Magnet Ping Issue - Upload & Interleaving

Steffano2002

Anybody here with a Magnet (ADSL2+) connection manage to get the interleaving turned down/off?
Furthermore, could people with a similar connection to mine (Magnet Intro or Lite = 4Mb download) post their Upload test results from either www.irishisptest.com or www.echosdunet.net ?

My connection is fantastic for downloading at the moment (4672.341Kbps average) but I mostly play online so priority for me is ping (and right now it's 100ms everywhere!). And my upload is (a poor IMO) 150Kbps instead of the advertised 512Kbps! This poor upload combined with heavy interleaving is killing my ping and I'm getting p@wned like a n00b! :mad:

Steffano2002

Here are my test results:

From echosdunet.net

From IrishISPtest.com

Nody

Steffano2002 wrote:

And my upload is (a poor IMO) 150Kbps instead of the advertised 512Kbps!

Two words, contention ratio. It is 512Kbs shared with up to 49 (assuming it is 1:50 which is standard for a "light" service) users, hence your chance of ever getting 512Kbps is non existant.

Steffano2002

Sorry, me again. Found something interesting on http://www.testmy.net. It confirmed my upload was poor ("Not the fastest broadband, but it's broadband..." it said) but it also posted the average upload of Magnet users which was above 500Kbps. See here.

Must be just me?

Steffano2002

Nody wrote:

Two words, contention ratio. It is 512Kbs shared with up to 49 (assuming it is 1:50 which is standard for a "light" service) users, hence your chance of ever getting 512Kbps is non existant.

Contention ration on Magnet = 1:1

I should be hitting 512Kbps!

Nody

Steffano2002 wrote:

Contention ration on Magnet = 1:1

I should be hitting 512Kbps!

What I get for posting with out checking the ISP . Anyway, why do you need 512Kbps upload ratio for games? I've yet run into a game that would go over 30 odd in upload and even that is extreme for most online games. What you need is good peering and backpipes to the servers you play on. If it is because you're uploading a lot get something like Netlimiter and limit the upload for the duration of your game play to give the game the required up bandwidth.

Do a traceroute to the server(s) you play on and see if you have some extreme jumps anywhere and take that to tech support. Have a word with tech support if they can possibly change the routing in the network etc. (unlikely but has happend back at the ISP I worked for before depending on what kind of day it was and how nice the customer was about it).

Steffano2002

Well, poor upload could affect ping times negatively although my upload isn't that poor at 150Kbps... Perhaps having 512Kbps upload will do nothing for my ping!

Which leaves interleaving... Great for downloading and having a stable connection but it's killing me for gaming...

Rattlehead_ie

I'm getting p@wned like a n00b!

What you mean LIKE a n00b!!
To be honest from what Ive heard fo Magnet, the connections are great for downloading etc, but trying to get certain services turned on or off is almost impossible, even port forwarding for services (legal or illegal) can be difficult.
Now when it comes to interleaving my guess is Magnet have this turned on NETOWRK wide to cut down on data transfer errors which will defo occour on a ADSL2+ network across a mainly ADSL network, I think it will be long time befroe they decide to turn that off on your connection, although it would be v nice of them if they did.

Zapho

Hey Steffano, I've got the same magnet package, but I can't run the speed
test til later on. But personnally my service has been crap with them. I've the
4mb adsl2 line, but I can only usually get about 2mb and usually between 25k-250k up, yes thats right, 25kbs! I've complained about this several times
but to avail, so I'm getting rid of it.

Steffano2002

At least I play man games! You and your WoW... Pfff! Get CoD2 and let's go! We'll see who the n00b is then! hehehe

So basically, even if I get my upload sorted my ping will remain the same meaning only interleaving can help. But nothing can be done about this at present (or "ever")... That's just great...

And to add insult to injury, the Cabra Exchange is down and probably won't be fixed until next week. Just GREAT! :mad:

Steffano2002

Zapho wrote:

Hey Steffano, I've got the same magnet package, but I can't run the speed test til later on. But personnally my service has been crap with them. I've the 4mb adsl2 line, but I can only usually get about 2mb and usually between 25k-250k up, yes thats right, 25kbs! I've complained about this several times but to avail, so I'm getting rid of it.

Was your Magnet connection ever good Zapho? Are you far from your Exchange? Is your line old/bad?

I'm asking because I'm happy with Magnet as I get over the advertised 4Mb download speed! However I really wish they could do something about that bloody ping! :mad:

Either way, I would be very interested to see your test results on the above-mentioned websites!

Rattlehead_ie

Steffano2002 wrote:

At least I play man games! You and your WoW... Pfff! Get CoD2 and let's go! We'll see who the n00b is then! hehehe

I play gears of war remember, Im Dom, he's Marcus!!

JNive

Now when it comes to interleaving my guess is Magnet have this turned on NETOWRK wide to cut down on data transfer errors which will defo occour on a ADSL2+ network across a mainly ADSL network

Not sure what you are actually on about there, the magnet network is not ADSL, its ADSL2+ ( equipment in the exchange ) with backhaul onto fibre ( esb ).

Also, the port-forwarding etc is only an issue with the 3wire router provided with the 2mb Magnet Base package as far as im aware.

As for your bad upload, if you have ever had another broadband service on that same line and had a higher upload, then since the service is uncontended then either there is a faulty or dodgy line ( mysteriously affecting upload channel only ) or an issue in the exchange with magnets equipment.

Your ping of 100ms to anywhere plus very low upload speed, which should actually be hitting 1mbps if your line is good, indicates very bad SNR on the upload, and probably resulting in a fairly high interleaving setting also. This could be due to a faulty modem, or faulty dslam equally.

Also, i hope you dont have any filter connected to the modem cause they are not needed. Your Telsey Modem should plug Directly into your Eircom NTU ( master socket ) and nothing else, even extensions should be on it.Also double check that your ringer wire is not connected inside the socket ( if the phone cable from the modem to the socket is only 2 pins, that should take care of it )

Steffano2002

JNive wrote:

As for your bad upload, if you have ever had another broadband service on that same line and had a higher upload, then since the service is uncontended then either there is a faulty or dodgy line (mysteriously affecting upload channel only) or an issue in the exchange with magnets equipment.

IMO, my line is perfect considering my download speeds. Furthermore, I used to have BT broadband (512Kbps/128Kbps) about a little over a year ago and it was perfect too!

JNive wrote:

Your ping of 100ms to anywhere plus very low upload speed, which should actually be hitting 1mbps if your line is good, indicates very bad SNR on the upload, and probably resulting in a fairly high interleaving setting also. This could be due to a faulty modem, or faulty dslam equally.

Well, in order for Magnet to investigate this I have to wait for the Cabra Exchange to be fixed! It's been down since Friday! (I'm cursed with ISPs!!!)

JNive wrote:

Also, i hope you dont have any filter connected to the modem cause they are not needed. Your Telsey Modem should plug Directly into your Eircom NTU (master socket) and nothing else, even extensions should be on it. Also double check that your ringer wire is not connected inside the socket (if the phone cable from the modem to the socket is only 2 pins, that should take care of it)

No filters. Everything my end is perfect. No phone connected to the modem (don't use my landline). Only my PC is connected to Port1...

LumoColor

I have the Origin Plus 3MB 24:1 contention ratio from Netsource, thats now part of Magnet and pings are excellent for me.

BF2 gets circa 20 on multiplay.co.uk servers, rock solid 99.99% of the time, thats better that what I get on a UK isp (40 ish with regular disconnects).

I would try tracert's to the gateway server and then the game servers your playing on, will show where the bottleneck is. If its to the gateway server, then its the connection, if its somewhere else in the chain then its prolly dodgey routing.

Here is someting really funny:-

http://www.irishisptest.com/runmyspeed.php

Netsource 3MB 24:1 Upload 321 kbps Download 2.57 Mbps

NTL 6MB Upload 276 kbps Download 626 Kbps

lmao @ NTL

JNive

then it indeed sounds like either a dodgy modem or a dodgy dslam/uplink in the exchange. if your 128kbps with BT was steady then it should be steady with magnet really. The only excuse they can possibly give that would result in them not having to fix something is if your line was dodgy or your internal wiring was dodgy, everything else is their responsibility, modem, dslam, exchange equipment, internal backbone bandwidth. Due to their assertions with 1:1 and no internal capacity/throuput limits, there is no reason for ANY drop in speeds within the Magnet network end of things, assuming your lines are ok, and as you say you have only your modem connected, and nothing else, and your BT connection was perfect before, i tend to agree that your lines should be ok.

Worst case scenario they have to limit your modem if possible from attempting to connect at 15mbps/1mbps which all the telsey modems are designed to do on ADSL2+ ( they connect at the maximum speeds allowable and throuput is limited on their end using averaging mechanisms )

When i start a speed test it will start at about 10/12mbps and then decrease to 4.5 or 5mbps within 2 or 3 seconds, and when i connected my smart modem and checked line stats, it was connected at 15mbps/1mbps

people withi dodgy speeds might be seeing a sideeffect to the 'negotiate maximum possible speed' system, or a dodgy rate limiter in the exchange

Steffano2002

LumoColor wrote:

I have the Origin Plus 3MB 24:1 contention ratio from Netsource, thats now part of Magnet and pings are excellent for me.

Is Origin Plus exactly the same as my ADSL2+ Magnet connection LumoColor? If this is the case, I don't understand why your pings are so perfect compared to mine (unless my line is bad which I honestly believe is not the case)!

I'll post up some tracerts when that bloody Cabra Exchange is back online (been down since Friday FFS :mad:)!

Steffano2002

JNive wrote:

then it indeed sounds like either a dodgy modem or a dodgy dslam/uplink in the exchange. if your 128kbps with BT was steady then it should be steady with magnet really.

I agree. IMO, if the line itself or my wiring was at fault, my downloads speeds and latency when playing online wouldn't be that good (I actually get more like 5Mbps Down and my ping, although high at 100ms, is rock steady!). I even manage to download and play online at the same time without lagging or having an increase in ping!

JNive wrote:

The only excuse they can possibly give that would result in them not having to fix something is if your line was dodgy or your internal wiring was dodgy, everything else is their responsibility, modem, dslam, exchange equipment, internal backbone bandwidth. Due to their assertions with 1:1 and no internal capacity/throuput limits, there is no reason for ANY drop in speeds within the Magnet network end of things, assuming your lines are ok, and as you say you have only your modem connected, and nothing else, and your BT connection was perfect before, i tend to agree that your lines should be ok.

Exactly! So they better get it sorted at their end! :mad:

JNive wrote:

Worst case scenario they have to limit your modem if possible from attempting to connect at 15mbps/1mbps which all the telsey modems are designed to do on ADSL2+ ( they connect at the maximum speeds allowable and throuput is limited on their end using averaging mechanisms )

When i start a speed test it will start at about 10/12mbps and then decrease to 4.5 or 5mbps within 2 or 3 seconds, and when i connected my smart modem and checked line stats, it was connected at 15mbps/1mbps

people withi dodgy speeds might be seeing a side effect to the 'negotiate maximum possible speed' system, or a dodgy rate limiter in the exchange

This is a little too technical for me even though I think I understand what you mean...
When I download a file though, it doesn't start downloading at super fast speeds like it does for you. It starts at 4/5Mbps and stays at that the whole time. I think it's either a messed up setting on my router which limits my upload (a friend of mine in Magnet said he would check it out for me) or, in my opinion the most likely culprit, the exchange in Cabra.
I do hope it will be back online soon but you know what, I bet you my connection will be completely cr@p when it does! I am cursed when it comes to ISPs! :mad: :mad:

Steffano2002

Good news! Cabra Exchange is back up! I'll be posting some tracerts tonight!

Steffano2002

Please find below some tracerts:

Tracing route to www.jolt.co.uk [82.133.85.65]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1    45 ms    45 ms    45 ms  87-198-16-1.ptr.magnet.ie [87.198.16.1]
  2    45 ms    46 ms    46 ms  87-198-95-209.ptr.magnet.ie [87.198.95.209]
  3    47 ms    51 ms    46 ms  d-clon-core1a.magnet.ie [85.91.0.129]
  4    47 ms    45 ms    44 ms  d-clon-core1b.magnet.ie [85.91.0.50]
  5    56 ms    57 ms    57 ms  vl211.lon-telehn-edge1.magnet.ie [85.91.0.169]
  6    56 ms    56 ms    57 ms  g1-1-255.core01.lon01.atlas.cogentco.com [130.117.243.117]
  7    56 ms    56 ms    56 ms  t1-1.mpd02.lon01.atlas.cogentco.com [130.117.2.26]
  8    56 ms    56 ms    57 ms  te1-3.cr05.tn5.bb.pipex.net [195.66.224.29]
  9    72 ms    95 ms   104 ms  g1-1-6.ar01.tn5.bb.pipex.net [62.72.140.142]
 10    91 ms    57 ms    56 ms  ge-0-0-0-3801.jolt-gw.cust.pipex.net [212.241.241.14]
 11    57 ms    57 ms    57 ms  secure.jolt.co.uk [82.133.85.65]

Trace complete.

Tracing route to www.boards.ie [82.195.136.250]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1    46 ms    45 ms    44 ms  87-198-16-1.ptr.magnet.ie [87.198.16.1]
  2    46 ms    46 ms    46 ms  87-198-95-209.ptr.magnet.ie [87.198.95.209]
  3    45 ms    46 ms    46 ms  d-clon-core1a.magnet.ie [85.91.0.129]
  4    45 ms    46 ms    46 ms  d-deg-core1a.magnet.ie [85.91.3.25]
  5    47 ms    48 ms    46 ms  d-deg-edge2.magnet.ie [85.91.2.42]
  6   277 ms   164 ms   123 ms  border2.hosting365.ie [193.242.111.23]
  7    51 ms    49 ms    50 ms  82.195.143.3
  8    50 ms    50 ms    49 ms  boards.ie [82.195.136.250]

Trace complete.

Tracing route to www.l.google.com [64.233.183.104]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1    45 ms    45 ms    45 ms  87-198-16-1.ptr.magnet.ie [87.198.16.1]
  2    46 ms    45 ms    46 ms  87-198-95-209.ptr.magnet.ie [87.198.95.209]
  3    47 ms    46 ms    45 ms  d-clon-core1b.magnet.ie [85.91.0.133]
  4    57 ms    56 ms    56 ms  vl211.lon-telehn-edge1.magnet.ie [85.91.0.169]
  5    56 ms    55 ms    56 ms  g1-1-255.core01.lon01.atlas.cogentco.com [130.117.243.117]
  6    56 ms    56 ms    56 ms  72.14.198.37
  7    57 ms    56 ms    56 ms  72.14.238.244
  8    66 ms    64 ms    67 ms  216.239.43.120
  9    67 ms    67 ms    67 ms  72.14.233.81
 10    69 ms    66 ms    78 ms  216.239.43.30
 11    67 ms    68 ms    67 ms  nf-in-f104.google.com [64.233.183.104]

Trace complete.

Is it normal that there are 4 to 5 hops within the Magnet network every time? Is this normal practice? Is this the same for SMART or BT or Eircom?

JNive

completely normal and your ping of 45ms is looking a bit better lol. ( mine was 35-40 i think )

try the speedtests now and see what its like

Steffano2002

Hi JNive!

I ran the download/upload test again last night and although my upload has gone up to around 250Kbps, my download has gone down to 1Mbps! :eek: And my ping is still exactly the same...

I've asked Magnet to revert to my old settings seen as everything is the same except my download speeds...

They are now going to organise a call-out to see if it's my line/modem/exchange... Not looking good on the ping front!

LumoColor

Steffano2002 wrote:

Is Origin Plus exactly the same as my ADSL2+ Magnet connection LumoColor?

I think they are different, mine is plain old ADSL.
Looking at the tracert's I get to jolt and google it looks like my ping to the gateway is only 9-10 ms, whilst yours is around 45ms:-
2 11 ms 10 ms 9 ms d-deg-edge1.magnet.ie [217.67.133.190]
3 10 ms 9 ms 9 ms d-deg-core1a.magnet.ie [85.91.2.39]
4 10 ms 10 ms 10 ms d-clon-core1a.magnet.ie [85.91.3.26]
5 11 ms 10 ms 10 ms d-clon-core1b.magnet.ie [85.91.0.50]
6 21 ms 20 ms 21 ms vl211.lon-telehn-edge1.magnet.ie 85.91.0.169]
7 22 ms 23 ms 63 ms g1-1-255.core01.lon01.atlas.cogentco.com [130.117.243.117]
8 23 ms 22 ms 22 ms 72.14.198.37
9 21 ms 21 ms 22 ms 72.14.238.244
10 32 ms 29 ms 33 ms 209.85.248.80
11 37 ms 29 ms 33 ms 72.14.233.83
12 37 ms 39 ms 42 ms 216.239.43.30
13 32 ms 32 ms 34 ms nf-in-f104.google.com [64.233.183.104]

2 9 ms 10 ms 11 ms d-deg-edge1.magnet.ie [217.67.133.190]
3 10 ms 10 ms 10 ms d-deg-core1b.magnet.ie [85.91.2.40]
4 10 ms 10 ms 10 ms d-clon-core1b.magnet.ie [85.91.3.30]
5 20 ms 21 ms 21 ms vl211.lon-telehn-edge1.magnet.ie [85.91.0.169]
6 31 ms 21 ms 21 ms g1-1-255.core01.lon01.atlas.cogentco.com [130.117.243.117]
7 24 ms 23 ms 21 ms t2-1.mpd02.lon01.atlas.cogentco.com [130.117.2.18]
8 37 ms 47 ms 52 ms te1-3.cr05.tn5.bb.pipex.net [195.66.224.29]
9 22 ms 21 ms 21 ms g1-1-6.ar01.tn5.bb.pipex.net [62.72.140.142]
10 22 ms 21 ms 24 ms ge-0-0-0-3801.jolt-gw.cust.pipex.net [212.241.241.14]
11 22 ms 22 ms 22 ms secure.jolt.co.uk [82.133.85.65]

This is a huge difference.

I know from back in the early days when I used to get loads of DSL HELL, any problems with ping to the gateway its normally an issue with the Telco side of the network (i.e. Eircom network), so I would expect the same with ADSL2+. If not I cant see ADSL2+ taking off with 45 ms pings to the gateway, thats next to useless for gaming.

I would get onto support with the tracert info and they should be able to sort it out for you.

Steffano2002

Well, rang Magnet to ask them what the average ping to gateway was and they told me it was between 35ms and 50ms. They say mine is average at 45ms...

I'm hoping to get a call-out scheduled soon to sort out this problem (if it can be sorted...) once and for all!

JNive

sounds accurate, if i remember right, mine was 37/38ms hehe, but of course my upload was 1mbps roflmao

Steffano2002

So, JNive, you had Magnet, and ping to gateway was around 35/40ms?
Did you play online FPS games such as Call of Duty 2 by any chance? If this is the case, do you remember what was your average ping on, let's say, UK servers?

It's damn hard to find Magnet users here to see what kind of service/speeds/ping they are getting!

JNive

average to UK servers was under 50 consistenly if i remember corretly, like i said before, im currently back on chorus while i wait for eircom to reconnect me, give me my old number back onto the line, and then order magnet again, so this time i can take my number with me lol.

Pings were rock solid, even if they were shifted about 20-25ms above eircom's pings. but they still have good international peerings, and pings to the USA etc were similarly rock solid

Steffano2002

Well, the "Engineer" or "Technician" came this morning and I was explaining my problem to him. Was basically telling him my download was perfect but my upload wasn't which, in my opinion, was the reason why my ping was poor, etc...

He didn't have a clue what I was talking about! :eek: He told me he "wasn't technically minded" and that he thought he was called out because of faulty/incorrect wiring... Well that was a big waste of a half day holiday! :rolleyes:

However, all is not lost! I asked him if he had a spare modem I could try and he did. So I gave it a bash and noticed that my upload improved from 250Kbps to 330Kbps! So he told me I could keep it. I also noticed that with this modem my ping to UK servers has dropped from 98/100ms to ~80ms! Even ping to gateway has dropped from ~45ms to ~41ms.
It's tiny, I know, but still! It proves (IMO) that there is nothing wrong with my line and that my problem is with these cr@p modems or the Magnet network!

Which means I'm back to square one and I have to keep ringing Magnet Tech. Support and ask them to fiddle around until it's better...

Steffano2002

Forgot to mention that I asked the Magnet technician (I'm reluctant to call him an engineer) where the Cabra Exchange is and he confirmed it was only up the road from me, I'd say less than 1km. Yet ping to gateway is 40ms+! :rolleyes:

JNive

the ping is not a result of distance, but of conversion time from data to modulated signal and demodulating it back to data again.

also, it should be pretty easy to spot the exchange by walking up there.

as for the slight improvement, the modem might have slightly different settings, or might have better components that didnt introduce noise on the upload. however if the server is 4mbps/512kbps and you are getting 4mbps/330kbps thats not all too bad, assuming the only thing wrong is having an old or dodgy phone line ( which nobody can actually fix, cause eircom wont )