Dell wants your opinion on Linux

aidan_walsh

http://www.dell.com/linuxsurvey

Home or Office?
Laptop or desktop?
Phone support or community-based?

Dell wants you to decide.

Blowfish

I have to say, that despite all of the whole debacle of the apparent change of tack with regards to Linux, that its great to see a them trying to support the Linux community - even if its ultimately for their own gain.

I think their biggest worry is support, but in reality most *nix users would prefer to google problems or ask on forums then go to Dell about them.

democrates

Nice one, filled it out earlier.

A note on the news page apologises for the server difficulties, obviously got slashdotted out of it.

This is a lot more encouraging than the last bit of cagey talk, time to give their site a once-over again, looking forward to a new laptop down the line.

leeroybrown

I was going to fill it in until I got to question (1) and found that I wasn't catered for.

Blowfish wrote:

I think their biggest worry is support, but in reality most *nix users would prefer to google problems or ask on forums then go to Dell about them.

I don't necessarily agree. While a decent percentage of those with Linux installs know how to use a search engine and form a useful question, there is a sizable percentage who would prefer to bicker about Dell support on a board or on their blog first.

humbert

I can't blame them for being worried. I could see them being inundated with "ms office wont install, my computer's broke" calls.

It's nice to see them offering an alternative to windows but it wouldn't influence me much as it's not difficult to install linux after purchase. While I'm all for introducing people to linux it's a brave move being the company they'll turn to for support.

Capt'n Midnight

Blowfish wrote:

I think their biggest worry is support, but in reality most *nix users would prefer to google problems or ask on forums then go to Dell about them.

5) For a tested & validated Linux install, what type of software support would you require?
Existing community support structures for Linux that already exist with Dell participating more

oscarBravo

The feckers could start by providing Linux drivers for their printers. It's a bloody nightmare getting them to work in even a basic way.

PhantomBeaker

If only there was an option to mention that it'd be a really good idea to have hardware that has support in linux. A friend of mine had a lot of trouble with a Creative Soundblaster that he got in his dell box. The soundcard was normally perfectly supported. In the end, he swapped out the same card with an "identical" one in a non-Dell box, which did work in linux. That worked fine.

On various sites, it was apparently a known issue that some hardware from Dell didn't play well with the linux drivers out there.

So Glad

I had sufficient trouble installing Linux on my Dell due to it's hardware being specifically tailored for XP, but I got there. Should be a Dell distribution for Linux though. Stop this Microsoft madness.

netman

they're just doing it because HP is offering linux. and they lost market share to HP already.

even an option to buy a dell without OS would be better than the gigs of bloatware they install on the machines.

oscarBravo

So Glad wrote:

I had sufficient trouble installing Linux on my Dell due to it's hardware being specifically tailored for XP, but I got there.

Heh. I decided last week to scratch install my Inspiron. I started with a teeny weeny XP partition for emergencies, although I haven't booted XP in nearly a year. When the installation was finished, the display had only a basic driver, and there were no drivers for the sound card, Ethernet card, wifi card or bluetooth.

Then I installed Ubuntu in the remaining disk space. From the start I had working Ethernet, wifi and bluetooth. When I get round to it, I'll download the Windows drivers, burn to CD and install them on the Windows partition.

I think I mentioned before my experience with my Vodafone 3G card. There's a huge amount of bloatware that needs to be installed before it can be used at all under Windows. I plugged it into my Ubuntu laptop. Watching the log, it basically said: PC card... USB hub on the card... three devices attached to the USB hub... Vodafone data card... OK, you can use it now. No driver installations, no downloads, nada. I set up a basic ppp configuration, typed "pon", and I was surfing.

I had to use Windows most of the day yesterday. God, it's painful.

BrenC

Dell will really have to be on top of the support because Linux is harder to configure in general.

philologos

but when it is configured it works impeccably, no matter what circumstances you are using it for. Home, office or server.

Cake Fiend

BrenC wrote:

Dell will really have to be on top of the support because Linux is harder to configure in general.

Which is why they'll presumably be offering it pre-configured.

PhantomBeaker wrote:

If only there was an option to mention that it'd be a really good idea to have hardware that has support in linux

I'm sure they're already considering this. It could be a big win for the linux community - if Dell start specifically choosing hardware with regard to compatibility with Linux, then hopefully this will encourage manufacturers to get off their holes in terms of linux drivers for their hardware.

Cormic

Have to agree here. I run Ubuntu on my Dell Optiplex in work and it runs like a dream. However the Optiplex is a business machine with pretty basic sound and video. It also works great on my older Latitude D600 notebook.

A Dimension home PC may be a different kettle of fish.

Blowfish

Cormic wrote:

A Dimension home PC may be a different kettle of fish.

Actually the Dimension that i'm using at the minute had absolutely no problems. I did make sure however that the gfx was nVidia before getting it.

So Glad

I don't know. I'm having way to many problems with Linux at the moment. Like for example, I cannot install anything at the moment (Permission needed :S), CDs don't seem to play although web videos have sound. I'm sure I'll fix 'em some how. All that aside, the only singular reason I would want to use Windows is for gaming, but now I've dicovered Wine & such so, thats pretty much covered :P

ethernet

It would be great if they'd let you choose a dual boot [two Linux distros or maybe Windows and Linux]. When you're customising your build, if you were offered some down-down lists and fields for choosing distro/distros and partition size, that would be a top service.

Right now, I'd settle for hardware that works fully under Linux and OS-less Dell machines.

Cake Fiend

So Glad wrote:

I don't know. I'm having way to many problems with Linux at the moment.

This is to do with lack of knowledge of the distro you're using, not linux itself. If you don't like the one you're using, try another - there are several distros that are geared around things like multimedia, gaming, security, etc etc. You could even dual-boot a couple (sharing a /home partition) to get to know more about them.

democrates

oscarBravo: How many peole would know to type pon? It's easy when you know how, but things like that make me hold off persuading family members from making the switch just yet, I'd have to support them is the bottom line and I don't have that much time.

What I have done for now is warn them off vista, point them at http://www.osalt.com/ and mailed them screenshots of openoffice, the gimp, avidemux, firefox, thunderbird etc which they can try for free on xp and see that they can move away from proprietary apps easily, convert files over to odf and other open standards. Once they're comfortable that they can work away as normal it's a much smaller switch at a later stage to say kubuntu and to get codecs for mp3 etc.

I'm waiting for one of them to mention aero so I can respond, not that I've any use for cpu-sapping eye-candy but for those who are impressed it's nice to have an answer, and for good measure throw these people the top 500 supercomputer stats by os family to spice their conversations with the wow factor they so enjoy, all of this helps to build the brand as it were.

ethernet: Dual-boot or no os would be great, virtualisation would be good too, but the Vista home versions EULA explicitly forbid running on a virtualisation engine, ostensibly because it opens a new surface to attack vectors but from their ever growing charge sheet it's just a typical ploy to frustrate that market from getting into Linux. I know, this in the face of ms oncecare being the sole failure once again in independant antivirus tests, unsuspecting customers would never guess from the ms blurb that onecare is stuck in the corner with a dunces hat.

cake friend: Exactly, hardware suppliers must already realise that the desktop linux market is maturing to a point where ordinary users are beginning to try it out. Up to now it's mostly been distro of choice on hardware of choice, but dell will create a few target platforms to get ready for volume shipping, with this focus remaining wrinkles should be ironed out fast. Hardware manfr's who fail to supply a growing market will face the wrath of Wall St., if Michael follows through that is and it looks promising right now.

oscarBravo

democrates wrote:

oscarBravo: How many peole would know to type pon?

Anybody who had ever configured any kind of dial-up connection on a Linux machine. They'd either know the command-line tools (as I do), or know how to use a graphical interface.

Don't get me wrong: my point (in this thread) isn't that Linux is easier to use for all people in all circumstances; merely that it's much more convenient for me in many ways. The same 3G card is a case in point: I had to use it yesterday in a Linux laptop I hadn't used it in before. I didn't have a Vodafone driver disk, but that was OK: I plugged it in, configured the dial-up settings from memory, and I was online in minutes. The last time I used the card in a Windows laptop I had to download the drivers (40-50M, or something daft like that), install all the bloaty crap that came with them, and then try to clean it all up afterwards so it wouldn't be in the way for the guy who owned the laptop.

democrates wrote:

It's easy when you know how, but things like that make me hold off persuading family members from making the switch just yet, I'd have to support them is the bottom line and I don't have that much time.

I find it easier to support Linux than Windows as a rule, for two reasons: one, it tends not to do the unspeakably stupid things to users that Windows does, and two, I can ssh into them if they're online.

democrates

Fair play, similar experience here with ndiswrapper for the wlan card driver, like you I'll dig around online and solve the problem. My aunt Mary sure wouldn't though, that's the target market to crack and we're home and dry.

We're damn close at this stage and I think the dell move can close the gap fast.

scojones

I think Dell are only considering this as an option because they had a bad year. For the average home user I do not think using Linux would be a good idea for both them and Dell. It's hard enough getting them to figure out how to use windows.

Steveire

I think there are two major issues: Drivers and crapware.

Dell can't be distributing drivers that 'kinda work' with the hardware. They'd have to distribute fully working drivers, probably as binaries. Maybe they'd find a way to build them in to the DellLinux or whatever, so that clearing it off and putting Ubuntu/Gentoo whatever you want on it would still present the same problems.

Dell seem to make money by agreeing to distribute 30day free trials of things like McAfee and highly recommending users keep subscribing. They'd probably need to cut similar deals for any linux OS they put on their systems.

I'm not sure if that's possible though, and if not they'll probably not do it. Windows is a very strong brand, and that's worth a lot of money.

Cake Fiend

Steveire wrote:

Windows is a very strong brand, and that's worth a lot of money.

Not only that, but you can be guaranteed that MS are going to open the book of dirty tricks at page 1 and go all the way through, with regard to doing anything they can to convince Dell to either knock this linux tomfoolery on the head altogether, or at least heavily recommend Windows systems over their linux counterparts.

Blowfish

Cake Fiend wrote:

Not only that, but you can be guaranteed that MS are going to open the book of dirty tricks at page 1 and go all the way through, with regard to doing anything they can to convince Dell to either knock this linux tomfoolery on the head altogether, or at least heavily recommend Windows systems over their linux counterparts.

Well they haven't done anything so far about the n-series that dell have available in the states, despite them being OS free, and available with linux.

Obviously having it available for home users is a completely different story though.