The Rambo look for target shooting!

coffeepot

I think that all military type clothing should be banned in target shooting clubs. It gives a very thuggish image to target shooting as a sport. I agree that when hunting such clothing may be suitable, because it is camouflaged, cheap, warm etc. But why do we have so many grown men wearing “desert camo suits” and “jungle fatigues” while they shoot the dreaded paper targets. Did they miss out on something in their childhood? I have brought non shooters to my club on occasions to demonstrate that we are not all nutters only to be confronted with people dressed like something that looks like a scene from “Full Metal Jacket”. For God’s sake some of these guys must think we are at war! I genuinely worry about some of these people, dressed from head to toe like they are straight out of a major combat situation, armed with a .22 rifle! I have noticed that some clubs have banned this. What are other people’s views on this? Am I the only one that thinks this is doing harm to our sport?

Remmy

I think that a large majority of shooters who go to the range also hunt so it would make sense that they would have camo clothing .Why should they cease to wear it just because it offends some peoples sensibilities :rolleyes:

I would agree ,however, that the walter mitty types going around in their black tacticool bill liners should be taken aside and had a few words with .What possible use could 5.11 black coveralls have in either shooting or hunting ! And believe me Ive seen a few!

But as far as the camo goes ,I have nothing against it .Unless you want to suggest a new line of stylish range wear that we should all be kitted out in

Thanks,
Remmy

Sparks

Done before...

17HMR

I thought that most ranges banned (or at least seriously frowned upon) military/tactical dress ?

And, military camo patterns (more suited to desert amd jungle) are generally looked down on out and about as well ?

Going around looking like paramilitary training units does none of us any favours...

coffeepot

Give me a break! Many of these people live in the city, they have never hunted in thier lives! Many of them dont even have land that they can hunt on! Granted some people hunt and target shoot on the same day, but they are in the minority. I would suggest wearing normal outdoor type clothing (or for indoor shooting normal indoor type clothing). Peoples sensibilities is not what worries me, it the the fact that Joe Public (who has a vote by the way) sees people may have watched too much TV being armed to the teeth, dressed up like Rambo. This alarms people. This is one of the reasons why some people associate target shooting with thugs. If we want to demonstrate to people that this is a sport, no an excuse to have a trophy pistol/rifle we need to think about how we are percieved. The practical shooting people have realised this long ago.

Umiq88

Ban military clothing yes

Ban camo jackets or trousers no

Realtree or similar patterns arent really offence and if someone looks at it they're more likely to associate it with hunting or country sports as oppsed to some nutter wearing full camo where they jump straight to the wrong conclusion of someone being a threat and wants to shoot everyone

Vegeta

I've had a long drawn out debate abut this before with Dvs. In my opinion is that people should be able to wear what they want.

If a person is safe with a firearm what care do I have what the guy/gal wears. I don't know, people wear camo hunting, the average Joe Public know this. Why are they so shocked when they see it at the range.

Are people who shoot targets ashamed to be linked to hunting?

Maybe some deer stalkers would like to practice in their hunting clothing.

Perhaps a person new to hunting buys some camo clothing (not all of which is cheap, most expensive piece of hunting clothing I own is a camo jacket at 150 euro, followed by my waders), he then joins a range and has no money for clothing for the range. Not all ranges are spotless and ordinary clothes may not be suitable at some so rough, hard wearing clothing is suitable.

I also think if camo clothing is banned, it is a slippery slope. Why not tracksuits and baseball caps, GAA jersey, Soccer jersey, runners.

Surely a range is a place where someone can go and safely practice their marksmanship. Not be judged by the shooting community for what they wear.

Yes camo has a negative stigma attached in this country because of the North's violent history but if a portion of the shooting community supports the ban of camo, it only affirms their beliefs that camo is worn by people up to no good.

coffeepot

As I pointed out, and I think most of us will agree MOST people that wear this type of clothing are not hunting on the same day. I know many famers and like many ranges they are not working in spotless conditions yet they do not all seem to be dressed in militay clothing.

It is nothing to do with being ashamed of being a hunter. When you hunt generally people dont see you. For Joe public the only time that he/she will see a civillian with a gun is on a range.

The fact that some of this clothing is expensive is not relevent.

Unfortunatley many people judge us on how we appear. Dress like you are ready to kill an enemy when all you are facing is a target and to many you appear unbalanced. In some of the more extreme cases I some may say that you are unfit to have a firearm.

This is not a good time for shooting to get a bad image!

bullets

I see your point even though I dont agree with it.

after a couple of trips up to the range I now
fire at I saw A LOT of camo gear on people that were only shooting at
paper targets. Myself and the guys that were with me did find it
a little bit Bizzare. And wondering why all the camo surely
they all cant be hunters. We silently wondered what was with
the sheer amount of camo on poeple that looked/sounded as though
there came from Urban Areas rather than Rural areas.

I dont agree that they should be Banned as
I think people should be able to wear whatever they like.
They are not harming anyone and mostly whoever is at the
range would not be there if they did not have an interest
so most of the time the rest of the public would not even
be bothered by poeple wearing the camo as they would not
be seen.

It could be like if your a Biker you dress a certain way
if your a rapper/raver or into a paticular pastime or sub-culture
fashion and clothing comes into play a lot when walking down the
street to act as indicators to let people know what your interests
may be etc etc.

A real weak Practical Reason I could thinkg about is.......
when were being thought to shoot in
the reserve army were were always told Camo and Green Colours
will relax the eye more than other colours and after looking through
a rifle for a duration your eyes do become tired we were always told
to look at green grass or something after a few minutes.

As I Kids/teenager I wore Camo and Army gear a lot of the time
simply cos I liked it. But I was not gung ho or acted like I was
going to war. When ever I went Orienteering, hill walking or
Camping I donned Camo without any thought or reason.

I know loads of people that buy clothes from the
Army store as the simply like them and they dont shoot.
My Girlfriend bought some moleskins and jumper for her Brother as
a christmas present!!

With that said when I visited the range for the first time
I did go out and buy some
earthly green and brown coloured clothes (Not CAMO or militery)
so I would not stick out like a sore thumb.

I did not want to appear like a Yuppie city boy or give any bad
impressions that I could be some nut-case.

I'm a goth so the stereotypical views on Goths to clueless Joe Soaps
are that they all are weirdos that wear black and are mad satanic devil
worshipping freaks that go listening to heavy nasty music
and blasting there way through high schools...nothing could
be further from the truth but If I arrived on the range with an
ankle length leather jacket and knee high boots with bits of metal
hanging out I dont think the range would be keen on letting me
become a member or handing me out rifles and letting me shoot.

( BTW I like nice mellow music and wear normal clothes
just I like them to be black ;-) and I dont have a ghosty pale face
long black hair or have any bits or metal hanging our of me)

Better to blend in with the crowd on Some occasions.

~B

coffeepot

Apart from the 1% of people that are hunting and target shooting on the same day why would you want to dress up in the costume of a solider? Is it that you watched so many war films that you feel that you can pretend to be the hero form the film? If you are old enough to hold a FAC are you not too old for this kind of make believe? One of the worst offenders can be the pistol shooter! Is he off hunting with this Glock18? I hope not! Or maybe he is part of a special forces unit! A lot of these people need to grow up! I have shot on ranges with serving members of the army and cops as well. Guess what, none of them wore uniforms at the time! Thankfully many clubs have the same point of view as I do.

maglite

what about all black swat style

the range of functional clothes is limited when it comes to shooting

and you tyhink 16 is too old to play in greens, i pitty you ,, will you retire to the rocking chair at 40???


Natural colours are functional they hide the muck as well as you


now i wouldent wear fill DPM( i think this is what we mean when we talk about military clothing),,,the exception to this is when its wet my gore tex gear is DPM,, it was very cheap when i bought it €50,ish

and i will get a rabbit or 2 the same day i go shooting the gun is already dirty

coffeepot

to be honest I think that 40 is too old for fancy dress with real guns!

coffeepot

BTW I see hillwalkers, farmers etc. all wearing functional outdoor clothing that is not military style!

civdef

For the sake of PR, whatever the rights and wrongs of it, I prefer if people leave the cammo look at home when going to the range. I have no problem with people wearing cammo going hunting.

coffeepot

My point exactly ! Civdef

Dvs

Hey Coffeepot,
Are you just blowing off steam!:D :

Dvs.

.243

civdef wrote:

For the sake of PR, whatever the rights and wrongs of it, I prefer if people leave the cammo look at home when going to the range. I have no problem with people wearing cammo going hunting.

i agree,there is a time and a place for this "army style" clothing,for a minority sport that has little or no positive coverage by any media all they need is an inch and we are put in the same slot as "threat" to joe public weather we like it or not, bascially army camo means "man with gun" in any form to the uninformed.Does midland have this code of no camo ???

coffeepot

DVS

Yes I am! Fun isnt it?

Manic Moran

I ordinarily wear jeans, though if I have a reason to, I'll wear camo: BDU trousers are in my wardrobe, and they lots of big pockets to carry things in.

NTM

jaycee

coffeepot wrote:

Peoples sensibilities is not what worries me, it the the fact that Joe Public (who has a vote by the way) sees people may have watched too much TV being armed to the teeth, dressed up like Rambo. This alarms people. This is one of the reasons why some people associate target shooting with thugs.

Well , if Joe Public is looking at people in normal civilian shooting jackets , and assuming that it is military attire ... He is just wrong. If he/she thinks that people are "armed to the teeth" , It is the responsibility of anyone bringing a new person to a shooting range to explain what the various firearms are , what competitions they are used for, what degree of training is involved , and the amount of skill and dedication required to compete.

Range safety rules must be brought to the attention of the visitor and as always , any infringements of range safety must be brought to the notice of a safety officer.

He , or she needs educating on how things work in the real world. Many peoples warmest and most waterproof clothing is their hunting jacket. They are strong items of clothing that can take some punishment , and nobody is too worried if some grease , gun oil , muck or bits of fauna become attached to it. No army that I know of uses "Realtree timber" pattern for its soldiers.

Like the Firearms and the safety procedures , this needs explaining to anyone who doesn't understand. What isn't needed is a respected branch of sporting activity , hiding and trying to second guess every erroneous conclusion that ignorant persons may jump to. If I wear black pants , am I now a "Ninja" ?, White ..a member of the KKK ..? Jeans ... a student demonstrator..?
Of course not, people know the difference ..don't they..?, and so it is with the humble shooting jacket , a matter of knowledge and education.

I also disagree that most people view target shooters in the same light as thugs. Most people view thugs as thugs. Preconceived notions based on little or no facts are always scary , some people obviously believe that a robber can easily be spotted by the fact that he will have a hooped jumper and be carrying a bag marked "Swag".

God bless the Beano .!

civdef

some people obviously believe that a robber can easily be spotted by the fact that he will have a hooped jumper and be carrying a bag marked "Swag".

Everyone knows criminals are easily identified by their inner-city-Dublin accents.

Gerri

civdef wrote:

Everyone knows criminals are easily identified by their inner-city-Dublin accents.

That is very offensive,please remove.

Dvs

And their hoodie top,
trainers and track trousers...



No thats bloody joggers!


Dvs.

civdef

I hear Lidl have a sense of humour on sale next Thursday. It'll be German of course, so a bit strange for our tastes, but still good value.

Clare gunner

Well,I suppose it would be more in keeping that we should show up in these PC days with our baseball caps [Burberry] on back to front looking like complete retards.Dressed in jeans with the crotch down around our knees,or a shell suit outfit complete with gold chains,walking with an ape like shuffle, moving your hands about in some sort of spastic gestures,talking like we da man out ta pop a few caps at dem homeboy muthafuka targets from da barrio from East LA.Oh not to forget safely carrying the piece in the front of our pants.:rolleyes: :rolleyes:
If we were to jugdge that type of dress with thugs and gang bangers you would be had up for being Politically incorrect and have all sorts of do gooders on your case.So why judge people wearing wearing cammo as thugs?Or a danger to shooting???It is also very offensive TO ME to be associated with a very nasty ficitious chacter from Hollywood,who NEVER BTW wore cammo in any of the films,by another shooter supposedly! I wear cammo or green on a range or forest.
[1] Because it is cheap and durable.
[2] Green is a traditional hunting color in Europe.Not flouresent orange or jeans.
[3] It is warmer and less noisey than some of the expensive dayglo rubbish that is foisted upon us as shooting clothes.
[4] Hillwalkers need Dayglo as they get lost all the damn time,when they arent tramping across private property.Farmers are just tight,and will wear grandpas wedding jacket from 1940 if they can get abit of twine around the waist.:D [Tounge firmly in cheek here]
[5] I would hardly call surplus a uniform.The reason it is surplus,is proably because an army has discarded it.Best example is the Bundeswehr OD moleskin pants.MUCH favourd by German hunters,who take great pride in wearing total green,and look more in uniform,in their traditional hunting kit than we ever will in our surplus khakhi.
[6] Quit judging books by their covers.The worst showoffs are supposed to be the most disiplined.Not mentioning some certain police units here and in the UK.Came onto one range in the UK all done up as if they were going off to storm the nearest embassy.Trouble is the range they came onto was the REAL big boys playground.The SAS range at Stirling lines,Hereford. Guess who was not impressed and who was told what sort of clowns they looked like?

I personally dont care if the guy next to me is wearing pink hunter wellies,fishnet stockings,a yellow polka dot dress,a big floppy hat,and spouts a zapasta moustache,and is carrying all his shooting kit in a handbag.
Does he shoot safely,does he shoot well?Thats all I careabout.

This nonsense that cammoed shooter equals nutter is irrevelant nowadays.If a dedicated target shooter lost his dog and went out popping folks with his single shot 22[somthing I would be more worried about than a spray&pray merchant,as the target shooter will know HOW to shoot accurately and well].

You can be sure the press whores will make somthing,and everything from his lifestyle.
Target shooting & hunting mags= Libary of mayhem on firearms and survivalism and bloodsports
three firearms=Arsenal of deadly weapons.
Living in a clapboard shack= Armed compound
Copy of Playboy under bed=sexual pervert with an extensive porn libary.

This is a kind of snobbery we can do without these days.It is the same as the snobbery around three shot semi autos and that doubles must be side by side.

Clare gunner

civdef wrote:

Everyone knows criminals are easily identified by their inner-city-Dublin accents.

Wha ya on about Sham??Sure everyone knows it us Limerick lads is de better criminals!!!Now take tha back or i'll come up an shtab ya!!!:D

Anyway whats Lidls selling thats German next week???:)

coffeepot

Well Clare Gunner I am new to this boards thing so I dont know how to show quotes properly sorry. Just to take each of your points:

1 Yes it is cheap and durable, so is much of outdoor clothing. Hillwalkers seem to be exposed to the elements and they use fleeces alot. They are warm, cheap durable etc. are many other forms of outdoor clothing. Combat clothing is not the only type that is cheap and durable.

2 I am not talking about hunting! I am talking about target shooting on a range. Green is a great colour, no argument there! I have no problem with wearing green on a range. I am referring to people in full millitary clothing shooting on a target range. Here is the opening line to my thread "I think that all military type clothing should be banned in target shooting clubs". I have no problem with green. I have no problem with this kind of clothing being used for hunting.

3 I am not suggesting that Dayglo is worn. I just mean normal outdoor clothing! Less noisey is not an issue when you are on the range! Walk in a park on on a beach some day or go up the mountains, many people have found it possible to dress in a practical way without spending a small fortune and without looking like they are in a combat zone!

4 Dont know what to say to this except hillwalkers now have GPS I like my 1940's wedding jacket. I have great pockets in it for extra mags!

5 I take your point, however I do know sevral individuals who wear what could definitley be described as a uniform! In Germany hunting is much more popular. I dont think that shooting as a sport is under threat in Germany like it is here.

6 I am not judging books by thier covers. I am concerned that others do.

I am just concerned that if some shooters are childish enough to dress up to play soilders that this can panic voters! There is an election very soon! I want to keep the items that I have. The perception people have of our sport is very important. Ok DVS is right I am blowing off a bit of steam. If I did not think our sport was under threat I would not care what people wore. I might think in some cases that it is a bit sad that a grown man would dress up like that just to shoot paper, but I would not really care!

Vegeta

Would you like to explain why you think people wearing camo at a range is bad for the sport of target shooting.

I accept you think it is sad that someone wears camo to a range, that full grown men dress up etc but you'll have to do better than that to convince me it is damaging the sport.

What exactly is your fear, that people will link camo to hunting or the IRA or the army??? I just don't get it. I can accept that no one wants to be linked to the IRA or anyone like them. On the other hand I'd have no problem being linked to the army or hunting.

coffeepot

Vegetta,

When people like me hunt generally we are not seen by the public, so what we look like is not so important. We are quite discreet. That is why I have no problem with what people wear when they hunt.

However as I'm sure you will agree most people in this country are not very keen on shooting. If they see civilians with guns in real life it will be on a range in most cases. This is where we as shooters have a chance to project a positive image of shooting. We need to show it to be a sport and our firearms as "sporting equipment". If we look like some of the people from "Bowling for Columbine" some people may think we are of the same mind as some of the people portrayed in that film. To enjoy shooting on a range you do not need to look like a US marine. This scares some people. I have seen it scare people. To Joe public if it looks like a sport it is a sport. If we look like nutters, maybe we are nutters! There is alot in the media about gun crime at present. Shooters like ourselves know that firearms that are legally held do not cause problems in this country. Joe public however does not know this in many cases, and he has a vote! Do you not think I have a point?

I am not alone in thinking this way, the practical shooting people have strict rules about this also. Many clubs around the country have rules about this.

Vegeta

I agree with 90% of what you are saying. Our sport is indeed in a tricky situation.

The problem I have is that if you ban people from dressing a certain way because of how the public feel you are pretty much telling the public "yeah we don't want to associate with people who dress like that"

coffeepot

I have tried to promote our sport. I have introduced sevral people to it. Some tried it once, that was it. Others are now very involved. All of them were suprised at the range of firearms that are available to some of us legally. I did my best to demonstrate how as shooters we are safe and responsible mature people. On one occasion in particular I was embarressed when asked by a person I brought as a guest to the club why a particular pistol shooter could be "of sound mind" because of his clothing. (sory I cant go into too much detail here as I would identify people concerned, but you can get my drift) I was lost for words. What should I have said? Pistols are not for hunting! This guy is not a hunter, I know him. This is the type of thing I am talking about.

As for the point that combats etc. are cheap, I know! Most shooters have no problem spending huge amounts of money on equipment, so why skimp on range clothing? Anyway good range clothing can be cheap and non military.