car Security

gary the great

Scumbags are likely to try and rob my car (323f 96) as its a 10 yr old Jap parked out on the road. Its fitted with an alarm, but im looking for a bit extra to deter them.

After reading posts on the issue before a chain and lock and a kill switch seem to be the best bet.

But does anyone know where to get a good decent chain and padlock at a reasonable price? I could be buying something crap for all i know.

Also what about the kill switch? Where would i get one of them? Are they easy to fit?

And anyone know how much it would cost to fit an immobiliser?

Any other general tips and keeping the car safe from the scum?

Gary ITR

B&Q are good for padlocks and chains. They have some really good ones.

SouperComputer

kill switch isnt a deterrant. You want to make it as much hassle for them to rob it as possible. If they REALLY want it, no matter what you do they will get it, but they usually go for the easiest car to rob.

Long, heafty chain with a padlock should do the trick, wrapped a few times around the steering wheel and seat bracket. They will most likely move onto easier prey.

B&Q have a good stock of chains and locks, the beefier the better.

mloc123

Best detterant for and old jap car? Snap off steering wheel. The snap-off boss is about €50-€90 and you'd need and aftermarket wheel like a momo etc.. but well worth it.

Wibbs

mloc123 wrote:

Best detterant for and old jap car? Snap off steering wheel. The snap-off boss is about €50-€90 and you'd need and aftermarket wheel like a momo etc.. but well worth it.

That's a good un alright. As for the crap "if they want they'll get it". It's largely self defeating nonsense. The harder you make it for them the less likely they'll nick it. Far less. Fact.

The chain and padlock is ok, but and it's a big but, the ones who "really want it" just cut through the thin metal of the steering wheel. It's pretty effective for your ordinary scum though. A disclok would be better if dearer.

A good alarm fitted by a good fitter in a hard to reach place with a backup battery and battery driven siren is a must. Otherwise it's useless to the scum who knows his trade. Consider a pager alarm.

A kill switch on the fuel power and maybe on the starter is v good(the starter one would need a relay though AFAIK). Oh yea hide the switch well. Sticking it in plain sight isn't worth a damn.:rolleyes: The fuel pump one is easy to fit if you have the full compliment of thumbs.

Two sets of locking wheel nuts are another one. You could go mad and add a wheel clamp.

gary the great

Yep im gonna drive up to B and Q tommorrow and get a big hefty chain, im sure 5ft would be enough? And a nice big padlock.

Il get a kill switch as well, there only a euro or two and failry easy to instal so that wil just delay them more and make it more hassle.

These, with the alarm should be ok. I see Maplin have flashing LEDS as well, that dont actually do anything. I might stick one of them beside the ignition and it may look like its a light for an immobiliser or something! I mean a couple of flashing lights, a big chain may anfd they probly wont bother.

Them disclocks are ment to be unbreakable though? may be worth it just for the peace of mind

Does anyone know an easy to install aftermarket immobiliser?

Wibbs

gary the great wrote:

These, with the alarm should be ok. I see Maplin have flashing LEDS as well, that dont actually do anything. I might stick one of them beside the ignition and it may look like its a light for an immobiliser or something!

Does your existing alarm not have an LED? If it does I wouldn't bother with another light TBH. If it doesn't it's probably a crap alarm which even the joyriders will bypass in seconds. BTW if there's a sticker advertising your alarm on the car remove it. The scum aren't dumb and they'll figure the LED's for show. Go on ebay and get a battery backup siren. They're cheap and replace the siren on your existing alarm. That actually adds to the security unlike the fake LED.

I mean a couple of flashing lights, a big chain may anfd they probly wont bother.

Or a half decent alarm, one LED, chain or better yet, disclok/snap off, hidden kill switch on the fuel and then you have a good chance of not coming down to an empty space where your car was.

Them disclocks are ment to be unbreakable though? may be worth it just for the peace of mind

While nothings unbreakable they are a better bet than the chain and padlock.

Does anyone know an easy to install aftermarket immobiliser?

An immobiliser is just a fancy name for a switch that stops one of the three systems that runs your car. Your home made kill switch is an immobiliser. Most alarms just cut the ignition, the fuel and the starter are the other two. The ignition immobiliser cut is the easiest to bypass. On a previous car of mine that was stolen they bypassed the alarm and immobiliser very easily. When it was recovered(luckily though €€€€ in damage) I could see how easy it was to bypass and I know sweet fanny adams about car electrics. Once bitten twice shy I can tell you.

I suppose it depends on how much you want to keep your car I suppose. Factors like how much it cost you in the first place etc. I figure spending 5-600 quid on security well spent.

gary the great

Thats some good advice, thanks for that.

I will get a battery back up siren of ebay and set it up, this one seems good:

http://cgi.ebay.ie/Battery-Backup-Car-Alarm-Siren_W0QQitemZ120058605146QQihZ002QQcategoryZ75329QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

My current alarm has got an lED on the dash, so il just that at that. At the moment my alarm key fob is broke, so to turn the alarm on and off i have to lift the bonnet and put the key in the alarm. I want to get this sorted at weekend, anyone recommned somewhere to go? It also only rings for about 20seconds and then turns off, which is a bit crap, il need to get them to adjust this. I could also pick up a back up battery siren in this place if its cheap and handy.

Il also put in a kill switch and this with the alarm and big chain should protect it. The disklock is ment to be great but there dam expensive so il have to give it a miss.

Any other pointers?

gary the great

Why not have security stickers on the window? My sticker says Cobra alarm, even though its not a cobra alarm, its the standard mazda one. It also says Keyguard Immobiliser, which gives the impression its immobilised, even though its not. Surely the scum would think that if a cobra alarm and keyguard immob are installed its going to be even harder to steal? Are most 323Fs fitted with immoblisers as standard?

My car is purely to be protected from joyriding scum that are here in fair numbers in Tallaght, I cant see professional car theifs looking to steal a 10 year old mazda

Hagar

A secondary siren inside the car mightn't be a bad idea. It would be pretty uncomfortable to stay inside and fiddle with wires etc with an ear splitting noise so close by.

Wibbs

gary the great wrote:

Thats some good advice, thanks for that.

Np worries. Anything to keep the scum at bay.

I will get a battery back up siren of ebay and set it up, this one seems good:

Yep and not much more than a fake LED

Any other pointers?

When you park turn your wheel all the way to one side or the other. Helps to stop them pushing it up the road and makes breaking the steering lock harder. Free and easy.

Why not have security stickers on the window? My sticker says Cobra alarm, even though its not a cobra alarm, its the standard mazda one. It also says Keyguard Immobiliser, which gives the impression its immobilised, even though its not.

In your case that's cool as it's distracting and confusing the scum. The people who buy an expensive alarm and advertise what it is are stupid or ill informed. Why make the scums job any easier? Even with the much vaunted clifford, if they know what they're doing and know what you have it makes their job much easier. I know of two cars that were lifted with cliffords on them. This is doubly the case for those of us with nice cars. You would be surprised at the "expertise" of even the joyriding scum. If they know it's a clifford as an example, they know pretty much where most of the fitters put the alarm brain, where they're likely to cut the ignition for the immobiliser etc. From that they have a head start. When you think that most people out there have an alarm yet still cars get stolen for parts and joyriding, it stands to reason that a lot of the scum know their stuff.

Hagar wrote:

A secondary siren inside the car mightn't be a bad idea. It would be pretty uncomfortable to stay inside and fiddle with wires etc with an ear splitting noise so close by.

It's a great idea. You must have a battery backup for the main alarm brain though, otherwise they just disconnect the battery and then have as much time as they like to disarm the thing(ebay again).

gary the great

Wibbs wrote:

It's a great idea. You must have a battery backup for the main alarm brain though, otherwise they just disconnect the battery and then have as much time as they like to disarm the thing(ebay again).

So i have to get a battery backup as well as the item i listed form ebay? how much are they and are they easy to install? Im a bit retarded when it comes to working with anything electrical, but il have one of my mates around on Saturday whos handy so if i could get the whole system in a shop here before Saturday he'd install it.

And anyone know where i can get the key fob for the alarm? Its just a standard mazda alarm that came with the car. I preusme they have to set the frequency or whatever so i cant just buy off ebay. And how much is this likely to cost?

Thanks again

ianobrien

This is my solution. It works on older cars, as it only works for cars with an ignition coil.

What I do is I take a wire from the positive side of the coil and place the end under the dash. Another wire goes from the dash to the negative side of the coil. All I have to do is join the wires, the coil is bypassed and the car will not start.

I use OE wiring. The wiring goes into the wiring loom, and I use an OE connector under the dash. The connector is placed with the other connectors.

The joy of this is that, if I want to start the car, I disconnect the right connection under the dash! As the connection is broken for the car to move, a poor connection does not effect it!

zilog_jones

Wibbs wrote:

On a previous car of mine that was stolen they bypassed the alarm and immobiliser very easily.

What car was this? Was it an after-market immobiliser? I was here thinking immobilisers are generally hard enough to break and was kind of only professional carthief territory

gary the great

zilog_jones wrote:

What car was this? Was it an after-market immobiliser? I was here thinking immobilisers are generally hard enough to break and was kind of only professional carthief territory

Ye me too, i thought immobilisers were unbreakable!

Del2005

New cars, not sure since when but if you have 3 keys and 1 is a different colour then they are the ones, have unbreakable immobilisers. But older cars which have an aftermarket immobiliser fitted as part of the alarm can be bypassed.

The newer cars have the immobiliser as part of the ECU and linked to other parts and the only way to start them is with the key. That is why the scumbags break into your house now to rob the keys as the car doesn't go without the key.

Wibbs

zilog_jones wrote:

What car was this? Was it an after-market immobiliser? I was here thinking immobilisers are generally hard enough to break and was kind of only professional carthief territory

Nope, as Del2005 said the newer ones are harder to defeat, but not impossible. Some of the newer ones can be bypassed in a scarily easy fashion(which I obviously won't go into).

All aftermarket ones are just a break in one of the three systems that gets and keeps your car running. It's a switch, nothing more fancy than that regardless of the advertising blurb. The well hidden fuel cut kill switch is just as effective if not more so. The thatcham approved ones just break the three circuits which makes tracing the breaks harder and takes more time. With enough time you can still get the car going(an hour for most). That's good as the longer it takes the more nervous they'll get. Layers of security and time are your friends. The bog standard single immobiliser found on most alarms just cuts the ignition and is so easy to bypass it's not funny(and I know feck all about car electrics, but I was shown by an alarm guy).

The backup battery siren and the back up battery for the alarm throws the scum as one of the ways of silencing the alarm and bypassing the immobiliser is stopped.

gary the great

http://cgi.ebay.ie/Battery-Backup-Car-Alarm-Siren_W0QQitemZ120058605146QQihZ002QQcategoryZ75329QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.ie/Battery-Backup-SIREN-for-All-Car-Alarm-NEW-boxed_W0QQitemZ230040299399QQihZ013QQcategoryZ75329QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem

This kit will cost about 50euro. Should make the alrm much better.

Just another question re the backup siren il be putting in the car, will they just not find were the siren is coming from and cut the wire? Making it redundent? Am i ment to hide this in the car? I presume the alarm will keep ringing until turned off by me.

If this is in the car, ringing in there ears while they try cut the steering wheel to get the chain off, find the kill switch and then hotwire it, it should have woken half of europe and therefore should be safe! Happy days.

Wibbs

gary the great wrote:

http://cgi.ebay.ie/Battery-Backup-Car-Alarm-Siren_W0QQitemZ120058605146QQihZ002QQcategoryZ75329QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.ie/Battery-Backup-SIREN-for-All-Car-Alarm-NEW-boxed_W0QQitemZ230040299399QQihZ013QQcategoryZ75329QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem

This kit will cost about 50euro. Should make the alrm much better.

In a big way.

Just another question re the backup siren il be putting in the car, will they just not find were the siren is coming from and cut the wire? Making it redundent? Am i ment to hide this in the car? I presume the alarm will keep ringing until turned off by me.

As usual I wasn't being too clear gary the great:D . Basically you'll be replacing the existing siren under your bonnet with the backup battery siren so you just need one of those backup battery sirens to replace the original. Also it doesn't really matter if they cut the wire as the battery in the siren keeps it going cut wire or not. That's the reason for the backup battery in the siren itself. Ideally you could put the siren in the wing which would screw them even further. What you can then do is get a second small siren wired into the alarm and put it under the dash or behind a speaker grill. This is what deafens the scum. http://cgi.ebay.ie/DEI-513T-Car-Alarm-Mini-Siren-Piezo-Pain-Generator-NEW_W0QQitemZ200052433039QQihZ010QQcategoryZ60203QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD2VQQcmdZViewItem

Now what you can then do to really screw with the scum is get a backup battery for the alarm brain itself. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/DEI-520T-VIPER-CLIFFORD-HORNET-CAR-ALARM-BATTERY-BACKUP_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33720QQihZ010QQitemZ200054932498QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW
The first thing the scum will do is go under your bonnet and disconnect your battery. In most cases this will silence the alarm on the spot. They don't even have to get into your car to do it in all too many car models. With your alarm silenced they have all the time in the world. Also on cheap alarms cutting the power to the alarm disconnects the immobiliser too. With the second battery powering the alarm independently, it'll really confuse and delay them, if not stop even the most professional scum. Even if and it's a big if, they bypass that, they are now faced with your kill switch on an entirely different circuit. Gary the great 2, scum zero.

If this is in the car, ringing in there ears while they try cut the steering wheel to get the chain off, find the kill switch and then hotwire it, it should have woken half of europe and therefore should be safe! Happy days.

That's the plan alright. My contention is that with a good alarm(even an ok one well hidden) with backup batteries and a secondary siren(extra sensors like tilt switch), kill switches, anti hijack and a snap off steering wheel, they'll need a tow truck to move it. Even then it'll be going apesh!t at them. I know this is overkill for your case, but it shows that the idea of "if they really want it they'll get" it is not that true and is basically a copout.

PS I've done all the above and more and the scum have tried on two occasions to steal my car(once with a lot of time on their hands). Guess what? They must not have really wanted it, because I still have it.

311

Is it possible to buy wheel clamps ???
I've seen a couple of them around and they seem like a great detterent.

gary the great

Wibbs your a legend!

Il get the backup battery siren and replace the existing siren and then get the small siren for inside the car (although i presume if i dont get the backup alarm battery they can cut this off). Should do the trick, keep the scum at bay.

Wheel clamps can be gotten in argos afaik?

gary the great

Dam i got a big problem. Mazda are telling me that to get me an alarm fob will cost about 180euro and will take about 4 weeks!

So im thinking i may just get a new alarm set-up. Is there a cheap enough one incl. the back up battery siren and the small siren for in the car?

Wibbs

You could get on to ebay and get one, but then you have the cost of install. Unless you have a friendly car electrician type.

Here's a cheap two way pager job, might not be great; http://cgi.ebay.ie/Code-Alarm-CA670-NEW-LCD-2-way-alarm-start-791XV-KILLER_W0QQitemZ130053103934QQihZ003QQcategoryZ94832QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
Here's an expensive but very sweet one with all the trimmings, but probably out of your budget; http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Clifford-10-5x-car-alarm-remote-start-530T-520T-sensor_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33724QQihZ004QQitemZ140061584578QQrdZ1
Or this one;http://cgi.ebay.ie/DEI-Viper-791XV-Car-Alarm-System-NEW-Reg-Aus-Business_W0QQitemZ170058247385QQihZ007QQcategoryZ31250QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
Viper are owned by the same company that owns Clifford. In most cases same alarm, different box and stickers.

Or alternatively you could just get a local alarm fitter to fit a cheaper alarm, get the battery backup siren and interior siren from ebay and get the bloke to fit the lot. Any of them worth their salt could do that for you no bother(they might even have the sirens themselves). Might be easier on your pocket and nerves in the long run . The whole ebay thing could get complicated and if it goes wrong you can at least ring the bloke who fitted it.

gary the great

Wibbs what about a bonnet lock? this would stop them gettign at the alarm and therefore wouldnt need the battery siren? Would mean less hassle wires everywhere and probly cheaper! Im gonna get the in car mini siren though anyway

junkyard

Why don't you take the rotor arm out of it when you leave it or put a note on the dashboard saying something like "sorry for parking car here but its broken down or out of petrol", if any would be thief saw this he'd more than likely walk away from it.

Wibbs

gary the great wrote:

Wibbs what about a bonnet lock?

Why? To get a half decent one that actually works is a tad more complex than snipping the wires to your existing siren and just joining up the battery siren. If it's a mechanical bonnet lock you're drilling the bulkhead for a start.

junkyard wrote:

Why don't you take the rotor arm out of it when you leave it or put a note on the dashboard saying something like "sorry for parking car here but its broken down or out of petrol", if any would be thief saw this he'd more than likely walk away from it.

Or they'll think you're not going to be around for a while so may vandalise it for the "fun". Or lift your stereo. Or smash your glass. In any case how convenient is it going to be to remove the rotor arm every time you leave the car for the night? On a rainy night in january I can see the scenario of "can't be arsed" coming to mind. On some cars it's a bitch and taking it in and out is sooner or later going to break it.

gary the great

junkyard wrote:

Why don't you take the rotor arm out of it when you leave it or put a note on the dashboard saying something like "sorry for parking car here but its broken down or out of petrol", if any would be thief saw this he'd more than likely walk away from it.

Ye if i left a note on the dashboard like that they would wreck it "for the laugh". And il have it parked in the same spot every day when i come home from work ,so they will soon relaise that its a load of crap

Ye your right Wibbs, i just though a bonnet lock would be a hnady little thing to fit!

junkyard

If things are that rough in your neighborhood its an ex RUC Landrover you should have bought not a Mazda 323.:)

Wibbs

Maybe so. Sadly the scum are everywhere. Some areas appear to be safer but no area is safe.

gary the great

Unreal, last night some little scumbag attempted to rob the car. About 12.30 and i was just heading to sleep when i heard the alarm. The alarm is not sensitive and only goes of if the doors are opened or someone is messing with the door handle. SO jumped up to see 2 little hooded ****s playing with my door. So threw on the trousers and runners and legged it out. They didnt notice me running towards then and by the time i got out the front door they had the bonnet up. I shouted at them so they wouldnt cut the alarm wires and the just dropped the bonnet and ran. I was so full of adrenilin i kept chasing them and one lad was real slow. As i was catching up with him he threw a hacksaw at me (was obviuosly goona cut the wheel) and then i caught him and beat the livin ****e out of him. I wouldnt be a violent person but i was so full of rage that I just went mad on him. his friend fecked off and left him there to get beaten, even though the 2 could of probly taken me. He wont be robbing a car for a while thats for sure. I also took his phone and smashed it off the ground until it broke and took the money out of his wallet to cover any damage he did to the lock (was only 20euro).

I think im going to go out and get a disklock at the weekend, this should sort it out and help me sleep at night. Im also goona drive it up onto the green in front of my house and park it right outside my house.

****in pricks you cant have anything without the scum trying to steal it.

Hagar

Don't park in the same place tonight.
You don't know who they are but one of them sure as Hell now knows who you are.
Not the wisest thing you have ever done my friend.:(