SU Council Motions, Mon 27th November 2006

panda100

Kaptain Redeye wrote:

However the past week has seen a lot of other people say some nasty things about and to me.

And its only november

.

Paddy it will get worse and worse I asure you before it gets better
I cant believe Im actually saying this after all our tiffs but Id actually like to see Paddy running for Pres and showing brenwatcher that you dont have to be a political hack to win an election but just a genuine,harworking girl/guy who knows they'll do a good job.

As for dissing the layout of my motion...dont tell me how to write a good motion mr vampires in trap

Stabshauptmann

You're right panda, if theres anyone here on boards Ive had more tiffs with I doubt it, but believe it or not I prefer your posts to many others. You seem to have made a few enemies by speaking your mind. I respect that.

TBH I always disagree with Humbert but I think we're friends enough in real life.

panda100

Kaptain Redeye wrote:

TBH I always disagree with Humbert but I think we're friends enough in real life.

Me too.I like chatting to humbert in real life but I disagree with him about EVERYTHING on boards. Saying that he loves my new proposal on positive body images;)

Stabshauptmann

I prefer the new one to the old one too, but I think its important to stress that this is a motion about body image and mental health; which I feel is significantly different from the feminist equality agenda of Arts poster motion.

Dont let anyone Hi-jack this. Some types of support could really undermine it

humbert

True on both counts though I know the kaptain IRL and know not to get wound up when he's aggressively argumentative, I have sympathy for those who don't though:)

Stabshauptmann

Sympathy for those dont know how not to get wound up, or sympathy for those who dont know me in real life

humbert

Kaptain Redeye wrote:

I prefer the new one to the old one too, but I think its important to stress that this is a motion about body image and mental health; which I feel is significantly different from the feminist equality agenda of Arts poster motion.

Dont let anyone Hi-jack this. Some types of support could really undermine it

I couldn't agree more with this. Keep the focus healthy and positive, promoting rather than prohibiting and whatnot.

Kaptain Redeye wrote:

Sympathy for those dont know how not to get wound up, or sympathy for those who dont know me in real life

Both of course:D

Blush_01

Garret wrote:

im not for the motion just so you know

I genuinely didn't know the guys name. If I had wanted to, I could have found out, but the way in which I phrased what I said highlighted the point I was making - surely that's clear. For or against the motion, calling someone "whatshisface" isn't usually going mortally offend anyone.

The_Minister

Blush_01 wrote:

calling someone "whatshisface" isn't usually going mortally offend anyone.

I got this, and I loved it.

pretty*monster

Kaptain Redeye wrote:

However the past week has seen a lot of other people say some nasty things about and to me.

And its only november

You'll get used to it, soon it will seem like the most natural thing in the world

Hurray for student politcs.

Miss GAAfia

pretty*monster wrote:

You'll get used to it, soon it will seem like the most natural thing in the world

She's right you know.....you'll get the abuse even if you don't run and you're just involved in a campaign...puts you off for life.....ah so ruthless and the stakes are so low.......:D

Brenwatcher

Henry Kissenger once said that he would prefer Middle East talks to University politics!

So good luck all would be hacks

Stabshauptmann

Ehh, you should be careful with the use of that word Brenwatcher.

Suppose its all a matter of perspective. How does anyone define a Hack. Few people who get the label think they deserve it (Im not actually sure who you are gubbie so no comment there) Generally though I think its fair to define Hack as:

HACK Noun.
Def.
1)Horribly overambitious student intent on climbing the greasy pole of success. First heard at Cambridge.
2)A cheap, mediocre, or second-rate practitioner, especially in the fields of journalism and literature: a charlatan or incompetent.
3)Someone who seeks office or position simply to add padding to their CV
4) A)The holder of an obsolete or irrelevant position,
or position within an organisation felt to be obsolete or irrelevant
C) or preoccupied with following the goings on of people and organisations
felt to be obsolete or irrelevant



The stereotypical profile from what I can tell is:
A)keen interest in university media and general going on
I **** you not, 2 of my flat mates didnt know that coca coala products are banned in SU shops, another thought it was the entire university. None of them know what events are on or when. We're all final years.

B)SU involvement
Well Ok, a lot of SU motions falls into the categories of common sense and extreme idealism. But noone ever seems to acknowledge the benefit they get from SU provided services.

C)CV Padding
Ok, Im the societies council rep on the management committee of the centre club.
Yes on the face of it that does seem pointless, but
Ive raised the issue of Free Trade beer and wine which we're gonna start stocking now
the cans issue is still ongoing. There are strong objections from the college but it really is all gonna come down to the economics of it.

But then again, there are a lot of committees that have no power and more that dont even meet

D)Debating
I dont know why. Suppose because its the same ppl who speak a lot at council that go to all the debates. Or maybe its the topics of debates. But it has that reputation.
Im a final year and still have my maidens rights, I just hope I score the bitch who ever she is before I graduate

E)Idealism
Which seems to be defined as the lack of complete pessimism. Margrette Thatcher & co really succeed with the old "There is No Alternative". Masterful marketing *does commerce chortle

Dan hayden added internet cynic to my list, wasnt aware till then that he read boards *waves at dan*

Do ppl think thats an accurate definition and stereotype?

I dont know you, but are you sure you escape the term?

For me, the term Hack means one of three things.
1)You're usurping something to benefit your career.
2)You're not very good at what you do
3)You're a busy body

Im none of those things.

humbert

I think the word is more a combination of 1) and 2) there. Though most of the SU hacks are busy bodies, not all busy bodies are hacks.

Brenwatcher

I glad you think so highly of yourself, so perhaps you could tell what you have contributed to the SU in the last number of years, also why bother running if not to contribute to your career ( that s nothing to be ashamed of BTW, we are all in college to learn as much as poss to benefit our future career and I dont just mean academical) and you were a bit a busy body when you wanted to know why I lived in Belgrove?!


These are only merely pointers as to your response to me and I dont mean to attack you...since apparently you have to explain yourself on boards when you make a comment

Sangre

Brenwatcher wrote:

also why bother running if not to contribute to your career

Are you for real? Speaks volumes about SU politics doesn't it? Well I guess she'd know, she is in with the 'proper circles'.

humbert

Brenwatcher wrote:

I glad you think so highly of yourself, so perhaps you could tell what you have contributed to the SU in the last number of years, also why bother running if not to contribute to your career ( that s nothing to be ashamed of BTW, we are all in college to learn as much as poss to benefit our future career and I dont just mean academical) and you were a bit a busy body when you wanted to know why I lived in Belgrove?!


These are only merely pointers as to your response to me and I dont mean to attack you...since apparently you have to explain yourself on boards when you make a comment

Not everyone is in college for the benefit of their career, I'm not and I'll refrain from making the obvious arts student joke. Also while it may be true that many of the SU people are there primarily to pad their C.V. it's not the case for all of them.

Stepherunie

Ok tbh I think the vast majority of people who are involved in the SU aren't there for there C.V. out of all the people I'd know reasonably to very well on Council I think there'd only be one person whom I'd even consider to be on it for her C.V. and even then I think she gives a damn.

Now maybe I just know people who are genuinely involved for the right reasons but I don't think many is right - i think minority is more correct - and more than likely this was more apparent this year than other years due to the far larger number of seats on Council this year.

Brenwatcher wrote:

also why bother running if not to contribute to your career

Omg how shallow can you get. Let me tell you this: I'm, as many people know, a rep for radiography, I'm pretty much guaranteed a job when I qualify, in fact I've already been offered one without even so much as a glance at my C.V. I'm on council and an internal class rep not to further my career (in fact in many ways it almost disadvantages me in my profession) but to help give students in my class and course a voice.

Having spent my first two years in college unheard and with not one person giving a damn about the huge issues facing my class I became a rep. I've campaigned for better treatment, I've given out to lecturers for there shoddy treatment of students, I've told the school that they kicked students in the nuts for working there asses off in second year, I've fought to get vaccinations and even though that's not sorted they wont' stop hearing my voice until it is.

I've taken abuse from lecturers and students alike, I've spent hours when I could have been studying to make life better for my class. I've lecture addressed and dealt with students issues, I've helped them get onto the people they need to speak with.

Yes I did all this for one tiny line on my C.V. 'SU Class Rep 06/07'

Brenwatcher you say your not a rep: Well trying being one and then you have the right to comment on peoples motivations - until then unless you have something constructive to say about reps be quiet.

HappyCrackHead

I personally enjoy Sabbatical elections...

The lies and chicanery (sp?) make it oh so worthwhile.

I wonder if anyone will offer magic student cards again.

Paddy's been outed, best of luck.

I wonder who else will come out of the SU election closet.

Stabshauptmann

so perhaps you could tell what you have contributed to the SU in the last number of years

Do you really want to know how active I am when it comes to student representation?

Last year I had a problem with an xmas exam, I cant go into details but there was a definite case of a lecturer acting improperly.
So I got appointed to the Student-Staff consultative forum where I raised my concerns and got the situation remedied.

I believe societies are central to student life and I was elected Auditor of the Dutch Society for my work, commitment, and organisational skills.

I was elected overwhelmingly to the management committee of the centre bar and I could have had the student bar too, but I declined the nomination.

At meetings of said committee so far this year I have raised the possibility of selling cans like they do in the Pav. But Ive also talked about other areas of the bars product range policy and am happy to report that we are going to start stocking Fair Trade Beer and extend the €3 pint range.

Im also on the societies finance committee and the welfare committee.

During the Well Fair week I support the graffiti session and massages. I was at the mental health awareness talk. Im contributing to the welfare guide and am very much involved in rewriting the college alcohol policy with Barry.

I also just happen to be floating around and help out when I can. Ive done some postering, manned the table in the Student centre for voter registration and assembled wheel chairs (to the best of my ability).

Ive submit 4 motions so far this year. All relevant to student life in UCD and completely a political.

Im not writing them for publicity, if I wanted publicity then I would have done something to get my name in the papers re:the can campaign

also why bother running if not to contribute to your career

Im not happy with the way the SU is run and I have many many great ideas on how to improve it.

As for it benifiting my career as an investment banker I doubt it, if anything the huge amount of time I put into these sort of things - that I should be spending studying, will hurt my overall grade and ultimately my degree.

My chosen career has nothing to do with politics or activism. I will be a number cruncher.

Paddy's been outed

I announced my candidacy openly on boards, at class rep training and at 2 different Dutch Soc events.

dajaffa

Kaptain Redeye wrote:

During the Well Fair week I support the graffiti session and massages.

Hope you enjoyed the massages, I was so busy doing my organisation biz that I never even got to give one myself, though my classmates did a fine job. Word caught on quickly + after a quiet first day there were loadsa ppl. On the last day we even ran out of time (+ sorry 2 any1 who missed out, it was very sucessful, might be done again @ some stage).

Kaptain Redeye wrote:

assembled wheel chairs (to the best of my ability).

Yeah, they can be bloody hard!

Chakar

dajaffa wrote:

Hope you enjoyed the massages, I was so busy doing my organisation biz that I never even got to give one myself, though my classmates did a fine job. Word caught on quickly + after a quiet first day there were loadsa ppl. On the last day we even ran out of time (+ sorry 2 any1 who missed out, it was very sucessful, might be done again @ some stage).

I got a massage too from a beautiful physio.Lovely

cast_iron

Am I the only one here that thinks the last 2/3 pages or so have pretty much nothing to do with the thread title and completely off-topic??

I've seen very little discussion on the MOTIONS in them.

gubbie

Brenwatcher wrote:

These are only merely pointers as to your response to me and I dont mean to attack you...since apparently you have to explain yourself on boards when you make a comment

Its not that you have to explain yourself, just that its hard to bring across tone in writing so ciascuno il suo!

Can't wait til the council is over so we can lay this thread to rest. All the motions have been changed so much that they are no longer the same motions that were put up. I say Boo Urns to that

(in fact in many ways it almost disadvantages me in my profession)

Steph you're right as usual. If you have "... for the student union" employers can either go two ways:
1) Oh brill, they're a leader
2) Uh oh, they're trouble makers.
Don't you think something like (say in Stephs case) "Auditor of radio soc" would look better? Don't you think that if someone was in it for their cv's they'd have gone for something like that? Actually if you look around the union you'll see that the people who want these things for their cv, don't just go for one thing-they go and get involved in loads of things.
Its also quite horrible being a su rep-you're expected to do loads and you get so little thanks back. For the thanks you get off your class though, that feeling is a lot nicer then "SU class rep" on the old cv


Oh and Paddy, please stick to your promises that you put into your manifesto. Scanning through the previous bunches manifestos, theres hardly any that have done all what they said they'd do

dajaffa

gubbie wrote:

ase) Actually if you look around the union you'll see that the people who want these things for their cv, don't just go for one thing-they go and get involved in loads of things.

That better not be directed at me

To be honest unless you're planning a career in politics, I don't think it's fair to be called a careerist. Yeah class rep is a slight plus on a CV, but there's plenty of thing's that'd look better on a CV that involve less work. Personally I'm involved in Bfm, the SU, hockey + other stuff outside of college. If people want to call me a careerist then go ahead, but like being able to produce a radio show won't do me a fat lot of good if I'm going for a job as a physio, + class rep is barely a plus for my CV + for a lot of people involved in the SU, it's a similar scenario. I just want to help my class out and the wider UCD community as much as I can.

gubbie

dajaffa wrote:

That better not be directed at me

Oops no!! I just meant in general. You're just a hack

I also like the amount of knowledge that you get from the su... actually come to think of it the knowledge I have is due to good relations with professors and postgrads... hmm

Edit: See how we're just rambling now... for the love of all things fluffy Hulla (oh I so wanna call you by your real name cos you know) close this thread.

Sangre

Stop posting in the thread then.

humbert

I don't really want to revive this thread but this is hardly worth starting another thread for.

Having been watching these motions go up for the last month or so I got to thinking, as wonderfully formal and serious and important as they look what actually happens when they're passed? With some of them it's quite obvious, particularly the ones directly relating to the union or lefty crap(I of course mean important student issues) but I'm thinking about the more down to earth practical ones, particularly for example the one complaining about the cost of sauces and butter in the "restaurant". Is sauce and butter cheaper in the restaurant now? are there talks going on with the powers that be? was there a strongly worded letter sent?

panda100

humbert wrote:

I couldn't agree more with this. Keep the focus healthy and positive, promoting rather than prohibiting and whatnot.

Well thats the aim of the game anyway. This motion isnt going to ban certain looking people from posters its just going to ensure that the union uses more a variety of people from now on.

Stepherunie

humbert wrote:

I don't really want to revive this thread but this is hardly worth starting another thread for.

Having been watching these motions go up for the last month or so I got to thinking, as wonderfully formal and serious and important as they look what actually happens when they're passed? With some of them it's quite obvious, particularly the ones directly relating to the union or lefty crap(I of course mean important student issues) but I'm thinking about the more down to earth practical ones, particularly for example the one complaining about the cost of sauces and butter in the "restaurant". Is sauce and butter cheaper in the restaurant now? are there talks going on with the powers that be? was there a strongly worded letter sent?

From what I remember Stephen Quinlaven (sorry if misspelt) had already arranged a meeting when he brought that motion to council with the manager to see what could be done about reducing the cost or indeed getting rid of the cost all together. He was also in the process of planning ideas for what campaign they would put on - I think this involved either giving out free butter for a week or the SU having a stand at the entrance to the restaurant selling these things.

Whilst I wasn't at the last council or won't be there tonight due to course commitments he was giving updates as far as I know