Bitten by a dog, Whats the protocol?

peasant

Beelzebub wrote:

Meanwhile pick up one of these or similar: http://www.maplin.co.uk/searchtemplate.asp?criteria=DOG%20SCARER

Don't !

As for why ...see my post above on using pepper.

These "dog scarers" do exactly what it says on the tin ...they scare the dog by creating pain in its ears.
Some dogs react to being scared and hurt by running away ...others react with a full blown attack :eek:
(Same as people, really)

Jotter

The-Rigger wrote:

No, I guess it's not, but whose fault it is doesn't really occur to me when 99% of the ones I encounter try to maim me.

.

Im not a fan of little dogs in general as Ive been bitten by plenty and a lot do come across as snappy but I think this is a size issue rather than an evil gene. Little dogs live in a big world so I think you just have to go easy on the approach esp when petting, and I wouldnt be gone on having one as a pet with kids around as imo they dont generally have enough patience, every kid I know growing up (inc myself) has been snapped at or bitten by a little dog. I have a feeling it might be part of natures learning curve or something!
Its not like me at all to stick up for little doggy rats but I did meet 5 lovely JRT's in a country pub across from my parents house, all were full of personality and happy to trot around the pub from person to person, you wouldnt cuddle one mind you but they did make me see beyond the teeth for a change and Id even go so far as to say Im quite fond of them so dont write off all little mutts just yet!

Jesus Wept

Jotter wrote:

Im not a fan of little dogs in general as Ive been bitten by plenty and a lot do come across as snappy but I think this is a size issue rather than an evil gene. Little dogs live in a big world so I think you just have to go easy on the approach esp when petting, and I wouldnt be gone on having one as a pet with kids around as imo they dont generally have enough patience, every kid I know growing up (inc myself) has been snapped at or bitten by a little dog. I have a feeling it might be part of natures learning curve or something!
Its not like me at all to stick up for little doggy rats but I did meet 5 lovely JRT's in a country pub across from my parents house, all were full of personality and happy to trot around the pub from person to person, you wouldnt cuddle one mind you but they did make me see beyond the teeth for a change and Id even go so far as to say Im quite fond of them so dont write off all little mutts just yet!

Fair point, I still support the evil gene idea, chance of a Jack Russel Terrior like the one I pictured seems to be 95%+, not sure what the % would be of a non Jack Russell Terrior, but small dog otherwise, far lower!

Gillie

peasant wrote:

A sensible dog owner will avoid busy times on the beach to give his/her dogs a run

Sums it up right there!
I personally avoid crowded places with my dog!

As for the legality of dogs in open spaces. There are places where you are instructed to keep your dog on a lead.

That woman is a disgrace! If i'm out with the dog and I meet ppl I will put the dog on the lead. It's manners and not a huge inconvenience to me!

EVERYONE has the right to use the beaches for recreation.
The OP has the right to jog there in peace and the person walking with or without their dogs have the right to do so also. (Bear in mind that there are ppl who verbally attack ppl with dogs even when nothing happens AND even if the dog is on a lead!)

Anyway. Sorry to hear about that experience OP. You have a good attitude though! Good for you.

Beelzebub

peasant wrote:

Don't !

As for why ...see my post above on using pepper.

These "dog scarers" do exactly what it says on the tin ...they scare the dog by creating pain in its ears.
Some dogs react to being scared and hurt by running away ...others react with a full blown attack :eek:
(Same as people, really)

Wasn't aware of that. You're speaking from experience? About the sonic device I mean?

golden

At the end of the day the lady should have kepted her dogs under control if they do not come to command they should be on a lead, however if the dogs get reported they would be put to sleep so why do the dogs have to suffer just because someone can not control the dogs.

peasant

Beelzebub wrote:

Wasn't aware of that. You're speaking from experience? About the sonic device I mean?

No, I've never used one nor have seen one being used.
But I don't need to, to know that on some dogs the infliction of pain will achieve the exact opposite of the intended result.

It's the same as with people. If you meet an obnoxious person in the street and you clout them one ...50 % will do a runner, the other 50% will go on an all out counter attack.

Dogs will react exactly the same on being threatend/hurt/attacked
Self defence instincts kick in (and it doesn't matter ift hey are triggered by fear or aggression) and the dog will go into attack mode.

Exactly what you wanted to avoid in the first place.

anniehoo

Im actually shocked at the so called responsible dog owners here saying not to report this incident as it was only a "snap" not a "bite"! A snap to an adult will be the equivalent of a very very dangerous bite to a child! Any dog with agressive tendencies should not be let off lead if it cannot be controlled! The law states in a public place your dog should be under control (not necessarily on a lead), but should respond to your command to heal if required! This dog owner is probably well used to her dogs behaving like this and no doubt she is continuing to get away with it as people like yourself wont report it! Please report this to the gardaí, even if they dont do anything at least you will be safe in the knowledge that if *god forbid* these animals bit a child, you tried to do something about it!

peasant

anniehoo wrote:

Im actually shocked at the so called responsible dog owners here saying not to report this incident as it was only a "snap" not a "bite"! A snap to an adult will be the equivalent of a very very dangerous bite to a child!

I don't want to defend that woman in any way ...what she did (or rather didn't do) was wrong and reprehensible.

But pleeeease, spare us the "won't anyone think of the children" - hype.

A snap is a snap and a bite is a bite.

That little dog was acting the boll*cks, it should definetly have been under control and it shouldn't have been given the opportunity to snap at the jogger.

But snap is all it did.

And I repeat myself ...a snap is a snap!
Human skin breaks very easily, no matter what age or size the human is. Blood flows just as easily out of a fit, adult joggers as it does out of a little child.

So please, don't overhype this.

That snap to a child would have done no more harm than it did to the jogger.

Once again, I'm not trying to defend or belittle what happened, but I'm a bit allergic to things getting blown all out of proportion as soon as somebody mentions children.

Let's stay reasonable here, ok?

anniehoo

....mmmm spot the one with no kids!!!

peasant

anniehoo wrote:

....mmmm spot the one with no kids!!!

I knew that was going to come next

All right then ...super -mom ...how about reporting all men that smile at children ...they're probably paedophiles !!

Or how about banning lollipops ...I know of one child that suffocated on one.

Or maybe we should all stop driving cars ...jeez ...think of all the children that get killed in traffic every year.


Proportion, my dear, proportion ... and staying within it ...ok?

lightening

I got bitten twice as a kid, stitches in one case. (taking a bone off my uncles dog!) I also fell out of a tree, skateboarded in to a wall, fell in to the Shannon, stood on a nail and got knocked down by a car. The walls, trees, roads, and even the Shannon is still there.

I walk my dogs in the park and the amount of kids that are terrified of dogs is amazing. Some of them scream and cry at the sight of a dog. I once heard a parent tell their kid that the dog would bite them! What's that about? Why are suburban parents getting so overprotective? The kids are going to grow up scared.

(oh, and fair play to the OP, I wish all joggers were like him/her)

Jotter

anniehoo wrote:

....mmmm spot the one with no kids!!!

I have an 8 mth old son and a 7 yr old stepson and I said not to report dog. the dog was small and yappy and it snapped or nipped. If the dog was a threat to society it would have bitten and the OP wouldnt have jogged on theyd be in too much pain. the owner was the problem here, reporting the dog for biting would have ment the dog could be destroyed, the owner is free to keep the rest of her dogs and or get a new one so whats the point in that? I think legislation needs to be brought in with regard to dog ownership but thats a thread for another day!

Gillie

If the dog had bitten and was reported then he could be destroyed!
If he only snapped then maybe not.

Either way that woman should have had control of the dog.

fits

Jotter wrote:

I think legislation needs to be brought in with regard to dog ownership but thats a thread for another day!

Well sign the petition mentioned in another thread, if you havent already. Legislation really does need to be brought in. The dog (and cat and horse to a lesser extent) situation in Ireland is appalling.

random_banter

TBH I would reccomend that you report the incident to the gardai/dog warden. The woman clearly has no control over her dogs and doesnt understand their behaviour, and if she needs a warning from the dog warden to get her ass into gear, so be it.

I'm a dog owner myself, and I know all of the posters here seem like very responsibe owners- we all know our own dogs well and can predict their behavior to some extent I would presume?

For example I have a huge, gorgeous, energetic 1 year old black lab. He's wired! He's also got the most gentle nature and has never shown any sign of having any aggressiveness, never growls, snaps or bites, anything. But he is very exciteable and gets very hyper when people visit the house, he meets new dogs etc he goes mental, runs up to them and jumps up and down etc. For someone who isnt used to dogs, this could easily be interpreted as aggressiveness and a person could easily get a fright, but I am aware of this and so I am careful.

Since I know his behaviour well I know that if he were to be let run free on a beach he would DEFINITELY run up and get excited over a jogger like the OP, and as a result I walk him at quiet times of the day, and early in the morning or late at night on the beach, or in open areas to run free. I always have my eye on him and at the first sign that hes going to get excited over someone he's called straight back to me and is on the leash so I can have greater control of him. I'm hoping that he's starting to calm down a bit and we are continously practicing letting him run away then calling him back to sit etc and basic obedience, and he is improving which is a relief! Anyway we are very careful with him, as his own friendliness could land him in alot of trouble with someone who isnt used to his excitement.

The woman on the beach who lets her dogs run wild like that needs to get some cop on (she doesnt understand her own dogs behaviour and doesnt know when to control them) and if this comes in the form of a warning from the gardai/dog warden then so be it. And I also agree that could well have been a child running around on the beach and i'm sure it would have been viewed as a more serious incident then!

iguana

lightening wrote:

I walk my dogs in the park and the amount of kids that are terrified of dogs is amazing. Some of them scream and cry at the sight of a dog. I once heard a parent tell their kid that the dog would bite them! What's that about? Why are suburban parents getting so overprotective? The kids are going to grow up scared.

I live in an area which is generally believed to be the most multi-cultural square mile in the world. So at least half the people I encounter are from cultures where dog owning is either unheard of, or taboo as touching an unclean creature ( a dog) can have you banned from heaven. It can be absolute hell.

I get screamed at by people 40ft away to keep my dogs away from them, even though my dogs are on their leads and I am not going in their direction. People scream and run around in crazy circles, stomping their feet up and down which makes my dogs think they are playing a game, especially when they were younger. And they are only 9 months old now, so pretty much still pups, but they have learned to ignore people now, unless they think an exciting game is going on.

I honestly believe that how to act around a dog should be thought in schools or on entry to a country with high dog ownership. Just basic things such as screaming and running away is just about the stupidest thing you can do around a dog as you will only attract it to you. I've actually started giving people who are open to it a few impromtu lessons when they freak out, to varying degrees of success.

To top it off, I have had complete dumbasses who have uncontrolable, aggressive dogs scream at me to keep my dog away because their dog attacks. They don't seem to think that if their dog is aggressive, they should be the one taking measures to control it. A lot of these guys seem to be appearing now that the weather is improving as apparently they don't walk their dogs in winter. And these muppets don't do any favours to the people who own dogs or those who are afraid of them.

lightening

iguana wrote:

I get screamed at by people 40ft away to keep my dogs away from them

That's mad, are your dogs German Shepards or Rothweilers? I had to shepard two African girls around a playful boxer in Marino once, they were terrified of him, really scared, one of them was shaking.

stovelid

The-Rigger wrote:

All Jack Russell terriers should not be allowed to breed in my opinion. Every one of them I have ever encountered are nasty snapping bitting little aggresive dangerous bastards, and no, I have not
been unlucky, this is their character.

And I do not run/have a fear of dogs/have this problem with other dogs/dislike dogs.

My best mate had a jack russell for years and he was fine. Prone to get very excited and very quick to chase people/cats/cars but a good natured dog and never bit.

Saruman

peasant wrote:

Don't !

As for why ...see my post above on using pepper.

These "dog scarers" do exactly what it says on the tin ...they scare the dog by creating pain in its ears.
Some dogs react to being scared and hurt by running away ...others react with a full blown attack :eek:
(Same as people, really)

Im curious.. would a Dog even know the source of this pain? I mean it emits a noise but i would not think the dog would associate the noise with a human.... I could be wrong.

peasant

Saruman wrote:

Im curious.. would a Dog even know the source of this pain? I mean it emits a noise but i would not think the dog would associate the noise with a human.... I could be wrong.

Does it matter, if the dog is or isn't clever enough to figure out that it was you, pressing a button, that caused it's pain?

If the pain drives it to switch over to aggressive, instinct driven self-defence mode, it's going to go for the nearest "enemy" around ...which would still be you.

See?

Oriel

If that should happen to me, I would have no problem with starting to kick the **** out of the dogs, and I mean hard. It will get them away from you, and it will make the owner think twice about letting them off the lead.
Not cruelty, self defence.

fits

sinecurea wrote:

If that should happen to me, I would have no problem with starting to kick the **** out of the dogs, and I mean hard. It will get them away from you, and it will make the owner think twice about letting them off the lead.
Not cruelty, self defence.

And do you really think, in this instance, that that is a better course of action than just stopping running, and ignoring them completely.

Gillie

To be fair here.
People have already mentioned the fact that the dog may get nervous if someone is jogging by and therefore get aggressive.
Well the same can be said for ppl! If they are being "attacked" by the dog or the dog shows any sign of aggression then the fight or flight instincts kick in.
And most ppl know there is no way they'll outrun a dog! So they fight back.
Not a good idea but it may be just pure instinct!

Those of us who own dogs will probably diffuse the situation easier than someone who hasn't experience of dogs but it may not always work!

Oriel

fits wrote:

And do you really think, in this instance, that that is a better course of action than just stopping running, and ignoring them completely.

No be fair, you can't just "stop ignoring" them. Once they start to bite of nip, they'll keep going unless there are called by their owner, or some other form of action id taking against them.
While stopping running might prevent them attacking in the first place, it will rarely stop them once they have started, just giving them an easier target.

fits

Believe me, I'd have no problem kicking an aggressive dog if it was required, especially if it was attacking my own dogs... but in the instance described by the OP, if they'd just slowed to a walk and ignored the dogs, nothing would have happened.

Rigsby

There are many honost, decent and caring dog owners that I know who just can not grasp the idea that not all people like and/or are afraid of dogs. Many times I've seen obviously friendly (to me) dogs off their leash bound up to a stranger who looks afraid or wary, only to be told by the owner "ah sure he wont touch ya he's a little lamb !" There has been a lot of talk here about what a jogger should or should n't do when approached by a dog off the leash. The bottom line is there should be no need for any remedial act on the part of the walker/jogger. It's what dog owners should do when there are people around that matters.

Deliverance

I think the OP should report the dog owner but only in such a way as the owner will get a slap on the wrist or a warning which will encourage them to look after the dogs more responsibly in such a way as to aniticipate situations that may occur such as joggers etc.

Peasants advice is pretty spot on as far as I can see, and he fielded the potential hype well. That some folks may find that pissing a dog off when it is exited is a good way of making it back off!? It would be interesting to see a person trying to kick the crap out of a dog after that person had just thrown pepper into it's face and the enraged dog has hold of one of his ankles and wont let go.

I like dogs I just don't like some dog owners, often the dog is only a reflection of the owner, but I am biased against Pomeraniens tis only a blessing that they are small.