Help picking something to fly!

red_ice

Hey guys, im looking for something fun and easy to fly.

My main interest is in helicopters. I want something with an engine, mainly becasue i like to fiddle with it and learn the mechanics of it, also i dont want to wait around for a battery to charge.

If i was to get a helicopter i wouldnt be itnerested in fast flight and stunts or anything, just something to fly around gracfully and land on stuff or something - i dunno, just mindless fun.

I would like a plane, but not something that just glides. I like bipeds (i thnk thats what they are called). If i was to get a plane i would like to do loops and tumbles and the likes, but nothing to complex, again just something to fly around and have a bit of fun with.

I was on the phone to a chap about differnt planes and helicopters, and i could tell he was a really into this thing, but he made buying what ever it was that i wanted sound very daunting.

I dont have a massive budget - my price range would buy me nothing from the sounds of it tbh, and its kind of put me off buying anything that will lift off the ground. I could see myself getting into this sort of thing, but i dont know where to start.

I dont want to waste money and go overkill, but then again i want to get something that will last long enough for me to take out for an hour or two on the weekend.

im saying 250 would be just right for me to spend, but im sure i could push it to about 350 at most. Anyone got any suggestions? I understand theres alot to take into consideration when buying these things. Please post me some links to some planes or helicopters that would be good for me to learn with, get a taste of what flyings about and let me see if i want to persue flying more seriously.

I have had 2 'toy' helicopters that both flew for about 5 minutes, but the collaborations on them were all wrong and wouldnt even lift off straight at all. I did how ever get to fly my second one for about 3 minutes around in circles by holding left for the whole flight haha (it was flying to the right)

Cheers

The Doktor

Have a read through this thread
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055064040

I understand where u are commin from with the engine thing, but I promise ya, there is plenty to learn about a heli without having an IC engine!!
Also you wont get anywhere near an IC powered heli with your budget. And dont worry bout havin to wait for batteries to charge, it only takes about 30 mins... read the thread.. see what ya get out of it.
I wont advise you about fixed wing, as its not my thing really... coolwings might help you there:D

coolwings

red_ice wrote:

Hey guys, im looking for something fun and easy to fly.

Welcome to the hobby and this forum

Wow - lots of questions there ... here goes:

red_ice wrote:

My main interest is in helicopters. I want something with an engine, mainly becasue i like to fiddle with it and learn the mechanics of it, .

Well the engine type heli is definitely more challenging from a technical point of view. Learning to tune engine etc. So if you like messing about with mechanics, it might be suitable. Electric helis are usually preferred by folks that like to fly more, but tinker with it less, if you know what I mean.

red_ice wrote:

If i was to get a plane i would like to do loops and tumbles and the likes...

Loops are the 1st aerobatic move we learn .... after we learn the basic how-to-fly stuff.

red_ice wrote:

I could see myself getting into this sort of thing, but i dont know where to start...

Sounds like you have already made a good start, investigating the matter first.

red_ice wrote:

i want to get something that will last long enough for me to take out for an hour or two on the weekend.

A good model can last a very long time. I have a "Skyraider" (not a learner) that has well over 200 flights, and it's still going strong! We average them out, some last longer, some shorter, and we regard the "airframe" as like fuel, we use it up a bit every time we fly. When it finally bites the dust we take "the innards" out, and move them into the next airframe. So we buy good "innards", engine, servos, receiver, and so on - and they last longer than the model.

red_ice wrote:

im saying 250 would be just right for me to spend, but im sure i could push it to about 350 at most. Anyone got any suggestions?

Not a lot of good stuff for 250 I'm afraid (since you want engine power) . But from 350 and up there is lots to choose from...

red_ice wrote:

Please post me some links to some planes or helicopters that would be good for me to learn with, get a taste of what flyings about and let me see if i want to persue flying more seriously.

Sounds like you might want to go to a model flying club, talk with the lads, and see how stuff works, (or doesn't work! ) before proceeding with your entry into aeromodelling.
Since you are in Dublin may I suggest you contact two clubs?
Dublin Kestrel Model Flying Club, monthly meets in Main st Tallaght, and daily/weekly flies at Brittas out past the Square.
Leinster Model Flying Club flies in Phoenix Park.
The club links are in the "general thread.

red_ice wrote:

I have had 2 'toy' helicopters that both flew for about 5 minutes, but the collaborations on them were all wrong and wouldnt even lift off straight at all.

That would be "normal" for beginners with helis. Flying well is not simple, it comes after practise. First flights are wobbly for everyone. It gets better with each flight!

red_ice wrote:

... some planes or helicopters that would be good for me to learn with...

Suitable models in your budget:
Electric planes - Easy Star, Mini Mag, Space Scooter.
Electric Helis - Twister V2
Green Hobby have one in a sale called Space Scooter, it comes with a basic 3-channel radio. If you got that but ask them to upgrade the radio to 4-channel you might get out with a (electric) motor plane, charger, proper radio under 250.

Suitable models borderline in your budget:
Electric planes - Daisy
Glowfuel piston engine planes - Boomerang, Cessna, Arising Star, Cub
Electric Helis - Twister 3D

Models triple your budget!
Glowfuel Engine helis - all of the reliable ones! (But their owners will confirm that they are good value at 900 - 1500 for the heli, radio, engine, starting gear, fuel, etc.

Either go to the cluband look round. See them fly. Then start with what they say.
OR
Go to the shop and get any of the above models . They are all good.

Hope this helps

red_ice

is the Arising Star 40 ARF Trainer electric or nitro?

I really want to get petrol - 30 minutes is a long wait especially if i have to drive back and forth from the park for a 10 minute flight. Id rather pack some fuel and go out for a couple of hours. Electric really is far from my interests, as every RC i've had has been electric. I want to learn about the engines n stuff. Even if i can build it myself - infact that would be great!

yea the posts are great lads, keep the info coming :]

cheers

coolwings

red_ice wrote:

is the Arising Star 40 ARF Trainer electric or nitro?

designed for nitro engine

red_ice wrote:

I really want to get petrol - 30 minutes is a long wait

It takes a bit longer to refuel and restart a glow engine model for the next flight, than to swop battery and switch a "leccie" on again.

But if engines is what you want ... no problem ... get a glowfuel engine model!
Arising Star, Boomerang, Cessna, Piper Cub are all glowfuel engine planes and will all do fine

The Doktor

red_ice wrote:

is the
I really want to get petrol - 30 minutes is a long wait especially if i have to drive back and forth from the park for a 10 minute flight.
cheers

But ya dont. You use your charger off a 12v car battery, and have a couple of packs with you.
And just in case ye think electric is slow and borin.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IXShhLsVUAo&mode=related&search=

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=np5XSTwv4vA

coolwings

Spitfire with brushless electric taking off ground http://aeneas.ps.uci.edu/edf/spit/spitfire_jepe_low.wmv
exactly same as glowfuel ... except engine can be started from the radio transmitter.

Aeronaut Panther (brushless electric) video http://aeneas.ps.uci.edu/edf/panther/panther_retr.wmv
no piston engine can do sufficient rpm to do this

El Bandito electric jet with Kontronik brushless engine http://www.kontronik.de/bandito.wmv

Of course, if you would rather lie under it with a glowplug spanner and nitro fuel pump and fuel up hose maybe these are not for you ......

Just joking of course. Choose what you like, then you will enjoy it most.

The Doktor

coolwings wrote:

Spitfire with brushless electric taking off ground http://aeneas.ps.uci.edu/edf/spit/spitfire_jepe_low.wmv
exactly same as glowfuel ... except engine can be started from the radio transmitter.

Would you stop postin links like that! Now I want one!

But seriously, as far as wanting to learn about IC engines, there isnt much to know. Its rare enough that you would pull them apart. And Id say there is plenty to learn about elecrtic motors. Loads of types..
I would have been the same as yourself. I always wanted IC stuff, but after havin a Heli, and a few cars, I think the elecrtic has a lot of advantages. Specially not havin oil all over the place when you`re fnished...oh, and not leavin little patches of dead grass there you were testin it (but the less said about that the better..;) )
Id be the same as yourself. I love to get a model, and make it go as well as I can. Cars are fun for that. Make them go as fast as you can and handle well.
Helis are even more fun. You can make em go well, and tinker and tinker till it flys perfect. I can spen a few evenings a week tinkering with my heli (without gettin covered in oil), and its only an electric.

red_ice

coolwings wrote:

designed for nitro engine
It takes a bit longer to refuel and restart a glow engine model for the next flight, than to swop battery and switch a "leccie" on again.

But if engines is what you want ... no problem ... get a glowfuel engine model!
Arising Star, Boomerang, Cessna, Piper Cub are all glowfuel engine planes and will all do fine

Haha, im sure it takes a little longer, but at the same time i get to light a ciggie, stand back from my plane, open a beer, say 'yep' a couple of times while i stand around with my mates talkin. then refuel and go! The fun in it would come from having work put into it to make it fly, not just plugging it into something and waiting

maybe a ciggie around the fuel isnt a good idea...

The Doktor wrote:

But ya dont. You use your charger off a 12v car battery, and have a couple of packs with you.
And just in case ye think electric is slow and borin.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IXShhLsVUAo&mode=related&search=

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=np5XSTwv4vA

cmon! Those things must cost a packet! I have nothing against the whole electric thing, i just want something that my dad would understand and get interested in. I rekon if i got an electric id pay though the nose with getting batteries n such!

Dont get me wrong, im not fixated on just getting something that takes fuel.. I just see it as being a big advantage over electic motors.

coolwings wrote:

Spitfire with brushless electric taking off ground http://aeneas.ps.uci.edu/edf/spit/spitfire_jepe_low.wmv
exactly same as glowfuel ... except engine can be started from the radio transmitter.

Aeronaut Panther (brushless electric) video http://www.halair.com/panther/thumb/video.jpg
no piston engine can do sufficient rpm to do this

El Bandito electric jet with Kontronik brushless engine http://www.kontronik.de/bandito.wmv

Of course, if you would rather lie under it with a glowplug spanner and nitro fuel pump and fuel up hose maybe these are not for you ......

Just joking of course. Choose what you like, then you will enjoy it most.

That spit fire loos great fun! thats more along the lines of what i would like to play around with. that Aeronaut Panther is just an image ¬_¬

As far as teh elbandito goes - the words electric and jet seem like such an oxymoron to me. When i hear jet, i think of fuel mixed with alot of air!

Choose what i like... I dont know what i like!! I know i have my heart set on a fuel based model or what not, but everyone is pushing me towards getting something electric, so i must be missing something with regards to performance or quality. As long as it would lift off the ground i would be happy. I dont think i would be playing around with the engine - once it flys and im happy with how it feels, i would like to leave the configuration as it is.

What are your recomendations for entry level flying? I know you've given a few, but im muddled up in prices and names. I dont want to spend too much or commit to a hobby like this unless i know ill be interested in it.

Cheers lads

The Doktor

Electric motors are not what they used to be....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NA1ZcMUzK3o

And chargers work of 12v anyway... no difference in price.
But sounds like ye have yer heart set on an IC model.

coolwings

Sorry about the Panther link folks.
I fixed it, but to avoid having to go back up the thread, here it is again:
http://aeneas.ps.uci.edu/edf/panther/panther_retr.wmv

The Doktor

coolwings wrote:

Sorry about the Panther link folks.
I fixed it, but to avoid having to go back up the thread, here it is again:
http://aeneas.ps.uci.edu/edf/panther/panther_retr.wmv

Damn you!!!! *shakes fist*.... I want that....so much for the new heli I spotted....:D

coolwings

So many model planes ... so little time ....
That pylon racer was impressive.

red_ice

I was just in greens models or something earlier on today having a look around. The chap who owns the place(i think) showed me a bunch of videos and planes n all sorts. One thing i have established in my venture to the shop was durability and the notion of planes inheriting componants. An angle i never really considered. I saw a bunch of planes that i was interested in. The gliders didnt really impress me. The slope soaring planes and so on were cool, but i dont think i would be that intrested in getting into that. Never the less, we got talking about the inheritance of certain aspects of the planes, and i think i will get and IC plane, so if something goes wrong (which will happen apparently), i can reuse the stuff and make it work on another model that i pick up.

I have established that i want one of the smaller planes. A jet or a biped would be kick ass. I was amazed at the size of the planes aswell.

I had a look at the arising star 40 I think it was, and it was like 4 foot wide and so on.. was about 120 for the plane, which i suppose is fair - i prefare to buy from shops and support irish stores. I buy all my music stuff from small shops, i like to do my part Never the less, i dont think i was interested in that style of plane.

Has anyone got any suggestions for a biped?

Should i be learning on something thats more bottom heavy like the arising star 40? or would something like this, but obviously not even 1/2 the scale of that be soemthing i could learn on?

coolwings

Patrick Dancy is the shop manager in there. He is away on holidays all this week and I was there covering for him, so it was me you spoke to!
Small world!
The Arising Star is less than you remembered, that amount would cover an A-Star and most of a good engine for it too.
Smaller is interesting, but the little ones can disappear into a dot quickish if you're not paying attention! Having said that, I must admit most of my own planes are smaller than average, and that makes them handier to transport.

Anyway - hope our conversation helped you decide.

Enjoy the hobby ... it's a brilliant one. :-)

coolwings

red_ice wrote:

... Should i be learning on something thats more bottom heavy like the arising star 40? ...

Here are several glow engine (nitro) trainer airplanes:Trainers
If you look you will quickly see the (external) design features they have in common - eg high wing, more wing than aerobatic planes, square wing-tips, bright colour.
The full size trainer airplanes s have exactly the same features for pilots learning to fly.
It is a successful recipe.

red_ice wrote:

... Has anyone got any suggestions for a biped?...

A biplane will increase the cost. This would encourage you to take shortcuts to get back within your budget, possibly going below the basic standard, and drifting down into "toys" from "models". If you use a biplane for learning you would have increased the investment "in the breakables" and are decreasing your investment in "the permant gear". This would be considered an unwise idea at this stage in the learning process. (Good idea for later ! )
Talk with the clubs and they will confirm this.

red_ice

that Piper Cub J3 .40 looks like something more along the lines of what i like / want in the plane! Are they any use?

coolwings

They are.
there are two types:
The clipped wing Cub which is a high wing but about 20% shorter wing, faster and much more lively
and
the standard J3 Cub which has the usual wing and is a very nice trainer

Some people call a Cub an advanced trainer because it does not have a trike undercarraige, it's a taildragger, and you have to learn to taxi on two main wheels at an earlier stage.