Best Team Looking towards September...

GuanYin

So we've given ourselves a very slim chance at qualification.

We'll need to finish undefeated imho and would want at least 4 points out of the Czech and German games.

It still strikes me that Staunton doesn't know his best 11, or indeed his best squad.

So what do people think? Whats our best 11 and who are the players coming through that will be important to us?

My first team would be:

---

Given

---

Finnan--McShane--Dunne--O'Shea

---S.Reid---Ireland---Carsley

---

---

Duff

---

Keane----Doyle

---

with the following players in order of importance in the squad

12. Colin Doyle
13. Andy Reid
14. Liam Miller
15. Stephen Hunt
16. David Connolly
17. Darren O'Dea
18. Steve Carr
19. Ian Harte
20. Anthony Stokes
21. Kevin Kilbane
22. Shane Long
23. Wayne Henderson

eirebhoy

Have this posted on another forum...

---

Given

---

Finnan---Dunne---McShane---OShea

---

Carsley

---

---

A.Reid

---

S.Reid

---

----Keane

---

Duff----

---

Doyle

---

The back 5 picks itself I think.

atm there's no competition with Carsley for the holding role.

Steven Reid replaces Kilbane in tonights team. He's an excellent box to box player when given a run of games. Played very well against Sweden in Stans first match.

Andy Reid replaces Ireland. I have to say, Ireland impressed me tonight. One turn when McGeady passed it to him was excellent. He was full of confidence and did well. I just think Reid is the better player at the moment and has much more of an influence on games. When he plays the play goes through him and he has a fantastic football brain to link up play.

Keane would be taking McGeady's place from tonight. I think Keane would excel here. He basically plays there anyway for us but it'd be taking the pressure of his shoulders to score. He'd be playing with his head to goal rather than his back to goal and more likely to actually get a few shots off.

Duff obviously picks himself while Doyle was top class tonight as the lone striker.

Vokes

Can't argue with that lineup, eirebhoy.

No recognized right-winger at the moment - McGeady seems to be still finding his feet at international level - so best have Keane / Duff floating around a point man (Doyle).

Centre midfield doesn't look half bad when the 2 Reids are back and fit.

GuanYin

As a Forest fan and someone who formerly thought Andy Reid was God, I just think he's about as good as he's going to get.

It's true his passing and vision are the best in the squad, but for me at premiership and international level he doesn't get involved enough, he's easily taken out of a game and defensively he's always been suspect.

I think he's there for certain games - but overall, I think Ireland adds more to the team and has the potential to go on and become a far far better player.

Thats why he shades it. But yeah, its between him and Ireland for the creative position.

I also wouldn't trust Keane in that position - dropping backto midfield or playing behind the front two, yes - but he gives the ball away too much to play where you have him there.

Limerick Dude

eirebhoy wrote:

Have this posted on another forum...

---

Given

---

Finnan---Dunne---McShane---OShea

---

Carsley

---

---

A.Reid

---

S.Reid

---

----Keane

---

Duff----

---

Doyle

---

The back 5 picks itself I think.

atm there's no competition with Carsley for the holding role.

Steven Reid replaces Kilbane in tonights team. He's an excellent box to box player when given a run of games. Played very well against Sweden in Stans first match.

Andy Reid replaces Ireland. I have to say, Ireland impressed me tonight. One turn when McGeady passed it to him was excellent. He was full of confidence and did well. I just think Reid is the better player at the moment and has much more of an influence on games. When he plays the play goes through him and he has a fantastic football brain to link up play.

Keane would be taking McGeady's place from tonight. I think Keane would excel here. He basically plays there anyway for us but it'd be taking the pressure of his shoulders to score. He'd be playing with his head to goal rather than his back to goal and more likely to actually get a few shots off.

Duff obviously picks himself while Doyle was top class tonight as the lone striker.

Id agree very much with that team except i would replace andy reid with Ireland, everything else seems good.

edit : woops i forgot, i would rather have ian harte at left back than johno!

eirebhoy

psi wrote:

As a Forest fan and someone who formerly thought Andy Reid was God, I just think he's about as good as he's going to get.

It's true his passing and vision are the best in the squad, but for me at premiership and international level he doesn't get involved enough, he's easily taken out of a game and defensively he's always been suspect.

I think he's there for certain games - but overall, I think Ireland adds more to the team and has the potential to go on and become a far far better player.

Thats why he shades it. But yeah, its between him and Ireland for the creative position.

Defensively Reid is just as good as Ireland imo. Since is time at Spurs his tracking back has come on leaps and bounds. I thought he was excellent against the Czechs and controlled the game against San Marino. He just has more influence on a game than Ireland. Ireland is great for the creative passes but Reid is the type of player that you give the ball to and he'll do the right thing. He was Charlton's best player in the few months he wasn't injured. I really like him, I like any player with a good football brain tbh.

leninbenjamin

eirebhoy wrote:

---

Given

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Finnan---Dunne---McShane---OShea

---

Carsley

---

---

A.Reid

---

S.Reid

---

----Keane

---

Duff----

---

Doyle

---

i was just going to say something along those lines myself. i think a 4-3-3 is best alright. it would allow Keane the freedom that he needs while keeping a bit of width to the side.

At the moment i'd play Ireland ahead of A.Reid like psi suggests, but if Andy could get a good run of form going next season then i can see a welcome dilemma.

GuanYin

Actually if Stephen Reid, Andy Reid, Stephen Hunt, Stephen Ireland (alot of Stephen's!!! :eek:), Aiden McGeady and Liam Miller can all gain/continue good form then I think our midfield prospects are looking good.

It gives you a pool of A. Reid, S. Reid, Hunt, Duff, McGeady, Ireland, Miller and Carsley to pick a midfield from.

Up front isn't too shabby either - Doyle, Keane, Stokes and Connolly are all players in form this season and Long, Elliott and Morrisson are also back up options.

Our back four is very good but our problem there is lack of strength in depth.

If we lose any of those players we're severely weakened. O'Dea looks very good but is untried in the team (and at this level) - For the first time in a long time we're weak at the full back positions - although Derek Geary has played well for Sheffield United and I wonder why he hasn't got a look in.

At the moment Given is irreplacable - but I wonder is Colin Doyle up to the task?

All in all, the future could be alot darker.

eirebhoy

leninbenjamin wrote:

At the moment i'd play Ireland ahead of A.Reid like psi suggests, but if Andy could get a good run of form going next season then i can see a welcome dilemma.

I just think Reid would give us that bit more possession. He'll always be there to receive a pass in an advanced position and would put it to good use. We could see tonight that Carsley and Kilbane were doing their defensive duties and there was nobody available to give the ball to. It was hoofed up the field and straight back down.

PHB

Based on the last two matches, our best midfielders are Hunt, Duff, and Ireland.

Personally I'd go for a 4-4-2, as I prefer the formation, with

Finnan-Dunne-McShane-O'Shea

-Duff--Ireland--S.Reid--Hunt

---

Doyle---Keane

---

I'd favour Ireland over A. Reid in any midfield role bar the front of a 3 man midfield

Andrew 83

It will need some practice together in the friendlies no matter what the players but rihgt now my view would be:

Given

Finnan ---- Dunne ---- McShane ---- Harte

Duff/McGeady ---- S. Reid ---- A.Reid/Ireland ---- Hunt

Keane ---- Doyle

WhiteWashMan

i have no problem with most of the teams picked on ere, but do some people not realise that my dog, which only has 3 legs incidentally, can play better football these days than ian harte?
seriously, id rather have staunton stick on an ol jersey at left back.

PHB

Some people just don't rate O'Shea. I think last night though was possibly his best performance in an Irish jersey, he was very good

Nalz

I agree, great side Eirebhoy.

---

Given

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Finnan---Dunne---McShane---OShea

---

Carsley

---

---

A.Reid

---

S.Reid

---

----Keane

---

Duff----

---

Doyle

---

From this remaining lot its tough to pick a decent subs bench (my selections in bold):

Wayne Henderson
Nicky Colgan
Paddy Kenny

Paddy McCarthy
Darren O'Dea
Steve Carr
Ian Harte
Andy O Brien
Stephen Kelly


Stephen Ireland
Liam Miller
Stephen Hunt
Kevin Kilbane
Alan Quinn
Stephen Quinn
Jon Douglas
Aidan McGeedy


Anthony Stokes
Shane Long
David Connolly
Caleb Folan
Clinton Morrison
Alan Lee

leninbenjamin

PHB wrote:

Some people just don't rate O'Shea. I think last night though was possibly his best performance in an Irish jersey, he was very good

yeah, he showed us last night what he can do, and most people accept that he has some very good displays in him, the problem with O'Shea is not his ability, more his mentality and inconsistency. There was an urgency about him last night, that wasn't present in most of his other performances in the green jersey. If he can play like that again in the next few games i'll shut up about him, but he has to prove he can continue to put in these types of performances.

Nalz

O Shea was fantastic last night, but he did no worse or no better then the other back 4. Great display by Given and co at the back

The_B_Man

Why is everyone goin on about Connolly? Since Keane decided to randomly mention his name as a squad candidate, everyone has been jumpin on it and agreein! the fella is crap for Ireland! Does nobody remember this? his form this season is irrelevant.

eirebhoy

He's crap beside Keane. Far from crap without Keane. In fact he was man of the match the last time he played beside someone else.

BaZmO*

PHB wrote:

Based on the last two matches, our best midfielders are Hunt, Duff, and Ireland.

While Captain Caveman did fantastic when he came on as a sub for the last 2 games, at the moment I think he is just a great impact sub. Dunno if I'd have him on from the start though.

As for JOSH, I think he had a great game last night. He got stuck in and his concentration levels were high. I think it might have been a master stroke by Stan to switch him with Finnan. I'm guessing that Stan thought that because the 2 of them are rightfooters and with Finnan being the better player it'd make sense putting JOSH on the right to boost his confindence and so far it seems to have worked.

Chardee MacDennis

Limerick Dude wrote:

Id agree very much with that team except i would replace andy reid with Ireland, everything else seems good.

edit : woops i forgot, i would rather have ian harte at left back than johno!

i'd agree with those two admendments. bench being:

Henderson
O'Shea
Long
Hunt
A. Reid
O' Dea
Connolly

LuckyLloyd

I would just like to say that this thread seems a little pointless tbh. By the time we get to the qualification games in September, a summer break will have come and gone in club football. The form of players will probably be quite different at that stage - injuries, transfers etc will play a part in how relevant players are for selection. Plus, the friendly games may produce a difference in thought. Too early to have this conversation.

WhiteWashMan

what should people base their opinions on so?

luckylucky

Could we get Stan on some fast track super dooper course in how to be a football manager for the next few months, if there's nothing available maybe a FAS(if it's still called that these days) course would do

jesus_thats_gre

Personally:

---

Given

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Finnan---Dunne---McShane---OShea

---

S.Reid

---

---

A.Reid

---

Duff

---

----McGeady

---

Hunt----

---

Doyle

---

or when appropriate:

---

Given

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Finnan---Dunne---McShane---OShea

---

S.Reid

---

McGeady

---

Duff

---

Hunt

---

Doyle

---

Keane

---

BaZmO*

luckylucky wrote:

Could we get Stan on some fast track super dooper course in how to be a football manager for the next few months, if there's nothing available maybe a FAS(if it's still called that these days) course would do

He could trying coming on this forum for advice cos apparently there's a sh1tload of experts here that know everything about football...

LuckyLloyd wrote:

I would just like to say that this thread seems a little pointless tbh. By the time we get to the qualification games in September, a summer break will have come and gone in club football. The form of players will probably be quite different at that stage - injuries, transfers etc will play a part in how relevant players are for selection. Plus, the friendly games may produce a difference in thought. Too early to have this conversation.

OK then. Bye Bye!..... see you in September.

cson

luckylucky wrote:

Could we get Stan on some fast track super dooper course in how to be a football manager for the next few months, if there's nothing available maybe a FAS(if it's still called that these days) course would do

Football Manager 2007 should be sent to him post haste. Play it to death over the summer. Even scout players on it!

Failing that LMA 2007 for the X-Box should do him. Bit simpler.

Bounty Hunter

i dont imagine stan switching from 442 although it may suit Ireland, so id expect this to repreaent a fully fit Irish selection

GK: Given

DR:Finnan (Backup-Carr/ S.Kelly)
DL:O'Shea (Harte)
DC: Dunne + McShane (O'Dea)

MR: A Reid (McGeady)
MC: S Reid (S Hunt)
MC: Carsley (S Ireland)
ML: Duff (Kilbane)

FC: R Keane (A Stokes)
FC: K Doyle (S Long)

eirebhoy

Bounty Hunter wrote:

i dont imagine stan switching from 442

Half our games haven't been a 442.

jesus_thats_gre

eirebhoy wrote:

Half our games haven't been a 442.

Haha was gonna point that out too :eek:

Pigman II

I agree with Eirebhoys team. 4-5-1 is the way to go with Doyle up front on his own. We look a very solid team when we play that way. If we had a stronger selection of central midfielders we'd really be something to taken seriously. The majoy problem for us as I see it is regarding the creative midfield position. Andy Reid and Stephen Ireland simply aren't good enough and are too lightweight to make a real difference there. The two them seem lost out there most times I've seen either of them.

homerjay2005

id go with the following 11 -

Given
Finnan_Dunne_Mcshane_O Shea
Andy Reid_Carsley_Steven Reid_Hunt
Duff_Doyle

Robbie Keane will never be dropped but he is just not doing it for ireland when really needed, he was ok against wales, but doyle should now be given the role as lead striker. its a tough call between steven ireland and carsley. defensively, thats our lot, we really have very little to choose from in there. Shay Given should be full time captain, end of story. add in mcgeedy and kilbane (unfortunatley) and we get a bit more competition in midfield as we do with Shane Long for up front, who still has a bit to do yet to be an international player but he looked good against Slovakia

S.M.B.

homerjay2005 wrote:

id go with the following 11 -

Given
Finnan_Dunne_Mcshane_O Shea
Andy Reid_Carsley_Steven Reid_Hunt
Duff_Doyle

Those underscores make that the hardest line up to read EVER!!

What's with all this Keane bashing. I find it amusing how people criticise Keanes contribution yet are calling for the two Reids to be included in future teams. Stephen has been exceptional at times for Blackburn but must do more in an Irish shirt to hold down a place while Andy hasn't been able to contribute anything to any team this season!

Calling for Keane to be dropped is ridiculous. It's as ridiculous as those who called for Duff to be dropped over the past 4 years (when he hasn't delivered much for Ireland). I don't hear many people asking for Duff to be dropped after his performance on Wednesday!

GuanYin

I think that perhaps Duff was being criticised for lack of effort or at least for not playing to his full ability (for whatever reason).

Both the Reids have had injury marred seasons, but when they do play for Ireland, they play well, they get involved and they give it their all.

For Ireland, Keane indulges himself. He squanders possession, he tries his little tricks at inappropriate times and he doesn't look up often enough. The ironic thing is, it isn't that Keane isn't trying hard, it may be that he is trying too hard - he's trying the flash approach when the sensible thing is better for the team. He doesn't play that way for Spurs.

I've said for maybe 2 years now that I hoped for the day when we had good enough striking options to be able to drop Keane if needed. Mainly because I felt that his lack of competition up front contributed to his poor attitude. Now that day has come, I hope that he can cop on to himself as the prospect of a Spurs-esque Keane and Doyle in the team gives us a striking line that, for the first time since the Charlton era, has top class players.

S.M.B.

psi wrote:

I've said for maybe 2 years now that I hoped for the day when we had good enough striking options to be able to drop Keane if needed. Mainly because I felt that his lack of competition up front contributed to his poor attitude. Now that day has come, I hope that he can cop on to himself as the prospect of a Spurs-esque Keane and Doyle in the team gives us a striking line that, for the first time since the Charlton era, has top class players.

I agree that the competition for places should keep Keane on his toes but those suggesting that we have better options available at the moment are talking nonsense. Given the fact that Keane has played quite well on the right for Totenham on occasions this seasons and the 4-5-1/4-3-3 contributing to Duffs best game in a green shirt for years then I'd consider going with the following against the Slovaks away.

---

Carsley/S.Reid

---

Kilbane

---

---

Ireland

---

Keane

---

Duff

---

Doyle

---

GuanYin

S.M.B. wrote:

I agree that the competition for places should keep Keane on his toes but those suggesting that we have better options available at the moment are talking nonsense. Given the fact that Keane has played quite well on the right for Totenham on occasions this seasons and the 4-5-1/4-3-3 contributing to Duffs best game in a green shirt for years then I'd consider going with the following against the Slovaks away.

---

Carsley/S.Reid

---

Kilbane

---

---

Ireland

---

Keane

---

Duff

---

Doyle

---

But you're missing my two main points.

1) Keane the spurs player and Keane the Ireland player are two different fish. For spurs, Keane looks up, links up well with his team mates, keeps the ball well and takes the pass that benefits the team. For Ireland Keane doesn't look up, tries the over elaborate thing and loses possession as often as not. He is also far more selfish with the ball.

2) We do have good strike options, or rather for the first time in a long time we have multiple players playing up front in the premiership and many championship strikers to boot.

We have Doyle, Keane, Connolly, Stokes and Morrisson with good seasons and decent scoring tallys (all over 10 goals). We have Long, Elliot and Folan coming through or returning from injury.

Given that Staunton favours the 433/451 formation it also means that Duff, Hunt, Andy Reid and Ireland are potent attacking options.

Now from all those players, I can think of any combination that omits Keane and still fills me with confidence. Connolly and Doyle and Duff or Doyle and Reid and Duff would make me just as happy as Keane and Doyle and Duff.

The main point is we have options AND as we saw on wednesday, we're quite capable without Keane - in fact I wonder if the lack of Keane made a difference considering his tendancy to lose the ball.

Also, regarding Duff - he played a great 45 minutes - he was invisible in the second half - he still has a LONG way (another 25 minutes for a start) to go before I'd say he's near his best for Ireland.

PHB

He may not be near his best, and Keane may not be near there best, but who else has the actual ability to score against Germany?

GuanYin

S.M.B. wrote:

I agree that the competition for places should keep Keane on his toes but those suggesting that we have better options available at the moment are talking nonsense. Given the fact that Keane has played quite well on the right for Totenham on occasions this seasons and the 4-5-1/4-3-3 contributing to Duffs best game in a green shirt for years then I'd consider going with the following against the Slovaks away.

---

Carsley/S.Reid

---

Kilbane

---

---

Ireland

---

Keane

---

Duff

---

Doyle

---

But you're missing my two main points.

1) Keane the spurs player and Keane the Ireland player are two different fish. For spurs, Keane looks up, links up well with his team mates, keeps the ball well and takes the pass that benefits the team. For Ireland Keane doesn't look up, tries the over elaborate thing and loses possession as often as not. He is also far more selfish with the ball.

2) We do have good strike options, or rather for the first time in a long time we have multiple players playing up front in the premiership and many championship strikers to boot.

We have Doyle, Keane, Connolly, Stokes and Morrisson with good seasons and decent scoring tallys (all over 10 goals). We have Long, Elliot and Folan coming through or returning from injury.

Given that Staunton favours the 433/451 formation it also means that Duff, Hunt, Andy Reid and Ireland are potent attacking options.

Now from all those players, I can think of any combination that omits Keane and still fills me with confidence. Connolly and Doyle and Duff or Doyle and Reid and Duff would make me just as happy as Keane and Doyle and Duff.

The main point is we have options AND as we saw on wednesday, we're quite capable without Keane - in fact I wonder if the lack of Keane made a difference considering his tendancy to lose the ball.

Also, regarding Duff - he played a great 45 minutes - he was invisible in the second half - he still has a LONG way (another 25 minutes for a start) to go before I'd say he's near his best for Ireland.

S.M.B.

psi wrote:

But you're missing my two main points.

1) Keane the spurs player and Keane the Ireland player are two different fish. For spurs, Keane looks up, links up well with his team mates, keeps the ball well and takes the pass that benefits the team. For Ireland Keane doesn't look up, tries the over elaborate thing and loses possession as often as not. He is also far more selfish with the ball.

Keane was always over elaborate, greedy and wasteful throughout the years he became Irelands top scorer. He struggled at Tottenham for a few years and was pretty close to leaving a few times it seemed. Over the past 18 months his game has changed and improved dramatically and his role for Spurs is now completely different to what was expected of him a few years ago. He hasn't brought the same level of form to his Irish performances over the same period but I believe the more games he plays for Ireland in this supporting role behind Doyle the more he'll improve.

As for being happy with alternative partnerships available to Ireland at the moment, I'd still pick an average Keane performance over all the others you suggested. Just because Connolly/Morrison are both having a decent run of form in the Championship doesn't mean they are up to the standard one would expect of the Irish national soccer team.