No ban for 196kmh Porsche driver (www.unison.ie)

It BeeMee

I don't think he should be fined.
Nor, indeed, get any points.

Instead, he should be forced to watch his precious porsche go through a crusher.
Better still, he should be forced to push the button to activate it......

kippy

The only speed camera I've ever seen at the spawell is a gard with a handheld detector.

There is a fixed camera there all right (unless my geography is wrong).
If you look at the road markings just after the speed limit drops from 120 to 80 on the main western to dublin road you'd realise there is a fixed camera there (as well as the numerous signs)

196 or even 300Kph isn't dangerous, just ask a German

Speeders would generally not be interested in reading any more than that sentence, this is the problem, they do not see the danger, and as you have mentioned these roads of ours arent up to that standard and never will be, hence the need for limits and enforcement of said limits.

silent

unkel wrote:

Stopping distance from 100km/h to standstill:

Generic: 80m
Porsche Carrera 4: 35m

ehm, a lada kalina (possible the biggest POS on 4 wheels) has a stopping distance of 59,4/55,2m (cold/warm)
anything over 40m is considered poor
best stopping power from 100km/h in a 'ordinary' car is ~33m (m3 csl I think)

byte

deman wrote:

Already being discussed here

That's a different story deman, but on the same road.

Donegal News wrote:

THE decision to acquit a Letterkenny driver detected driving at 197kph through Barnesmore gap has been met with outrage this week

Controversy has surrounded the decision by Judge Derek McVeigh to find driver Paul McAteer (19) of Lismonaghan, Letterkenny, not guilty for dangerous driving at Keadue, Barnesmore on 3 March. The decision was made at a recent sitting of Donegal District Court following a week of carnage on the roads where 12 young people lost their lives.

Garda Sweeney recorded McAteer travelling at 195kph at 10.40am. He was driving a blue BMW with four passengers in the car. He stopped the driver near Drumlonagher and arrested the defendant and took him to Donegal Garda Station. He charged McAteer with dangerous driving.

Under cross-examination by solicitor Mr Paudge Dorrian, Garda Sweeney said the car did not cross the white line and no-one had to jump out of the way. Garda Sweeney said that as a member of the Garda Traffic Corps for eight years he had seen first hand the effects of speed and considered McAteer's driving to be dangerous.

Judge Derek McVeigh said McAteer would've been travelling at around 120mph and it appeared from the evidence was driving at speed but was not driving dangerously. He dismissed the charge.

Linky: http://www.nwipp-newspapers.com/dn/free/287362082939382.php

So basically, 2 guys got away with such speeds because they got they were charged wrongly?

Car Mad

god damit eveyone is mixed up lol dam roads who needs em,drive safely ladies and gentlemen

Guy:Incognito

kippy wrote:

There is a fixed camera there all right (unless my geography is wrong).
If you look at the road markings just after the speed limit drops from 120 to 80 on the main western to dublin road you'd realise there is a fixed camera there (as well as the numerous signs).

Your geography is indeed wrong. Your thinking of the spa hotel in lucan. The spawell is on the n81 between the m50 and templeogue bridge.

C_Breeze

deman wrote:

Yeah but he WASN'T convicted!

GOOD

is_that_so

SouperComputer wrote:

196 or even 300Kph isn't dangerous, just ask a German

AFAIK travelling as double the speed limit in Germany is instant loss of licence. There are certain places on the autobahn where you are allowed to go at those speeds. Many have speed limits.

Lovely writer

byte wrote:

That's a different story deman, but on the same road.



Linky: http://www.nwipp-newspapers.com/dn/free/287362082939382.php

So basically, 2 guys got away with such speeds because they got they were charged wrongly?

I would be inclined to believe that influential people in Donegal brought influence to bear on the judge. No intelligent person (and judges are suppose to be intelligent) could imagine that driving at those speeds was not extremely dangerous.

dubstub

Lovely writer wrote:

No intelligent person (and judges are suppose to be intelligent) could imagine that driving at those speeds was not extremely dangerous.

As has other posters have noted, driving at those speeds are not necessarily dangerous. I regularly drive at 185-190kph. But it's on a Spanish highway with excellent visibility and in a car that is safe to drive at those speeds.
Doing that kind of speed on any Irish road is reckless. The judge seems to have examined the evidence and decided that it was not dangerous in this case. I find it hard to know how he came to that conclusion, even if the roads were empty and it was in a car that was able to do that speed safely, the fact that other road users would not be expecting cars travelling at that speed and the fact that Irish roads are in crap condition means that this could not have been anything other than dangerous.
Disclaimer: I'm not familar with the road he was caught on but it can't be in a condition safe for those speeds?

unkel

is_that_so wrote:

There are certain places on the autobahn where you are allowed to go at those speeds

Yes so in the view of the Germans, speed in itself isn't necessarily dangerous. The judge seems to have the same view...

kippy

Yes so in the view of the Germans, speed in itself isn't necessarily dangerous. The judge seems to have the same view...

Lets stop this crap about making excuses.
1.
This is not germany.
2.
Even if it were Germany, our laws are different.
3.
Germans will tell you that driving at such speed on Irish roads is dangerous.
4.
Germans do have speed limits on all roads outside of the autobahn-so let cut the crap about Germans.

The attitude of a lot of people towards speed in this country leaves a lot to be desiried.
The faster you drive the more likely there will be a fatality if something goes wrong. This is physics. Whether or not no speed limits are a good thing on roads is up to that country. I personally believe it is not a good thing. No matter how good the road or the vehicle you drive.
Roads in Donegal are notorious for accidents, I think I know the piece of road that the driver was caught on and it aint a good road by any means.

The bottom line was he was well over the legal speed limit and in my opinion he got off very very lightly. The judge did not do what he should have done, however he was within the current guidelines in doing what he did.
The current guidelines need to be changed.

peasant

right ...heres what the Germans think about speeding:


fines for going above the signposted speed limit within built up areas:
innerhalb geschlossener Ortschaften (gilt auch für 30 km-Zone !)
bis 10 km/h 15,- EUR
11-15 km/h 25,- EUR
16-20 km/h 35,- EUR
21-25 km/h 50,- EUR, 1 Punkt
26-30 km/h 60,- EUR, 3 Punkte
31-40 km/h 100,- EUR, 3 Punkte, 1 Monat Fahrverbot
41-50 km/h 125,- EUR, 4 Punkte, 1 Monat Fahrverbot
51-60 km/h 175,- EUR, 4 Punkte, 2 Monate Fahrverbot
61-70 km/h 300,- EUR, 4 Punkte, 3 Monate Fahrverbot
über 70 km/h 425,- EUR, 4 Punkte, 3 Monate Fahrverbot


fines for exceeding the signposted speed limit outside buildt up areas:
außerhalb geschlossener Ortschaften (z.B. Landstraße, Autobahn, auch in Baustellen)
bis 10 km/h 10,- EUR
11-15 km/h 20,- EUR
16-20 km/h 30,- EUR
21-25 km/h 40,- EUR, 1 Punkt
26-30 km/h 50,- EUR, 3 Punkte
31-40 km/h 75,- EUR, 3 Punkte
41-50 km/h 100,- EUR, 3 Punkte, 1 Monat Fahrverbot
51-60 km/h 150,- EUR, 4 Punkte, 1 Monat Fahrverbot
61-70 km/h 275,- EUR, 4 Punkte, 2 Monate Fahrverbot
über 70 km/h 375,- EUR, 4 Punkte, 3 Monate Fahrverbot

Punkte = penalty points
Fahrverbot= banned from driving for x months

so in both cases these guys would have used the bus for three months, got 4 points on their licence and a fine of 375 euro (plus 26.50 in fees)

EDIT ...oh ...and if their driving would have been deemed "dangerous" it would have been another automatic (i.e. without a courtcase) 7 points on the licence ...bye,bye licence ...plus a possible prison sentence/ really hefty fine depending on the amount of danger they posed and the outcome of their day in court

deman

Lovely writer wrote:

I would be inclined to believe that influential people in Donegal brought influence to bear on the judge. No intelligent person (and judges are suppose to be intelligent) could imagine that driving at those speeds was not extremely dangerous.

Sorry guys. I just came to the realisation myself that these were 2 different incidents. Who'da thought it? Same speed, same county, same area (roughly), same verdict and, most importantly, SAME JUDGE!

Guys, if you have a fast car, e.g. a Porshe or a BMW, why not come up to dear old Donegal and see how hard she can go. It's perfectly legal up here (it's my home btw ignoring current location). As long as you have Judge McVeigh and a rich daddy, you'll be fine, and NOT fined.

Oh, and in Finland, police can issue bans themselves without it going to court for a maximum of 6 months.
http://www.poliisi.fi/poliisi/home.nsf/Pages/07897C7BD4BDDB12C2256C370036F94F

MrPudding

kippy wrote:

Lets stop this crap about making excuses.
1.
This is not germany.
2.
Even if it were Germany, our laws are different.
3.
Germans will tell you that driving at such speed on Irish roads is dangerous.
4.
Germans do have speed limits on all roads outside of the autobahn-so let cut the crap about Germans.

The attitude of a lot of people towards speed in this country leaves a lot to be desiried.
The faster you drive the more likely there will be a fatality if something goes wrong. This is physics. Whether or not no speed limits are a good thing on roads is up to that country. I personally believe it is not a good thing. No matter how good the road or the vehicle you drive.
Roads in Donegal are notorious for accidents, I think I know the piece of road that the driver was caught on and it aint a good road by any means.

The bottom line was he was well over the legal speed limit and in my opinion he got off very very lightly. The judge did not do what he should have done, however he was within the current guidelines in doing what he did.
The current guidelines need to be changed.

In addition, there are now only very small sections of the autobahn network that have no limits.

MrP

Alun

MrPudding wrote:

In addition, there are now only very small sections of the autobahn network that have no limits.

That's a comment that's bandied about here a lot, but I have to say that after a recent two week trip there, I didn't notice any significant difference between now and when I lived over there 15 years ago. If you're looking at motorway networks around large urban areas like the Ruhrgebiet, then yes, they have limits there, but then they always did, but on the open sections between the major cities they're pretty much all still unrestricted as far as I can see (except for areas around the major motorway intersections, that is).

unkel

Alun wrote:

That's a comment that's bandied about here a lot

I was thinking the same thing. I have nothing to back it up, but a couple of years ago about half of all Autobahns were unrestricted iirc

peasant

I've done an extensive search but I can't come up with any solid, never mind official data.

Seems to be that around 30% of German motorway are still unrestricted, but even that is under dispute, because there are an awful lot of places that have automated speed governing systems that react to traffic density and weather circumstances.

So while one section of Autobahn might be unrestricted on a bright Sunday morning at 7, a rainy Friday afternoon during rushour might see it restricted anywhere between 60 -120 km/h

The days where you could drive for hours on end at insane speeds are definetly over. If you're lucky, you might find the odd 20 - 50 km stretch that's unregulated ...if you're even luckier it might actually be clear enough to really open up.

MrPudding

peasant wrote:

I've done an extensive search but I can't come up with any solid, never mind official data.

Seems to be that around 30% of German motorway are still unrestricted, but even that is under dispute, because there are an awful lot of places that have automated speed governing systems that react to traffic density and weather circumstances.

So while one section of Autobahn might be unrestricted on a bright Sunday morning at 7, a rainy Friday afternoon during rushour might see it restricted anywhere between 60 -120 km/h

The days where you could drive for hours on end at insane speeds are definetly over. If you're lucky, you might find the odd 20 - 50 km stretch that's unregulated ...if you're even luckier it might actually be clear enough to really open up.

I have carried out no research on the subject and based my comment on a section of Fith Gear. Jason Plato was driving an Audi S6 (I Believe) and was trying to get 180mph or something out of it.

He commented on the difficulty in finding a area of autobahn which was unrestricted and further, when you did find one, you would be lucky if it was long enough or that the traffic was light enough.

MrP