Guy kissed me while I was drunk...

Pet

I personally believe it's down to natural selection. When we were evolving if you were 100% gay & comfortable with same the chances are your genes would never be passed on. If you were homophobic it's much more likely your genes would have been passed on. Hence people of today.

I'm just going to drop into this thread to educate you a bit, hopefully without starting another homosexuality debate.

What you have written there may make sense to you, but it's actually complete rubbish. Let's put aside logic, common sense and biology for a second, and assume that what you have written is true. Why wouldn't women show the same reaction when confronted with lesbians?

Homophobia is a learned behaviour, gleaned from society. It is not biological in nature. Have a read of this and this for more info.

Boston

This was an assualt of a sexual nature. As for what I'd do if it was a large women, I'm more likely to feel physically threatened by a man then a women, since the reality of the situation would be that the man would pose a higher danger. However if I was in a situation where I felt that I couldn't easily overcome my attacker, I would panic and react in the much the same way as I would if it was a guy. aka a chair to the head of the cu't.

Solair

Can people please put this into some kind of perspective?

He was very drunk and was kissed, it happened to be by another guy. Calling that sexual assault is blowing things way way out of proportion and using the term "sexual assault" far too flippantly.

It's not only a massive over-reaction but it's also diminishing the very meaning of the word and making a very serious thing into a minor every day kind of issue.

It doesn't sound like he was attacked, forced to do anything, drugged, held against his will or raped.

Nothing about the incident seems particularly aggressive. The other guy may have been equally plastered. Sounds far more like a stupid incident of misreading a situation.
Why didn't he just say .. "Eh I'm not gay!! / not interested" .. even mildly push him away.

I've been kissed by plenty of women who I wouldn't particularly find attractive when drunk and it's never led anywhere.

It seems he paniced and bolted ... and being so plastered fell down the stairs in the process.

Suggesting that someone should beat the guy up is utterly ridiculous. It's the homophobic paranoid response. Are you living in medievel times?

If it had been a particularly ugly woman who you didn't find attractive at all would you also be suggesting beating her up?

It's a bit of an embarrassing awkward situation, but it's not worth getting violent over!

Being kissed by a guy doesn't mean you're gay either (just in case you think it does) .. it just means he happens to think you're attractive.

Chill out.. just tell him you're not interested next time rather than diving out the window or decking the poor guy..

Not generally a great idea to make moves on people while very drunk, but from what you're describing it doesn't sound like anything happened other than you got kissed!

It'd be a very different story if you'd been seriously assaulted etc..

I mean, if you take this to its logical conclusion you'd need to sign a waiver before entering a nightclub lest some girl might lay a finger on you.

Boston

Solair wrote:

Can people please put this into some kind of perspective?

He was very drunk and was kissed, it happened to be by another guy. Calling that sexual assault is blowing things way way out of proportion and using the term "sexual assault" far too flippantly.

It's not only a massive over-reaction but it's also diminishing the very meaning of the word and making a very serious thing into a minor every day kind of issue.

More then the fact he was drunk is the fact he was unconcious. He couldn't give his permission. Would you do what the Guy did? You're suggesting it's ok, so would you?

It doesn't sound like he was attacked, forced to do anything, drugged, held against his will or raped.

Another person forced themselves on the OP. He wasn't in a position to say no.

Solair

Boston:

He was KISSED. From what he said, it didn't progress from there at all.

We have no idea how he reacted. It seems that he was drunk enough to assume it was his girlfriend .. thus he may have actually reacted in an initially positive way. The guy seems to have bolted out the door at that point. So there was no particular opportunity to discuss it / say no or anything else.

It was inappropriate and stupid behaviour, but the level of violent reaction on this thread is absolutely ridiculous.

Having a word with him about it might be appropriate as a reaction. Suggesting that he should be beaten to pulp is a complete and total over reaction in any context.

Boston

Solair wrote:

Boston:

He was KISSED. From what he said, it didn't progress from there at all.

No business doing anything to the guy.

It was inappropriate behaviour, but the level of violent reaction on this thread is absolutely ridiculous.

Meh, says you. My personal account is accurate. I've lashed out at people before in my sleep that tried to appraoch me. I've no doubt as to my reaction.

Suggesting that he should be beaten to pulp is a complete and total over reaction in any context.

I don't suggest that.

Faith

Boston wrote:

More then the fact he was drunk is the fact he was unconcious. He couldn't give his permission. Would you do what the Guy did? You're suggesting it's ok, so would you?

No, he wasn't. He was falling asleep. He wasn't unconcious. In fact, he was awake enough to know that somebody was kissing him, he assumed it was his girlfriend and he started talking to her.

OP wrote:

I was lying on the couch almost asleep when someone starts kissing me. Being this drunk for some reason I thought it was my girlfriend and started talking to them as if it was.

Boston wrote:

Another person forced themselves on the OP. He wasn't in a position to say no.

Yes, he was.

I agree with Solair, the term "sexual abuse" is being thrown around far too freely here.

Boston

meh, if you not a virgin you can't be raped.

Gordon

Boston wrote:

meh, if you not a virgin you can't be raped.

Stop trolling.

Incidentally, the op has a, now unqueued post, around post #55.

Boston

It's not a troll. In some contries a distinction between being raping a virgin and someone whose not a virgin is made.

Gordon

Although I don't quite understand the point you made I'm not going to ask you to back that up with evidence as it will bring this off topic. Interesting topic though, one for humanities that one..

No trolling this thread please. Back on topic.

randylonghorn

what2do wrote:

'Well just to let you know, I did tell the girlfriend when we were out last night and it felt great to confide in someone about it. ...

I've actually almost completely forgot about it and actually laugh when I think about it now because it's just so crazy and unbelievable. Being with the girlfriend on a night out helped alot I think and I've set my limit of drinks to 6 whenever I go out and I must say I really enjoyed myself last night.

OP, if you happen to look in again, glad to know you're feeling better and that you've felt able to talk to your girlfriend about it.

secret_squirrel

what2do wrote:

'Well just to let you know, I did tell the girlfriend when we were out last night and it felt great to confide in someone about it. She knew that I didn't know what I was doing because she was out on my last birthday where I was given free drink all night so knows what I'm like on a mad night out.
She advised me to just avoid the guy if possible but as most of you said he is probably so embarrassed he will avoid me too.

I've actually almost completely forgot about it and actually laugh when I think about it now because it's just so crazy and unbievable. Being with the girlfriend on a night out helped alot I think and I've set my limit of drinks to 6 whenever I go out and I must say I really enjoyed myself last night.

Anyway thanks for all the replies and advice (though some of it scares me).'

Fair play to you OP - thats probably the best way to deal with it.

Nice that you are now able to keep things in proportion, unlike some of the other posters on this thread.

Solair

That's great to hear.

I never know why people get so worked up over stuff like that. You'd be amazed how difficult it is to undermine your masculinity

kizzyr

Tha Gopher wrote:

Good god, young man with above views. Hello 999, put me through to the thought police.

If I assume by the way she is dressed a girl is loose, and when shes asleep i feel her up, she wakes and clatters me one, is it because she doesnt want to be used? Or is she a slut in denial, much like your insinuitating ninja is gay in denail?

Kizzyr, its how society works. If a man does this to you, the reaction is violence, its just the way of the world. Pretty much the same way we instinctively react with violence in matters to do with harm on our sisters, daughters, partners, family and friends etc, its simply in the head and tbh as a female you should be greatful if you have male relatives/friends willing to risk prosecution to commit illegal violence if harm comes to you.

As for the stigma, is basically boils down to one sentence

"Its an exit hole"

Its all in the head, again, pre determined since before you knew what gay and straight were. Hell, as a 5 year old I was mortified when my mother told me Id be getting a tetanus injection in my arse (terrified as I assumed it was going the brown avenue route in, rather than simply puncturing my cheeks )

To me its more how society "doesn't" work rather than works. I am constantly baffled at how men are scared by gay men. Its almost as though they think homosexuality is a contagious disease.
Re: it being a normal reaction to be violent again I disagree with this. Women have drunk men dropping the hand, pinching their ass, groping their breasts and slobbery unwanted unwelcome kisses landed on their faces on a regular basis. If she reacts by telling the guy where to go or smacking him on the face the usual thing thats thrown back at her is "what are you a lesbian?" Imagine a girl NOT wanting to get a load of THAT love machine eh? However if this happened to me next week I wouldn't expect my boyfriend, brother or father to find the bloke and beat the living sh1t out of him.
As for the stigma being there only because its an "exit hole" well tell that to all of the straight heterosexual people who engage in anal sex. And from spending time here on Boards its obvious that they aren't few and far between.

Boston

kizzyr wrote:

To me its more how society "doesn't" work rather than works. I am constantly baffled at how men are scared by gay men. Its almost as though they think homosexuality is a contagious disease.
Re: it being a normal reaction to be violent again I disagree with this. Women have drunk men dropping the hand, pinching their ass, groping their breasts and slobbery unwanted unwelcome kisses landed on their faces on a regular basis. If she reacts by telling the guy where to go or smacking him on the face the usual thing thats thrown back at her is "what are you a lesbian?" Imagine a girl NOT wanting to get a load of THAT love machine eh? However if this happened to me next week I wouldn't expect my boyfriend, brother or father to find the bloke and beat the living sh1t out of him.

So it's ok then. Is that what you're saying.

LegacyUser

'Strange thread this. Of course what that chap did was wrong, he made a move on a sleeping person. No more or less wrong than if it had been a guy to a girl or a girl to a guy. The fact that its a homosexual act shouldn't come into it. Likewise "beating him up" (what ****in age are ye people...) is bang out of line, as it would be in any of the above heterosexual situations. Some contributors to this thread are having a very hard time understanding their own sexuality. Particularly some of the, shall we say, martial arts inclined?'

kizzyr

Boston wrote:

So it's ok then. Is that what you're saying.

I'm not too sure what you're asking me about there so I'll answer what I think are the possibilities.
1) not its not ok that the guy was kissed while he was asleep. That is taking advantage of someone and that is wrong.
2) I think the extreme violent reaction towards this kiss is also wrong.
3) if you're asking me if I'm saying its ok for people to be homosexual then yes I am saying that that is ok.

To sum this whole thing up, yes the guy was kissed when he shouldn't have been. Whether it was a man or woman who did this to him it was wrong and no one should take advantage of someone else. However I do think it should be put in perspective and those who are calling this a serious sexual assualt are having an OTT reaction as did the OP to the kiss.

Zirconia

Unreg220107 wrote:

'The fact that its a homosexual act shouldn't come into it.'

Well I don't agree with that at all!

First or all, I don't believe there is anything wrong with being gay, my brother is gay and therefore my circle of friends and associates include gay people, who I go out with for drinks occasionally, and enjoy their company as friends.

Waking up and finding a stranger kissing you when you don't know them is unacceptable. Yes, you might not mind so much if you're hetrosexual and it is someone of the opposite sex you find attractive, but it still really isn't acceptable behaviour.

But if you are hetrosexual and it a member of the same sex it is far more unacceptable, and you can't validate it by accusing the person of being homophobic for not accepting this!

The fact that its a homosexual act shouldn't come into it, but only when both parties are gay, otherwise it is a problem. Saying it shouldn't come into it to me says that you don't respect hetrosexuality. People do have the right to be attracted to either the same sex or the opposite sex, and they have the right for this attraction to be exclusive, meaning someone behaving in a sexual way towards them don't fall into their sexual preference, this behaviour can (ligitimately) be offensive to them. Obviously this goes for everyone, gay or straight.

Let me put it this way, if the person in question was gay, I'm sure it's likely that in this situation he would have been offended to some degree, having been taken advantage of by another guy. But if he was gay, and had a strong dislike for contact with the opposite sex where it was clearly of a sexual nature, and a WOMAN had done this to him, then this would be far more offensive.

Homosexuality isn't an issue here, but homosexual behaviour towards someone who clearly isn't, and uses their incapacitation to take advantage is unacceptable. The guy who did this is a scumbag.

LegacyUser

Zirconia wrote:

Well I don't agree with that at all!

Waking up and finding a stranger kissing you when you don't know them is unacceptable. Yes, you might not mind so much if you're hetrosexual and it is someone of the opposite sex you find attractive, but it still really isn't acceptable behaviour.

But if you are hetrosexual and it a member of the same sex it is far more unacceptable, and you can't validate it by accusing the person of being homophobic for not accepting this!

It depends on what you mean. You mean because the person couldn't possibly be attracted to the 'attacker'? Would this not be the same as an unattractive person making the same move in a heterosexual situation?

Zirconia

Unreg220107 wrote:

It depends on what you mean. You mean because the person couldn't possibly be attracted to the 'attacker'? Would this not be the same as an unattractive person making the same move in a heterosexual situation?

No, it would not be the same. You don't seem to understand. I'm not talking levels of attraction. People can be exclusively gay and people can be exclusively straight. If you fall into either of these catagories, most likely you would find the prospect of you, yourself being involved in any act that you would consider sexual with someone other that your sexual preference completely repugnant and disgusting.

Feeling this way is perfectly acceptable. It does not mean that you feel this way about other people performing these acts with each other, just that this is how you would feel if you were involved.

So it is not like you being more or less attracted to an 'attacker', it is a whole other issue altogether.

To put it another way, if the OP was an observant Jew, and he regained consiousness to find one of his 'friends' had been feeding him pork sausages, you could not say that it was just a matter of him being taken advantage of, and his religous beliefs should not come into it.

Zambia

Oh dear lord ...

Ok if this was me I probably would have given the silly eejit a wee slap. There would have been no "kicking" as people have put it. He was chancing his arm and in my opinion risking a violent instant reaction as you would by kissing a girl when asleep.

I would also not be happy about being woken. The OP handled it well.

There are certain rules men have between each other and this broke one. There is nothing more to it.

Boston

kizzyr wrote:

I'm not too sure what you're asking me about there so I'll answer what I think are the possibilities.
1) not its not ok that the guy was kissed while he was asleep. That is taking advantage of someone and that is wrong.
2) I think the extreme violent reaction towards this kiss is also wrong.
3) if you're asking me if I'm saying its ok for people to be homosexual then yes I am saying that that is ok.

To sum this whole thing up, yes the guy was kissed when he shouldn't have been. Whether it was a man or woman who did this to him it was wrong and no one should take advantage of someone else. However I do think it should be put in perspective and those who are calling this a serious sexual assault are having an OTT reaction as did the OP to the kiss.

Seriousness is relative. But he was assaulted in a sexual fashion. I guess I'm just shocked by the type of thing people tolerate. It might be my demeanour that scares assholes away, but no female friend of mine had ever had to put up with being groped or abused while in my presence. It just doesn't happen, so I find it alarming when people say it's common.

Ps, assault isn't this thing where you have to kick the **** out of someone before it's considered assault. If I place my hand on your shoulder and restrain you or push you, that's assault. If you could get past the OP being drunk and maybe the attacker being drunk you'd agree with this being sexual assault.

dame

what2do wrote:

'Well just to let you know, I did tell the girlfriend when we were out last night and it felt great to confide in someone about it. She knew that I didn't know what I was doing because she was out on my last birthday where I was given free drink all night so knows what I'm like on a mad night out.
She advised me to just avoid the guy if possible but as most of you said he is probably so embarrassed he will avoid me too.

I've actually almost completely forgot about it and actually laugh when I think about it now because it's just so crazy and unbievable. Being with the girlfriend on a night out helped alot I think and I've set my limit of drinks to 6 whenever I go out and I must say I really enjoyed myself last night.

Anyway thanks for all the replies and advice (though some of it scares me).'

Op, glad to hear you've had a chat with your girlfriend and gotten past this incident in your own head (without resorting to some of the more extreme advice :rolleyes: ). Hope your fingers mend quickly and that the rest of your final year in college goes well (and a bit less eventfully ). Best of luck!

kizzyr

The amount of OTT reaction, from both side I might add, is nothing short of disgraceful. To beat the **** out of anyone for being gay is ridiculous. Ninja and a couple of others need to ring the bank and let them know their reality check is bouncing.

Likewise, the other brigade suggesting that this is nothing, and that he should just brush it off are just as bad. Just because YOU find it acceptable, does not mean that you can apply this to everyone, just the same as someone who finds homosexuality unacceptable can not force their views on everyone.

You all need to calm down and take stock of the situation:

FACTS:

OP was drunk and semi-conscious. Practically asleep. (Asleep enough that it matters not whether he was fully/partially asleep).

OP was approached by a gay man, who, for some reason, thought it was/didn't care if it was or was not acceptable to make sexual contact. This was unwanted and uninvited.

OP copped on, panicked, and fled, injuring himself in the process.


Unknowns:

Gay man may/may not have been drunk. He may even have been drunker than the OP, we can't know.

Gay man made an approach to a person who, for argument's sake, was asleep/unconscious. He then initiated sexual contact. I'm sure that at the best of times, it must be difficult for a gay man to do this, for fear of rejection and ridicule, due to the stigma attached to being gay. Waiting til he was asleep, in this instance, is the wrong move.

This is unacceptable, no matter what the sex of the initiator or the recipient is. No matter how drunk somebody is, asleep means no. Anybody who thinks the fact that he was drunk means that he leaves himself open to this kind of thing is lower than a snake's ball-bag. By your reasoning, anybody who goes to a pub leaves themself open to their drink being spiked, and therefore deserves it.

I'm outraged at some of the replies in this thread, so much that i'm having difficulty expressing myself properly, and my response is all over the place.

btw......

kizzyr wrote:

if thats how you feel then you must be gunning for rapists, pedophiles etc etc

I know this isn't directed at me but If ANYBODY and i mean ANYBODY raped a member of my family or molested an underage member of my family, and i had a gun.......I'd do time for them. Gladly.

kizzyr

Deleted User wrote:

The amount of OTT reaction, from both side I might add, is nothing short of disgraceful. To beat the **** out of anyone for being gay is ridiculous. Ninja and a couple of others need to ring the bank and let them know their reality check is bouncing.

Likewise, the other brigade suggesting that this is nothing, and that he should just brush it off are just as bad. Just because YOU find it acceptable, does not mean that you can apply this to everyone, just the same as someone who finds homosexuality unacceptable can not force their views on everyone.

You all need to calm down and take stock of the situation:

FACTS:

OP was drunk and semi-conscious. Practically asleep. (Asleep enough that it matters not whether he was fully/partially asleep).

OP was approached by a gay man, who, for some reason, thought it was/didn't care if it was or was not acceptable to make sexual contact. This was unwanted and uninvited.

OP copped on, panicked, and fled, injuring himself in the process.


Unknowns:

Gay man may/may not have been drunk. He may even have been drunker than the OP, we can't know.

Gay man made an approach to a person who, for argument's sake, was asleep/unconscious. He then initiated sexual contact. I'm sure that at the best of times, it must be difficult for a gay man to do this, for fear of rejection and ridicule, due to the stigma attached to being gay. Waiting til he was asleep, in this instance, is the wrong move.

This is unacceptable, no matter what the sex of the initiator or the recipient is. No matter how drunk somebody is, asleep means no. Anybody who thinks the fact that he was drunk means that he leaves himself open to this kind of thing is lower than a snake's ball-bag. By your reasoning, anybody who goes to a pub leaves themself open to their drink being spiked, and therefore deserves it.

I'm outraged at some of the replies in this thread, so much that i'm having difficulty expressing myself properly, and my response is all over the place.

btw......



I know this isn't directed at me but If ANYBODY and i mean ANYBODY raped a member of my family or molested an underage member of my family, and i had a gun.......I'd do time for them. Gladly.[/QUOTE]
I'm not saying that is an over reaction, I was using that more as a question or wonderment. If the FM who wrote that the man who kissed the OP (wrongly I will agree) deserved a huge kicking and beating and sees the KISS as such a big sexual assault that the man in question should be imprisoned I was wondering what on earth he'd do to rapists and paedophiles.

Boston

kizzyr wrote:

I'm not saying that is an over reaction, I was using that more as a question or wonderment. If the FM who wrote that the man who kissed the OP (wrongly I will agree) deserved a huge kicking and beating and sees the KISS as such a big sexual assault that the man in question should be imprisoned I was wondering what on earth he'd do to rapists and paedophiles.

Prison, what yea on about. If you forced yourself on someone regardless of how far you got, you'd deserve what ever you got.

kizzyr

Boston wrote:

Prison, what yea on about. If you forced yourself on someone regardless of how far you got, you'd deserve what ever you got.

My point is that if you give someone a prison term for an unwanted kiss what do you give them if they kiss you and drop the hand? and then taking it to a higher level rapists, and then those who gang rape, or rape old women, male rape, paeophiles who rape little boys and girls.......... The severity of the crime gets worse but are all of these people going to be given the same punishment? I realise that this is a whole other discussion but the punishment needs to fit the crime and a kiss, unwanted as it may be is not the same as someone breaking into a house and gang raping an 85 year old woman.
I'm not condoning ANY of these things btw.

Drift

I know its not strictly relevant but there was a court case in England in the 1830s where a man had tried to kiss a woman and she didn't want it so when he bent in she bit the end of his nose off.

He took her to court and the judge found in her favour, said she was perfectly entitled to bite the end of a guys nose off if he tried to kiss her and she didn't want it.

A bit off topic but just to show how a similar legal system to ours dealt with it, although it was the 1830s.