Liverpool - Arsenal CC

Guy:Incognito

Jivin Turkey wrote:

I couldn't even tell you who the "next big thing" tipped to come out of the academy is, because there doesn't seem to be any major hopes. Andersen is supposed to be good, but how come he is not good enough when Arsenal can field a team of teenagers and win, comfortably.

He may well be but who knows whats going on in Rafas head. He gave Robbie a new contract because he played a good half season last season. He says he'll use him this season yet barely does. He's picked up a few goals even at this stage of his career and only getting a game every so often, even with othens not playign great.

He's talked about anderson and others before yet doesnt give them games.Rafa seems to want to forget about the young players at the club abd buy in tons of others in the hope a few come good. I think it's a possiblility he'll sell Carson at the end of the season despite the fact that everyone else would do the opposite.

He's a strange one alright.

Kingp35

Any highlights for this game up yet?

Stky10

Jivin Turkey wrote:

I couldn't even tell you who the "next big thing" tipped to come out of the academy is, because there doesn't seem to be any major hopes. Andersen is supposed to be good, but how come he is not good enough when Arsenal can field a team of teenagers and win, comfortably.

Well there are a couple. I don't know whats happened Anderson this year, he seems to have gone off the boil. There's also Hamill, Lindfield, El Zhar, Hobbs, Roque, Darby, & Insua.

Why they were'nt played I don't know. But sticking Guthrie out on the right when he needs to be played in the middle and leaving Anderson/Hamill/El Zhar out of the squad makes no sense to me. Similarly playing Peltier who's a central midfielder instead of Darby. Darby is still eligible for the Youth Team this year though, so he's probably too young, but then again Traore was playing and he's only 17 as well.

If you're going to bring a young player in, he's not going to make it if he's played out of position. I see we're about to sell Darren Potter to Wolves. He's another central midfield player who was only ever given a chance out wide. Even when he went to Wolves thats where they played him at first as well, but since they moved him to the middle he's a completely different player, they can see that and so want to make the move permanent. We seem to be making the same mistakes all over again.

Guy:Incognito

Kingp35 wrote:

Any highlights for this game up yet?

I think Dudek is on Paramount comedy at 12.

Savman

Stekelly wrote:

I think Dudek is on Paramount comedy at 12.

He could be joined by nearly all his teammates! With the possible exceptions of Gerrard and Bellamy...

kinaldo

Hahahahaha

Liverpool totally owned by Arsenal this season!

3 games played, scored 4 conceded 12

(although it was funnier when it was at 11-2)

So much for fortress Anfield.

Savman

kinaldo wrote:

Hahahahaha

Liverpool totally owned by Arsenal this season!

3 games played, scored 4 conceded 12

(although it was funnier when it was at 11-2)

So much for fortress Anfield.

People in glass houses...

Guy:Incognito

Savman wrote:

People in glass houses...

They beat Utd 5-0 and Spurs 7-1 once you know.:)

kinaldo

Savman wrote:

People in glass houses...

I can laugh at Newcastle as well (sometimes at least), but hey it's all relative. We didn't have lofty title ambitions this season.

Stky10

Stekelly wrote:

They beat Utd 5-0 and Spurs 7-1 once you know.:)

Beat Barcelona 3-2 once as well I think....

And don't forget that Fairs Cup victory 50 years ago, and being crowned this years Inter-toto winners as well. Didn't they do well....

kinaldo

People can try to wind me up all they want but it doesn't make Liverpool's performances this season against their great rivals Arsenal, Man Utd, Chelsea and Everton any less funny. In total I make that Liverpool 4 Rivals 18

Savman

kinaldo wrote:

In total I make that Liverpool 4 Rivals 18

That's interesting but let's not forget this

Really weird game. I can see Benitez going soon.

Stky10

So they're not having a great season. In the general scheme of things while the result of tonights match brought out the "sack him now" supporter to rant and rave, it was a game between two relative reserve sides and is going to have damn all of an effect.

They'll still qualify for the champions league next year, they'll have the money from the DIC investment to finally buy the first choice of player they want, and they'll still have a reputation as being one of the top clubs in the world and so should be able to attract top class players without having to pay them absolute top dollar wages like Newcastle have to do.

So yeah, its not great, but its nowhere near as bad as some are making out. Didn't it take Ferguson 7 seasons to win his first league title?. 7 years during which he'd more money to spend than any other team?. Benitez is on his third, during which time he's constantly had to scrimp, save, and compromise. Thats about to change. Things take time, rome wasn't built in a day.

county

i think they should name it the sunday league cup,never mind the coca cola cup

cashback

event wrote:

classic quote right there

Yeah, suppose it was a classic quote!
I didn't see it apart from the goals on the news. My Liverpool supporting friend came in at half time and said it was 1-4. I was sure he was taking the piss.
Sounds like Ali had a good one but still don't think he'll do it in the PL.
Delighted for Baptista. It's what he needed and I'm sure the penalty won't bother him too much now.:D
At least there's been a good response since the sheffield utd match.

redspider

It's being reported that Benitez has apologised:

http://www.rte.ie/sport/2007/0110/liverpool.html
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/league_cup/6246893.stm

We tried to do our best, but we conceded goals and you cannot change the result now. All I can say is 'sorry' to our supporters.

"We must forget about tonight as soon as possible and look ahead to Watford on Saturday and the Champions League."


I guess the impact of this result has been communicated to him by one and all, and I would imagine that there are very few of the Liverpool executives that would have opted for playing such tactics, more or less giving up a shot at a trophy and suffering an very embarassing heavy defeat at home in the process. That is not the ethos of Liverpool football club, and try as he might there is no way that Benitez can explain it away.

Up to now, Benitez has been given ultimate control in team selection and neither directors nor players knew who would be in the 16-man squads up until close to the kick-off, with Benitez preferring to have plenty of players ready. After this, I suspect, that the executives at least will want some sort of heads up on Benitez's intentions. Even though Benitez had flagged a likely weak team selection in pre-match interviews, it was the level of weakness which was a shock for all, and given that many involved with Liverpool wanted to win this game at all costs.

eg: Stevie Gerrard
http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/drilldown/N154642070109-1300.htm

Redspider

kippy

From a football fans' point of view it was a great match to watch. Arsenal looked like they could beat most teams last night but in fairness the main liverpool culprits were Pauletta and Dudek. He was at fault in more than one goal. The Arsenal attack were fantastic though.
Many people will say now how Rafa should have played his best team, but that is all good in hindsight. On paper, before the match, you would have said that the Liverpool team were a better team-thats what Rafa would have thought too when picking them.
He didnt have too much choice in changing things either once gonzalex got injured and couldnt make 2 substitutions at half time as many pundits were hammering him for not doing, however the Carragher substitution at that time was possibly the strangest decision of the match-seeing as most of the point was to rest players like Carra, they were in need of a player who could change games and Crouch who would be considered a squad player was on the bench. That said Crouch did feck all on Saturday.
Perhaps for these type of matches, the manager should put out a first choice defence and rotate the rest of the squad-I think this would have helped Liverpools cause a lot last night. Again hindsight is great.
I wouldnt worry to much about the result as a once off but as many have pointed out Liverpools season is full of such "once off" results. Not worth getting the manager sacked over but not a great sign for the fans.
Perhaps the worst thing to come out of the match after Rafa trying to rest his main players was that there are potentially three serious injuries to the players now.
Arsenal, while many seem to be writing them off in the Cups already are a formiddable force. I believe if they can overcome their historic bogey team, Bolton in the FA cup, they will win it.
Kippy

wheres me jumpa

Does anyone else feel that League Cup games, no matter how good are tinted in some sort of way. I watched that game last night, 9 goals, it should have been a cracker, but I thought it was awful, it was like watching and u16's game, so many mistakes.

Arsenal are getting a lot of credit for their performance but in fairness, it was down to Liverpool being awful. 3 of their goals were from long balls, two were from set pieces and I cant remember the 6th.

Rafa got it wrong with the choices made in the starting XI and he got it wrong with the choices made with the substitutes. For that does he deserve a thread questioning whether he should stay or go, no. He deserves the thread because last night was Liverpools last chance of domestic silverware and its still January.

The Rooster

It was only the league cup.

I though Rafa got the team right. A last chance for some of the guys on the fringes to get a chance to force their way into first team reckoning against a a largely second string Arsenal team. His substitutions were also spot on - apart from the last one, but the game was over by then, and it took a superb save from Almunia to deny Carra a goal.

It was a freak game. It took Arsenal 20+ minutes to mount their first attack and they scored from it.

But the real key to the game was first half injury time. A Dudek mistake leads to a flukey rebound with the ball going in off the Arsenal's player's hand. Then the 4th came which was clearly offside. Nobody with an ounce of brainpower could say that 4-1 was a fair reflection of the first half, but we get lots of geniuses in media and muppets on foums saying Arsenal wiped the floor with Liverpool in the first half. It was pure freak that Arsenal got 4 goals.

At that stage its gameover. The second half was 2-2. Liverpool pressing and Arsenal hitting on the break. Could have been any score, but with Arsenal leading by three at half-time they never looked in danger.

Its the league cup. Nice to win, but no big swing when you don't. The next game is more important.

fade2black

The Rooster wrote:

It was only the league cup.
Its the league cup. Nice to win, but no big swing when you don't. The next game is more important.

Or the last game. :rolleyes:

kippy

It was only the league cup.

I though Rafa got the team right. A last chance for some of the guys on the fringes to get a chance to force their way into first team reckoning against a a largely second string Arsenal team. His substitutions were also spot on - apart from the last one, but the game was over by then, and it took a superb save from Almunia to deny Carra a goal.

It was a freak game. It took Arsenal 20+ minutes to mount their first attack and they scored from it.

But the real key to the game was first half injury time. A Dudek mistake leads to a flukey rebound with the ball going in off the Arsenal's player's hand. Then the 4th came which was clearly offside. Nobody with an ounce of brainpower could say that 4-1 was a fair reflection of the first half, but we get lots of geniuses in media and muppets on foums saying Arsenal wiped the floor with Liverpool in the first half. It was pure freak that Arsenal got 4 goals.

At that stage its gameover. The second half was 2-2. Liverpool pressing and Arsenal hitting on the break. Could have been any score, but with Arsenal leading by three at half-time they never looked in danger.

Its the league cup. Nice to win, but no big swing when you don't. The next game is more important.

Was Saturday "Only the FA Cup"?
Songs goal, was piss poor defending, all the "Potential offisides" in the match were marginal and you forget Arsenal missed a penalty in the second half.
Arsenal did wipe the floor with them in the first half. It was 4-1 at half time. If that isnt a floor wiping then I don't know what is.

I know it is only the "league cup" but Liverpools season thus far has been nothing short of terrible. Granted their recent last number of games in the league have been good but who were they against? Blackburn even managed to get a result.
Liverpool look like having a seriously bad season this season, that said I wouldnt be surprised if they beat Barca but what happens when the meet Arsenal, Chelsea or Man U in the later stages-they havent gotten a great record against them as of recent times and this ultimately will define how good a team Liverpool really are.
To concede 6 goals at fortress Anfield is surely not something fans can forget about easily.

HashSlinging

If not already posted.

Match Stats:
Goals: Liverpool 3 Arsenal 6
Shots: Liverpool 17 Arsenal 7
On Target: Liverpool 11 Arsenal 6
Off Target: Liverpool 6 Arsenal 1

The difference between the two sides was in the finishing ability and the relative merits of the two goalkeepers.

kippy

Stats are great.
Whats the most important one?

HashSlinging

The most important stat is the fact we are ahead of arsenal in the PL.

They can have the egg cups this season, we have enough to go round the whole of liverpool at this stage.

Another one is what have arsenal won in the last two years?

HashSlinging

Answer

Cups to Liverpool 2
Cups to Arsenil 0

I honestly dont know how they have supporters.?

jank

HashSlinging wrote:

The most important stat is the fact we are ahead of arsenal in the PL.

They can have the egg cups this season, we have enough to go round the whole of liverpool at this stage.

Another one is what have arsenal won in the last two years?

By a mighty one point!

Sure Arsenal will take a the cup double while liverpool can have the mighty achievement of 3rd and adding 17 years to the last time liverpool won the league.....

What have Arsenal won in the last ten years. oh right that doesnt spin your arguement enough..:rolleyes:

kippy

The most important stat is the fact we are ahead of arsenal in the PL.

They can have the egg cups this season, we have enough to go round the whole of liverpool at this stage.

Another one is what have arsenal won in the last two years?

HAHAHA......
So all the cups Liverpool have won over the years are merely egg cups? Or are they more than "Egg cups" when Liverpool win them?
By your methodology all Liverpool have won in the past 15 years are "egg cups"
Above them in the league or not at this stage, Liverpools season hangs on the Barcelona game together with a few games against Arsenal (again) chelsea and Man United. Teams that they havent been beating lately.
There are a few more stata about Liverpools games against these three teams this season floating around, they dont make pleasant reading in the goals for, goals against column.

HashSlinging

Eh how many times have liverpool won the league??

jank

HashSlinging wrote:

Eh how many times have liverpool won the league??

LOL Classic Liverpool Yet Again!!:D

HashSlinging

Your the one bringing up HISTORY!!

kippy

Eh how many times have liverpool won the league??

HAHAHA
Typical.
Its okay to look more than 15 years into the past to get this stat but not okay to compare the modern day Liverpool "egg cup winners" with the modern day Arsenal, Chelsea and Man U?
Sorry about this thread, it is again descending into a Liverpool are class everyone else sucks even though recent times tend to dissprove that particuliar pieces of information.
Kippy

HashSlinging

Jesus lads your very bitter.

jank

Right, well i take it you dont remember bringing arsenal's success over the last 2 years......

HashSlinging

what do you want me to say?
Liverpool 3
Arsenal reserves 6

Again, as soon as there is a tiny bit of pressure on the likes of Hyypia, Peltier, Warnock and Paletta, it was route 1 again.
Straight back at us, but on the deck.
They found space and used it, the amount of times an Arsenal player was in 20 yards of space on his own down the flanks was obscene.
They had players that were quick enough and skillful enough to get to our byline and pull it back, to get in behind us.
Garcia was abysmal, the worst I have ever seen him play.
Fowler was just as bad, he lost posession all night.
Hyypia was continually out of position, which meant Paletta was out of position, which meant the full backs were out of position, which meant...
The back four sat back and let the Arsenal boys approach them with the ball at their feet, big mistake.
When we tried to play the ball out of defence the midfielders were too far up, too much of a gap and the defenders were not confident enough to play it on the ground across 20 yards so they punted it.
This is Rafa's defensive system for you. Does he actually train these lot or do they have a kick around a couple of days a week on a tarmac playground?

HashSlinging

Best thing I've heard all day -

Garcia will need a scan this morning on a damaged knee that Benitez fears could keep him out for a few weeks.

Am I evil??

Savman

Thread is getting very silly now :rolleyes:

Mossy Monk

HashSlinging wrote:

They can have the egg cups this season, we have enough to go round the whole of liverpool at this stage.

Another one is what have arsenal won in the last two years?

HashSlinging wrote:

Answer

Cups to Liverpool 2
Cups to Arsenil 0

I honestly dont know how they have supporters.?

HashSlinger wrote:

Eh how many times have liverpool won the league??

HashSlinger wrote:

Am I evil??

you are prescious. you have made me smile today

HashSlinging

Lads I'm only buzzin off ye, hope arsenal win at least one egg cup this season.

event

ah the old comparing past histories

why dont yiz just measure your tools and see who's is the biggest :rolleyes:

let it go lads, alright?

can no one actually talk about the game last night?

HashSlinging

I just posted a post a couple of posts back did you not see it, 15 minutes it took to write.

astrofool

People who compare histories do so cos they have no "tools"

The Rooster

kippy wrote:

Songs goal, was piss poor defending, all the "Potential offisides" in the match were marginal and you forget Arsenal missed a penalty in the second half.
Arsenal did wipe the floor with them in the first half. It was 4-1 at half time. If that isnt a floor wiping then I don't know what is.

Song's was a pure fluke. The ball hit him on the arm and he knew nothing about it. The 4th goal was offside. Arsenal were extremely lucky to get 4 goals in that half. But these things happen in football. It was bizarre and embarrassing for Liverpool. But anyone who believes the 4-1 was a fair reflection of the play in the first 45 minutes knows very little about football.

I know it is only the "league cup" but Liverpools season thus far has been nothing short of terrible.

Still doing better in the league than Arsenal, Spurs, Newcastle etc.

Liverpool look like having a seriously bad season this season, that said I wouldnt be surprised if they beat Barca

So, given that this is a thread about Liverpool going out of the Carling Cup, are you trying to say that winning the Carling Cup would make it good season? If not, what the hell is your point?

But if finishing third in the league and knocking Barca out of the Champions League = "a seriously bad season", then you obviously hold Liverpool in very high regard.

To concede 6 goals at fortress Anfield is surely not something fans can forget about easily.

A mainly reserves outfit conceding 6 goals at Anfield in a minor competition means feck all to Liverpool fans, other than disappointment at the display by the underlings.

Conceding 2 or 3 goals at Anfield in a league or CL game would be far more worrying, especially if it wasnt a one-off. Thankfully we've had more clean sheets at Anfield in the league than any other team has had at home this season.

So can a Liverpool fan easily forget when the reserve keeper and reserve defence concede 6 goals? Yes, quite easily.

We're out of the league cup. Oh woe is us

Mossy Monk

The Rooster wrote:

Still doing better in the league than Arsenal

so what. i dont understand this mentality at all. Arsenal are also having a terrible season

Jivin Turkey

I'm glad a lot of people are writing off Liverpool this year. We still have our two main objectives to focus on. We have won domestic cups a plenty over the last number of years and they just flatter to deceive.

Now Liverpool will have a fairly easy schedule and probably a few weekends off leading up to the Barca game, and will also be able to solely focus on the league in this time.

Anyone that thinks that United being eliminated in the groups of the CL or by (Liverpool ) in round five of the FA Cup last year didn't result in a huge upturn in the league performances is kidding themselves. Perhaps Liverpool will avail of the same fate?

TheMonster

The Rooster wrote:

A mainly reserves outfit conceding 6 goals at Anfield in a minor competition means feck all to Liverpool fans, other than disappointment at the display by the underlings.

Tell that to the crowd who booed them off.

Only 3 players could not be described as first team squad players far less than the opoositions.

MrJoeSoap

Liverpool fans never cease to amaze, because we all know if the score was 6-3 in their favour last night they'd be bragging and boasting about how they were on their way to another cup final, about revenge for last weekend etc...

But no, of course, they come on and try and devalue the cup by saying it was only the Liverpool reserves, ignore the fact that it was the Arsenal reserves as well, boast about their history and how Arsenal haven't as many leagues as Liverpool and how they are ahead in the league.

A question to all Liverpool fans, which would you prefer...

a/ Still in the FA Cup, League Cup and Champions League, and 4th place in the league on 39 points.

or

b/ Out of the FA Cup and League Cup, still in the Champions League and 3rd in the league on 40 points.

gandalf

Very surprised at last nights result, didn't expect us to win it. I just hope we don't pay the price for these victories in March in the league game.

Why did Benitez choose Dudek again, is Reina injured.

What I don't understand are all the people calling for Benitez's head. Sir Alco had years in OT before he won anything, I believe Benitez if given a similar chance and some cash will get Liverpool challanging for the league.

Hopefully this will mean The Beast gets a few more games and a load more goals !!!!

Jivin Turkey

TheMonster wrote:

Tell that to the crowd who booed them off.

Didn't a near full Anfield crowd not sing their hearts out in the 92nd minute? The booing at half time was letting the team know that the performance was not good enough (which it wasn't) but a capacity crowd singing at the end, despite it still being a woeful scoreline is something that you only get at a couple of grounds in the world.

MrJoeSoap wrote:

Liverpool fans never cease to amaze, because we all know if the score was 6-3 in their favour last night they'd be bragging and boasting about how they were on their way to another cup final, about revenge for last weekend etc...

But no, of course, they come on and try and devalue the cup by saying it was only the Liverpool reserves, ignore the fact that it was the Arsenal reserves as well, boast about their history and how Arsenal haven't as many leagues as Liverpool and how they are ahead in the league.

A question to all Liverpool fans, which would you prefer...

a/ Still in the FA Cup, League Cup and Champions League, and 4th place in the league on 39 points.

or

b/ Out of the FA Cup and League Cup, still in the Champions League and 4rd in the league on 40 points.

Of course I'd be bragging if Liverpool had won 6-3 at Highbury, regardless of the team that was put out. The FA Cup loss was a bitter pill, but last night is no real disappointment IMO. It'd be nice to win, don't get me wrong, but I'd rather we focussed on bigger goals.

dr.bollocko

Yeah in fairness you have to hold up your hand as a pool fan and say that they sucked the big one last night, and the previous game too. To lose every game they have played against top English opposition is a poor season, and they are still reeling now. The squad lacks depth and the lack of a clinical finisher or a top class defender is going to leave any team struggling.

And if Pool fans dont care at all, why in the hell is Benitez apologising unreservedly for the catastrophe of a performance last night.
quote from Benitez:

"The problem was conceding four goals in the first half.

When you are faced with a scoreline like that it is very difficult to manage the game. "

What a smart guy!

event

HashSlinging wrote:

I just posted a post a couple of posts back did you not see it, 15 minutes it took to write.

i know, only one to do it before my post