Help with upgrading

JimmyO

Hi All,

I'm a bit of a Noob. I can manage to find my way around inside a S.U. but only with a detailed manual.

Looking to Upgrade what I've got.

Firstly here's my current system:

eMachines 420 - (Don't laugh - I was broke at the time)
Intel Celeron 2.60ghz
80gb HD
3D AGP Graphics
56k Fax Modem
1256mb DDR (added some myself)
10/100Mbps Ethernet
6 USB Ports
48x CD-RW
16x DVD
Running XP

Since then I've got an External DVD-RW and and an SB Audigy 4

Just got my hands on these bits (at an exceptional price):
PNY Verto GeForce 6 6200/PCI 256MB DDR memory - (no AGP or PCIe slots)
500GB USB 2.0 External HDD - (got lots of music and video to store)
Hi-Speed USB 2.0 7-Port Hub - (loads of peripherals)

Now for the query. Is there any thing else I should add?

I was thinking about upgrading the CPU but it's a complete minefield and I know SFA about it. Can't really find any useful articles on upgrading from a Celeron. Is it even possible?

Short of asking for my money back are there any other recommendations you guys can make?

All suggestions greatly appreciated.

Tom Dunne

JimmyO wrote:

I was thinking about upgrading the CPU but it's a complete minefield and I know SFA about it. Can't really find any useful articles on upgrading from a Celeron. Is it even possible?

You are right, it is a complete minefield. Earlier this year I upgraded my laptop from a Celeron to a P4 processor.

You need to check what socket your Celeron is. At a guess, I would say it is a socket 478. If so, you can get a P4 socket 478, but make sure your motherboard can take that particular stepping of P4. I went through 2 Pentium 4's before I got the correct one that my motherboard would support. This was despite the fact that they were all socket 478. Expensive time for me on E-bay.

JimmyO

Thanks Tom.

The manual provided with the machine is useless. Grand if you've no idea how to set the PC up for the first time but has no specs in it for anything.

I know you did it the hard (and expensive) way but maybe someone knows (or you've found out since) Is there any way to find out what my Motherboard can support?

For example are there any reference markings on the board that I can google for?

Don't feel lost lost and alone now!!!

Tom Dunne

Use CPU-Z - it will give you a load of info on the motherboard which you can google for.

It will also tell you what the stepping of your CPU is.

JimmyO

Thanks Tom. That'll be a great help.

I'm sure I'll be able to find out more about Stepping etc as I progress.

Will let you know how I get on.

Anything else I should think about getting?

JimmyO

If any one else has any golden nuggets of advise they would be greatly appreciated.

The graphics card arrived today so I'll be giving that a go later.

uberpixie

What model e machine do you have?

Where did you buy it?

JimmyO

Only reference I have is eMachines 420, which I know is useless as it's not listed on their website.

No other reference numbers in the Manual or on the unit.

Bought it in PC World about 2 years ago.

uberpixie

JimmyO wrote:

Only reference I have is eMachines 420, which I know is useless as it's not listed on their website.

No other reference numbers in the Manual or on the unit.

Bought it in PC World about 2 years ago.

mobo is [SIZE=-1]Motherboard is a Trigem Imperial-GV[/SIZE] IM845GV. (google is your friend..)

Socket 478 mobo.

In theory you should have no problem getting a 2nd hand P4 socket 478 CPU of ebay and slapping it in.

In practice it depends on the bios and what chips your mobo supports.

AFAIK the mobo will support 400mhz bus speed P4s.

JimmyO

That's an incredible help!!!

Thanks uberpixie!!

I found this:

Is that what I'm after?

Buadhach

As far as I can tell that is just a fan+cooler for Pentium 4, socket 478.

I learned from experience to read descriptions very carefully.:p

JimmyO

Thanks Buadhach.

Is this more like it?

I presume I need to by the Fan and Cooler too?

uberpixie

JimmyO wrote:

Thanks Buadhach.

[URL="http://cgi.ebay.ie/Intel-P4-1-8GHz-CPU-Socket-478-SL6S6-1-8Ghz-512-400_W0QQitemZ

I presume I need to by the Fan and Cooler too?

It's more like it :-)

I had a look at the specs of the 845GV chipset again and I think you might get away with a 533 FSB P4.

Might being the big word :-) Don't take that as gospel!

A P4 2.8 or 3.06 in 533 FSB would be what you are looking for if your mobo can take 533 FSB P4 CPUs.

JimmyO

Ok uberpixie,

I've found one of those so I'm gonna research further to see what I come up with.

I should have come here ages ago!!

Again thanks to all for the help.

JimmyO

OK!

There is not enough information for the IM845GV with 3.06ghz cpu. It seems though that the 2.8ghz will be supported.

So I've gone for a Pentium 4 IV P4 CPU 2.8Ghz 2.8 512k/533 Northwood 478.

Still haven't had a chance to install all my other new bits but when the CPU arrives and I've got all the bits and pieces in I'll drop a line to let you know how I got on.

Again, cheers for all the help!

Fingers Crossed!

TerrorFirmer

Pity that now with the 2.8 p4, the 6200 will be a bottleneck - might have even be cheaper to sell that machine, and add a few quid to the money you spent on upgrades to buy an entirely new machine.

JimmyO

Not too bothered. The external HD would be essential anyway.

Got the CPU for $55 and the Graphics Card was only €65. Don't think my existing set up is worth that much.

I'm probably wrong though!!!! I usually am.

JimmyO

Hi All,

OK I'm back.

And I've a problem.

Still haven't recieved the CPU but I've installed the Graphics Card.

The machine now runs really slowly and the VDU goes black and comes back again.

Anyone got any clues as to what's happening and how to work around it?

TerrorFirmer

I assume you installed correct drivers for your card, and in the bios made sure video was set to either agp slot or auto rather then onboard...

JimmyO

Hi Havoc,

Yeah I've installed all the drivers etc that came with the card and I've downloaded the forceware update from NVIDA.

As far as I know I've changed the BIOS correctly. I'm a bit nervous messing about in there due to early experiments a number of years ago. It's actually a PCI card rather than an AGP and I'm fairly sure that I've changed it to that. Should I try using auto?

I can't double check now as I'm in work and it's my home PC so I'll check it out later. Due to the machine running so slowly trying to use LogMeIn is a nightmare!

Do I need to uninstall the onboard drivers? I don't think that there's a card to be removed (Can't see one anyway). There's 3 PCI slots and in them I've got the Graphics Card, my sound card and a modem (using broadband but I've no reason to remove it just yet).

Any more clues?

JimmyO

OK I've braved the BIOS.

The graphics are definitely set to PCI. The options were PCI or onboard.

The flicking to black thing still happens.

I'm able to type the system freezes altogether).

I'm editing this cause I've reduced the Hardware Acceleration and the problem seems to be gone.

Gonna try running some more programs to see what happens but it's looking ok.

I found this tip on a Forum so not sure what it's doing. I presume everything isn't running to the best of it's ability.

Any more clues?

JimmyO

Hi All,

OK my CPU has been shipped and should be here mid next week.

Does any one have a handy step by step guide for replacing a CPU?

I got googled one from the Berkley Uni site but I wouldn't mind a few more in case there's a hint or two more.

Like I said I'm new to this so I'd like to have as much info as possible before I start.

Thanks in advance and a Happy Christmas to all!!

triffidfood

I'm really glad I found this topic ..

I have the exact same specs as the opening poster here (emachines 420, Celeron processor, hopeless onboard graphics card, etc) .. I've been trying to figure out how to make my pc slightly less graphics/ games unfriendly (mainly in order to play Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind properly on it), and getting very stuck.

Firstly, should I buy a new CPU (i.e., a Pentium 4) or a new (PCI) graphics card? Will a new card just give me beautiful graphics at even draggier, hopeless speeds without a new processor?

I've really no idea, and it doesn't help that the documentation that came with my pc is totally, utterly & completely useless ~ it doesn't tell me what my motherboard is, how (or even whether) I can install a new processor, how to install a new graphics card, etc. I feel as if I'm floundering around in a sea of my own stupidity (ok, lack of knowledge) & totally uselss emachines documentation.

I've more or less decided on a new graphics card ("PNY GeForce 6 6200 256MB " ~ coincidentally, the exact same card mentioned by the OP, you can buy these on ebay UK now for <£70), simply because these are a little cheaper than CPUs, look easier to install, and because I have no faith in my ability to install a new processor & get it running, especially given the total lack of information that came with my pc about this.

Anyway, I'm waiting til next week to buy the card, but any advice on how to install this (i.e. on how to disable the onboard graphics, or about any changes I'd need to make in Bios or elsewhere to make it work) would really be greatly appreciated. Thanks!


[Edit: my current system specs (the main ones, anyway) are:

Machine name: YOUR-Y0MKAZ8JAQ
Operating System: Windows XP Home Edition (5.1, Build 2600) Service Pack 2 (2600.xpsp_sp2_gdr.050301-1519)
Language: English (Regional Setting: English)
System Manufacturer: n/a
System Model: n/a
BIOS: n/a
Processor: Intel(R) Celeron(R) CPU 2.60GHz
Memory: 766MB RAM
Page File: 171MB used, 1702MB available
Windows Dir: C:\WINDOWS
DirectX Version: DirectX 9.0c (4.09.0000.0904)
DX Setup Parameters: Not found
DxDiag Version: 5.03.2600.2180 32bit Unicode

Card name: Intel(R) 82845G/GL/GE/PE/GV Graphics Controller
Manufacturer: Intel Corporation
Chip type: Intel(R) 82845G Graphics Controller
DAC type: Internal
Device Key: Enum\PCI\VEN_8086&DEV_2562&SUBSYS_3186109F&REV_03
Display Memory: 64.0 MB
Current Mode: 1024 x 768 (32 bit) (60Hz) ]

JimmyO

Hi triffidfood,

I installed the new Graphics Card and I have to reduce the hardware accelleration to make the machine work. When run at the highest setting the screen keeps flashing blank or the system stalls completely.

As far as I can make out the CPU upgrade is an essential too. Mine hasn't arrived yet due to Christmas post but I expect it to be in next week. As soon as it's installed I'll let you know the score.

TerrorFirmer

Thats a strange problem you have JimmyO....obviously you shouldn't have to move the hardware slider down, it's quite possibly a fault with the 6200 you got, I would try uninstalling drivers, using Driver Cleaner Pro to get rid of all traces of nvidia drivers, reseat the card and install the latest drivers.

If you're still getting the problem, I'd think about returning it for a replacement.

Triffidfood - Your Celeron Processor isn't great but it's more then enough to run older games like Morrowind and similar at the highest settings, should you have the graphics power behind it. Your Ram is also fine.

The Intel Extreme (this is what you have) is pretty poor, throw in a dedicated graphics card and you'll be fine. Are you limited to PCI also, or do you have an AGP slot?

If it's PCI, you can still get cards that'll run titles like Morrowind at high settings without too much difficulty, although pci cards are a bit rare these days being obsolete and all. The best one in the pci format available is the Geforce 6200, although something alot older like a pci fx5200, Radeon 9250, 9200 etc will still yield great results on the games you're looking to play, and a massive increase over your 845 onboard.

triffidfood

JimmyO wrote:

As far as I can make out the CPU upgrade is an essential too. Mine hasn't arrived yet due to Christmas post but I expect it to be in next week. As soon as it's installed I'll let you know the score.

Okay thanks, I'd be really interested to know how that goes, or any problems you have etc. Incidentally, the cpu I'd bookmarked & was thinking of buying (online in the UK) has the following specs:

Intel Pentium® 4 2.8GHz (533MHz) 512K cache Northwood Boxed CPU inc Fan and Heatsink socket 478 CPU
Features/Specifications:
Intel Pentium 4 2.80GHz Socket 478 CPU
General Features:
2.80 GHz clock speed
FC-PGA2 478-pin package
533 MHz system bus
512 KB L2 cache

I'm pretty sure that would be compatible with my pc (?! :rolleyes: ), I'm just concerned about making any necessary changes to Bios etc to get it working (I read somewhere this can be kinda tricky sometimes with emachines...?)

Anyway, I'd be interested to know how you get on with this.

HavoK wrote:

Triffidfood - Your Celeron Processor isn't great but it's more then enough to run older games like Morrowind and similar at the highest settings, should you have the graphics power behind it. Your Ram is also fine.

The Intel Extreme (this is what you have) is pretty poor, throw in a dedicated graphics card and you'll be fine. Are you limited to PCI also, or do you have an AGP slot?

If it's PCI, you can still get cards that'll run titles like Morrowind at high settings without too much difficulty ... something alot older like a pci fx5200, Radeon 9250, 9200 etc will still yield great results on the games you're looking to play, and a massive increase over your 845 onboard.

Okay that's helpful, I was reading topics on a Morrowind forum earlier where they said pretty much the same thing ~ in terms of graphics, there's not much point having anything >the FX5200 because you won't get much additional performance (other than maybe pixel shaded water! :cool: ) with anything higher.

What I might do for the time being is buy a Geforce FX5200 & some more RAM (512MB to replace my existing 256MB slot, just to bump this up a bit) .. Morrowind is pretty CPU intensive though, but I'm hoping maybe buying an external card & fitting some more RAM will take the load off my poor, beleagured Celeron a bit....... :rolleyes:

(I only have PCI slots, by the way ...)

triffidfood

Actually, could I ask a question ... does it matter what onboard menory a card (graphics card, e.g. the FX5200) has, in terms of compatability? Is it just a case of buy whatever you can afford (128mb, 256mb, etc), or is it possible for an external card to have too much menory, somehow?

Sorry for a stupid sounding question, I've tried Googling this but I just get sites saying "more memory isn't necessarily an advantage" (etc), but could it actually be a problem in any sense?

Thanks for any help..

TerrorFirmer

No, it won't pose a problem. Sometimes you do see cards advertised with more memory then they could technically use, like budget cards with 'massive 512mb' etc, and in those cases the extra memory isn't much use.

But 256mb would still be of use to you, and again, regardless of its memory configuration, as long as you have a pci slot free it'll work. But just to mention, there wouldn't be a huge difference between a 128mb and 256mb Fx5200.

triffidfood

Well, I bought my Geforce fx5200 (which came this morning), disabled (I thought) my onboard graphics[control panel> system> device manager> display adaptors ... disable] & installed the card in one of my spare PCI slots but...

It's not working. Windows does "Detect New Hardware" when I start up, but the 'new hardware' it's detecting (& prompting me to update drivers for, since I removed these before installing my new card) is the stupid Intel graphics chip/ adaptor thingee I was trying to replace!

A couple of questions...

(1) When I right-clicked the Intel graphics card (adaptors) name (control panel etc ~ path as described before) to remove it I chose "Disable", should I choose "Uninstall" instead or would this be risky? I still want to be able to use my pc when I restart, even if the new card still doesn't get recognised.

(2) When you're installing a new card, does it matter which spare PCI slot you use? Does it have to be the next available free one (I didn't use this because the heatsink kinda got in the way, so it was easier to use the other, end slot).

Thanks for any help. (JimmyO ~ was disabling Intels onboard adaptor all you had to do prior to installing your new card, or did you have to do anything else? )

8T8

Step 1: Download these drivers if running XP.

Step 2: Right click on Intel Integrated graphics and select disable in the device manager or go into the bios and disable it (if the option is present) be sure your monitor is plugged into the FX2000 card beforehand.

Step 3: Run the NVIDIA driver installer it will extract the files to a folder and then find the FX2000 and install the driver for it, reboot when it is finished.

Alternative Step 4: In the event it does not find the FX2000 & the installer quits go into the device manager and bring up the properties of the FX2000 it may be called PCI VGA or unknown device etc. and then select update driver and point it at the folder c:\nvidia\93.71 folder.

Anti

8T8 wrote:

Step 1: Download these drivers if running XP.

Step 2: Right click on Intel Integrated graphics and select disable in the device manager or go into the bios and disable it (if the option is present) be sure your monitor is plugged into the FX2000 card beforehand.

Step 3: Run the NVIDIA driver installer it will extract the files to a folder and then find the FX2000 and install the driver for it, reboot when it is finished.

Alternative Step 4: In the event it does not find the FX2000 & the installer quits go into the device manager and bring up the properties of the FX2000 it may be called PCI VGA or unknown device etc. and then select update driver and point it at the folder c:\nvidia\93.71 folder.

fx5200 you mean