The Scottish PL discussion thread

PauloMN

Mr Alan wrote: »

Does Eirebhoy still post on here? Havent seen him around in a while

He said something about his house being like a building site and not having access. Either that or he's hiding.

redspider

PauloMN wrote: »

But I think Strachan really has to go. I honestly couldn't bear another season of the football Celtic are playing currently. We are so predictable, so easy to score against, so poor in front of goal, so ineffective in central midfield.

Does he really have to go? I dont think we have reached that point yet.

Surely Celtic have done very well in the CL in the last few seasons under Strachan. He also won the league last season so its not as if he hasnt been having any success.

Yes, this season he wont, but there was relative success in the CL. He has changed the personnel in the team. Has he done okay with the money that he has had available to him? In cold analysis perhaps yes. I know there are many improvements that could be made to the team and squad. We know we have players that are weak in their positions. But do fans think that Strachan is canny enough to do as good a job as anyone or is it solely his fault? Is Strachan underperforming. I think Gordon has done okay.

Celtic's standards are high, but still and all I think its too early to be calling for his head. He has a good football brain, getting better perhaps (eg: facilitating the improvemets in McGeady this season), and whilst he can be petulant and an awkward hot-headed bugger at times which he will readily admit to, he is still very capable of doing a good job at Celtic.

Redspider

jimmyboy

Anyone see the banners at the match last night??
One saying "nakamura ate my dog" and others saying ***
Disgraceful!!

PauloMN

jimmyboy wrote: »

Anyone see the banners at the match last night??
One saying "nakamura ate my dog" and others saying ***
Disgraceful!!

I've given up taking much notice of their fans TBH, they'll always come out with stuff like that. The Hiroshima thing for Naka, the Nazi salutes etc.. No point in getting wound up by them.

PauloMN

redspider wrote: »

Does he really have to go? I dont think we have reached that point yet.

Surely Celtic have done very well in the CL in the last few seasons under Strachan. He also won the league last season so its not as if he hasnt been having any success.

Yes, this season he wont, but there was relative success in the CL. He has changed the personnel in the team. Has he done okay with the money that he has had available to him? In cold analysis perhaps yes. I know there are many improvements that could be made to the team and squad. We know we have players that are weak in their positions. But do fans think that Strachan is canny enough to do as good a job as anyone or is it solely his fault? Is Strachan underperforming. I think Gordon has done okay.

Celtic's standards are high, but still and all I think its too early to be calling for his head. He has a good football brain, getting better perhaps (eg: facilitating the improvemets in McGeady this season), and whilst he can be petulant and an awkward hot-headed bugger at times which he will readily admit to, he is still very capable of doing a good job at Celtic.

Redspider

I think we've been found out this season though, last two Rangers were crap and we won with relative ease.

I think his signings have been ok overall, but we're not seeing the best of the players he has brought in, and I think that's down to him and how he plays them.

Can't deny the CL success but we just made it through the group this season. We should be getting to the group stages every season without question, that should be a foregone conclusion. We need to for the money nevermind anything else. I have a serious concern that we won't see the group stages of the CL next season. 2 qualifiers, serious potential for getting dumped out.

He's too pig headed. Look at last week, takes McDonald off for Samaras with them down to 10 and us 0-1 down at home, and sticks on Hutchinson with what, 3 mins to go? Keeps starting that imposter Donati. If I was paranoid, I'd think he actually wants us to chuck the league with those decisions of his.

I think it's vital he goes end of season. If he doesn't, you can kiss another league title goodbye, and start supporting someone else if you want to see some CL action.

Erin Go Brath

redspider wrote: »

Does he really have to go? I dont think we have reached that point yet.

Surely Celtic have done very well in the CL in the last few seasons under Strachan. He also won the league last season so its not as if he hasnt been having any success.

Yes, this season he wont, but there was relative success in the CL. He has changed the personnel in the team. Has he done okay with the money that he has had available to him? In cold analysis perhaps yes. I know there are many improvements that could be made to the team and squad. We know we have players that are weak in their positions. But do fans think that Strachan is canny enough to do as good a job as anyone or is it solely his fault? Is Strachan underperforming. I think Gordon has done okay.

Celtic's standards are high, but still and all I think its too early to be calling for his head. He has a good football brain, getting better perhaps (eg: facilitating the improvemets in McGeady this season), and whilst he can be petulant and an awkward hot-headed bugger at times which he will readily admit to, he is still very capable of doing a good job at Celtic.

Redspider

I would agree with this. I think strachan has done pretty well with the resources available to him over the last few years. We urgently need new players to compete both at Europe and now in the SPL as Rangers have upped their game in the past season. I would highlight our defence as an area of weakness in particular. The defence is quite frankly a shambles and needs to be overhauled completely. I would like to see us getting 1 quality midfielder and 1 quality striker to bolster those positions. In short we will have to spend big in the close season. Personally i would keep Strachan for at least another season.

Eirebear

jimmyboy wrote: »

Anyone see the banners at the match last night??
One saying "nakamura ate my dog" and others saying ***
Disgraceful!!

I know....i only just got the poor thing too.....:D

Eirebear

Awfully quiet round here lads....cant for the life of me think why!?

nervous for tomorrow?
predictions?

Ill go for 2-2, i dont see us winning it this time around as it means far too much to Celtic at this stage, but ive also seen us score when we need to often enough this season to know that were not just about not losing goals.

PauloMN

2-1 to the good guys, Samaras and McDonald to score.

League to go to the wire, Rangers to drop more points but to win the league by 1 point.

The micro-huns are in fine voice tonight, watching them v. St. Pats at the mo, Pats are 1-0 up.

ziggy

This post has been deleted.

redspider

PauloMN wrote: »

I think his signings have been ok overall, but we're not seeing the best of the players he has brought in, and I think that's down to him and how he plays them.

Can't deny the CL success but we just made it through the group this season. We should be getting to the group stages every season without question, that should be a foregone conclusion.

He's too pig headed. Look at last week, takes McDonald off for Samaras with them down to 10 and us 0-1 down at home, and sticks on Hutchinson with what, 3 mins to go? Keeps starting that imposter Donati.

I think it's vital he goes end of season.

I dont think he should go and I dont think he will be let go.

Yes, a reasonable and fair expectation is getting to the CL group stages. I think that's also what the owners are aiming for and whats in their business plan. It will also be the target for next season. So, Gordon getting out of them has to be recognised as doing very well.

In terms of Samaras on for McDonald, some days substitution decisions dont work out, some days they do. Some managers are good at them, some less so. Maybe Gordon is not the best substitution manager, but he has other attributes. I'm sure he was instrumental in developing McGeady this season, so doesnt he deserve some kudos for that? (I'm not a big fan of Samaras).

I agree with Erin Go Brath, that defence is our biggest weakness and has cost us dearly so a wise purchase or two is required there. Hinkel was a good buy though, dont you think, so a step in the right direction and a good choice by Strachan?

We have to recognise that Gordon is competing with limited funds when compared with others on the global stage. Think of an Everton, that is Celtic.

Also, he has some hard decisions to make and needs to balance his squad for both SPL success and CL success. That's why some 'flair' players such as Nakamura are at Celtic. Rangers have gone a different route and are surprised as any to find themselves doing so well in the Uefa Cup. Their litmus test may come next season.


Back to tonights football. I think we will see a solid Celtic performance tonight. Whilst there is pressure to some extent, there is also some freedom to go and get at Rangers. The team deserves a break of luck and perhaps tonight they will get it. A win wont win the league, but it will restore a bit of pride. I have no doubt that Rangers will be defending as much as they can and looking for a breakaway goal.

Redspider

PauloMN

redspider wrote: »

I dont think he should go and I dont think he will be let go.

I agree he won't be let go, I don't think he'll walk yet either. I hope he goes end of season, but I can't see it. He'll be around until mid-season next year at least. Prepare for another trophy-less season that being the case.

redspider wrote: »

Getting into the CL last-16, a minimum target?? Thats a bit high dont you think? Yes, it is a good target but its not the minimum Celtic should be doing each year. A more reasonable and fair expectation would be just getting to the group stages. I think that's also what the owners are aiming for and whats in their business plan. It will also be the target for next season.

I never said last 16 as a minimum, I said we must be in the group stages every season as a minimum. Anything less is failure in Europe as far as I'm concerned, and is also a huge financial blow to a club like ours trying to survive without Sky money.

redspider wrote: »

In terms of Samaras on for McDonald, some days substitution decisions dont work out, some days they do. Some managers are good at them, some less so. Maybe Gordon is not the best substitution manager, but he has other attributes. I'm sure he was instrumental in developing McGeady this season, so doesnt he deserve some kudos for that? (I'm not a big fan of Samaras)

I don't expect substitutions to always work, however I expect logical subs to be made when it is blatantly obvious that they should be made. Don't hook a striker when you are at home, down a goal against 10 men. Stick another one on and hook a defender.

redspider wrote: »

I agree with Erin Go Brath, that defence is our biggest weakness and has cost us dearly so a wise purchase or two is required there. Hinkel was a good buy though, dont you think, so a step in the right direction and a good choice by Strachan?

Hinkel was an excellent buy. Aside from Caldwell, I don't think our defence is our biggest concern. Our midfield has been bitterly disappointing this season, Scott Brown and Donati being the main culprits. Last weekend showed that with Hartley and Robson IMO - they breathed a bit of life and urgency into midfield. More of same tonight bhoys please.

Something else to consider is the number of goals conceded by Celtic compared with that of Rangers. Have a look at the table. Makes interesting reading. Maybe our defence isn't so much the problem...

redspider wrote: »

We have to recognise that Gordon is competing with limited funds when compared with others on the global stage. Think of an Everton, that is Celtic.

Also, he has some hard decisions to make and needs to balance his squad for both SPL success and CL success. That's why some 'flair' players such as Nakamura are at Celtic. Rangers have gone a different route and are surprised as any to find themselves doing so well in the Uefa Cup.

I'm fully aware of the limited funds. Taking that into account, do you think £4.5m on Brown, and £3m on Donati was money well spent? Maybe these guys have talent - we all know Brown does - so why are we not seeing it now under Strachan? £7m+ on two players who haven't cut the mustard in the SPL is astonishingly bad business IMO. This is the SPL FFS, we should be destroying teams in midfield.

redspider wrote: »

Back to tonights football. I think we will see a solid Celtic performance tonight. Whilst there is pressure to some extent, there is also some freedom to go and get at Rangers. The team deserves a break of luck and perhaps tonight they will get it. A win wont win the league, but it will restore a bit of pride. I have no doubt that Rangers will be defending as much as they can and looking for a breakaway goal.

Redspider

I'm going for a 2-1 Celtic win. Let's just hope JCD and McGregor both have howlers.

Eirebear

Alright lads, just over an hour to go.

Enjoy the game(but not too much!) and may the best team win!
(not that they ever do!)

Dave!

1-1 at the mo...7 mins to go.

McDonald had a peno saved.

McGregor went off injured.

Dave!

2-1 ! Vennegoor!

applehunter

Poor quality game I thought.

Great drama though!

A Dub in Glasgo

Great game... so glad we got that one

estebancambias

What a ****ing moment...I really liked that game. Though McGeady's(Irish perspective) distribution was pretty good in terms of passing but a few poor crosses. Still looks very confident on the ball despite being tightly marked.

John Venegoor OR Hesselink....what a guy.

SantryRed

So what do Celtic fans think of McDonalds attemted dive at the corner flag at the start of the second half?
Judging by the reactions to the dives by Rangers players in the past weeks I'm guessing it should of been a straight red?

A Dub in Glasgo

A booking

Cuellar deserves 3 red cards for that piece of cheating

Ferguson deserves a red for being an arsehole

ziggy

This post has been deleted.

Peyton Manning

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

Ferguson deserves a red for being an arsehole

That made me lol, have some thanks.

A Dub in Glasgo

PauloMN

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

Great banner!

Great game.

Cuellar, jaysus. Naka should have had his brace. 2 goals I mean, not Ugly Betty's train tracks.

Naka you little gem. "Oh he's only good for set pieces"... GIRFUY.

Loved it. ****in' loved it. Where ever the league goes, that was so enjoyable. :D:D:D:D

RestoredPride CSC

PS. Is McGregor out for a while or what?

PauloMN

SantryRed wrote: »

So what do Celtic fans think of McDonalds attemted dive at the corner flag at the start of the second half?

:rolleyes:

That's what I think.

A Dub in Glasgo

I forgive McDonald for telegraphing his penalty



Weir being gracious in defeat :eek:

Dave!

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

There was a good one, "for those watching in blue and white, this is what a European cup looks like"

Dempsey

http://i30.tinypic.com/2lxgv8z.jpg

Brilliant

Eirebear

well done lads, you deserved that one.
Complete wondergoal by naka i must say, one of the best ive seen in a long time.

Funny though how your all about pictures tonight though eh?

heres one for you.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/scot_prem/table/default.stm

see those games in hand?:D

See Y'all next sunday!

Dempsey

Games in hand arent points and looking at yer fixture list, you should have some concerns

A Dub in Glasgo

It is still Rangers title to lose. We are just happy that finally we may be putting Rangers under pressure and not gifting the title to them. That is what I am most happy about

Erin Go Brath

What a dramatic finish!

I thought we were the better team over the game and deserved to win.
Glad we stuck with it until the end and grinded out the result in the end.

On the run in:
Its still very much advantage Rangers, but with 7 games left (5 away), a couple of injuries and mounting fixture congestion to contend with the possibility for them dropping points exists, although it is more in hope than expectation that they will falter i must admit.

Celtic need to win all the last 5 games (3H, 2A) to have any hope, and just to keep the pressure on really.

If we win on Sunday week (and we must or else were finished) it will keep us breathing down their necks, and certainly make it a very tight finish.

redspider

Well, Celtic can certainly keep the fans on the edge of their seats! It wasnt looking good towards the end I have to say. Celtic's weaknesses came back to haunt.

Celtic dominated the first half but for all the possession the chances created were mainly half-chances. Naka's goal came out of nothing as he found himself in some space and whacked in a curler which deceived. A good goal but I dont think he scores enough like these so these are rare. I thought McDonald wasnt great in the 1st half or the 2nd, VofH is not fast enough. Robson and Hartley are pedestrian, more holding midfielders than anything else, so everything was up to McGeady. He did well, very well, and was doubly marked at times. Naka did okay too. Cuellar was soaking up a lot of the aerial stuff and I felt that McDonald and VofH were being easily beaten.

I had a pre-match premonition that Nacho Novo would score and somehow he did it again. A chance out of the blue, a semi-mistake by Wilson, unfortunate, and Novo found himself in space, his shot had a lot of work to do but it was well struck and went in. I thought that Boruc got his timing wrong for his dive, he was 'bouncing' as Novo ran at him and was off the ground as Novo struck. These milliseconds in the air and being unable to dive are vital, so I would put Boruc down as partially culpable for that goal.

The match was mainly Celtic. They deserved a 2nd goal, 1-1 would not have been a fair result. Then came the handball on the line. I think the rules of soccer should be changed. A defender and his team should not get a benefit by handballing on the line and preventing a certain goal. I think the ref's should have within their discretion to award a goal AND send off the offending player. Only this way will we rid ourselves of the game from this cynical "tactic". Of course its a penalty, but as it turned out, these can be missed or saved. McDonald really telegraphed his intentions and it was typical of him on the night I thought. Do McGeady or Naka have the bottle for penalties?

Celtic kept plugging away against the 10-men, and it looked like a typical game for Celtic, a lot of the play, probably deserving of the win, but looking like they would drop points. However, the surprise came at the very end. For once, McDonald won a header in the box and had the wherewithal to knock it across the box. VofH finished it in a style that is typical for him. I didnt feel that ecstatic with the win though. Welcome and all as it was, the way the match played out it typified why Celtic is not quite there yet. Loads of potential, but a few major pieces missing.

So, its still advantage Rangers, and whilst the season isnt over completely, it is still theirs to lose.

Celtic's remaining fixtures are:
Saturday, 19 April 2008 Celtic v Aberdeen, 15:00
Sunday, 27 April 2008 Celtic v Rangers, 12:30
Saturday, 03 May 2008 Motherwell v Celtic, 12:30
Sunday, 11 May 2008 Celtic v Hibernian, 12:30
Sunday, 18 May 2008 Dundee Utd v Celtic, 13:30

None of those are particularly easy.

I dont know Rangers run-in in the league, does anyone have it even if the dates arent decided as yet?

Redspider

PauloMN

Rangers fixtures:

Sunday, 27 April 2008
Celtic v Rangers, 12:30

Sunday, 04 May 2008
Hibernian v Rangers, 14:00

Wednesday, 07 May 2008
Rangers v Motherwell, 19:45

Saturday, 10 May 2008
Rangers v Dundee Utd, 12:30

Sunday, 18 May 2008
Aberdeen v Rangers, 13:30

St. Mirren and Motherwell (both away) are the two games to be rescheduled.

Eirebear

My only real worry about Rangers at the moment is confidence.

We should beat St Johnstone in the semi on sunday, we then take on Fiorentina midweek if we dont get a result there, coupled with a bad result against celtic the following weekend....i think the nerves will set in and confidence will be low.

Not getting beat in the next three games is a must for me, a win against St Johnstone and two draws will do TBH

PauloMN

Anyone know if McGregor is going to be out for a while or is he ok?

Eirebear

PauloMN wrote: »

Anyone know if McGregor is going to be out for a while or is he ok?

No news yet.

Weir misses the St Johnstone game, while Cuellar will be out for the OF game.
McManus misses the Aberdeen game for you lot.

Its a shame the game never finished a draw, Cuellars save would have went down in history as one of the greatest!

PauloMN

Eirebear wrote: »

No news yet.

Weir misses the St Johnstone game, while Cuellar will be out for the OF game.
McManus misses the Aberdeen game for you lot.

Its a shame the game never finished a draw, Cuellars save would have went down in history as one of the greatest!

Nothing against him, but I hope he's out for the rest of the season.

How come Wier and Cuellar miss different games? Is the the violent conduct thing? Delighted Cuellar is out for the OF game, he's Rangers best player.

Eirebear

PauloMN wrote: »

Nothing against him, but I hope he's out for the rest of the season.

How come Wier and Cuellar miss different games? Is the the violent conduct thing? Delighted Cuellar is out for the OF game, he's Rangers best player.

Yep, violent conduct is an automatic next game ban, cuellars is the next league game.

He has easily been our best player this year, IMO probably the best in scotland

redspider

PauloMN wrote: »

Rangers fixtures:

Thanks. Not an easy run-in either. It could be nip and tuck. Maybe Celtic's odds at 11/2 yesterday to iwn the league were worth a punt (or euro).

Eirebear

McGregor will definetly miss the St Johnstone game, and possibly the Fiorentina game.
http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11788_3435733,00.html


Not sure i like the prospect of taking on the Italians without McGregor, Thomson and Ferguson....

Badabing

Just back from Glasgow and the match, great game had everything great goals and loads of passion, i was watching Lennon at the dugout and he was encouarging the players all nite thats what they needed a reminder of what it means to play for Glasgow Celtic, a nice touch before the players came out was ynwa in memory of Hilsborough and of course the Rangers fans booed and threw orange streamers on the pitch:mad:

CountingCrows

Badabing wrote: »

Just back from Glasgow and the match, great game had everything great goals and loads of passion, i was watching Lennon at the dugout and he was encouarging the players all nite thats what they needed a reminder of what it means to play for Glasgow Celtic, a nice touch before the players came out was ynwa in memory of Hilsborough and of course the Rangers fans booed and threw orange streamers on the pitch:mad:

Never mind the animals.

Eirebear

Badabing wrote: »

Just back from Glasgow and the match, great game had everything great goals and loads of passion, i was watching Lennon at the dugout and he was encouarging the players all nite thats what they needed a reminder of what it means to play for Glasgow Celtic, a nice touch before the players came out was ynwa in memory of Hilsborough and of course the Rangers fans booed and threw orange streamers on the pitch:mad:

See this absolute BULL**** about YNWA "for the Hillsborough victims".

YNWA is sung, before, during, and after every Old Firm game by you lot, and is roundly booed by Rangers fans.
Most of whom would not have known anything about any dedication this game.

You cant have a version of a song that you claim as your own, that you sing every week, that you know Rangers fans will boo anyway and then tack on a wee dedication over a tannoy that many people wont hear considering the noise and atmosphere at an old firm game, then describe us as "animals" for booing it.

Grow up

CountingCrows

Eirebear wrote: »

is roundly booed by Rangers fans.
Most of whom would not have known anything about any dedication this game.

If you want I can post a link to the Giant Banner held up before the game showing our support for the victims??

....Celtic fans fault for your ignorance - brilliant!

Eirebear

CountingCrows wrote: »

So its Celtic fans fault for your ignorance - brilliant!

Did anyone blame Celtic fans for anything? Get off your high horse for a second ok?

Its plainly simple.

There was no media statement before the game referring to a rendition of that song in rememberance of Hillsborough.
There was no official line from either club that this would be happening, and there was certainly no official line from the SPL?UEFA etc etc that they expected teams to do this before games.
What does it have to do with an Old Firm Game anyway?

What you are left with is a few thousand fired up Rangers fans, who chances are didnt hear any announcements over the tannoy as they were too busy trying to make themselves heard.

Then a song which is associated with Celtic gets belted out by the fans in Green and White, and ive heard the Celtic fans sing YNWA at Parkhead....its loud, very loud. Every single Rangers fan will try and boo and drown that out.

Why?

Because Celtic fans claim it as their own, they sing it with passion before EVERY big match.
How in gods name were rangers supporters supposed to know that this time it was suddenly being sung in order to remember Hillsborough?

Badabing

Eirebear wrote: »

See this absolute BULL**** about YNWA "for the Hillsborough victims".

YNWA is sung, before, during, and after every Old Firm game by you lot, and is roundly booed by Rangers fans.
Most of whom would not have known anything about any dedication this game.

You cant have a version of a song that you claim as your own, that you sing every week, that you know Rangers fans will boo anyway and then tack on a wee dedication over a tannoy that many people wont hear considering the noise and atmosphere at an old firm game, then describe us as "animals" for booing it.

Grow up

EH before kick off the announcer fella said that to commerate the 19th anniversary of 96 people being crushed to death at Hillsborough we would ask the Celtic fans to sing ynwa which we did and then Rangers fans did what they did. And we did it at half time which funnily enough had less booing and less orange streamers from rangers

Eirebear

Badabing wrote: »

EH before kick off the announcer fella said that to commerate the 19th anniversary of 96 people being crushed to death at Hillsborough we would ask the Celtic fans to sing ynwa which we did and then Rangers fans did what they did.

Again...have you ever been to an Old Firm game at Ibrox?

If its anything like going to one at Parkhead for a Rangers supporter, you will not hear very much of the tannoy believe me.

And again, if you didnt want Rangers fans to boo it.....pick a different song.
And not one that is KNOWN to be used as your team are coming onto the pitch and fires the whole stadium up the way it does.

EDIT: Are you actually trying to say that Rangers fans booing it "Less at half time, with less orange streamers" when we were 1-0 down and had just played the worst 45 mintes the team had put in all season, was a deliberate ploy?
Do you actually believe that the Rangers fans would have deliberatly booed a dedication to Hillsborough because of our hatred for dead liverpool fans?
If so then you are one twisted individual and there is no point carrying on this conversation.

Why not have a minutes silence if you feel so strongly about it? or even a Minutes applause?

Its like Rangers fans having a rendition of Follow Follow in respect for some tragedy that has nothing to do with the two teams playing, could you imagine Celtic fans standing quietly for that?

CountingCrows

I have been at numerous Old Firms in Ibrox and I'm contantly amazed that the teams have to run out through people waving giant union jacks, I can only imagine the media response if we did likewise with Tri-colours!

"hear very much of the tannoy" I repeat this again, there was a giant BANNER clearly viewable to everyone in the stadium.

As for your last slight on Celtic fans I seem to remember 60,000 people giving a minutes silence when your Queen mother died.

Eirebear

CountingCrows wrote: »

I have been at numerous Old Firms in Ibrox and I'm contantly amazed that the teams have to run out through people waving giant union jacks, I can only imagine the media response if we did likewise with Tri-colours!

I know....its disgusting that a club who plays in Britain would have Union Flags at the start of a game......really, shocking so it is.

CountingCrows wrote: »

"hear very much of the tannoy" I repeat this again, there was a giant BANNER clearly viewable to everyone in the stadium.

Ok, at least now we know for next time....If celtic fans have it on a banner, Rangers fans must obey.

CountingCrows wrote: »

As for your last slight on Celtic fans I seem to remember 60,000 people giving a minutes silence when your Queen mother died.

HAHAHAHAHA! The famous 14 second silence.
I remember this game, and believe me i have as little, if less respect for the royal family as you do.....but the referee stopped that "minutes" silence after less than 30 seconds.