Drinking and Going Out

Boston

JC 2K3 wrote:

See, I'm not under stress. Stress is simply a mindset. Perhaps it's due to the fact that I only need 355 points, which I could have gotten had I sat the LC at the end of 5th year. Perhaps it's the fact that I drink and socialise without guilt and itgives me a chance to relax. In any case, unless you're going for something with a very high demand like medicine you'll only need between 300 and 500 points. If you pay attention in school and do your bit of study every night there's no reason you can't get those kind of points while still having a night out with drinking on the weekend. And I'm 18, it's not underage.

You're assuming everyone has your ability, for some 355 points will be a major achievement, something they will have to work incredibly hard to achieve and have no certainty about achieving.

That was exactly my point. I don't let the competition bs get to me.

Well you seem to have the attitude that you're a shoe in for your course, and maybe you are, but the vast majority or people won't be thinking along those lines.

I find that despite being a two year course, most subjects don't have a massive amount to cover. A lot of subjects are very drawn out and could be covered in 6 months.

tbh 355 points can be achieved with medium scores in most subjects. C3 acrross the board at higher level will get you it with points to spare. C3 Grade isn't difficult to come by, but I don't personally consider it a great result. You're attitude is that you can easily get the points you need so there no point in breaking your back this year, which is grand. There a people with less ability then you who will do far better then you, and if you're ok with that, then fine. Aiming towards the middle of the road will only get you so far, eventually you're going to want to show what you're made of.

So in conclusion you really should have said you're not looking for achieve great things in you're leaving cert and you're happy to underachieve, when you gave your advice about taking things easy.

JC 2K3

I got 480 in my mocks and am confident of 550 in the actual thing. Put it this way, I am working hard, but the fact I don't NEED the points I'm working for means I have no stress. I'm working through my study with a somewhat calmer attitude than, for example, someone who needs 570 for medicine, and perhaps the real difficulty level and amount of work needed to achieve high points is clearer to me. And tbh, going out drinking once a week is perfectly manageable and acceptable.(Of course you have to know your limits though.)

Oh and when I said a lot of subjects could be covered in 6 months I didn't mean to achieve a C3. I meant to achieve an A1 or A2. I'd say a lot of people, albeit a minority, would agree with me also. It would certainly make me more motivated.

boger

Boston wrote:

Quiet a normal trend is to seriously cut back on drinking and socialising when it comes to important exams. Just have look at the threads on the trinity forum about the schols exams and what people put themselves through before hand. Simple fact is the leaving cert is a competition for places in third level. You're competing with people all across Ireland and you'll want to do the absolute best you can. Doing your best doesn't involved getting hammered once a week. You're talking about something which will affect the rest of your life, and it says a lot that you can't give up underage drinking for a few months in an effort to insure you get that place you want. Imagine how you'll feel if you miss out on the place you really wanted? Will be at least be able to say, I gave it my all? Nope. Getting drunk has a serious tole on your body and when you're body is already under a lot of stress it's not a good idea.

Also the Leaving cert in a way is the most difficult exam you'll ever do because of the competition element to it, and the drive to do the best you can to insure your place. In college if I get 70% and you get 95% that's the same grade under most systems, ( a first class honour). Most people are never under the same level of pressure in college exams as they are for the leaving cert. There's so much BS surrounding it.

You have to remember also, that a lot of course have continuous assessments and exams through out the year, so while you might still be getting 6-7 exams at the end of the year, you could potentially already know you've passed them or exams can be split over the year. In third year I had 4 exams at Christmas and another 4 in June. A further point is that the leaving cert exams are based on material covered over 2 years at least, where as college exams tend to limit it to only what was covered in a few months. My final year exams will be based on material covered in 18 weeks of lectures, 20% of the overall grade is from a final year project I've already completed. 20% of the remaining grade is for other continuous assessment I've already completed. I basically have my degree without having sat a single exam. There is no fear of failure and no pressure that goes with it. The leaving cert on the other hand is all about how much of the last two years can i cram into a two and half hour exam.

just wondering wat course are you doing.

md99

JC 2K3 wrote:

Quite likely spouting bs. However, you cannot honestly say that those doing well in college exams don't drink or go out for the last 2 months of college.

Or perhaps they don't. I am making assumptions.

Some do, some don't, what you seem to ignore is the fact that alcohol affects different people differently, some will still feel a little tired Tuesday morning from a Sunday night session, others will be over it completely by noon on Monday... Its up to each individual to discover what they can take, but preaching this 'ah sure, it's grand' attitude is pointless..

md99

Boston wrote:

Quiet a normal trend is to seriously cut back on drinking and socialising when it comes to important exams. Just have look at the threads on the trinity forum about the schols exams and what people put themselves through before hand. Simple fact is the leaving cert is a competition for places in third level. You're competing with people all across Ireland and you'll want to do the absolute best you can. Doing your best doesn't involved getting hammered once a week. You're talking about something which will affect the rest of your life, and it says a lot that you can't give up underage drinking for a few months in an effort to insure you get that place you want. Imagine how you'll feel if you miss out on the place you really wanted? Will be at least be able to say, I gave it my all? Nope. Getting drunk has a serious tole on your body and when you're body is already under a lot of stress it's not a good idea.

Indeed, finely pointed out, you see so many potential top-category students on the sauce every Saturday night, then sick so not able to work on Sunday, then their Monday is the start of the catch up.... Yet they seem to repeat the cycle over and over, I'm not saying this applies to all great students who are out on the piss (and I don't mean just having a few for the road) but at the end of the day, weekend after weekend it's turning potential A1s into B1s, B1s into C1s....

The REAL issue here is, why can't people look at things in the long run??... It's like this

2 months of Sobriety
+
Leaving Cert
=
Freedom

Maybe alcohol would barely affect most of those who become temporary pioneers for the biggest exam of their lives, maybe none? But why risk it... In JC 2K3s case, at 355 he's basically risking nothing, but this doesn't apply to many. Why risk two months for the rest of your life ? And, not to mention, the 2/3 months of alcoholism that will surely follow the Leaving ;-) That's what I'm waiting for... People get on to me about my refusing to drink at this stage (or not drinking enough in their books), this is what I tell them... and a lot of the time it doesn't work! Another thing is some of my friends are first college students who are drinking constantly themselves, bad balance when mixed with studious sixth years!

fuinneamh

It's not the alcohol that will affect you, its how long you stay up to, stay up to 4 the next morning and your sleeping pattern is ruined for the next day. It's easy to get up on a sunday and do some good study after a good 8-9 hours sleep after drinking but its not so easy on a monday morning after 5 or 6 hours sleep. the only way alcohol will affect your study if you've been puking your guts out the night before.

JC 2K3

md99 wrote:

Another thing is some of my friends are first college students who are drinking constantly themselves, bad balance when mixed with studious sixth years!

lol, once again, my point, why are college exams less important than the LC? You are now spouting the "bs" about college that I apparently was spouting earlier according to Boston.

And I'm preaching organised, sensible and planned drinking as an alternative to giving it up, not simply "ah sure it's grand", I don't know where you got that from.

And wake up, it's not "FREEDOM!!" after the LC. You go to college and have to study there too and if you want to drink you're going to have to plan your drinking around studying. Also, what's the harm in taking Sunday off? We've always been advised by teachers not to study on Sunday and to relax provided we've done enough during the week. This crap about A1s turning into B1s/C1s because someone likes to go out Saturday night doesn't apply if the student has done 3 hours of study per weeknight and 5+ hours on Saturday.

I'm not telling you you should drink. I'm not saying I will be religiously on the piss every weekend either. All I'm saying is I don't get the point of all the fuss about not drinking before the LC.

dcarroll

eh, yeah they do

Boston

JC 2K3 wrote:

I got 480 in my mocks and am confident of 550 in the actual thing. Put it this way, I am working hard, but the fact I don't NEED the points I'm working for means I have no stress. I'm working through my study with a somewhat calmer attitude than, for example, someone who needs 570 for medicine, and perhaps the real difficulty level and amount of work needed to achieve high points is clearer to me. And tbh, going out drinking once a week is perfectly manageable and acceptable.(Of course you have to know your limits though.)

I've known alot of people who thought they could cake walk 500+ points. They've usually ended up getting their second of thrid choice. Getting those points requires A1's and A2's and take it from someone who managed two A1's in the leaving you don't get them without being absolutely outstanding and a cut above the rest in that subject.

Oh and when I said a lot of subjects could be covered in 6 months I didn't mean to achieve a C3. I meant to achieve an A1 or A2. I'd say a lot of people, albeit a minority, would agree with me also. It would certainly make me more motivated.

There are private places you can go to where leaving cert courses are covered in a 6 -7 month period however, in normal schools their not. So point stands that you're being tested on material you've learnt over two years.

boger: I'm doing Engineering at Trinity. A seriously tough course.

JC 2K3 wrote:

lol, once again, my point, why are college exams less important than the LC? You are now spouting the "bs" about college that I apparently was spouting earlier according to Boston.

Are you seriously comparing first year college exams where all you have to do is get the pass grade, to leaving cert exams? You realise that in most colleges and course you can sit the exams twice even three times untill you pass? First year college exams are probably the least important ones you'l lever do. I'm talking about exams in college that actually make a difference to your future.

And wake up, it's not "FREEDOM!!" after the LC. You go to college and have to study there too and if you want to drink you're going to have to plan your drinking around studying.

There is a huge amount of freedom after the LC. There's no one standing over you forcing you to work, no one forcing you to go to lectures or tutorials. You're treated like an adult, free to make your own **** ups. This is a problem for alot of first years, who are used to having teachers on their back keeping them in line. It's only when you get into college to you realise how rigid and stifling secondary schools are.

Also, what's the harm in taking Sunday off? We've always been advised by teachers not to study on Sunday and to relax provided we've done enough during the week. This crap about A1s turning into B1s/C1s because someone likes to go out Saturday night doesn't apply if the student has done 3 hours of study per weeknight and 5+ hours on Saturday.

When I was doing the leaving I took Sundays off. I went and played squash for an hours are so and then relaxed for the day. One problem with going out and getting hammered on a Saturday night is that you loose a nights sleep, it throws your sleep pattern and system all out of whack, and while you may be over the hangover on Sunday.

JC 2K3

Boston wrote:

I've known alot of people who thought they could cake walk 500+ points. They've usually ended up getting their second of thrid choice. Getting those points requires A1's and A2's and take it from someone who managed two A1's in the leaving you don't get them without being absolutely outstanding and a cut above the rest in that subject.

Why thank you.

Boston wrote:

There are private places you can go to where leaving cert courses are covered in a 6 -7 month period however, in normal schools their not. So point stands that you're being tested on material you've learnt over two years.

My point was it's not that tough. However, people do procrastinate and panic at the last minute when they've nothing done for a year and a half.

Boston wrote:

Are you seriously comparing first year college exams where all you have to do is get the pass grade, to leaving cert exams? You realise that in most colleges and course you can sit the exams twice even three times untill you pass? First year college exams are probably the least important ones you'l lever do. I'm talking about exams in college that actually make a difference to your future.

Fair enough, I guess.

Boston wrote:

There is a huge amount of freedom after the LC. There's no one standing over you forcing you to work, no one forcing you to go to lectures or tutorials. You're treated like an adult, free to make your own **** ups. This is a problem for alot of first years, who are used to having teachers on their back keeping them in line. It's only when you get into college to you realise how rigid and stifling secondary schools are.

Perhaps I just have an unusual amount of freedom then. No one's forcing me to work, at this stage there's very little homework and teachers don't care much if it's not done.

Boston wrote:

When I was doing the leaving I took Sundays off. I went and played squash for an hours are so and then relaxed for the day. One problem with going out and getting hammered on a Saturday night is that you loose a nights sleep, it throws your sleep pattern and system all out of whack, and while you may be over the hangover on Sunday.

During the week I go to bed at around 12 and get up at 7:30, Saturday morning I'm up at 9:30 and if I'm out on Saturday I'll be in bed by 3ish and up at around 12 or 1. I don't see how that messes up my sleep pattern, it IS my sleep pattern.

md99

Well, I could continue to fight my ground here but there's no need, since Boston has said everything I was going to say, it's as if you read my mind man, thanks for saving me the typing!

You're exactly right. There is no such thing as cakewalking 550 points, 500 points even. I had to laugh at 'I got 480 in the pres and am confident of at least 550 in the real thing' , I mean this is such a .... I mean, it's just ridiculous. Not that you couldn't get 550, but being that confident of at least a 70 point leap for the real thing... ? When already bordering the 500s? I don't think Einstein himself could have been confident of such an achievement. In my own case I got 500 in the pres, I'm fairly confident but a jump to 550? Maybe it'll happen, but jeez.. That's pretty much straight A2s, and getting an A in the Leaving Cert in anything isnt as simple as knowing what your doing and having the work done. You also have to excell on the day, during the exam. That can't be counted on... You may be at a no-stress advantage over others, but this can equally work against you. Stress during the exam is often a good thing, a motivator to keep writing and give the best damn effort you can, whereas someone stress free often cares less, or feels the exam is not as important for them, and while they may have the same A1 knowledge as the stressed candidate, may end of with a lower result.

As regards the 'FREEDOM' part... Well, Bostons done it all for me again.

md99

Except for this..

JC 2K3 wrote:

Perhaps I just have an unusual amount of freedom then. No one's forcing me to work, at this stage there's very little homework and teachers don't care much if it's not done.

It's not your amount of freedom which is unusual, I'm sure many are in the same boat as you. In my case, I am free to work/study however much or little I feel like, drink as much as I want, spend as much or as little money, drive whenever/wherever I want, do my homework or not, free to go to school or not to bother...

So that's all well and good, except for, oh wait, if I DONT do the work and get the points, I wont have the FREEDOM to do my course...

JC 2K3

md99 wrote:

getting an A in the Leaving Cert in anything isnt as simple as knowing what your doing and having the work done. You also have to excell on the day, during the exam. That can't be counted on...

So it's all a matter of luck?

I'd say it's not so much excelling on the day as simply not having a bad day. If your exam technique is good you most likely won't.

My theories:
1. You can get 550 in the leaving without giving up drinking.
2. It is possible to be confident in getting 550.

I'm not saying that that is the case for everyone, I never tried to argue that.

I don't understand why you think my confidence is a negative thing though.

I'm willing to say "touché" on the freedom argument, however. I made assumptions about college.

Rozabeez

Your confidence is not a negative thing, but lets hope it doesn't let you down. Perhaps some of us are a little intimdated or even jealous of said confidence? Or maybe it comes across as cocky/arrogant? Overly confident maybe? Who knows?

Boston

JC 2K3 wrote:

Why thank you.

You haven't got any A1's yet mate. Mocks are a pile of crap and you should know that. A1's are very political in how they are assigned. There's a fixed percentage for each subject, and then a fixed percentage for each correction centre.

As for freedom, I'd hasard a guess you've never had it. I thought i had alot of freedom in school. You don't realise how much hand holding goes on in school. When you get to college all your successes and failures are your own, there on your own head. Your parents are no longer involved in your education, you lecturers don't know you, and in most cases don't want to know you. nobody know nor cares if you're going to lectures. A lecturer isn't like a teacher, in that lecturing isn't their primary role, they do it as a side earner. They have no vested interest in you succeeding. You're in for a real culture shock when you get to college.

Also what are you basing your theories on, do you know anybody that has achieved the success you claim you will, and still drank regularly during the leaving cert? I know alot of people who managed 500+ points (I'm one of them) I can't think of one that drank in the months preceding the leaving. You might find some, but really most people intelligent enough to achieve those points have enough cop on not to do what you suggest.

ninebeanrows

The Leaving Cert is like a box of chocolates, ya just don't know what your gonna get..

The liklyhood is if you do a decent amount of study you can get yourself to 460/470, after that it gets much more difficult as you talking about B1's A2's and of course A1's.

You could be sick on the day or anything so to count your chickens is a fools decision and only a fools.

As for drinking, I'm probably going to stop now.

Things are going to come thick and fast now with the Field Trip write up and 2 oral exams. You won't literally have time to go out and drink.

But tbh JC 2K3 i think your a idiot (tit) if you think your going to cake walk 550, it isn't hard if all goes well for ya but whose to say how your going to cope under the actual LC pressure. You could go into English and just flip out, you could have the ****s, you could have a BUG or something.

JC 2K3

lolz, I love these pointless arguments.

Boston wrote:

You haven't got any A1's yet mate. Mocks are a pile of crap and you should know that. A1's are very political in how they are assigned. There's a fixed percentage for each subject, and then a fixed percentage for each correction centre.

We've had this discussion on here before, there's no proof that happens.

Boston wrote:

As for freedom, I'd hasard a guess you've never had it. I thought i had alot of freedom in school. You don't realise how much hand holding goes on in school. When you get to college all your successes and failures are your own, there on your own head. Your parents are no longer involved in your education, you lecturers don't know you, and in most cases don't want to know you. nobody know nor cares if you're going to lectures. A lecturer isn't like a teacher, in that lecturing isn't their primary role, they do it as a side earner. They have no vested interest in you succeeding. You're in for a real culture shock when you get to college.

JC 2K3 wrote:

I'm willing to say "touché" on the freedom argument, however. I made assumptions about college.

Boston wrote:

Also what are you basing your theories on, do you know anybody that has achieved the success you claim you will, and still drank regularly during the leaving cert? I know alot of people who managed 500+ points (I'm one of them) I can't think of one that drank in the months preceding the leaving. You might find some, but really most people intelligent enough to achieve those points have enough cop on not to do what you suggest.

You make it seem like I'm recommending to everyone to drink as much as possible and forget about studying in the last 2 months of the LC year. All I said was that if you could plan your studying around hangovers and you felt it wasn't affecting you too much then there wasn't any reason to give it up.

Weathercheck wrote:

You could be sick on the day or anything so to count your chickens is a fools decision and only a fools.

Being sick would be an extraordinary circumstance and would be extremely unlucky.

Weathercheck wrote:

Things are going to come thick and fast now with the Field Trip write up and 2 oral exams. You won't literally have time to go out and drink.

I'm fluent in Irish, amn't counting French(although I'll do a bit of work for it anyway) and don't do Geography. And besides, even if I needed to work hard on all those three subject like yourself(presumably), I don't see why I wouldn't have time to go out Saturday night...

Weathercheck wrote:

But tbh JC 2K3 i think your a idiot (tit) if you think your going to cake walk 550, it isn't hard if all goes well for ya but whose to say how your going to cope under the actual LC pressure. You could go into English and just flip out, you could have the ****s, you could have a BUG or something.

Firstly, I never said I was going to cake walk 550, Boston did. What I remember saying was that I was going to do 3 hours of study every weekday and 5 hours on Saturday, taking Sunday off and having the option to go out on Saturday if I wished.

Secondly, I'm not counting English, so even if I happen to "flip out", it won't be all that costly.

Boston

JC 2K3 wrote:

lolz, I love these pointless arguments.

We've had this discussion on here before, there's no proof that happens.

It's called a bell curve, the leaving cert is graded by it. It's statistical fact. You never see much variation in the numbers of A's, B's, C's and passes.

JC 2K3

That's just the nature of stats. There's no proof that examiners are told to give out X amount of As and Y amount of Bs etc.

md99

Boston wrote:

It's called a bell curve, the leaving cert is graded by it. It's statistical fact. You never see much variation in the numbers of A's, B's, C's and passes.

We're back to the bell curve argument again, something I seem to have started in another topic which proved a little confidential... Some people, for some reason refuse to believe that this is the way the system works (Indeed, I wish it wasn't done this way..)

Evidence? I have no written evidence. I have, however, the word of mouth from several of my teachers who correct the exams themselves that they're only allowed a certain number of each grade in their bundle, that they have to mark up and mark down in certain cases to fit this system, I don't see it anywhere in writing online... Does anyone know where to find this? But I have no reason to question the word of these teachers, why would they make up such a thing?

Boston

JC 2K3 wrote:

That's just the nature of stats. There's no proof that examiners are told to give out X amount of As and Y amount of Bs etc.

Their not told that. They mark the papers and then send them to their supervisor to check that the awarded marks are in line with "guidelines" and the rest of the papers being marked. It's a very course correction, you won't get individual corrector by corrector quotas for grades. If they are found to be marked too easily or too strictly they are sent back to be remarked. It is not the nature of statistics since the difficultly of papers can vary wildly year to year, however the results are always pretty much the same year in year out. It's a dynamic way of maintaining standards and the CAO system.

md99

Agreed, perfect example to prove this is the 2006 maths paper, due to its new (pre-1992 course) author it was a bit of a leap from the normal standard, the standard in the years before having been fairly common each year... Yet the end grades were all around the same, how did this happen??? Was 2007 Year of the Mathletes, or was it just marked to a curve as always?

me2gud4u

yeh i'd just like to add to that, my mother is an examiner and every july we have have about three hundred scripts in our house and it is a real eye opener. She has been correcting for the last twenty yrs are so, much to my horror, seriously the pay is dismal and they have to spend hours slaving over the scripts.Not only that but you would not believe the amount of statistical work they must compile, filling out forms with the grades, then how many got certain grades, they have to send random scripts to their chief supervising examiner (they all have one and that examiner makes sure the examiner is correcting it right and so that the standard of correcting is in line all across the board.ie they might pick the best one they have corrected, the worst, and then a few mediocre ones, it's such a rigorous process) and it is true that they have to make sure the number of A1s, A2s and so on conform to other yr statistics. I have seen it with my own eyes. so there ya go i don't really contribute that often but just a nougat of info there maybe to put leaving certers at ease, ur scripts will be corrected properly and what u get is what u ultimately deserve.

md99

me2gud4u wrote:

yeh i'd just like to add to that, my mother is an examiner and every july we have have about three hundred scripts in our house and it is a real eye opener. She has been correcting for the last twenty yrs are so, much to my horror, seriously the pay is dismal and they have to spend hours slaving over the scripts.Not only that but you would not believe the amount of statistical work they must compile, filling out forms with the grades, then how many got certain grades, they have to send random scripts to their chief supervising examiner (they all have one and that examiner makes sure the examiner is correcting it right and so that the standard of correcting is in line all across the board.ie they might pick the best one they have corrected, the worst, and then a few mediocre ones, it's such a rigorous process) and it is true that they have to make sure the number of A1s, A2s and so on conform to other yr statistics. I have seen it with my own eyes. so there ya go i don't really contribute that often but just a nougat of info there maybe to put leaving certers at ease, ur scripts will be corrected properly and what u get is what u ultimately deserve.

To quote Larry David....


BIIIINNNN-GOOOOOOOOOO!

Although I don't know about this 'what you get is what you ultimately deserve', I think a few borderline As knocked down to Bs and the like might disagree!

me2gud4u

true, well i guess that's where the SEC cover their backs with the appeal process

cocoa

md99 wrote:

Although I don't know about this 'what you get is what you ultimately deserve', I think a few borderline As knocked down to Bs and the like might disagree!

ok, I'm not going to get into the argument over marking to a curve happening or not, it is as far as i can see, mostly irrelevant anyway. Point is at A1 and A2 level they do mark hard and some examiners can be really stupid and unfair. The thing you don't want, is to need a recheck to reach the points you need, because even if you do get marked up, likelihood is you've already lost a year of your course, because the places are filled.

This is why I don't understand when people complain about mock marking. No matter how badly it was marked, it is still an indication of what might happen in the summer, so take it into account and try and get your grade without a recheck.

JC 2K3

I found this interesting blog entry by Sarah Carey, a columnist for the Sunday Indo, from last year:

http://www.sarahcarey.ie/2006/05/28/if-nobody-fails-the-exam-the-qualification-is-meaningless/

At the end it quotes former UL president Edward Walsh as saying that he believed a bell curve marking system should be introduced to the LC.

Now I don't know about you, but if a someone in such a high ranking position in the education system is saying it should be introduced, then it hardly exists already now does it?

RandolphEsq

Surely if you get a paper recorrected,that bell curve thing wont apply?
And if theres a set marking scheme which you can see yourself, I don't know how there is a set grading process

md99

JC 2K3 wrote:

I found this interesting blog entry by Sarah Carey, a columnist for the Sunday Indo, from last year:

http://www.sarahcarey.ie/2006/05/28/if-nobody-fails-the-exam-the-qualification-is-meaningless/

At the end it quotes former UL president Edward Walsh as saying that he believed a bell curve marking system should be introduced to the LC.

Now I don't know about you, but if a someone in such a high ranking position in the education system is saying it should be introduced, then it hardly exists already now does it?

Uhhh, maybe in the SECs brilliant attempts to cover their backs they might have arranged one high-up person to boost what they claim to be true? I don't think the wishes of one UL President are much of a match to the word of all the secondary school teachers/correctors....

JC , you've just heard meguds.. personal account, i'm sure you've heard it from plenty of teachers in your own school, why do you refuse to believe this happens, it's not going to change what happens your own paper at the end of the day... megud..'s has just wriiten about how her mother corrected papers for 20 years and about how they were marked to a curve, and now you're linking us to something Edward Walsh says? What is that gonna change, one respected persons opinion versus the word of Irish secondary school teachers and exam correctors? Is this guy the Messiah, or are you stuck for material here?

Boston

The person that writes that blog must be like you JC. I mean in the same way you like taking different sets of exams which arn't related to each other at all (college Vs leaving) she compares exam results from tests 20 years ago to today. But anyway you've completely taking the wrong thing out of that quote. He suggesting a normalisation of the way in which all papers are graded. It's well know that certain subjects have a higher rate of honors grades awarded then others, that's often deliberate. It's far easier to get an A is applied maths (something like 20% from what I remember) then honours maths. It's far from a standard bell curve across the board. He's not saying that the results aren't statistically aligned, merely that getting 90+ doesn't necessarily mean you where in the top 90 percentile.