Stan - More Ballboys..

Trotter

I just read in the Sunday Indo that Stan said the Welsh team had tried to slow our play down.

His solution...

We're gonna look into getting more ballboys.

I told this little nugget to my girlfriend who usually vomits at the sight of a soccer match and her reaction was that of any sane human being..

F**k*n Muppet.

I think she should have the job.

whiskeyman

Trotter wrote:

We're gonna look into getting more ballboys

THe little fellas would probably do a better job on the pitch than the current 11 he's picking...

Trotter

Right so lets agree that this guy should not be in the job.

WHY is it that he is? Is it John Delaney panicing because he has no Plan B? Is it because the FAI are shrugging their shoulders and saying behind closed doors that they hope it'll all fix itself?

The guy should have been sacked, but Im just curious as to the reasons behind him keeping his job. Is he seriously pally with the main guys in the FAI?

Dr Galen

no plan B plus no one with any proven class wnated the job i'd say

~Rebel~

id have taken Kevin Moran over Stan in a second, at least he could actually motivate the players to perform, and probably wouldn't do the ridiculously silly tactical things Stan does we can all recognize as being bad decisions straight away. think hed get a bit more respect from the players too

Zebra3

~Rebel~ wrote:

id have taken Kevin Moran over Stan in a second, at least he could actually motivate the players to perform, and probably wouldn't do the ridiculously silly tactical things Stan does we can all recognize as being bad decisions straight away. think hed get a bit more respect from the players too

On what basis do you make those comments?

Savman

Oh for crying out loud. PR training is available at any decent college so there's no excuses for Stan. Christ.

Dr. Nick

In fairness to the much-maligned Stan, multi-ball is a decent tactic in the correct circumstances.
What makes it ridiculous is that the team aren't allowed to play by their manager, meaning muti-ball is irrelevent.

Rollo Tamasi

Zebra3 wrote:

On what basis do you make those comments?

based on the charisma he displays whenever he speaks about his country and also based on his sucsessful businesses. You need a certain bit of man - management to build up a empire. I'd take Moran any day over Stan. Moran would work very well actually....

KdjaCL

Rollo Tamasi wrote:

based on the charisma he displays whenever he speaks about his country and also based on his sucsessful businesses. You need a certain bit of man - management to build up a empire. I'd take Moran any day over Stan. Moran would work very well actually....

So why isnt Moran a football manager?


kdjac

Bateman

KdjaCL wrote:

So why isnt Moran a football manager?


kdjac

Was about to ask the same thing...

Rollo Tamasi

KdjaCL wrote:

So why isnt Moran a football manager?


kdjac

dunno, maybe he is making too much from his companies to be properly bothered? I think he would make a good international manager. He reminds me a bit of Mark Hughes for some reason.

BKtje

So you would replce one unproven (well proven to be bad at this stage) with another unproven?

We need a proven, experienced manager at the helm, not some wannabe's.

cson

B-K-DzR wrote:

We need a proven, experienced manager at the helm, not some wannabe's.

Seems to me that the FAI just can't afford a top quality replacement. I think Stan is on €500K a year.

BaZmO*

Rollo Tamasi wrote:

dunno, maybe he is making too much from his companies to be properly bothered?

So you want to replace the current "Manager" (and I use that term lightly) with someone that's not bothered?

Bateman

cson wrote:

Seems to me that the FAI just can't afford a top quality replacement. I think Stan is on €500K a year.

I don't think the manager would have to be "top quality". Some experience as a football manager would be a start though, preferably some experience as an international football manager.

Anyway, I hate it when people bang on with the question "so who would you replace him with". If you identify the manager as being a major part of the problem, then you take steps to remove that problem.

_blank_

Who, in their right mind, would want to work for the FAI?

It's not a money issue, it's getting someone mad enough.

They went the stupid option, it hasn't worked.

el rabitos

international management in itself, bar a handfull of positions isnt exactly the most attractive position to many managers, i'd imagine. the top leagues and the champions league are where the top managers want to be. theres a certain amount of pride to be taken in managing your/a country and thats always been the main selling point of the job imo. i think jose mourinho said it best when he said international management is for old men, a place for managers to wind down their careers.

the irish managers job in itself has never been the most attractive post in the world. not to the "top" managers around anyway, and why would it be? a relatively shallow talent pool and its not exactly a glamorous job in comparison to the english job.

it takes a certain kind of man to want the irish job, its a different pressure than the english job, and rewarding in a different way. and obviously money would have to be low on any potential managers list of requirements if he wanted the job.

i dont think the fai had many options at their disposel when they picked out stan, personally during his playing years i never tipped him to ever be a manager. some players you just dont ever see being a manager.

aldridge would have been the best of a limited bunch to give the job to, and o'leary would have been ideal considering the calibre of the other candidates imo.

i'm sure stan has the tactical knowledge, he's played under some good managers and for 2 big clubs for a long time and i'm sure in his own head knows what he wants, but i dont think he's got the skills to execute what he wants and to get it out of the team. always with the irish team its been spirit and heart more than the greatest tactics thats saw us do well, and right now it just seems like the spirit and heart is gone and all thats left is the tactics...and, they suck. pretty bad.

just my 2c

~Rebel~

B-K-DzR wrote:

So you would replce one unproven (well proven to be bad at this stage) with another unproven?

In my initial comment i actually meant when they were interviewing for the job in the first place. Moran has wanted the job for years. I would obviously prefer a proven quality manager, but if we had to take an unproven one, i would prefer it to be a charismatic motivator who has experienced success in each of his sports and at anything else in life he's put his hand to.

I would actually still take him now as a replacement for stan on a temporary basis while we looked for a quality manager and who knows, if he proved decent we could stick with him.

You can tell as soon as stan opens his mouth he's not gonna motivate anyone and thats been the most important factor of every successful irish team, giving 110% every time for the cause. If the manager doesnt have the tactical nous then he'd damn well better have another trick up his sleave to get his team performing in the week or so they have together, and so far Stan doesnt seem to have anything going for him.

redspider

el rabitos wrote:

i dont think the fai had many options at their disposel when they picked out stan, personally during his playing years i never tipped him to ever be a manager. some players you just dont ever see being a manager.

aldridge would have been the best of a limited bunch to give the job to, and o'leary would have been ideal considering the calibre of the other candidates imo.

i'm sure stan has the tactical knowledge, he's played under some good managers and for 2 big clubs for a long time and i'm sure in his own head knows what he wants, but i dont think he's got the skills to execute what he wants and to get it out of the team. always with the irish team its been spirit and heart more than the greatest tactics thats saw us do well, and right now it just seems like the spirit and heart is gone and all thats left is the tactics...and, they suck. pretty bad.

I agree with most of your post. Staunton may, in time, become a good manager, but the problem is that he has insufficient experience at club level now to apply it to the international stage. Experience in this sense means converting playing tactical knkowledge and motivation, man-management,m etc to the field.

And Ireland cant afford the time for him to learn, or at least he has to learn very rapidly. Aldo would have been a better choice perhaps, although he also lacks credentials of managing a top team. O'Leary definitely could do it, but may not want it yet as he obviously wants a job back in England.

But if we look historically at the types of managers we have had, they have never been the top of the profession. Giles was still learning his trade as a manager (he started player manager) and in the long-run he didnt last at it. McCarthy also came with no top level experience. Kerr likewise and Staunton now. Charlton wasnt a brilliant manager but he was able to create a style that proved effective if not so creative.

This may be Staunton's one and only campaign though, if things get worse.

Redspider

PHB

I would have picked a better unproven manager than Staunton. There are plenty of managers who have shown they can cut it at a higher level than Staunton. What about Paul Ince? He'd probably take the job and has shown himself to be a lot more successful. Ultimately, the FAI don't even consider these things, it's all about keeping their jobs if you ask me.

Zebra3

Wasn't McCarthy about just as unproven as Staunton? :rolleyes:

Vokes

MCarthy had 4 years of management behind him - Staunton has only been a reserve team coach or something

Sizzler

Have been speaking to punters who were unfortunate enough to be at the game on saturday and they were saying a lot of people left at half time and even more sloped off into the second half ! The general mutterings from the cusack were "wish we had lost" !

Any chance of a few banners on weds night saying how people really feel ...

TwoShedsJackson

Sizzler wrote:

Have been speaking to punters who were unfortunate enough to be at the game on saturday and they were saying a lot of people left at half time and even more sloped off into the second half ! The general mutterings from the cusack were "wish we had lost" !

Any chance of a few banners on weds night saying how people really feel ...

Well that's muppetry anyway - if you go to the game you should bloody well stay to the end and support the team. Leaving at half time or partway into the second half when we were winning is daft, that'll be the 'ole ole' crowd, as Pat Spillane would no doubt say

Sizzler

TwoShedsJackson wrote:

Well that's muppetry anyway - if you go to the game you should bloody well stay to the end and support the team. Leaving at half time or partway into the second half when we were winning is daft, that'll be the 'ole ole' crowd, as Pat Spillane would no doubt say

The olé olé crowd lol ! You mean the clowns that shout that at any given opportunity....take your pick !

1) A concert
2) GAA Game
3) Copper Face Jacks
4) All of the above

Cringe

_blank_

It's goonery of the highest order.

Olé Olé, leprechaun outfits, inflatable shamrocks, bananas in jersies, Mexican Waves, jester hats.

Although in fairness, watching that team at the moment is like going to the circus.

Zebra3

SofaKing wrote:

MCarthy had 4 years of management behind him -

And in those four years he achieved what? He left Millwall in February and they went down three months later.

How could anyone have said that with four years experience managing Millwall he'd guide Ireland to the last 16 of the WC knocking out a very strong Dutch side in the qualifiers?

~Rebel~

well your comment was that they're equally unproven. Obviously having actually managed a team for 4 years, even if not with much success, is better then having no experience whatsoever, so they're not equally unproven.

Staunton im sure given 4 years of regular week in week out management would be a vast improvement over where he is now. regardless how bad you are you're gonna pick up something!

astrofool

He left Millwall top of the league if I remember correctly.

TwoShedsJackson

astrofool wrote:

He left Millwall top of the league if I remember correctly.

They were relegated the season he left so I don't think you do remember correctly. Can't find what position they were in when he left and Jimmy Nicholl took over.

astrofool

Yes, I know they were relegated, but I think they were top of the league when he left, someone here will be able to confirm either way (or put together the table from that time based on results )

event

TwoShedsJackson wrote:

They were relegated the season he left so I don't think you do remember correctly. Can't find what position they were in when he left and Jimmy Nicholl took over.

Jimmy Nicholl of Raith Rovers was appointed as McCarthy's replacement, but could not address the slump in form which saw Millwall relegated at the end of the season in 22nd place. Just five months before this they had been top of Division One pushing for a place in the Premiership

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millwall_F.C.#Another_slump

Zebra3

Yeah, they were top at one stage, but on a serious bad run of results by the time he left them for the Ireland job.

Chucky the tree

But he still wasnt as unrproven as stan.

Andrew 83

Didn't Milwall do pretty well during Mick's time then collapse when he left?

PHB

In all fairness, the mexican wave was possibly the most enjoyable thing in the entire match, and the group who started it seemed to be the most hardcore supporters.

Darando

TwoShedsJackson wrote:

Well that's muppetry anyway - if you go to the game you should bloody well stay to the end and support the team. Leaving at half time or partway into the second half when we were winning is daft, that'll be the 'ole ole' crowd, as Pat Spillane would no doubt say

If you pay for the ticket then you can do what you want! I think if anyone left it wasnt for the usual beat the traffic excuse but because we were completely rubbish.

Its not like we have a squad of loads of talented players - but when the talent is on the bench - Hunt (2 bookings and free kicks and he was only on a short while), Doyle, McGeady. and then replace Douglas.

How hard can it be really. It would be different if we were rubbish and had out the best team, then not Stans falut really, but not to play the best team, cmon.

Given
Finnan, Dunne, McShane, Harte
Duff, Carsley, Ireland, McGeady
Doyle, Keane


Ok, so left back might be tricky (Harte) , but outside that there arent too many hard decisions. Centre midfield could also be someone that can pass a ball + Carsley.

~Rebel~

Darando wrote:

How hard can it be really. It would be different if we were rubbish and had out the best team, then not Stans falut really, but not to play the best team, cmon.

Given
Harte, Dunne, McShane, Finnan
Duff, Carsley, Ireland, McGeady
Doyle, Keane

Ummm I dont get the logic of Harte at right back and Finnan at Left back, seems just as strange as what he did with Finnan and O shea..

Otherwise, thats the team i would have put out against Wales myself anyway (with harte and finnan on their correct sides), and with Duff and McGeady having freedom to swap sides on occasion. Against Slovakia i'd be more wary of the attacking threat against Harte, so would probably revert to J'O'S, but give him a serious bollicking and make it damn clear if he didnt put in an effort he would no longer be an automatic starter untill he proved himself again.

Darando

~Rebel~ wrote:

Ummm I dont get the logic of Harte at right back and Finnan at Left back, seems just as strange as what he did with Finnan and O shea..

sorry should be the other way around!! was list them as i see them!!

edited!

Kingp35

PHB wrote:

and the group who started it seemed to be the most hardcore supporters.

I agree with this. It was the lads in the corner at the Canal end that were starting the Waves and they were the fans that were making most of the noise. Still though im not a big fan of Mexican waves or the ole ole crowd although I wont go as far to say that I dont like them wearing Leprechaun suits and inflatable shamrocks etc because it brings a bit of colour to the crowd. If your an Irish player and you walk to a sea of green or you walk out to lads wearing jackets I think I know what I would prefer.

BaZmO*

Kingp35 wrote:

I agree with this. It was the lads in the corner at the Canal end that were starting the Waves and they were the fans that were making most of the noise. Still though im not a big fan of Mexican waves or the ole ole crowd although I wont go as far to say that I dont like them wearing Leprechaun suits and inflatable shamrocks etc because it brings a bit of colour to the crowd. If your an Irish player and you walk to a sea of green or you walk out to lads wearing jackets I think I know what I would prefer.

Yeah, I think it's BS people complaining about Mexican Waves and dressing up. It's the same people that complain about the prawn sandwich brigade. You can't have it both ways.

I was in the lower canal end section and everyone there was trying their best to create an atmosphere but it's hard when the players on the pitch don't respond. It's like trying to start a sing song in Masseys.

The_B_Man

ye plus we dont really have any good chants, just the *clap* *clap* *clap* *clap* *clap* *clap* *clap* *clap* *clap* IRELAND! and ole! ole! ole! ole! i felt like a spa shoutin out by meself and *clap* *clappin*! even herself was shoutin! after the goal, there crowd slightly livened up.

_blank_

BaZmO* wrote:

Yeah, I think it's BS people complaining about Mexican Waves and dressing up. It's the same people that complain about the prawn sandwich brigade. You can't have it both ways.

Yes you can.

Wear a scarf, or maybe even a jersey, although I'm no fan of wearing a jersey with the eircom logo plastered all over it, and the Umbro crest aswell, when I know that not even a small amount of the money the FAI gets from the sale will go to anything resembling helping the sport in this country.

I wear my Shels jersey to Shels matches. Just on the point of that, I have no problem wearing that, the sponsors directly put money into the club. I sing my heart out too. I also shout abuse at the ref, Shels players, opposing players and fans.

I don't wear red jester hats, bring red inflatable hammers or spray my hair red (:eek: ). I don't start Mexican waves, in fact I've never seen one at a LoI game (probably not enough fans:) ).

_blank_

The_B_Man wrote:

ye plus we dont really have any good chants, just the *clap* *clap* *clap* *clap* *clap* *clap* *clap* *clap* *clap* IRELAND! and ole! ole! ole! ole! i felt like a spa shoutin out by meself and *clap* *clappin*! even herself was shoutin! after the goal, there crowd slightly livened up.

No international team has 'good chants'.

The fans aren't together long enough.

joe316

seansouth wrote:

No international team has 'good chants'.

The fans aren't together long enough.

exactly, i dont get this giving out about the songs that are sung at ireland games, what do people suggest? i am not going to be pedantic and say that do you suggest we sit and sing/say nothing because that what its seems to me, but nobody has suggested that we do anything different. whatever little atmosphere ole or mexican waves adds they are still better than nothing.

although i do have faith that an evening match will have a better atmosphere, always has been the way in lansdowne.

one thing i did note on saturday was that there were a lot of children at the match, and before anyone gives out im not for one second saying that they shouldnt be there (but their young eyes shouldnt be tainted by that rubbish on the pitch) but they are not likely to sing.

_blank_

'Come on you boys in Green' hardly got an airing on Saturday.

Ire-land clap-clap-clap, sure I do that one myself at Shels games.

clap-clap......clap-clap-clap......clap-clap-clap-clap IRELAND, ditto.

The Fields without the ra undertones would be nice.

Amhrán na bhFiann during the match, a lá France?

Ireland, Ireland, Ireland.

Any Rangers players in the Slovak set-up at all, you can't beat a few boos for them lads :rolleyes:

joe316

yeah i was very disappointed that couldnt get a redinition of fields going, the one that was sung during the england rugby match sent shivers down my spine and i was watching it on tv, pity it wasnt matched last saturday

gucci

what irks me is when you want to actually watch the match and fellas are pegging abuse at you "will you sing!!" etc etc. this isn't just common in league of ireland but i attended a few serie a games in the past and its the same there!!

_blank_

You see gucci, that depends on the area of the ground you choose to go to.

Different parts of grounds are considered to be the traditional singing sections, the hardcore support. The Kop, The Stretford End, Hill 16 for the Dublin Gah team, the New Stand in Tolka

You go there, you'll be expected to at least try to join in with the chants.

If you don't want to sing, I'd suggest you try for tickets in a different part of the ground. IMO, if you go to the singing section, you are obliged to sing. That what supporting a team is about, especially in thses parts of the grounds. I assume it goes back to the tribal days.

What grates me is, and this has ONLY happened to me at Ireland games, when I get up to try start a chant, or encourage a player, I get told to sit down and shut up :rolleyes: by a prawn sandwicher.

The_B_Man

seansouth wrote:

What grates me is, and this has ONLY happened to me at Ireland games, when I get up to try start a chant, or encourage a player, I get told to sit down and shut up :rolleyes: by a prawn sandwicher.

Wha?!?! Dublin Port is down the road....ya shoulda told him to get the boat!

I actually did think it was too quiet on saturday! i also felt that Croke Park was too big! Landsdowne surrounds the pitch better with less open space than Croker so ya feel more involved, and more inclined to sing.