Freedom of Speech on Message Boards

Wompa1

Two of my housemates were members on a boards site called 'Foot.ie', they seemed to have different views to alot of the other posters which should be no suprise to anyone on this site because everyone thinks different on here,very much opinonated posters that debate points.Well anyways on 'Foot.ie' the majority of 'Foot.ie' seem to just be of one mind set and all agree with each other and try to squash anyone with other views, nobody more than the owner of site who banned my two housemates claiming they were the one person using two accounts....this guy who had the ability to set up and moderate a web site couldn't grasp the fact that two or more people can be on one Network, so he banned one account permanently and the other for 3 months.
I can't help but think since their view differed from that of the moderator that they got dumped from the site, especially since it seemingly has happened to other outspoken posters.
The ban said Permanenet, Reason Given: No Reason Given....anyone else have this kind of problem before?, I always thought Freedom of Speech was promoted by sites such as this

Ruu_Old

No idea about foot.ie but boards.ie is privately owned, there is no such thing as free speech and the admins have to take responsibility for the content of the posts here as it comes down on their heads.

miju

Ruu wrote:

No idea about foot.ie but boards.ie is privately owned, there is no such thing as free speech and the admins have to take responsibility for the content of the posts here as it comes down on their heads.

yep , seconded

Rb

As Ruu said, message forums are generally privately owned sites. The messages we post become property of the sites, and where a post may cause trouble, the blame is then lays with the owners of the sites, not the posters. There simply can't be complete and utter freedom of speech for perfectly obvious reasons. If someone were to come on and say something libellous about a company, the user isn't going to be the one hauled up to a court room, the owners are so letting people say whatever they want is a horrendous idea. There does exist some freedom of speech, but not complete and utter.

It's also at the owners discretion should he want to ban someone from the site he owns, does he need a reason?No, but it would be nice and mannerly if he gave one. In the case of your friends, sounds like the owners just a tad ignorant BUT how does he know its two different people on the same network? Anyone with two or more accounts could use that excuse, as I'm sure many have in the past.

Cake Fiend

If you're at a party in someone else's house, who doesn't like what you have to say, and they tell you to either shut up or piss off, are they interfering with your freedom of speech?

No, because you can simply leave their house and then say whatever you like. You can even throw your own party (i.e. set up your own forum) and say what you like all day. Freedom of speech doesn't apply when you're a guest at someone else's party.

Exit

Even without the whole legal issues, whoever owns the forum can do whatever they want with it whether they want to have freedom of speech or filter certain words or just ban people for no reason.

I'm not sure what would happen if someone banned people based on colour or race though (just a spinoff in my head, nothing to do with the original post) Can a person discriminated against in that manner do anything about it legally, or is it just the internet?

Exit

Cake Fiend wrote:

If you're at a party in someone else's house, who doesn't like what you have to say, and they tell you to either shut up or piss off, are they interfering with your freedom of speech?

No, because you can simply leave their house and then say whatever you like. You can even throw your own party (i.e. set up your own forum) and say what you like all day. Freedom of speech doesn't apply when you're a guest at someone else's party.

You know, I was wondering the exact same thing as I was writing my post. If you kick someone out of your house for saying something you don't like, could they go to the police for opposing their freedom of expression (not that anyone would be bothered)?

Would it be different if the house wasn't owned by you (i.e. rented)?

I mean, I figure you can kick whoever you want out of your residence, but I'm just wondering.

Black Swan

One foot follows another.

Rb

This had better not be a clever shilling either.

monkeyfudge

People seem to always under the impression that we actually have freedom of speech in this country... perhaps from watching too much American television.

In Ireland your freedom of expression comes with a lot of strings attached.

phantom_lord

meh, if it's his board...

Wompa1

Can we say what we want if we put in: The Opinion Expressed above is not necessarily that of the owner of this site and are only the ranting of a crazy man

Rb

Wompa1 wrote:

Can we say what we want if we put in: The Opinion Expressed above is not necessarily that of the owner of this site and are only the ranting of a crazy man

Not that I know of, its still the owners property and he/she is responsible for it.

However, you could get away with saying "Apparently..." and not naming the individual/company, but you can imply who they are...I think..

Xavi6

I'm also registered on foot.ie. It's an Irish football board that I rarely use due to the close minded nature of the discussions. Basically you either go along with the crowd and stay within their way of thinking or you're an outcast. I think this may have been what happened to the OP's housemates.

phantom_lord

Xavi6 wrote:

I'm also registered on foot.ie. It's an Irish football board that I rarely use due to the close minded nature of the discussions. Basically you either go along with the crowd and stay within their way of thinking or you're an outcast. I think this may have been what happened to the OP's housemates.

sounds like trolling time!

Spitfire666

If we had freedom of speech we wouldnt have a stickey on nearly every sction of this forum in relation to not mentiong the actions/inactions at a certain event last year.

Time Magazine

rb_ie wrote:

However, you could get away with saying "Apparently..." and not naming the individual/company, but you can imply who they are...I think..

Of course you can't. Defamation is the utterance or publication of an untruth that would lower the opinion of the defamed in the eyes of the public. A newspaper was successfully sued for calling someone a "Fagin" ala the famous Dickensian thief.

Similarly, if I said "A concert promoter, let's call them <*whistle* look over there!>, rape children and other such beings" there'd be a letter on Vexorg's doorstep.

Rb

phantom_lord wrote:

sounds like trolling time!

Hrmm, sounds like a good idea

bucks73

I am also registered on foot.ie. Only really use the Junior Football board and people tend to speak their minds in there. Discussions over junior football here in Limerick can get quite heated. Mods only ever jump in if their is personal abuse which is fair enough. Have had a warning myself. By the way, one of the mods (maybe even the owner) is registered here.

phantom_lord

Last edited by Ruu

lol

Anti

legal disclaimers for all to sign on registration is the way to go

mike65

Is'nt foot.ie owned by Dahamsta?

Mike.

Victor

Yup, I'll PM him to get the OP banned aswell.

Time Magazine

Ibid wrote:

Similarly, if I said "A concert promoter, let's call them <*whistle* look over there!>, rape children and other such beings" there'd be a letter on Vexorg's doorstep...

Last edited by Ruu

Incidentally, changing it to that would probably still open you to being sued. Given the, eh, "reputation" of one particular concert promoter on this site, it could probably be shown to be implication enough.

However, it's not defamation to go up to your friend, slap him on the back and say "How are you, you old thief?" because it's clearly not serious. I presume that would apply to saying a company that organises gigs rapes kids.

biko

OP, do a search for speech and you'll see that this subject has been touched upon in feedback a few times before.

Rb

biko wrote:

OP, do a search for speech and you'll see that this subject has been touched upon in feedback a few times before.

Those feedback threads are some of the best.

faceman

If a message board is badly moderated like foot.ie seems to be, then it wont be a popular site. leave the losers to themselves!

everytime someone says free speech in this country, i cant help but laugh. Stand up a cinema and shout "fire" for the craic, and see where your free speech gets you!

I dont know the boards owners but im pretty sure they dont want to end up in jail or in court so they have to take legal responsibilities. However Boards went through a phase last year where some of the moderating was OTT but that seems to be a thing of the past which is positive.

Correct me if im wrong, but has any case been ever brought to court about content on a message forum in Ireland/UK? Im curious.

Gordon

Wompa1 wrote:

I always thought Freedom of Speech was promoted by sites such as this

Why did you presume that?

Rb

faceman wrote:

If a message board is badly moderated like foot.ie seems to be, then it wont be a popular site. leave the losers to themselves!

everytime someone says free speech in this country, i cant help but laugh. Stand up a cinema and shout "fire" for the craic, and see where your free speech gets you!

I dont know the boards owners but im pretty sure they dont want to end up in jail or in court so they have to take legal responsibilities. However Boards went through a phase last year where some of the moderating was OTT but that seems to be a thing of the past which is positive.

Correct me if im wrong, but has any case been ever brought to court about content on a message forum in Ireland/UK? Im curious.

Erm, have a look at the top of each and every forum on Boards at the moment. The reason we can't discuss a certain company/events related to the company is because they're bringing Boards to court over something that was said on here.

Gordon wrote:

Why did you presume that?

God knows, but it has to be the biggest mis-conception on this forum as a whole. The sheer amount of people who believe they can say whatever they like wherever on Boards they like is amazing (and who subsequently moan on feedback about the "lack of freedom of speech/I quit de boardz u nazis".

Cake Fiend

Maybe we need a sticky called 'If you want free speech, go here' or something, with links to a hosting company and Bulletin Board installation instructions.

faceman

rb_ie wrote:

Erm, have a look at the top of each and every forum on Boards at the moment. The reason we can't discuss a certain company/events related to the company is because they're bringing Boards to court over something that was said on here.

they issued legal proceedings but i havent seen it in the courts yet?

Sangre

Exit wrote:

You know, I was wondering the exact same thing as I was writing my post. If you kick someone out of your house for saying something you don't like, could they go to the police for opposing their freedom of expression (not that anyone would be bothered)?

Eh..no. Suppressing FOE isn't a crime anyway.

ChRoMe

I regulary post of several different forums on the internet and Boards is without a doubt the most conserative in relation to the topics that are allowed. Thats fine Boards LTD have decided what they felt they were happy with allowing on the site and thats their decision.

I've allways thought that a few little changes (if the owners wanted to that is) would be able to get around this. For example if you were unable to view anything without being logged in none of boards would be available to search engines and if by registering a account you clicked accept to the type of disclaimer that exsists on a lot of other forums that usually goes something like this.

"The opionoins expressed therein remain the property of the user and in no way reflect the views of Boards LTD."

I'm not a lawyer but I allways thought that if you had such a disclaimer along with not allowing threads to be viewed by unregistered members that it would remove legal liability?

Sangre

No as boards are consider the publishers. It would be like a paper printing anything it wanted then claiming the opinions remain that of the journalists.

Hopefully if an issue like this came to a Judge the position would be changed but as it stands its only prudent to continue as boards does especially considering the awards in a defamation case.

Karoma

Cake Fiend wrote:

Maybe we need a sticky called 'If you want free speech, go here' or something, with links to a hosting company and Bulletin Board installation instructions.

Or simply Enable Freedom Of Speech Mode

Rb

Karoma wrote:

Or simply Enable Freedom Of Speech Mode

Nice.

marco murphy

As what Ruu etc said, it comes down to the Mods heads if a member posts ****e that causes trouble. However you get some right wing ***** that delete your post for no real reason.

tallaght01

As someone who gets banned from fora on here all the time, I'd say take a chill. Don't worry about a banning. It's only the internet. There's a whole big world out there. Moderators don't leave their bedrooms, so go out to the pub, or visit ur bird or whatever and ull be away from the constraints of the power-seeking.

I'm off to the pub to say "I don't like the colour yellow" without hindrance

Kind regards.

Rb

faceman wrote:

they issued legal proceedings but i havent seen it in the courts yet?

We'll see what the future brings but its headed for court afaik.

joebhoy1916

Ruu wrote:

No idea about foot.ie but boards.ie is privately owned, there is no such thing as free speech and the admins have to take responsibility for the content of the posts here as it comes down on their heads.

Maybe some Mods are just assholes and ban ya for no reason.

Rb

joebhoy1916 wrote:

Maybe some Mods are just assholes and ban ya for no reason.

Doubt it.

Wompa1

Maybe some Mods are just assholes and ban ya for no reason

Yeah, I think your right

D

joebhoy1916 wrote:

Maybe some Mods are just assholes and ban ya for no reason.

I can see how some people who's first interaction with a mod is by banning, but I think that when you are around any message board for long enough, you see the same problems come up over and over again. As a normal user I can just go: "Not one of these again, ignore". However, I think the mods can't ignore those types of threads and having to wade through repetitions of literary detritus can become frustrating. Being human they might not be willing to explain their actions and just take the shortest way to deal with them, i.e. the banstick.

I sincerly doubt that anyone is banned for no reason.

tallaght01

I'm comfortable with being banned. However, why does it always have to be preceeded by a "tough line". I usually get message from a mod just before the inevitable and it says something like "your card is marked". Maybe it's just me, but I don't feel that "tough lines" work on the internet :P
Dirty Harry can pull them off, but internet moderators generally can't.
If one of my patients asks me a question that's a seperate issue from the one I'm treating them for, I'll try to answer it. Or if I can't help them I don't say "off topic, user banned" lol. If I can't help them, I'll politely refer them to somebody else. Some mods remind me of the comic book bloke in the simpsons.
The manners have gone out of the internet. I've (almost) always been polite in every posting I've made, but I've had some nasty comments made. Unneccesary.

I'll get me coat. Taxi!!!!!!

Rb

D wrote:

I sincerly doubt that anyone is banned for no reason.

Noone on Boards is banned without a reason anyway. A quick browse through the Banlist will verify this. If a mod is being a dick, report it to a higher power i.e an Smod or Admin and they'll take the case but not before talking out the problem with the mod in question.