Your Top 5 Quarterbacks in the NFL

Coileach dearg

Rented Mule wrote:

Yes he did, along with a 75.7 QB rating.

52.6% completion percentage
154.6 years per game average
2474 passing yards for the season.

Rex Grossman who is being called 'the worst starting QB to ever make it to a Super Bowl' has put up better numbers than Vick.

You should also mention there that Falcons #1 WR Brian Finneran was out all season and the WRs for the Falcons all season dropped alot of balls.
Over a thousand rushing yards too. If that draft goes well for the Falcons and sign Calvin Johnson you will see that completion percentage significantly increase next season.

Rented Mule

Coileach dearg wrote:

You should also mention there that Falcons #1 WR Brian Finneran was out all season and the WRs for the Falcons all season dropped alot of balls.
Over a thousand rushing yards too. If that draft goes well for the Falcons and sign Calvin Johnson you will see that completion percentage significantly increase next season.

I realise that he rushed for 100 yards rushing. You just made my point for me that he is not a 'pocket passer'. He was an option QB in college and he is still very much an option QB in the pros.

I will give you the fact that the receivers for Atlanta may have dropped alot of balls this season (taking your word for it), but I can't believe that they would have dropped that many to significantly drop his completion percentage that much.

Michael Vick is probably the most gifted athlete playing the QB position as far as pure speed and arm strength. I am not sure who can actually rival him in these areas.

Lothaar

Arm strength isn't worth **** unless it's combined with accuracy and decisionmaking (Carson Palmer anyone?).

Pfft! Vick sucks, his stats suck, his legacy sucks. It seems to me that people only like him because he pulls off an amazing run now and then. Since when was that enough to be a top 5 QB?

Lothaar

Double post...

Rented Mule

Lothaar wrote:

Arm strength isn't worth sh1t unless it's combined with accuracy and decisionmaking (Carson Palmer anyone?).

Pfft! Vick sucks, his stats suck, his legacy sucks. It seems to me that people only like him because he pulls off an amazing run now and then. Since when was that enough to be a top 5 QB?

Exactly my point.

I do not feel that he is a Top 5 QB by any means.

jdivision

Vick is completely over-rated. No way he should be the highest paid player in the NFL. As I constantly stress to people who talk about his running ability and the 1,000 yards, the Falcons lost every single game this season that he led the team in rushing. He's completely overrated.

Top 5 QBs
Manning
Brady
Palmer
Brees
and then probably Bulger

Favre and McNair are past it, Delhomme appears to have gone backwards, Roethlisberger not there yet, Trent Green had a bad year even before the concussion, Hesselbeck not where he was

Boomer23

Lothaar wrote:

Pfft! Vick sucks, his stats suck, his legacy sucks. It seems to me that people only like him because he pulls off an amazing run now and then. Since when was that enough to be a top 5 QB?

if his recievers catch the ball, then Vick will show the league why he is really an Icon!

plus they shouldnt use his rushing ability as the first option. look at how Culpepper was used for years in Minnesota! that guy could run! but they used it to bully the defence into certain defensive fronts so they could exploit them.

Mora used the pass as a last resort, i just hope the new guy knows how to call a balanced offence

Lothaar

Vick looks to run first, pass second. Mora had a run-heavy offense... not dissimilar to the Broncos' vaunted offense of the 90s, which isn't surprising since Alex Gibbs is the Asst Coach in Atlanta.
A balanced offense is NOT an offense that is 50% run and 50% pass, this is a common mistake. A balanced offense is one that poses an equal threat of running or passing, and can do either successfully when necessary. The Falcons can't do both because their QB can't pass the ball well.

If I was Mora, even with hindsight on all his games, I don't think there's much I would do differently with that offense. Vick is a talented athlete - and a better QB that some QBs in the NFL because of his unique abilities - but he is simply not good enough to do much more than he has already done. Sure his WRs dropped a lot of passes last year. Two years ago the Seahawks suffered from the same thing, and even lost a playoff game on a dropped pass on 4th and goal as time expired... but it was clear that Hasslebeck was still a good passer. Vick isn't.

johndylan

Brady; Brees; Manning [ but which one?!]; Romo; McNair...
No-one making a case poor Grossman? Hope he gets creamed on Sunday night, charlatan.

spyder238

1. peyton
2. brady
3. brees
4. mcnair
5. palmer

Colts FTW!!

Boomer23

Lothaar wrote:

A balanced offense is NOT an offense that is 50% run and 50% pass, this is a common mistake.

yes it is, and you fell for it yourself......a balanced offence is actually 60-40 run-pass

ask a coach

Boomer23

and finally, proof that its not Vicks fault. This is a link to ESPN.com, an interview with new Head Coach Petrino.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2752463

this is my favourite part:

"Under previous coach Jim Mora, Vick basically had to go with whatever play was called by offensive coordinator Greg Knapp, even if it looked doomed when the quarterback got to the line and studied the defensive alignment.

Vick's only options were changing the protection scheme and calling which side of the field to run the play."

obviously, if thats all he was allowed do, probably due to the coaches ego's, then he was doomed every couple of plays.

geoff_nfl

#1 Favre
#2 Brady
#3 Brees
#4 Manning
#5 Palmer

Chucky the tree

Boomer23 wrote:

and finally, proof that its not Vicks fault. This is a link to ESPN.com, an interview with new Head Coach Petrino.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2752463

this is my favourite part:

"Under previous coach Jim Mora, Vick basically had to go with whatever play was called by offensive coordinator Greg Knapp, even if it looked doomed when the quarterback got to the line and studied the defensive alignment.

Vick's only options were changing the protection scheme and calling which side of the field to run the play."

obviously, if thats all he was allowed do, probably due to the coaches ego's, then he was doomed every couple of plays.

I'd wonder just how true that is though.

RadioActive

1. Manning
2. Brady
3. Brees
4. McNabb
5. Palmer

Dr.Slurm

1. Grossman
2. Everyone else

spyder238

haha grossman should have gotten MUP (most useless player)

Boomer23

i felt sorry for Grossman in the game, the kid was just out of his depth. Technically this is his Rookie season after all his injury problems, so i hope he comes back with a bang next year

Lothaar

Boomer23 wrote:

yes it is, and you fell for it yourself......a balanced offence is actually 60-40 run-pass

ask a coach

I don't understand. How could I fall for it when I refuted it? And you've STILL missed my point - there is no set ratio of run:pass for a balanced offense. The point is that it is about abilty and threat - the ability to run or pass when necessary, and the threat of both. Unbalanced offenses may run and pass in equal amounts (or 60:40, or whatever) but they can only do one successfully. Balanced offenses may run 80% of the time, but they have the ability to pass and they are successful with the passing game the 20% of the time they use it.

It's funny that you say 'ask a coach'. It looks like most of your information comes from NFL columnists who dumb down the game for the workaday fans.

Vick is allowed to call the plays? Nice. Lay it all on his shoulders so HE goes down when the Falcons sputter next season, not the coach. Good call Petrino! Hahahahahaha.

LuckyLloyd

Vick has simply not produced the neccesary body of work to be seriously considered as one of the five most accomplished quaterbacks that are currently active in the NFL. There is no doubting that he has enormous upsides in terms of athleticism and armstrength, but questions remain about his decision making, game management and abillity to lead a franchise to success. All of it isn't his fault - Atlanta have had front office and coaching problems since he arrived - but I think that the key on Vick is how he has performed in his limited playoff experience - anyone who says that he really rose to the challenge on those occassions is not being fair.


Manning has finally got there -in terms of his numbers and consistency in regular season competition it is difficult to look beyond him now that he has successfully negotiated a post - season.

However, for me Brady is the man. He is money at the crunch times, and this season can't really detract from the work he has put in his career so far. He embodies all of the intangible qualities of leadership, determination and mental toughness. He may not be the best athlete or have the best arm - but he certainly makes plays when they count.

Special mentions go to tough as nails McNair, and Pennington who, despite substandard arm strength, finds ways to win games - he is, as far as I am concerned, the finest example of how the position is about so much more than pure athletic abillity.

For me, the key is that when you look at the four players I have just mentioned - Vick is severly lacking. Because the NFL is a business, Vick is overhyped. It is much easier to package his athleticism (70 yard weaving runs through flailing defenders) into something marketable - than it is to package the mental toughness and focus of Tom Brady. Vick has great potential and may yet be great - but right now he is a player that has yet to live up to great expectations and fully adapt from being an option QB at the college level.

baldi1212

Current:

1. Tom Brady
2. Brett Farve
3. Peyton Manning
4. Steve McNair
5. Donovan McNabb

All-Time:

1. Joe Montana
2. Johnny Unitas
3. Brett Farve
4. Bart Starr
5. Jim McMahon

Dodge

1. Brady
2. Manning (Peyton, obviously)
3. Palmer
4. McNabb
5. Brees

Lothaar

baldi1212 wrote:

4. Bart Starr
5. Jim McMahon

Cough, splutter!

Bart Starr won a couple of bowls, and was a tough competitor, but he's nowhere near the top 5 QBs ever! The Packers won those bowls primarily on the back of their D and their power running game.
Same goes for Jim McMahon. He was a decent QB, tough as nails and he has a Superbowl ring, but not really anything special when you're talking all-time.

Players like Marino, Elway and even the likes of Steve Young and Randall Cunningham all played in the same era as McMahon and were all better than him.

Pherekydes

Lothaar wrote:

Same goes for Jim McMahon. He was a decent QB, tough as nails and he has a Superbowl ring...

Not an all-time great, but, give him his due, he has two rings.

baldi1212

There my picks, I stand by them. McMahon's character was like no other.

4 reasons I have McMahon.

McMahon made a case for being the best rollout passer at that time. He explained that coaching in his youth had taught him to square his shoulders to the direction he wanted to throw the football, and he was thus able to execute passes with tight spirals and a high degree of accuracy when running to either his left or his right.

"He made a habit of changing the play both in the huddle and at the line of scrimmage, a practice which frustrated Ditka but usually led to success. His knowledge of the game and an instinctive, intuitive grasp of in-game situations were significant.."

"No discussion of McMahon's 1985 season would be complete without a mention of an early-season Thursday Night game at Minnesota. McMahon was slated to back up Steve Fuller, as McMahon had missed practice time earlier in the week due to a neck injury that required an overnight hospital stay. Midway into the third quarter the Vikings held a 17-9 lead. McMahon spent much of the second and third quarters pacing alongside Ditka, lobbying to be sent into the game. Ditka quietly dealt with these advances while concentrating on the game, but eventually relented and McMahon, to the excitement of the Bears and the dismay of the Minnesota fans, entered the game in the third quarter.

With the atmosphere in the Metrodome suddenly charged and electric, McMahon confidently knelt in the huddle and called his first play. The Vikings blitzed at the snap and left Willie Gault open, and McMahon hit the speedy receiver with a 70-yard touchdown pass that stunned the Vikings' players and fans as well as a national television audience. The jubilant Bears were instantly cocky and confrontational, and quickly got the ball back. On McMahon's second play he threw a 25-yard touchdown pass to Dennis McKinnon. McMahon was now 2-2 for 95 yards and two touchdowns. After a Vikings punt, the Bears moved across midfield running the football and a few short passes. On a crucial 3rd and short, McMahon (neck injury and all) got a firstdown on a quarterback sneak play, and the very next play hit McKinnon for a 43-yard touchdown. Three quick TDs, and the Bears cruised to victory."

and...

"His time with the Packers was noteworthy. Despite his history with the Chicago Bears and his unpopularity in many circles he was warmly welcomed in Green Bay. He mentored Brett Favre and helped Favre with throwing mechanics. With the Packers stumbling against the Dallas Cowboys at Texas Stadium on a regular basis in big games, Green Bay searched for answers to the puzzle. McMahon helped Favre correct his poor performances in Dallas by explaining that the field at Texas Stadium was dramatically crowned compared to many other fields, and this was why Favre's sideline passes often sailed high."

As for Bart Starr
He is the only player to quarterback a team to five NFL championships.

Don't get me wrong the other guys were great too, I could talk about how great a player Randall Cunningham is and Marino's stats speak for themselves.

Lothaar

Indeed he was a good QB. But top 5? Nowhere near! Fair enough though, it's all subjective anyway. I'm guessing you're a Bears fan.

baldi1212

I am indeed since 86 but I just love the game. Hoping I get lucky and get tickets for the London game in Oct.

Rented Mule

Lothaar wrote:

Indeed he was a good QB. But top 5? Nowhere near! Fair enough though, it's all subjective anyway. I'm guessing you're a Bears fan.

I am a born and bred Chicago Bears fan from the southside of Chicago. Jim McMahon was a great leader on the field (when he was healthy) but he is in no way a Top Five QB of All Time.


As for that second ring, he got that as a 3rd string QB in Green bay and never took a snap.

Love Jim McMahon and have met him on several occassions, but he is not a Top Five guy. I don't think he was a Top Five in his own era.