How do you feel about the property market and what is your situation.

godtabh

tHE vAGGABOND wrote:

I do see what your saying, and there is logic there.

But dont forget that banks dont want to lend people money for 1 bed places. I have 4 banks offering me a very healthy amount to buy a 2 or 3 bed place [via broker], they would only offer me a tiny fraction of that for a 1 bed place [and only 1 or 2 of them would offer me anything for a 1 bed place].

I got finance on what I could afford rather than what I was buying.

I bought a one bed.

copacetic

kearnsr wrote:

I got fiance on what I could afford rather than what I was buying.

I bought a one bed.

i suppose u only needed the one bed what with buying a fiancé and all.
how much did u spend on him?

Zambia

rick_fantastic wrote:

23 male, single, working full time, masters part-time.

in process of buying house south dublin. deposit down and waiting on results of survey on the property before i sign contracts.

borrowing a large amount of money so im a little worried bout the financial implications (ie 50k negative to pay stamp and refurbish)

going to live in and rent out the rest of it. ex council house 5mins from dundrum.

By any chance did you have a whole thread about this last year? about 500,000 for a house in dundrum ?

CannonBalls for balls my good man hope it works out I personnally would be sceptical but Dundrum has a lot going for it.

Do-more

42, Married, 3 yo and newborn. Bought an apartment in Mullingar in 1990 and sold for 3 times the initial price in 1998, it's gone up another three fold since then.

Bought a serviced site in a development in 2001 and self-built a nice 5 bed detached for €230,000 all in. Could never afford to buy at today's prices. On paper our home is supposedly worth €500,000-€550,000.

From the point of view of house prices I'm not worried about a crash, but I am very worried about it's effects on the Irish economy. From where I'm sitting this country's future certainly doesn't appear rosy. As it is, even without a large mortgage, we need two incomes to get by in this rip-off republic, if either or both of us were made redundant we would be in serious trouble making ends meet.

For my part I'm off to Germany for a week in March to work on the contingency plan. Depending on how that goes we will either sell here and move or more likely I will commute every other week.

Kipperhell

Married no kids double income early thrities
Bought our first house 6 years ago in an area we felt would rise faster than the average market. It did. Bought our second selling our first moving from 10% equity on purchase to selling at 36% equity. Bought 2nd house with a 23% equity 2.5 years later, with estimated price 20% asking prices on my road (2 for sale on this road) we have equity of 36% with actual asking price it would be 49%.
Our mortgage is 19% of our income which has gone up from 16% in the 6 years but our salaries have also gone up. No need for expensive cars and high fuel bills due to location. Small car and relience on cycling and public transport. Very well serviced area with gyms,pools,shops,cinemas, schools,transport etc...
More room than we need in the house and great rental potential if needed and possibility to extend.
We couldn't afford to buy our first house now if we were starting out again and could never dream of having this house. I feel sorry for younger people for their more limited choices but I also think expectations are higher than need. We were/are lucky and other people are expecting luck rather than their needs to be met.
By us lowering our expectation when we first bought we were able to move on friends who bought bigger houses further away have less equity and more expenses along with much higher commute times. Their better value houses have proved in the long term to be much much more costly.
As for a crash we are again luck that we could weather some pretty drastic prices drops. I would rather not see it happen and really don't see it being as extreme as many are predicting. It is unlikely to effect our property to the extent it will effect others as it has so much going for it. There are many people who want a crash for personal reasons but I don't think they really understand what impact it will have on them and the general economy.

Bluehair

Turned 31 last year and getting married this year, bought about 1999 and sold last year to return to renting. Well over a six figure sum in the bank as a result (won't say exactly how much). The 'Speculation Nation' will ruin the country and destroy the economy. Despite the 'boom' years we have appauling infrastucture, policing, health care and education systems. Real shame but we are actively exploring other places to live as a result. Ireland will shortly replace Japan as the definitive example of a Property Bubble/Irrational Exuberance and will retain that title for decades. The last decade was utterly wasted by the government.

godtabh

daveym wrote:

i suppose u only needed the one bed what with buying a fiancé and all.
how much did u spend on him?

Sorry I meant to say finance and if I did have a fiance it would a her

chump

Mid 20's. With gf. Renting 1 bed city centre.
Started career job recently. In 2-3 years both will be on good wage, with good prospects (pray gawd) - not interested in buying or considering buying property until then.

copacetic

kearnsr wrote:

Sorry I meant to say finance and if I did have a fiance it would a her

yeah i know, but it didn't work if i added the extra e!

MisterAnarchy

I have a 3 storey terraced home which I bought when I just finished college about 8 years ago.
I just got in on time.
Buying a new house these days is utter insanity .
Half of them are shoe boxes.
This sums it up nicely
In a country that is 4 percent urbanised, compared with 12 percent in France and 20 percent in Italy, a small number are making huge killings from the artificial supply restrictions on land for development.
Irish new house sizes are, at an average of 945 square feet (88 square meters), among the smallest in Europe.
The average size of new houses in Denmark is 1,475 square feet (137 meters). The majority of new houses built in France are detached.
While there is enough land rezoned for the equivalent of 5 years housing output, our sclerotic centrally controlled local government system, gives no incentive for local authorities to compete for an increasing population. In contrast, in decentralised Switzerland and Germany, real house prices have not increased since 1970.
More than 17 per cent of the private non-farm workforce are in construction. The total rises to 20 percent when jobs in services related to construction are added. The corresponding proportions for the UK and US are 7 per cent and 5.4 per cent respectively.
Emperors new clothes syndrome.

Uuuh Patsy

3 Bed Semi in Citywest; bought in 03 @ 285k. Moving to Oz early next year so I'm completely obsessed with the property market at the moment. Trying to maximise equity. So many balls to juggle. Watching Luas line, surrounding developments; McDowells big gob. Not sure to sell in Aug or wait until early next year...... Such problems

copacetic

Uuuh Patsy wrote:

3 Bed Semi in Citywest; bought in 03 @ 285k. Moving to Oz early next year so I'm completely obsessed with the property market at the moment. Trying to maximise equity. So many balls to juggle. Watching Luas line, surrounding developments; McDowells big gob. Not sure to sell in Aug or wait until early next year...... Such problems

yeah, looks like McDowell has guranteed that the property market will struggle even more this year with his new pronouncements on stamp duty. He could have single handedly turned a soft landing into a crash with his big gob in the last year..

tHE vAGGABOND

Despite the 'boom' years we have appalling infrastructure, policing, health care and education systems.

I'm sorry, but thats such complete reactionary bull****..

Our education system is one of the best in the world, at every level IMHO - and IMHO thats one of the reasons we have so many hi-tech computer and pharmacy companies, our well educated and flexible work force, at entry level and minimum wage level as well as further up the food chain..

While parts of our infrastructure may be busy or full, if you ventured beyond the M50 you will have seen the many millions spent at every corner of the country by-passing congestion points and improving old/bad roads. The rail network is not amazing, but its a damn sight better than 5 or 10 years ago IMHO.

Again our health care system is far from perfect, but there are far worse systems across Europe. I lived in the UK for many years, and I would rather be a private patient here than suffer at the hands of the NHS in the UK tbh

Calina

tHE vAGGABOND wrote:

I'm sorry, but thats such complete reactionary bull****..

Our education system is one of the best in the world, at every level IMHO - and IMHO thats one of the reasons we have so many hi-tech computer and pharmacy companies, our well educated and flexible work force, at entry level and minimum wage level as well as further up the food chain..

While parts of our infrastructure may be busy or full, if you ventured beyond the M50 you will have seen the many millions spent at every corner of the country by-passing congestion points and improving old/bad roads. The rail network is not amazing, but its a damn sight better than 5 or 10 years ago IMHO.

Again our health care system is far from perfect, but there are far worse systems across Europe. I lived in the UK for many years, and I would rather be a private patient here than suffer at the hands of the NHS in the UK tbh

I'm sorry, I'm not entirely sure I agree entirely with you.

Our education system is falling behind. We are incapable of funding schools correctly, our skills in maths and science are sliding, and our literacy counts are not in the top echelon. Additionally, not one of our universities is top flight on a world level. It may be your honest opinion that it's one of the best, but in truth, from a quality point of view it's standing still rather than moving forward. Our attitude to education is a bit tragic too - our young people aren't as attached to learning and getting by on it as they were 10 years ago - I guess 5% unemployment does that to you, in the same way as 17% unemployment has a slightly different effect.

As for our health system - well I've lived in France, Germany, Belgium, the UK and Ireland, and I'd prefer to be a public patient in France than a private patient anywhere else. It is unfair, incidentally, to compare private care in Ireland with public care in the UK, but even so...there's a lot we could do to improve things here.

As for infrastructure - I don't care how much money we've spent already, the truth is we still have a lot more to spend. If you compare our infrastructure to that of countries like Belgium and France, you'll know it's still in the slow lane, comparatively speaking. The fact that it's better than it used to be doesn't make it somehow good.

Gurgle

Housing situation:
Married, 31, 2 kids & 3rd on the way.
Bought a 3-bed in commuter-land 8 years ago at £107,000 (have never commuted btw, and no plans to do so) amid much yapping about how house prices couldn't continue to rise and were heading for a crash.

We looked briefly into trading up to a 4-bed house to accomodate the new arrival. Very quickly abandoned that plan and are now planning to extend.

We could trade up to a 4 bed for around €60k with what we would get for our house.
Then add €22.2k for stamp duty, €3k for the auctioneer to sell our house, €2k for solicitors and we would have spend €87k for a slightly bigger house with a second box bedroom, before we even started furnishing.

Screw that, the same €87k will build on a second living room, a conservatory/sun-room and 2 more bedrooms, and furnish the lot.

As for the property market - If the value of my house doubles again or drops by 50% it makes little difference to me. Interest rate rises so far aren't making much of an impact on my mortgage repayments either.

If the construction boom is over, we'll probably save a bit on building the extension.

tHE vAGGABOND wrote:

Our education system is one of the best in the world, at every level IMHO - and IMHO thats one of the reasons we have so many hi-tech computer and pharmacy companies, our well educated and flexible work force, at entry level and minimum wage level as well as further up the food chain.

Fully agree with this.
Our literacy rate is one of the highest in the world at 99% (linkey)
The only thing our economy is missing are a few home-grown international corporations.

Calina

Gurgle wrote:

Our literacy rate is one of the highest in the world at 99% (linkey)

Alternatively see this from the Oireachtas. PDF warning where our adult literacy rates leave something to be desired.

tHE vAGGABOND

Cailan - I'm not saying we are perfect. We have room to get better everywhere..

I think our transport infracture is 10 years behind where it should be, country wide, but I like the fact they are spending money on it, and making an effort to bring it up to speed.

Maybe I'm too nice or something, but to expect our schools and uni's to be the best in the world may be a bit unfair? We are, after all, a country of circa 4 million people - I'm sure some of the Uni's at the top of this list have literally hundreds of thousands of people on their books, and in turn rather more money to spend than our top uni's.

You will find maths and science rates are falling all over the western world. The UK govt are having a fit about it, and have some committee with top folks looking into why [*I will find link*] - It must be linked to the fact that kids have it quite easy these days, not like in our day ;P

I too have lived in a few places, and as an epilepsy suffer, have been inside a fair amount of them. The best hospitals I have been in are in the states, but then again, the worst I have been in are also in the states too! I'm happy they are not afraid to make hard choices here [re: childrends hospital - 10 years ago thats something that would have been dodged until after the election and then sidelined forever - I don't know *anything* about the in's and outs of the choice, so don't bring thread off course on this one subject. Im just making the point that we are finally making hard choices]

re: thread subject...

I have found somewhere I would like to make an offer on. I want to show it to my family, so to get a second set of opinions. But now of course the bloody agent has gone to ground and everyone in his office is too busy to show it to use for several days. If he is playing games, he can keep his apartment, I wonder if the owner knows he is basically refusing to sell it

Raskolnikov

Calina wrote:

Our education system is falling behind.

Falling behind? What are you on about? Classes sizes are falling on average, schools are getting more teachers and funding than ever, there is huge investment in third level education.

I was educated in primary school in a class of 34 with three different years in the same room. In secondry school, our class size was frequently 32+, we didn't even have computers or science labs.

Calina wrote:

our skills in maths and science are sliding, and our literacy counts are not in the top echelon.

Our skills in maths and science aren't "sliding", just because no one wants to do the subjects. As for literacy rates? There's always going to be a proportion of people in the country who are unable/can't be bothered to learn how to read. The important thing in a competitive economy is getting skilled graduates in key areas. According the the IDA, we have the best record in the world at getting people into tertiary education. Obviously, there is a degree of propaganda in that. My point still stands though. Education is always going to be tiered. Everyone in the country can't work in IT or making pharmaceuticals.

http://www.idaireland.com/home/index.aspx?id=97

Calina wrote:

Additionally, not one of our universities is top flight on a world level.

Top flight of what exactly?

Calina wrote:

Our attitude to education is a bit tragic too - our young people aren't as attached to learning and getting by on it as they were 10 years ago - I guess 5% unemployment does that to you, in the same way as 17% unemployment has a slightly different effect.

I agree with you on this though, maybe for a different reason than you though. Education is becoming devalued these days in an attempt to churn out more graduates.

iguana

daveym wrote:

yeah, looks like McDowell has guranteed that the property market will struggle even more this year with his new pronouncements on stamp duty. He could have single handedly turned a soft landing into a crash with his big gob in the last year..

What is he saying about stamp duty? I don't live in Ireland and strangely McDowell doesn't make it onto the news here much.

copacetic

iguana wrote:

What is he saying about stamp duty? I don't live in Ireland and strangely McDowell doesn't make it onto the news here much.

he is saying if the PDs get voted back they will abolish it for first time buyers and reduce it for everyone else (or close to that can't remember the exact wording). It would save a lot of money if this happened for a lot of people so any FTBs waiting to see what happens in the market are even more likely to wait to see who wins the election and if PD/FF get back in to wait until Dec to see if they actually do anything on stamp duty.

of course maybe it won't have much effect, surely most people will know that them being back in government is unlikely. If they do get back they usually don't follow through on their promises, and even if they do try to keep their promise FF won't agree anyway...

El Stuntman

daveym wrote:

he is saying if the PDs get voted back they will abolish it for first time buyers and reduce it for everyone else (or close to that can't remember the exact wording). It would save a lot of money if this happened for a lot of people so any FTBs waiting to see what happens in the market are even more likely to wait to see who wins the election and if PD/FF get back in to wait until Dec to see if they actually do anything on stamp duty.

of course maybe it won't have much effect, surely most people will know that them being back in government is unlikely. If they do get back they usually don't follow through on their promises, and even if they do try to keep their promise FF won't agree anyway...

anyone who places any credence in what any politician says between now and the election should be sent for a checkup from the neck up

it's called buying votes and they're all it

Labour last week, PDs this - who's next?

tHE vAGGABOND

anyone who places any credence in what any politician says between now and the election should be sent for a checkup from the neck up

Took the words out of my mouth [well my fingers]!

Remember folks, political parties promise what they think you want to hear, so you grow to like them, and maybe vote for them. Thats their job! We should all have a personal store of large pinches of salt!

Dont believe us, sunday indo [afaik - I had 4 papars on sunday] had a list of the main election promises of all the political parties going back to the mid 90's on Sunday, a massive percentage of them pie in the sky, never heard of again! [a single 38% tax rate anyone!]