Dutch psychic Jomanda & Breastimplants: The True Story

6th

Answering my question with a question is only showing both you and your arguement up for what they are.

Now again I ask: Can you prove that Sylvia Millecam performs mircles? Yes or No.

I ask because you have made claims that she has/can. I have not stated my beliefs either way so it is up to you to back up for statements.

If you are of the opinion that I am challenging your statements as a nonbeliever then I suggest you chech out this forum: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=446

Now answer the questions put to you and stop dodging them.

Btw, have you personally meet this woman or experienced her powahs first hand?

ISAW

FE30033 wrote:

Can you prove she can not ?

How many times must you be told?

Shifting the burden
proving a negative

Have you learned anything?

Please please plaese explain to me what "shifting the burden" adn "proving a negative " means so i know you understand it. Can you do that?

I write. I am no researcher. I do not have to proof anything.

Actually you have been tolfd several times now when you come to a skeptics forum and make claims you DO hae to provide evidence or withdraw the claim. You seem to ignore what you are informed. you keep resorting to the same logical fallacies and ignoring the advice you are given. this amounts to time wasting.

Now you have left off the personal attacks. they are not nearly so blatent. so I suggest you now stop the trolling and timewasting before someone complains about you ignoriong answers and asking the same questions over and over.

a desperate straw to try to shoot the messenger so that the own imagination or believe-conviction can be kept up as a pink elephant that the message might be worthless or justifies ignoring the message, the content.

I suggest you also look up "mixed methphors". If you write for a living you have a problem.

I presented the 'Sylvia Millecam-The True Story' as a matter of discussion ...

along with a load of seemingly unresearched references and claims about Jomanda's paranormal powers

snip more claims based on TV footage which prove nothing. Need i post the statue of liberty disappearing on TV again?

FE30033

ISAW wrote:

Same again. shiften the burden!

I do not want to repeat myself (see post to '6th'). All you seem te be able to do is headstrong bleating out and repeating about only one sentence. If you yourself are not able to answer my simple questions and/or ignore them selectively, I see no reason why I should make an effort to answer your questions. Most of your questions can be found in earlier postings and/or on the internet, if you do not want to make an effort to find the answers to the questions YOU ask, I will assume you are not really interested, but only want to find a stick to hit the dog with (in your fantasy), to make it go away, as you stated, but it is a fantasy to think that the matter presented will go away with me.

I have stated the matter. Do with it as you like.

ISAW

Unnecessary header in bold which claims to mean something
[quote= http://www.spaink.net/parool/20000815.html]
We received gifts we had brought ourselves. Everyone had to bring something that was collected at the entrance, and later distributed by Jomanda, who was ''led from above'' as to what gift to give to each person. Each gift came with a message. "A bottle. I am getting that it has something to do with drinking. Do you perhaps drink too much? The message is that you'd better drink a little less.'' The recipient shakes her head: no, she doesn't drink alcohol. ''Someone close to you, perhaps?'' The recipient insists. Nobody she cared much about imbibed too much. Quickly Jomanda faces the hall. ''Who brought this gift? Ah, you. Do you perhaps have problem with alcohol? Of someone close to you?'' In concentration, the giftgiver nods. Yes, she has a nephew who drinks too much. ''Well, than then message is for him. Tell him that it is not good too drink too much.'' In the hall, respect rose. That she, Jomanda, knew this about the nephew...
Lourdes in the Betuwe (Dutch) Karin Spain, Het Parool, Aug. 15, 2000.
[/quote]

Un official translation. thanks to the apologetics index for these quotes.

Jomanda's web site includes a recipe claimed to heal cancer.
[quote= http://krant.telegraaf.nl/cgi-bin/nieuwsarchief?http://www.telegraaf.nl/krant/archief/20000520/teksten/bin.jomanda.html]
A recipe by Jomanda purported to heal cancer, posted on the internet, has incurred sharp reactions from the medical community. According to Jomanda, known as a healing medium, a mixture of codliver oil, honey, and sage is enough to control and get rid of cancer

The Netherlands Cancer Institute is angry over Jomanda's recipe, because her advice is complete nonsense.

Woede over recept Jomanda tegen kanker (Dutch) De Telegraaf, May 19, 2000
[/quote]

Jomanda may have edited the website but one can not escape the long arm of the wayback machine
April 28 1999 (note the Us flag instead of the Union Jack)
http://web.archive.org/web/20000419211648/www.jomanda.nl/english.html
Heres where you get a union jack:
http://web.archive.org/web/20051025054624/http://www.jomanda.nl/

Anyone game for searching Wayback machine and checking out the "recipe" claim?

It is my sincere belief that Jomanda is not in any way paranormally gifted.
The Phenomenon - Jomanda, Ewald Vervaet,

ISAW

FE30033 wrote:

I do not want to repeat myself (see post to '6th'). All you seem te be able to do is headstrong bleating out and repeating about only one sentence. If you yourself are not able to answer my simple questions and/or ignore them selectively, I see no reason why I should make an effort to answer your questions.

Exactly! You dont see reason! The point has been made several times pointing you to logical fallacies in your reasoning.

THIS ISNT A TIT FOR TAT FORUM!

YOU CAME HERE MAKING A CLAIM. Others asked you to prove it. Asking others to prove you are wrong is SHIFTING THE BURDEN. Refusing to put up or shut up and claiming that the reason you wont put up is because others wont take the burden off you or others refuse to prove a negative is NOT a reasonable way to behave.

Most of your questions can be found in earlier postings
...
I have stated the matter. Do with it as you like.

you have been asked for evidence. yu failed to provide any. you are fast becoming a joke. please dont also become a nuisance by re posting unsupported claims.

If you wont answer the questions i have nothing further to say to you. please dont persist in reposting the same unsupported claims and asking others to prove them wrong or I will complain about you.

FE30033

6th wrote:

Perfect post. 100%
My problem with Jomanda, is that she offering her "healings" as an alternative to medicine. .

Jomanda has been calling out for 30 years for co-operation with regular medicine AND / AND. Not OR / OR. Jomanda insisted to Sylvia Millecam she visited regular doctors, which Jomanda also says at all her healings "never to exclude regular medicine".

JOMANDA: WORKING TOGETHER
( source - newspaper 'De Gelderlander', 13-04-2002 ) [ Jomanda ] - "That is very easy: there MUST be made a bridge between alternative- and regular medicine. I look at that especially because I have been busy with that for 26 years. A lot must change in that area in the Netherlands. From te reactions of people it seems that there is a lot of need to that. I do make that opening to regular medicine. I work already for years with a few doctors who are pen minded to that. But they on their turn have problems with their colleahues. I find that that batlle fight should be over for once"

JOMANDA: PSYCHIATRIC COOPERATION
(source - Dutch Tv-programma 'Big Entertainer Club', bco RTL4, 18 march 1999) - [Jomanda]- " Furthermore I work outside Netherlands, abroad, I am allowed much easier to get into hospitals. In Here in the Netherlands you have some kind of threshold to get over, while abroad I can walk over intensive cares" - [Threshold?] - " I think struggle against doctors, while it is during the years a little bit improved, but it is really struggle agianst walls, and not getting any further"- [ Due to Unbelieve?] - "I think people are afraid, that there territory is touched, while that is not true, because there will always be sick people, also in psychiatric-clinics, as I have stated before, I am allowed to do much about taking away negativity / entities from people, which is very succesfull. It seems impossible to get into psychiatric-clinic's. People just stop me, while many many people are behind iron-bars, and maybe it is thus too simple to solve somethings through the Divine World through me as medium to rescue, free these people, because the physicians are yet not able to do anything, but I am stopped, I can not go through them, and I am very sorry about that"

6th

I beg for people not to post on this anymore. The comments I would like to make about FE and his arguements (or lack of) would get me banned.

FACT is that no one here will get answers from the OP as he said he is just putting the story forward and has nothing to add to it or to back it up.

robindch

This thread is going nowhere -- closed!