priority list as far as pretty design, tasteful colour schemes and cutesy CSS is concerned.

-nick

DemonOfTheFall

So nick.... Who do you know, in what compnay ?!

ntlbell

IIRC Nick is the head of operations at INEX.

I don't see why you have to ask who he works for.

bk

Hi nick, welcome to boards and thanks for clearing up a few things.

I look forward to UPC's routing vastly improving here.

DemonOfTheFall

ntlbell wrote:

IIRC Nick is the head of operations at INEX.

I don't see why you have to ask who he works for.

I didn't mean it in a negative way!

I just thought he'd provided some great insight into how things were working out and was wondering how he knew.

I'm not peering through Germany anymore anyway, so happy days. Still managing to ping between 50 and 200 to Eircom users within a few kilometers of my house though.

shltter

nickhilliard wrote:

Heh, what a hoot! RIP2 is what you might use on your linksys or your netgear box at home. Aorta - like all other service providers, bar none - use BGP4 for exterior routing.



NTL Ireland has been owned for several months by Liberty Global, who plan to change their trading brand to UPC at some stage shortly. Aorta is the name of the network used by UPC's different operations in the different countries they serve.



Oh my.

Look, layke, could I suggest that before posting this sort of crap, you get some clue on what you're talking about?

Incidentally, UPC's connectivity to other irish networks should improve shortly, as will their general connectivity to locations outside Ireland. It's just that they are still building new infrastructure over here, post the Liberty Global buyout, and this sort of thing takes time. Trust me - there are quite a few smart people working in Aorta, and a bunch of them are directly involved in the IE build.

And www.ipv6.aorta.net isn't UPC's main web page, or even their main NOC web page. It's their public IPv6 network web page, and that's just going to end up pretty much at the bottom of the priority list as far as pretty design, tasteful colour schemes and cutesy CSS is concerned.

-nick

Its a pity that NTL or Liberty Global or whatever they are called this week could not inform its customers that it is upgrading its infrastructure and that things will improve.
It would be even better if they could estimate a time frame in which we can expect improvements.
The general impression around here is that NTL has gone to the dogs since the takeover and that it might stay routing our traffic around continental Europe forever a simple explanation that this was temporary and that they were working to improve it would have been of great benefit to all of its customers.
It is typical of the service from NTL of late that it is someone from INEX that explains the situation for them.
BTW Thanks for the Information