Too fat to fly?

miamee

PARIS (Reuters) - An overweight passenger has sued Air France after being told he was too fat and had to pay for a second seat to accommodate his bulk.


Jean-Jacques Jauffret, a French scriptwriter, told Reuters on Wednesday he had felt humiliated by Air France staff who had measured his waist in public at New Dehli airport in 2005 and decided he was too big for a single seat.


A lawyer representing Air France told a court on Tuesday the company had a clear policy of asking obese

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passengers to pay for two seats.

"Let's be objective. This man is fat," lawyer Fernand Gamault told the court in Bobigny, according to Le Parisien newspaper. "He barely fits on the courtroom chair. How could he sit in an airplane?"


Gamault was not available for comment but Jauffret confirmed the lawyer's comments and said he was denounced as "fat" and "enormous" on countless occasions during the hearing.


"I felt shocked and humiliated by what he said," Jauffret added.


Jauffret said he weighed more than 160 kilos (352.7 lb) and said he had flown numerous times, including on other Air France flights, without ever being asked to pay more.


Air France's website urges overweight passengers to reserve a second seat, adding that failure to do so might mean they are refused access to an aircraft if it is fully booked.


Jauffret has asked for 8,000 euros in damages and 500 euros reimbursement for the cost of the additional ticket. A verdict in the case is due on February 20.

Having worked for an airline before I've heard of this plenty of times, I never thought anyone could sue for it though. If your bum doesn't fit in one seat you have to pay for a second seat - simple really. What do you think?

Marksie

miamee wrote:

What do you think?

"I think i seen about everything
but i aint seen an elephant fly"
-DUMBO

Lexus1976

Dont mind once he's not sitting beside me on a long haul flight.

Maybe they should put all the overweight people on the plane sitting beside each other. huh!

Ruu_Old

Airlines need to be more consistent if they are going to use these rules. I've seen it happen before on numerous airlines before.

miamee

Lexus1976 wrote:

Dont mind once he's not sitting beside me on a long haul flight.

Maybe they should put all the overweight people on the plane sitting beside each other. huh!

The laws of physics would say No to that

biko

Just as long as the amount of fat ppl on right side of the plane equal the amount on the left. Otherwise the plane will fly crooked.

Gran Hermano

Well if the average punter gets charged up to 10 euro per kilo for
excess baggage me thinks it is only fair that they charge the
lardy folk for the excess weight they are carrying on board
the plane.

Maybe they should have a scales at check-in for obese people
and charge them €10 for every kilo they are overweight.

Would you like to be stuck sitting beside a seriously obese person
if there was need for an emergency evacuation of a plane?

seamus

Ruu wrote:

Airlines need to be more consistent if they are going to use these rules.

Agreed. The man is quite clearly morbidly obese (25 stone! - Let's not get into debates about pro rugby players here people), but the fact that he managed to fly with AF before without issue, suggests that he'll probably win.

What are airlines to do? They can't weight people before they get on a flight. Well, they can, but they'll see their female passenger numbers (and numbers in general) plummett. And if you're going to just pull out people who look fat and measure their waists, then you risk emotional trauma, first off, but secondly you run the risk of inconsistency again - one person's obese man is another person's fat man.

miamee

seamus wrote:

What are airlines to do? They can't weight people before they get on a flight. Well, they can, but they'll see their female passenger numbers (and numbers in general) plummett. And if you're going to just pull out people who look fat and measure their waists, then you risk emotional trauma, first off, but secondly you run the risk of inconsistency again - one person's obese man is another person's fat man.

I think their width rather than their weight should be the issue as that is what is preventing them from sitting in one seat. With all of their high tech security scanning equipement at airports surely some bright spark can come up with a machine that can scan passengers to approximate size (and possibly weight)?

You're probably right too seamus, if he has flown without problem before then he has a chance. Of course he'd have to prove he hasn't put on any weight/inches since then too!

bluto63

He doesn't deserve any money. It said on the site he should have booked two seats and if he is that fat he SHOULD have booked two seats. I don't like the idea that I have to pay that much extra for baggage when this guy is allowed carrie an extra 200lbs for free.

bluto63

He doesn't deserve any money. It said on the site he should have booked two seats and if he is that fat he SHOULD have booked two seats. I don't like the idea that I have to pay that much extra for baggage when this guy is allowed carry an extra 200lbs for free.

ScumLord

Jean-Jacques Jauffret, a French scriptwriter, told Reuters on Wednesday he had felt humiliated by Air France staff

Can't have been as humiliating as having it splashed across every newspaper in the world you dick!

Would you like to be stuck sitting beside a seriously obese person
if there was need for an emergency evacuation of a plane?

I wouldn't mind sitting behind him it would be like having your own airbag on the plane. I wouldn't mind sitting near a fat person though I've been obese so I know how it feels.

Karl Hungus

Clearly fat people are a security issue. They can hide weapons under the folds in their stomachs.

leeroybrown

In my opinion the actual weight is largely irrelevant - the problem is that he is too large/wide to sit in a standard airplane seat means that both he and any adjacent passenger will probably be severely constrained and possibly endangered.

joebhoy1916

I know a woman who was about 20 stone or that no joking. Anytime she wanted to get on a plane she had to pay for two ticket's.

I dont think it's right but space's are very small.

miamee

leeroybrown wrote:

In my opinion the actual weight is largely irrelevant - the problem is that he is too large/wide to sit in a standard airplane seat means that both he and any adjacent passenger will probably be severely constrained and possibly endangered.

Exactly leeroy, well put. It surely can't be comfortable to squeeze yourself into a seat that is too small for you anyway, even on a short flight?

robinph

They should have a set weight limit for each person including their baggage and then I can take more luggage on with me and lardy people just don't get allowed any bags.

Cake Fiend

"I felt shocked and humiliated by what he said," Jauffret added.

At over 315lb, I find it hard to believe that he would be "shocked" that someone noticed his size. He humiliated himself by expecting to fit into a seat that even most regular-sized people find uncomfortable.

Although, maybe if they had told him he'd get two dinners he'd have been more inclined to get two seats!

tbh

I had to fly from Mumbai to London beside this woman who was massive - she was in the middle seat in a row of three. She was so big, I couldn't get to the media remote in the arm because the folds of her stomach were hanging over it. I was literally squashed up against the wall, and I was pissed off. I asked the stewardess for a different seat, but the flight was full. She told me she'd have upgraded me if she could, and that it wasn't fair that I didn't have a full seat. There should definitely be a width limit.

Fanny Cradock

They should just have placated his rage by offering him some left over Air France dinners and a voucher to McDonalds.

r3nu4l

Don't have a link onhand but there was a story on ABC or CNN or one of the US stations (Gee, I'm very precise aren't I :rolleyes: ) about expanding waistlines and the aviation industry. Apparently airlines and aircraft makers are becoming very concerned and are thinking of having larger seats in a set number of rows for obese people.

Mossy Monk

why not larger seats for everyone. ****ing things are uncomfortable for everyone

Sangre

seamus wrote:

Agreed. The man is quite clearly morbidly obese (25 stone! - Let's not get into debates about pro rugby players here people), but the fact that he managed to fly with AF before without issue, suggests that he'll probably win.

What are airlines to do? They can't weight people before they get on a flight. Well, they can, but they'll see their female passenger numbers (and numbers in general) plummett. And if you're going to just pull out people who look fat and measure their waists, then you risk emotional trauma, first off, but secondly you run the risk of inconsistency again - one person's obese man is another person's fat man.

And set a precedent that a company can't change it policies or business practices?

Backtoblack

Fat people should just loose weight. Its disgusting, its unhealthy and people can't be as happy as they would be were they fit and healthy. :rolleyes:

pred racer

miamee wrote:

Exactly leeroy, well put. It surely can't be comfortable to squeeze yourself into a seat that is too small for you anyway, even on a short flight?

Believe me it isnt...... if you have taken a few internal flights in the states, then this has happened to you at least once.

BuffyBot

Its disgusting, its unhealthy and people can't be as happy as they would be were they fit and healthy.

It must be great to be able to read minds.

Anyway, if AF weren't applying this policy across the board, then yes, they have to accept some measure of responsibility.

However, it's also about how they approached it seems. Even if they were going to take measurements, surely there was somewhere private which would have sufficed to do it, and tact never goes astray either.

This doesn't nessecarily mean this guy is right, but he may not be completely wrong either

LundiMardi

some of the rediculous and retarded comments in this thread are unreal!!!

The guy was humiliated ffs!! He had flew before and never been asked to buy a second seat!! Like has been said, if there was some consistency in the rules then maybe just maybe it would be ok. But that's not the case.

I'm 23 stone, i carry it well and you'd never think i was but if i was measured in an airport i would go ****ing ape****.

Black Swan

Could it be that the overweight scriptwriter has run out of material and is using this legal affair as a source? A year or two from now you may just see the new film release, "Too Fat to Fly."

Red Hand

Blue_Lagoon wrote:

Could it be that the overweight scriptwriter has run out of material and is using this legal affair as a source? A year or two from now you may just see the new film release, "Too Fat to Fly."

Good thinking!:D

Would he be left sit at the premmier though?

Ruu_Old

Backtoblack wrote:

Fat people should just loose weight. Its disgusting, its unhealthy and people can't be as happy as they would be were they fit and healthy. :rolleyes:

What if they can't? Not everything is that black and white.

Sam Vimes

Ruu wrote:

What if they can't? Not everything is that black and white.

not be too un pc but they all can. i've put on a bit round the middle recently but i know its entirely my own fault so i've cut out chippers and i'm running and stuff. i'm doing something about it. if morbidly obese people changed their eating and exercise patterns they'd shed weight like an ice cube

Attol

I think it's fair enough to have to pay for 2 seats if you don't fit into one. If you're going to take up 2 seats wouldn't it make sense? I was on a coach in the UK from Birmingham to London and spent the whole time squished against the wall with no space to move. It was a 3 hour journey and it was so uncomfortable. I had paid for a full seat yet only got half. That's not fair on me. I expected a reasonable degree of comfort. The reply from their customer service was very unhelpful and basically told me "their policy is not to discrimminate". I think it's a reasonable request to be allowed have the full seat you paid for.

The cost of redesigning all planes to accomodate increasing waistlines is totally unfeasible.

Ruu_Old

LadyLotts wrote:

I think it's fair enough to have to pay for 2 seats if you don't fit into one. If you're going to take up 2 seats wouldn't it make sense? I was on a coach in the UK from Birmingham to London and spent the whole time squished against the wall with no space to move. It was a 3 hour journey and it was so uncomfortable. I had paid for a full seat yet only got half. That's not fair on me. I expected a reasonable degree of comfort. The reply from their customer service was very unhelpful and basically told me "their policy is not to discrimminate". I think it's a reasonable request to be allowed have the full seat you paid for.

The cost of redesigning all planes to accomodate increasing waistlines is totally unfeasible.

You should have asked them if you could have a smoke on the plane if you had to be uncomfortable. Wouldn't overweight people be just as much of a risk as smokers?

SandhillRoad

What about overweight stewards/stewardess? Seen any lately? It seem like the rules have changed.

Naikon

If you are big enough to require two seats, then you should have to pay for the extra weight that has to be accounted for.
Dont get me wrong, I am 6 foot, 3 inches(1.905M) and the lack of legroom on planes is the real killer for me:mad: :mad: :mad:
But thats besides the point in fairness.

I am not the fittest person around by any measure, but the prospect of having to pay for two seats alone to accomodate extra bulk would be humiliating to say the least, and incur motivation to lose such weight.

Another poster mentioned that it wouldent be feasible to extend seats as it could become a situation where planes will reach physical limits with regards to seat and interior extension.

Would you like to be stuck sitting beside a seriously obese person
if there was need for an emergency evacuation of a plane?

Well, it depends on if the plane crashes at sea or not..

.. if Brainiac taught us anything its that fat people are really buoyant.

Attol

You have a point there boney.

tbh

Commander Vimes wrote:

not be too un pc but they all can. i've put on a bit round the middle recently but i know its entirely my own fault so i've cut out chippers and i'm running and stuff. i'm doing something about it. if morbidly obese people changed their eating and exercise patterns they'd shed weight like an ice cube

the point is that a lot of people who are overweight are that way because of underlying medical conditions. It's not all just because some people have no willpower, although I'd imagine that would be 75% of the time.

DublinWriter

seamus wrote:

What are airlines to do? They can't weight people before they get on a flight.

I flew from Rosaveel in Galway to the Inismor with Aer Aran in it's early days in 1996.

Back then they were flying 6-seater Cessenas (basically a Hiace with wings) and everyone getting on the flight had to publically weight in at check-in on this scales with a massive dial on the wall that you could read from miles away.

My then gf was not impressed.

Sam Vimes

Naikon wrote:

If you are big enough to require two seats, then you should have to pay for the extra weight that has to be accounted for.
Dont get me wrong, I am 6 foot, 3 inches(1.905M) and the lack of legroom on planes is the real killer for me:mad: :mad: :mad:
But thats besides the point in fairness.

you should always request the emergency exit seats. loads of leg room.

Mitch Connor

LundiMardi wrote:

The guy was humiliated ffs!! He had flew before and never been asked to buy a second seat!! Like has been said, if there was some consistency in the rules then maybe just maybe it would be ok. But that's not the case.

In fairness, i do not see how that is entirely relevant to the real issue. It states on their website that obese people should book a second seat and if they don't, they may either have to purchase one on boarding or possibly be denied access tot he plane. Just because this has not happened to the person beofre is no reason to say it should not happen ever.

People speed when driving, and mostly get away with it. I'm sre there are people that speed but have never been causght. If they do get caught do you think "But i have sped before and no one has said anything to me" should be an acceptable defence.

I know in one case it is illegal what the person has been doing and in the other it clearly isn't, but i think the comparison stands.

CountryWise

If you overweight your overweight, hate this sensitivity issue around weight, but the reason that we can get so many people in the air is the size of the seats in the plane thats probably not an issue that can be changed!

As previously stated im tall and i dont complain i understand the logic of small areas per person in a plane, maybe the embarassment of the weight issue might help them change their lives

robinph

DublinWriter wrote:

I flew from Rosaveel in Galway to the Inismor with Aer Aran in it's early days in 1996.

Back then they were flying 6-seater Cessenas (basically a Hiace with wings) and everyone getting on the flight had to publically weight in at check-in on this scales with a massive dial on the wall that you could read from miles away.

My then gf was not impressed.

They still do the same thing when I took that flight a couple of years ago. I think where you tipped the scales may have determined which seat you got so that they balanced the plane out correctly.

There was even less leg room on that flight though than on Ryanair planes and I'm surprised the guy in front of me didn't complain about me kneeing him in the back. But he was a little busy flying the plane at the time I guess. :eek:

BuffyBot

In fairness, i do not see how that is entirely relevant to the real issue. It states on their website that obese people should book a second seat and if they don't, they may either have to purchase one on boarding or possibly be denied access tot he plane.

Assuming he booked on the web, of course...

Marksie

Blue_Lagoon wrote:

Could it be that the overweight scriptwriter has run out of material and is using this legal affair as a source? A year or two from now you may just see the new film release, "Too Fat to Fly."

titled "united 93 stone"

RandolphEsq

Obesity is a disease. Obese people should be taxed and treated for their physical and psychological problems. The man's weight is affecting on other people,its time for him to pay

Sangre

tbh wrote:

the point is that a lot of people who are overweight are that way because of underlying medical conditions. It's not all just because some people have no willpower, although I'd imagine that would be 75% of the time.

More like 99%

justsomebloke

tbh wrote:

the point is that a lot of people who are overweight are that way because of underlying medical conditions. It's not all just because some people have no willpower, although I'd imagine that would be 75% of the time.

Sangre wrote:

More like 99%

I would have to agree with this as I don't think "can't be aresed" can actually qualify as a medical condition. yes I know some people can't lose weight due to medical conditions however these are far out number by people who just don't try hard enough.

As has been pointed out it states on it's website that you may require an extra seat and I am sure the terms and conditions if you booked it over the phone would also indicate the same. So I think he should have to pay for an extra seat, as poor person beside who would already be squashed in a small space would be squashed into an even smaller space.

however on the issue of them having to take to seats do the seatbelts on airplanes strech far enough to lock in safley when you have to take 2 seats

miamee

I *think* they can provide a seatbelt extension so that the belt from the first seat can stretch far enough to plug into the second seat...if ya get me?

ScumLord

Obesity is a disease. Obese people should be taxed and treated for their physical and psychological problems. The man's weight is affecting on other people,its time for him to pay

How?

Maybe we should bring back communisim then the government could control every aspect of our lifes and we wouldn't need to tax any minority in socity.

Ruu_Old

miamee wrote:

I *think* they can provide a seatbelt extension so that the belt from the first seat can stretch far enough to plug into the second seat...if ya get me?

The only extension I ever heard about was the one if you have a babeh, perhaps I'm wrong.