Is it ok to learn drums on an electronic kit?

Quatre Mains

Hi all
I've always wanted to learn to play the drums, but for noise reasons have never bought a kit. I see a no. of electronic kits are available to buy, and was wondering what people's opinion of them is as a learning tool. I'm not looking to become Terry Bozzio but I don't want to pick up any bad habits etc. that will be hard to undo later. Any opinions on the subject would be most welcome.

Rustar

I love mine! If you want to go jam with someone, you can carry it to the van one-handed!

It's also nice being able to lower the volume or use headphones when it's late.

Royale with Cheese

Got one sitting next to me now. It's not mine and I only play the drums half assed when nobody else is around but I'd say it's definitely possible. There'd be drum purists who'd tell you not to learn on one, but if you really want to learn and the noise level is what's stopping you then definitely go for it. Like Rustar said, it's dead handy for transport and for playing quieter with. It's not quite the same as a full kit but if you get serious you can always get a full acoustic kit at a later stage and pick up what you missed out on.

DublinWriter

Johnnycabs wrote:

and was wondering what people's opinion of them is as a learning tool. I'm not looking to become Terry Bozzio but I don't want to pick up any bad habits etc.

Nooooooooo!

They're a great practice tool, but never use them to learn.

For starters, you'll crap up your dynamics using an electronic kit. You won't be able to develop subtleties in your sticking, especially on the snare, and especially with flams. You may think you've got your rudiments down on the electronic kit, but switch over to a snare and you'll find they'll sound like crap.

Secondly, drum tuning is an oft-overlooked art in itself. There are complete DVDs available on the subject. Learn on an electronic kit and you won't have a clue how to tune a kit.

Thirdly, electronic pads are usually 10" - 12" in diameter. Switch over to an acoustic kit after an electronic and everything will appear over-sized to you.

Fourthly, cymbals. You don't get the subtle 'colouring' of traditional hats, you won't figure out how to use various areas of a ride to get completely different sounds or the many and various ways you can make the same crash sound completely different by just using different sticking.

Rant over!

I have an electronic myself, and it's great for practising when you want to stay ASBO free, but it's nothing like playing an acoustic set.

Gabriel

Depends on which electronic drumkit you are playing on. If you buy a high end electronic drumkit you can feel like almost being playing an acoustic drumkit.
I own a Roland TD20k Pro drumkit and is great with dynamics and feel. Plus you can play along to lots of different types of music , time signatures and create your own patterns.
I am improving a lot by playing with it everyday day:)
Great tool !!!

DublinWriter

Gabriel wrote:

I own a Roland TD20k Pro drumkit and is great with dynamics and feel.

I tried one out in a shop in Denmark St. London a few years back, and it really is the closest thing to playing an acoustic set. It is such a sweet piece of kit, but costs €6K in Waltons and I couldn't justify it myself...or could I?!?

I had one of the first generation Simmons kits (the '50p' shaped ones) back in the late 80's and it sounded and played like crap. I used to Midi it up to an Alesis for some decent sounds.

Johnny Storm

Assuming noise is a concern would it be better in terms of technique etc to learn on electric drums or regular drums with those rubber dampers on them?

DublinWriter

Johnny Storm wrote:

Assuming noise is a concern would it be better in terms of technique etc to learn on electric drums or regular drums with those rubber dampers on them?

In terms of purely practising rudiments, I would think it would be far better to use just a single practise pad, as latecy will be a big issue with electronic drums if you want to really develop speed and dynamics in your rudiments.

I wouldn't see any benefit in padding out an entire acoustic kit, just the snare, or just buy a seperate stand-alone practise pad.

The electronic kit would be good for practising kit-drumming if noise is an issue.

If you are really, really, really serious about drumming, I'd advise you to *never* practise by playing along to CDs. Practising with a click, or a metronome is fine, but you'll wreck your ability to 'grove' and/or play ahead of the beat if you just stick to practising along with recorded music as you end up just following the drummer on the track instead of leading with your own playing.

mp3guy

Learn on an electronic kit. Its fine, I learn and practice on a pretty damn cheap electric kit at home, and whenever I'm at a friends and I play an acoustic kit, I adapt to it in about 5 minutes, and can play all the flams, ghosts, light/heavy cymbal hitting and accents I want. If you practice your rudiments properly they won't sound like crap on a normal snare, if you really feel like it get a practice pad and do your rudiments on that.

As far as drum tuning goes, why does it matter if you don't know how to tune an acoustic kit if you only have an electronic kit anyway? And whenever you do get acoustic drums, you can learn to tune. Its not like when you buy electronic drums you'll never ever be able to learn anything about acoustic drums when they arise.

Learning on small pads doesn't really matter when going to an acoustic kit, which can go up to 22" or so on floor toms etc..., you adapt to acoustic kits very very quickly, and aiming for small 10" electronic pads will improve accuracy rather than hitting a 14" tom.

Then of course, they don't sound nearly as good as acoustic drums. If you spend a tonne you could get the toms sounding great, maybe the snare, but you can't beat acoustic cymbals for sound. But then again, its not like you can't learn. The roland and yamaha kits often have dual hit cymbals, for ride bells etc... and allow choking. Some have real hihat stands which imitate the original quite well. Dynamics of cymbal hitting, such as the difference between completely mashing a crash/ride and lightly touching it can be picked up quickly enough, its not that difficult.

And don't practice/learn a thing without a metronome, ever.

DublinWriter

mp3guy wrote:

Then of course, they don't sound nearly as good as acoustic drums. If you spend a tonne you could get the toms sounding great, maybe the snare, but you can't beat acoustic cymbals for sound.

It's amazing, but you can get any half-decent toms to sound good with the right set of heads and you don't need to spend a ton. I've played Pearl Export and my Ludwig Super-Classic, and in a loudish-rock live setting you'd be hard pressed to get much of a difference, especially if they are mic'ed up and have a bit of reverb applied.

Cheap and poor quality snares and cymbals are what are really noticeable.

Gabriel

Sorry Dublin Writer, but I would have to be disagree with your theory of "never play to record if you are serious about drumming" , like PRO DRUMMERS says (Dave Weckl , Dennis chambers, Virgil Donati) it is OK and VERY HELPFUL to play to records .

Gabriel

Sorry Dublin Writer, but I would have to be disagree with your theory of "never play to record if you are serious about drumming" , like PRO DRUMMERS says (Dave Weckl , Dennis Chambers, Virgil Donati) it is OK and VERY HELPFUL to play to records .

It wasn't me!

I think the idea he was getting at was that a player could get caught up in playing someone else's material instead of developing their own style and feel. If someone can play to a record and not play what they're hearing, I think that'd be fine.

DublinWriter

Gabriel wrote:

Sorry Dublin Writer, but I would have to be disagree with your theory of "never play to record if you are serious about drumming" , like PRO DRUMMERS says (Dave Weckl , Dennis Chambers, Virgil Donati) it is OK and VERY HELPFUL to play to records .

I'd love to see some direct quotes from them about that. Simon Phillips always maintained it was very dangerous to learn by playing to pre-recorded music. I agree, for the reason I stated earlier, it makes you develop a very lazy groove and as a player you become a follower rather than a leader, not good if you are a drummer.