Just heard - new increases in VRT??

galwaytt

wtf??!! more???!!!

part of Herr Roches lemming crusade to Kyoto stupidity..........but I can't see any details on the www yet.............

astraboy

Great, another increase to a tax totally against the principles of the EU common market, and under the guise of "Environmentalism." Bull****(excuse my french). And we still have to pay tolls to use all the good roads.

um7y1h83ge06nx

What a balls, higher VRT is on the way:

http://www.rte.ie/news/2007/0402/Climate.html

As if we weren't getting screwed enough!

slickmcvic

...and the greens have promised in INCREASE petrol by 20c a litre & a hike in road tax if they get in so it looks like We're F*ucked either way

mike65

Hi ho, fewer new car sales more UK imports.

Mike.

astraboy

You end up paying VRT anyway when you register the car, be it imported from Japan or britian, even though its illegal under the treaty of Rome.

quarryman

yeah so it won't affect the VRT we pay when importing a car from the UK, right?

It says the plan won't come into affect until 2012 though? Time to buy that Toureg so!

unkel

Merged the two threads

astraboy

quarryman wrote:

yeah so it won't affect the VRT we pay when importing a car from the UK, right?

It says the plan won't come into affect until 2012 though? Time to buy that Toureg so!

No, if you buy say a BMW 325 in britian, when you register it the customs office has a list price for each car and then charges you VRT based on that. You may save money on VAT vy buying in the UK, but you can't escape VRT if you want to register the car in Ireland. :mad:

Stark

Not a bad idea if it discourages people from buying the likes of SUVs and 4x4s for heading to the shops and dropping kids to school imo. I just worry that they'll use some inaccurate measure like raw engine size to determine what's a polluter and what's not.

ninty9er

AFAIK, it's to be emissions based...did any of you care to send a proposal to the Minister for Finance following his request for submissions on the matter????

If not stop complaining...you had your chance...I know I did....a while back though before he requested submissions, so whether it'll be included in the draft or not is another matter

Anan1

Stark wrote:

Not a bad idea if it discourages people from buying the likes of SUVs and 4x4s for heading to the shops and dropping kids to school imo. I just worry that they'll use some inaccurate measure like raw engine size to determine what's a polluter and what's not.

I think the plan is to base it on CO2 emissions, which seems fair enough to me. Personally, i'd like to see penal rates on SUVs.

astraboy

Anan1 wrote:

I think the plan is to base it on CO2 emissions, which seems fair enough to me. Personally, i'd like to see penal rates on SUVs.

I have nothing against SUV's, IMO the war against 4x4 is Irish peoples problem with people showing off and doing well for themselves. If a car has a large engine and is a polluter then it gets no bad press, but a 2.5/3.0L 4x4 does! but if a family wants to buy a 2.0L SUV because it might make loading and unloading the kids easier and have room for all the gear kids need then whats the problem? I hate this anti "gas guzzler" mentaily in Ireland when we don't really have gas guzzlers. In the US SUV's can come with engines up to 7 litres! That is a gas guzzler!

unkel

Anan1 wrote:

I think the plan is to base it on CO2 emissions, which seems fair enough to me

Not to me. A tax based on the potential to pollute is not fair. A tax based on actual pollution is fair

cantdecide

what kind of statistics are available for motoring costs? i'm so curious- we must be very high internationally.

we pay so much and get so little. look at the roads- I'm fed up of fixing my car because of them.

high cc cars pay enormous road tax already, completely disproportionate to their emmisions. as previosly posted- we don't have gas-guzzlers or a gas-guzzler problem in Ireland.

it is convenient to the government to treat the Irish motorist as a pariah? does anyone else feel tired of the pious environmentalists? i am one of the greenest people i know but i'm so sick of the punishment.



so the big one- What can now be done? who will be our champion?

what_car

ninty9er wrote:

AFAIK, it's to be emissions based...did any of you care to send a proposal to the Minister for Finance following his request for submissions on the matter????

If not stop complaining...you had your chance...I know I did....a while back though before he requested submissions, so whether it'll be included in the draft or not is another matter

fianna fail...............wot a joke
hope they get booted at next election......

is_that_so

unkel wrote:

A tax based on actual pollution is fair

Eh how does that work? Surely if a vehicle is known to have certain emissions isn't it reasonable to apply a tax to that? If someone claims otherwise let them go and get it tested.
I personally welcome it , evil things - SUVs .

colm_mcm

tax on petrol only makes so much sense. one that incorporates toll roads aswell. it's ridiculous what they're proposing for the M50. It's ridiculous to have to tax your car. It makes sense that if you buy very little fuel, then you're either driving a very fuel efficent car, or you don't drive as much. Why not reward people who use less fuel and cause less pollution.

DMC

I thought VRT was to be phased out by 2009, as Bruxelles said non?

Ba$tard

I'm all for tax (road and environmental) to be incorporated into the cost of fuel. I think, who is it, Finland do it already? Definately the fairest and most accurate.

"Per use" rates have a startling effect on people finding an economical and environment alternate - look what happened when pay by weight came in, recycling exploded (ok we crunch and ship our paper to China as fuel ).

It would also mean that the elderly who typically drive very low milage per annum pay less than what they need to now.

cantdecide

my 2.8 nets the govt. a grand a year in road tax even though it barely moves. like most people, my usage is my usage until a viable alternative is given.

i think the mechanics of the taxation are irrelevant- we pay far, far too much already, as we have done for many, many years.

in other words, lift your heads fellow citizens, we've already done OUR bit. It's actually Uncle Paddy's turn to do something about it. as opposed to taking some false moral high ground as he would have you believe he's doing.

further procrastination is all todays announcements amounts to.

booooooooooo

Tipsy Mac

Typical FF, do as I say not as I do...they all drive around in the most fuel ineffient tanks which they pay no BIK, no VRT and don't even pay for the fuel yet they want Joe Public to drive around in bubble cars stripped down to the shell with the bair minimum of safety features to allow them be affordable when VRT is added.

What surprises me most is us motorists do zero to go against them, why don't we get together and take it on as an election issue, simply get people to vote for anyone except FF. SIMI are in bed with this government for years, keeping VRT and avoiding any competition from overseas for the Irish consumer.

_Kaiser_

Tipsy Mac wrote:

What surprises me most is us motorists do zero to go against them, why don't we get together and take it on as an election issue, simply get people to vote for anyone except FF.

Because (massive generalisations ahead):
- Irish people are great at whinging to each other in the pub, but that's about it
- Irish people are sheep, and will vote for whoever our parents did rather than on the issues
- Irish people are too busy looking after our mates, and out for as much as we can get for ourselves, that we're bereft of any social conscience or responsibility ("sure what's the point.. " - which leads me neatly back to my first point).

... for what it's worth I agree with you though!

ninty9er

Tipsy Mac wrote:

SIMI are in bed with this government for years, keeping VRT and avoiding any competition from overseas for the Irish consumer.

Really

Could have sworn I've seen Cyril McHugh and other SIMI spokesmen on TV over the past few years damning the levying of VRT

Every election VRT is going to be an issue 2002, 1997.....yet I don't remember it ever reaching campaign level or for that matter getting support from any other party...remember that FG introduced it in the first place!!

edit: apologies 1992 election was originally included, however VRT was introduced after this time

Ice_Box

So yet again the government increases the tax on safe cars making the national fleet older and more people dead. FF just want organ doners.

There are miles of skid marks on the M7 where the pile ups happened the other day. This shows how few cars in this country have ABS. Keeping your children alive is taxed as a luxury by fianna fail.

RobAMerc

This government have a brilliant plan.

Use buzz words like SUV to convince plebs that "Big" cars are really bad for the environment. Then the plebs jealous of the people with SUV's are happy they are gonna be taxed more for their cars safe in the knowledge the b*stards in SUV's are getting screwed even more!

While politicians buzz about in chaufer driven E320 Mercedes etc or if traffic becomes an inconvienience they just jump on a chopper - no environmental issue with those of course :rolleyes:

To highlight the inaccurate bs they spout, the DTO's figures for average CO2 is taken as an average of all the cars in a range from lowest diesel to largest V8 yet as we all know the average SUV on the road in Ireland is the smallest engined diesel model emitting the lowest C02 and is in no way representative of the facts!

Ice_Box wrote:

There are miles of skid marks on the M7 where the pile ups happened the other day. This shows how few cars in this country have ABS. Keeping your children alive is taxed as a luxury by fianna fail.

Well said

NBar

So does anybody know when the VRT increase:( is going to start as I would like to vrt my new car before it goes up. And before anybody goes on about vrting it now as I am breaking the law the car is currently locked away until I get my own car sold

ninty9er

linky

Seth Brundle

is_that_so wrote:

Eh how does that work? Surely if a vehicle is known to have certain emissions isn't it reasonable to apply a tax to that? If someone claims otherwise let them go and get it tested.
I personally welcome it , evil things - SUVs .

Should a high polluting vehicle that covers 1000 kilometres per year be taxed more than a less polluting vehicle that covers 40000km per year? The latter will pollute more!
Where is the fairness / sense / environmental responsibility in that?

Ice_Box wrote:

FF just want organ doners.

Well it is organ donor week!

Seth Brundle

RobAMerc wrote:

as we all know the average SUV on the road in Ireland is the smallest engined diesel model emitting the lowest C02 and is in no way representative of the facts!

Every day I see loads of big 3L and up engined 4*4s. The M50 is full ov X5s, V8 Range Rovers, etc.

RobAMerc

kbannon wrote:

Every day I see loads of big 3L and up engined 4*4s. The M50 is full ov X5s, V8 Range Rovers, etc.

I realy do not believe that - take a closer look - you will find it hard to find a petrol X5 or RR in this country, in my nerdiness I always look at them and rarely see anything but TD's. These have far lower emmisions than the petrol V8 versions you may be mistaking them for.

For example : what % of the following search brings up petrol V8's ?

http://www.usedcars.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=search&maxrows=100&MakeID=3&xMakeID=3&ModelID=35&xModelID=35&Year=&xYear=&submit=Find+cars+%3E%3E

Just to highlight the difference - a x5 3.0d has a CO2 emission of 233 - exactly the same as a 1.8T VW passat or seat alhambra 1.8T!
Are we going to start throwing rotten eggs at them too ?