SU Sabbatical Elections

Vainglory

Chakar wrote:

KBC candidates ftw!

The last ones left in contested elections are Quinlivan and Rath.

Maybe you should rethink this comment then.

Het-Field

I dont understand why people believe that the Kevin Barry Cummann are somewhat independant of Fianna Fail. I dont know any party or branch for that matter, who have this independance complex

Pythia

Stepherunie wrote:

Why oh why would you vote on such a mute point as there political affiliation??????

Because it tends to show their leanings on things. I would certainly look at politcal affiliations. It wouldn't be the only thing I'd look at, but it would certainly be a big indicator.
I'm very involved in YFG but I might vote for someone in the KBC as they are similar to us in some ways. A Socialist Workers member would probably have very different views. And of course I'd never vote for a member (or former member) of Sinn Fein on principle.

Chakar

Het-Field wrote:

I dont understand why people believe that the Kevin Barry Cummann are somewhat independant of Fianna Fail. I dont know any party or branch for that matter, who have this independance complex

The Kevin Barry Cumann predates the foundation of Ogra Fianna Fail.Its the largest cumann in the country.Then you have its presence on campus.

gubbie

Chakar wrote:

The Kevin Barry Cumann predates the foundation of Ogra Fianna Fail.Its the largest cumann in the country.Then you have its presence on campus.

Which is zero compared to the stuff that LY do and considering their size compared to theh KBC!

And I heard some really dodgy things about KBC at the irish ff meeting...

I don't care if people are political on things like this-I think the perfect balance would be if there was 2 left wing, 2 right wing and a indo... I think it'd strike well

Chakar

gubbie wrote:

Which is zero compared to the stuff that LY do and considering their size compared to theh KBC!

And I heard some really dodgy things about KBC at the irish ff meeting...

I don't care if people are political on things like this-I think the perfect balance would be if there was 2 left wing, 2 right wing and a indo... I think it'd strike well

By 'presence' I meant the presence of the KBC in the Students Union and in the societies.

And do tell what did you hear?

Jonny Arson

Pythia wrote:

Because it tends to show their leanings on things. I would certainly look at politcal affiliations. It wouldn't be the only thing I'd look at, but it would certainly be a big indicator.

Surely the only ''leaning'' that should matter is that whoever regardless of their personal political affiliation will work hard and stand up for students, strive to make UCD a better college for students and will not let their political affiliation prejudice and get in the way of issues such as fees and grants? What do you think affiliations would be an indicator of specificly in relation to the SU?

Pythia wrote:

I'm very involved in YFG but I might vote for someone in the KBC as they are similar to us in some ways. A Socialist Workers member would probably have very different views. And of course I'd never vote for a member (or former member) of Sinn Fein on principle.

The SU isnt the Dail. I know there has to be a political element in the SU with regards to fees etc. but on the whole grand scheme of things varying social and economic ideolgies mean sweet FA in an SU - once people are active in the SU for the right reasons and the right goals for students thats the only ideology that matters (and yes sadly I know there have been many who have put political careers before the SU and its members)

Forget about the political affiliations, concentrate on what the individual candidate has to offer for students and the SU. If SU ever gets rid of this stupid lefty/righty divide which is holding it back by the balls it might actually someday be worth the €70 odd we pay per year.

humbert

Jonny Arson wrote:

Surely the only ''leaning'' that should matter is that whoever regardless of their personal political affiliation will work hard and stand up for students, strive to make UCD a better college for students and will not let their political affiliation prejudice and get in the way of issues such as fees and grants? What do you think affiliations would be an indicator of specificly in relation to the SU?



The SU isnt the Dail. I know there has to be a political element in the SU with regards to fees etc. but on the whole grand scheme of things varying social and economic ideolgies mean sweet FA in an SU - once people are active in the SU for the right reasons and the right goals for students thats the only ideology that matters (and yes sadly I know there have been many who have put political careers before the SU and its members)

Forget about the political affiliations, concentrate on what the individual candidate has to offer for students and the SU. If SU ever gets rid of this stupid lefty/righty divide which is holding it back by the balls it might actually someday be worth the €70 odd we pay per year.

common sense like that and youth politics aren't good bedfellows.

The_Minister

Johnny_Arson, when you the problem with the left candidates is that they tend to use the union for their own personal political objectives (abortion, shell to sea, etc)

Chakar

Jonny Arson wrote:

Surely the only ''leaning'' that should matter is that whoever regardless of their personal political affiliation will work hard and stand up for students, strive to make UCD a better college for students and will not let their political affiliation prejudice and get in the way of issues such as fees and grants? What do you think affiliations would be an indicator of specificly in relation to the SU?



The SU isnt the Dail. I know there has to be a political element in the SU with regards to fees etc. but on the whole grand scheme of things varying social and economic ideolgies mean sweet FA in an SU - once people are active in the SU for the right reasons and the right goals for students thats the only ideology that matters (and yes sadly I know there have been many who have put political careers before the SU and its members)

Forget about the political affiliations, concentrate on what the individual candidate has to offer for students and the SU. If SU ever gets rid of this stupid lefty/righty divide which is holding it back by the balls it might actually someday be worth the €70 odd we pay per year.

They can do that as well can't they?

People can vote for who they want.If there is an attraction to be had as a KBC candidate then people will vote for that person.I know that most candidates have declared their political affliations in their manifestos including me last year.

Sangre

Jonny Arson wrote:

Surely the only ''leaning'' that should matter is that whoever regardless of their personal political affiliation will work hard and stand up for students, strive to make UCD a better college for students and will not let their political affiliation prejudice and get in the way of issues such as fees and grants? What do you think affiliations would be an indicator of specificly in relation to the SU?

It may not affect his work during the year but there isn't a ****ing chance I'd ever vote a Shinner in. Why risk giving a potential politician fodder for his CV? Not to mention he's probably an idiot if he is in Sinn Fein.

Anyway this is one year, student positions. Its not physically possible to find the true political positions of all the candidates. How would I possibly find out who will work hard for me if I'm locked in the library as a final year, or out for most of the year on placement? I can't. That's why generalisations are needed. Usually based on faculty, political leaning, past experience etc.,
Tbh, student politics aren't worth the effort you're asking for.

Byrno

It is my opinion that political parties should not be a factor in voting for a candidate. Their potential capabilities as an officer should.

Also officers should resign from their political party when elected. It would eliminate any potential political difficulties as much as possible. That is if they are in a political party.

EDIT: Oh and all this clap-trap about people only going for their CVs. Yes some do but they are generally seen through by the students. Most do it because they genuinely interested in helping their fellow students.

Also the VP positions are probably the most important positions, not the President. They are the ones who mainly deal with the students and do the bulk of the work. Also I believe that you can achieve far more in Education/Welfare than as President

Stepherunie

Pythia wrote:

Because it tends to show their leanings on things. I would certainly look at politcal affiliations. It wouldn't be the only thing I'd look at, but it would certainly be a big indicator.
I'm very involved in YFG but I might vote for someone in the KBC as they are similar to us in some ways. A Socialist Workers member would probably have very different views. And of course I'd never vote for a member (or former member) of Sinn Fein on principle.

As I pointed out, someone could easily not join a political party but have belief in there ideals, thus that is why I prefer to look at all candidates rather than just work purely on what party they subscribe to.

Stabshauptmann

Just read Stephen Quinlivan's manifesto.

Great use of mystery tour
Not pretending to be able to get an off license on campus
Great profensional, relevant experience
Takes credit for everything good about Ents this year
Detailed plans

If he doesnt get ents expect to see me and a rifle ontop of the arts block!

Dontico

Stepherunie wrote:

Why oh why would you vote on such a mute point as there political affiliation?????? Just because there affiliated with a certain party makes them no more qualified for the position. Many of the candidates have political affiliations, I don't agree with some peoples political affiliations but if I had been at home to vote I'd vote on the basis of whom I deem to be the best candidate for the position. You haven't even given the candidates the chance to put forward there manifestos. At least be somewhat opened minded and let people say what they want to do before you strike them out of the race.

What is to say that a candidate never joined a party, they felt it better to not join a party because they knew at some point that they may run for a sabbat position or even to do with a job later in life and they felt it more prudent to not join a party. Does that make them a better candidate then someone who decided to be completely honest about there own political beliefs and wanted to stand up for them???

if you want to contribute to a decusion, please read the posts. especially the one you quoted.

Dontico

Pythia wrote:

And of course I'd never vote for a member (or former member) of Sinn Fein on principle.

it should the primary function of every political group or person in ireland, to keep sinn fein out of everything!

Dontico

Kaptain Redeye wrote:

Just read Stephen Quinlivan's manifesto.

where?


at the moment i'm leaning towards laura, on the basis i met her once.

singingstranger

Jonny Arson wrote:

it might actually someday be worth the €70 odd we pay per year.

Just because I'm anal, you actually pay your €70-odd as part of the mortgage for the Student Centre itself; the Union doesn't get that cash. There is however about €17 that's taken out of your Reg Fee that the Union gets, €5 of which (or €2.50 if you're part-time) goes towards your affiliation to USI.

Stabshauptmann

Dontico wrote:

where?


at the moment i'm leaning towards laura, on the basis i met her once.

Quinn School, and I read Shannahans: Boo, Liar. He promises free grinds in core subjects, I dont believe he has any intention or capability of fulfilling that promise.

Since its down to viv or carl ann rush - whose views on the poster scandal [sic] I find totally ridiculous, Viv gets my welfare vote.

So only one left is education.
Pres and Deputy uncontested.
Ents: Stepen Quinilvan
Welfare: Viv

Education: Definitly not Shanahan, Regans the nicest guy in the world where as paul is a careerist - but then again which one is more likely to get things done.

Paul Tergat

Voting:

Ents - Quinlavan
Welfare - Rath
Education - Shanahan - he'd work his arse off for the union!
President - Colfer (even if he came up against someone)
Deputy - Brennan

Kaptain Redeye - i really think you need to speak to Ronan if you can before making your mind up, you'll see what kind of a person he is and how much he's willing to do!

Stabshauptmann

If i ever ran into him casually maybe Id get to know him better, but I dont think he can or intends to deliver on all his promises in his manifesto so hes immediatly lost my vote.

Dontico

The_Minister wrote:

Johnny_Arson, when you the problem with the left candidates is that they tend to use the union for their own personal political objectives (abortion, shell to sea, etc)

i would imagine you would agree with me that the people in the SU shouldnt be allowed force thier personal agendas on others?
as in:
A-support shell to sea, its not a UCD issue.
B-help people get abortions on the basis its against the law here.
c-banning various food products(other thread).

GusherING

Dontico wrote:

i would imagine you would agree with me that the people in the SU shouldnt be allowed force thier personal agendas on others?
as in:
A-support shell to sea, its not a UCD issue.
B-help people get abortions on the basis its against the law here.
c-banning various food products(other thread).

Performing an abortion is generally illegal in Ireland but there are exceptions, such as when the mothers life is at risk. The fact that this hasn't been legislated for over a decade on from the X case says a lot about our politicians. But its not illegal to inform people of where to get one, how to get one or to travel abroad to get one once all the other options for an unwanted pregnancy are discussed also. All those things fall within the remit of the Welfare Officer or any (non-Catholic) Crisis Pregnancy agency. Thus, you're completely wrong in saying that helping people to get abortions is part of a personal agenda, rather, its the sign of a good counsellor to inform a woman of all her options. And its legal too.

As for your usual tripe of the union being apolitical, can you truly tell me that a Sabbat thats in the KBC won't have their own personal agenda that you incessantly accuse the left in UCD of having? No you can't. A KBC'er is probably less likely to go against the policies of their party which is running the Dept of Education these days. Doesn't that portray an agenda? Where is your virulent criticism for that?

Reading your posts in general shows you up as portraying as much of an agenda as those you criticise.

Whoever gets elected will have an agenda of some degree. Build a bridge and get over it.

Pythia

GusherING wrote:

But its not illegal to inform people of where to get one, how to get one or to travel abroad to get one once all the other options for an unwanted pregnancy are discussed also.

As far as I know there's some technicality where you can't give out the information unless somebody actually asks for it. Ie you couldn't have a big poster giving the details.

GusherING

Pythia wrote:

As far as I know there's some technicality where you can't give out the information unless somebody actually asks for it. Ie you couldn't have a big poster giving the details.

Correct. You have to go to a counsellor, they can't just give it out over the phone, poster it everywhere or publish it in a general magazine and just slip in abortion info at the back etc. And all a womans options have to be discussed. I'd imagine that the ethics of most counsellors are naturally inclined to this apporach anyway, but they're the rules.

Chakar

So we're talking about our votes.I will be voting for the candidates running against RON namely Brennan and Colfer.

Entertainments: Stephen Quinlivan, the proposal that he has is to establish a 'governance structure' which would be backed up by the 'Ents Crew' is an excellent idea which is eminently achieveable.Its quite possible it will be retained by future Entertainments officers.Also as a sidenote he is a member of the KBC.

Education: John Regan has some very good ideas, seems to know his stuff compared to Lynam and Shanahan.He is also a member of the KBC

Welfare: Viv Rath KBC member of four years standing.He's also a good worker and is genuninely passionate about the brief of Welfare Officer.He was also the Disability Officer and co founder of the IPA Society.

Vainglory

Chakar wrote:

Also as a sidenote he is a member of the KBC...He is also a member of the KBC..Welfare: Viv Rath KBC member of four years standing.

And people say I'M trying to push a "political agenda". Christ on a bike.

Chakar

Vainglory wrote:

And people say I'M trying to push a "political agenda". Christ on a bike.

Well I would suppose that its not within my control that the best candidates in my opinion are members of the KBC is it?

What political agenda would I be trying to put forward?

Its definitely not Shell to Sea, Charles Donnelly and abortion.

Vainglory

Chakar wrote:

Well I would suppose that its not within my control that the best candidates in my opinion are members of the KBC is it?

What political agenda would I be trying to put forward?

Its definitely not Shell to Sea, Charles Donnelly and abortion.

Of course not, heaven forbid the Union might do anything other than an awareness campaign about something like, oh, let's say, the need for more awareness campaigns? Yep, something like "More Awareness Campaigns Needed. Twister all day in the Arts Block for this cause!" Obviously with the huge interest in sabbatical elections this year and the thoughtful and productive motions debated at council this is really working....ah...wait.

But this is off topic and I have far better things to do than argue with you so I guess we shall agree to disagree.

pretty*monster

Was a bit suprised by Shanahan's promise to turn the library into a short-loan-only operation.

And by suprised I do of course mean horrified.