Planning issues - post them here MOD WARNING post #1

boxtysugarbulb

BryanF wrote: »

is this an existing system?

contact your local authority water section and ask to speak their engineer outlining your query/ ask what the requirements are. post them here when you know ta

Hello Bryan. No, this is a proposed system for a proposed housing estate. It's rather close to a (proposed) dwelling as well as a couple of existing residential gardens. I thought there might be some national guidelines covering such things - EPA, for instance - but I can't find anything.

Dubchick81

Hi.. I'm in the process of buying a house and in the process have discovered there is no planning permission for the drive.. Its just been concreted and has no gates.. But anyone I've mentioned this to has said they didn't think planning was required for a drive.. Its been laid for more than 7 years so legally (i'm told) the local authority can't do anything.. Anyone any thoughts?

rayjdav

Dubchick81 wrote: »

Hi.. I'm in the process of buying a house and in the process have discovered there is no planning permission for the drive.. Its just been concreted and has no gates.. But anyone I've mentioned this to has said they didn't think planning was required for a drive.. Its been laid for more than 7 years so legally (i'm told) the local authority can't do anything.. Anyone any thoughts?

What permission is required for is the actually opening up of the boundary wall onto the public thouroughfare, path/roadway.
If as you say it is just concreted and no opening??, this does not require permission.
Re the 7 years, the council have no enforcement rights but it is still UNAUTHORISED DEVELOPMENT regardless of what Billy down the pub said.... The onus is on the owner to prove that it is there at least that time or the coco, if they wished, could chase it up. Unlikely, but they could, at your/owners expense.

Dubchick81

rayjdav wrote: »

What permission is required for is the actually opening up of the boundary wall onto the public thouroughfare, path/roadway.
If as you say it is just concreted and no opening??, this does not require permission.
Re the 7 years, the council have no enforcement rights but it is still UNAUTHORISED DEVELOPMENT regardless of what Billy down the pub said.... The onus is on the owner to prove that it is there at least that time or the coco, if they wished, could chase it up. Unlikely, but they could, at your/owners expense.

Am pretty clueless here about the whole thing TBH.. There is no gates/wall onto the property.. So you're saying that the fact the garden fence has been removed is why PP is required??
Long story behind the purchase of the house but basically we agreed a price on it with the seller, paid our deposit and later found out he's selling it to Mrs. ?, and in the contract of her sale is that she must sell to us at the agreed price! No idea why this is happening or the reasoning behind it.. So.. basically we've been made aware of it before our contract were drawn up.. She has to, apparently, supply in writing that its been checked and confirmed that there's no PP but its been longer than the 7 years there and she can sell without applying the retention.. then we hav to decided if we want her to rip it up and put it back as was, if we want her to apply for retention, or if want to do the same with the letter to state we are aware of the situation... We've yet to meet with our solicitor to be advise which is the best way to go...
I'm just confused about everyone saying PP isn't required for a drive...

Thanks for your reply

sydthebeat

...She has to, apparently, supply in writing that its been checked and confirmed that there's no PP but its been longer than the 7 years there and she can sell without applying the retention..

that is NOT correct.

as raydav has stated, it its unauthorised, the it always unauthorised. the 7 year rule only stops the local authority from enforcing action on it.

If plannig is required, and all parties still want the sale to go through... you can agree to hold back a percentage of the sale costs (say arbitrary 8K) until planning retention is granted. the seller should fund the total cost of the retention application.

Dubchick81

sydthebeat wrote: »

that is NOT correct.

as raydav has stated, it its unauthorised, the it always unauthorised. the 7 year rule only stops the local authority from enforcing action on it.

If plannig is required, and all parties still want the sale to go through... you can agree to hold back a percentage of the sale costs (say arbitrary 8K) until planning retention is granted. the seller should fund the total cost of the retention application.

OHhhh... OK.. thanks for that..
I'm sure once we meet with our solicitor he'll state the same but I just wanted to have some clue going in just in case... Thanks for all the replies..

prq

Hi all,
I have a neighbor building a wooden wall/fence around 2m high between our back gardens (where none previously existed). This unfortunately blocks our view to a nearby lake.

If I understand this link correctly http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2001/en/si/0600.html#sched2 , in particular Class 11, a wall with more than 1.2m cannot be built there without a planning permission?

Is there any other regulation regarding blocking a neighbor's view?

Thanks in advance!

muffler

prq wrote: »

Hi all,
I have a neighbor building a wooden wall/fence around 2m high between our back gardens (where none previously existed). This unfortunately blocks our view to a nearby lake.

If I understand this link correctly http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2001/en/si/0600.html#sched2 , in particular Class 11, a wall with more than 1.2m cannot be built there without a planning permission?

Is there any other regulation regarding blocking a neighbor's view?

Thanks in advance!

The height exemption is 2.0m to the rear and 1.2m to the front.

Unfortunately no one has the right to a view.


Edit/ I should have said that Class 5 applies here.

Poor Uncle Tom

prq wrote: »

Hi all,
I have a neighbor building a wooden wall/fence around 2m high between our back gardens (where none previously existed). This unfortunately blocks our view to a nearby lake.

If I understand this link correctly http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2001/en/si/0600.html#sched2 , in particular Class 11, a wall with more than 1.2m cannot be built there without a planning permission?

Is there any other regulation regarding blocking a neighbor's view?

Thanks in advance!

I'm afraid you are not reading it entirely right, if the fence is at the rear of the houses it is allowed to be built to 2m in height without planning permission.

Also, there is no right to retain any views in the Planning Legislation.

prq

Thank you!

Coga

A quick question, is it possible to go in for planning with no velux windows on the roof to the back of the house but incorporate them during the build- do they require planning permission? Can anyone direct me to the relevant legislation please?

Poor Uncle Tom

Coga wrote: »

A quick question, is it possible to go in for planning with no velux windows on the roof to the back of the house but incorporate them during the build- do they require planning permission? Can anyone direct me to the relevant legislation please?

Putting roof lights on the rear roof surface is generally taken as being all right without planning permission (due to recent Board Pleanala cases). It is advisable to get this in writing from the LA involved before doing the work though.

However, you cannot incorporate any perceived exempted developments until the initial construction is completed.

Outside of the Planning & Development Act 2000, and SI No. 600 of 2001, there is not any specific legislation regarding roof lights, to my knowledge.

Coga

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

Putting roof lights on the rear roof surface is generally taken as being all right without planning permission (due to recent Board Pleanala cases). It is advisable to get this in writing from the LA involved before doing the work though.

However, you cannot incorporate any perceived exempted developments until the initial construction is completed.

Outside of the Planning & Development Act 2000, and SI No. 600 of 2001, there is not any specific legislation regarding roof lights, to my knowledge.

Thanks Poor Uncle Tom.

Purdia

Good morning,
I would be grateful if anyone can help with the following.
Hoping to buy a site which has planning permission for house, planning permission expires next June. Vendor is happy to apply for an extension for planning permission to allow extra time for me to complete the build. However, I anticipate sale closing very shortly and we *should* have property up to wall plate level before the original planning permission expires.
My question however, is this, do we have to stop construction when the application for time extension is being decided. If we do, the delay of waiting 8/10 weeks would be significant *IF* the time extension is refused. If it is granted, obviously it wouldn't matter.
I asked the planning authority this question and they didn't actually know the answer! They said they would have to seek legal advice, which would take time.

Hope I have explained the scenario correctly. Thanks in anticipation.

muffler

Purdia wrote: »

Good morning,
I would be grateful if anyone can help with the following.
Hoping to buy a site which has planning permission for house, planning permission expires next June. Vendor is happy to apply for an extension for planning permission to allow extra time for me to complete the build. However, I anticipate sale closing very shortly and we *should* have property up to wall plate level before the original planning permission expires.
My question however, is this, do we have to stop construction when the application for time extension is being decided. If we do, the delay of waiting 8/10 weeks would be significant *IF* the time extension is refused. If it is granted, obviously it wouldn't matter.
I asked the planning authority this question and they didn't actually know the answer! They said they would have to seek legal advice, which would take time.

Hope I have explained the scenario correctly. Thanks in anticipation.

Thats an interesting question and Im a bit surprised that the PA would have to seek legal advice on something like this. To the best of my knowledge you can continue working while an extension of duration is sought. I have never known a refusal in these situations unless of course the development was being carried out in contravention of the original grant of PP.

But what will help is the fact that you (or the vendor) can now apply for an extension of duration without any works having been commenced. Maybe this could be incorporated as a condition of sale.

mal_1

Purdia wrote: »

Good morning,
I would be grateful if anyone can help with the following.
Hoping to buy a site which has planning permission for house, planning permission expires next June. Vendor is happy to apply for an extension for planning permission to allow extra time for me to complete the build. However, I anticipate sale closing very shortly and we *should* have property up to wall plate level before the original planning permission expires.
My question however, is this, do we have to stop construction when the application for time extension is being decided. If we do, the delay of waiting 8/10 weeks would be significant *IF* the time extension is refused. If it is granted, obviously it wouldn't matter.
I asked the planning authority this question and they didn't actually know the answer! They said they would have to seek legal advice, which would take time.

Hope I have explained the scenario correctly. Thanks in anticipation.

I take it you intend constructing the house through to completion or do you intend just building it to a stage which is 'practically complete' for planning purposes such as wallplate level and or the roof on, and leave it?

You kind of answered your own question, and practicalities of it are, if commence building the application you have and are at a 'practically complete' stage when the planning expires in June 2013 then you can proceed and complete the works beyond that time. Hence you shouldn't need to apply for planning again for the same building.
Be careful in the current climate regarding funding and mortgage providers as it is they that hold you up, and may question the tightness of this.

sydthebeat

Purdia wrote: »

Good morning,
I would be grateful if anyone can help with the following.
Hoping to buy a site which has planning permission for house, planning permission expires next June. Vendor is happy to apply for an extension for planning permission to allow extra time for me to complete the build. However, I anticipate sale closing very shortly and we *should* have property up to wall plate level before the original planning permission expires.
My question however, is this, do we have to stop construction when the application for time extension is being decided. If we do, the delay of waiting 8/10 weeks would be significant *IF* the time extension is refused. If it is granted, obviously it wouldn't matter.
I asked the planning authority this question and they didn't actually know the answer! They said they would have to seek legal advice, which would take time.

Hope I have explained the scenario correctly. Thanks in anticipation.

a few points:

1. you do not have to stop construction while the 'extension of duration' permission is being decided. The parent permission is still applicable until the day it expires.

2. you have two options. You can try to get the build to a 'substantially complete' stage (usually blockwork complete) and apply for an extension of duration of permission for a length of time which you think is reasonable to complete, say 12 months. This type of permission is usually not problematic once youve done nothing unauthorised on site.
The other option is not to commence the development and apply for an extension of duration of the permission for a further 5 years. This type of application can be problematic if the county development plan has changed since the parent application was made. i would only consider this if there was no way of getting the build substantially complete prior to expiry of permission.

BryanF

Purdia,
This may not be relevant AT ALL, but have you/ your solicitor/ architect viewed the original application and conditions: often with rural housing the permission is linked to the applicants housing need - it may be worth checking out

Purdia

Thank you for the replies, I am grateful. It is an unrestricted planning permission, not linked to housing need. I just need to sign a declaration that it will be my primary permanent residence (which it will be).
Fortunately it will also be 100% self funded, so not relying on a bank etc. I am confident that it will be "substantially complete" prior to expiry of original planning permission so long as we can commence building as soon as possible after sale and commencement notice lodged. It will be a self build by hubby, but I would prefer the extra reassurance of having a little bit of extra time "just in case" on the life of the planning permission.
I am also of the view that we should still be able to build during the time extension application stage, but was just ??? at the planning authority's response to submit my request in writing for them to refer to their legal advisors

Thanks once again I am very grateful to the Boardies

JeanLucPicard

Hi

Can someone please advise.

I have an opportunity to purchase a site in Co Wexford. It is in an area where the planners have deemed that planning will only be given to a direct relative of the landowner.

I will not be purchasing the land unless I am sure of a good chance of permission being granted.

Here are my questions;

If I was to buy it now......Is there a certain time that has to pass before I would be seen as the land owner and be granted permission?


Is there any other way around this?

I hope so!!

Many thanks

JLP

muffler

JLP, please read the forum charter before posting again. Asking for ways to circumvent the planning process will have an unhappy ending for you.

BryanF

Read the local development plan section on housing need requirements for the actual stipulations. They all generally are some variation of

Do you live in the immediate area?
Do you work in the immediate area?
Do you have a family connection in the immediate area?
Have you a housing need in the immediate area?
Etc

And can you prove the above for a period of 7+ years

JeanLucPicard

muffler wrote: »

JLP, please read the forum charter before posting again. Asking for ways to circumvent the planning process will have an unhappy ending for you.

My bad Muffler. Didnt realise I went against the charter

musclesmcginty

All,

How much specific design detail is required (or wise) to have before having a pre planning meeting with the C.C. planning office?

I have some obvious details like local needs, site location, floor area, 1.5 storey, style. But no design drawings as of yet.

mal_1

musclesmcginty wrote: »

All,

How much specific design detail is required (or wise) to have before having a pre planning meeting with the C.C. planning office?

I have some obvious details like local needs, site location, floor area, 1.5 storey, style. But no design drawings as of yet.

There is no set requirements for a pre-planning meeting however it would be advisable to have as much as possible, and depending on the council, they may have a list of information that it would preferable to have.

If you are DIYing it and meeting without profession assistance, it would be reasonable to have in addition to your listed items, some idea of a site block plan with the location of house & garage if included, entrance, foul treatment area shown. Maybe photos of the site in a way that represents it best in context (rather a green field with a hedge in the distance) Also rather describing the style of the house, which mean different things to different people, have decent photos of similar houses.

rayjdav

musclesmcginty wrote: »

All,

How much specific design detail is required (or wise) to have before having a pre planning meeting with the C.C. planning office?

I have some obvious details like local needs, site location, floor area, 1.5 storey, style. But no design drawings as of yet.

Not too much detail. I would advise design wise just basic sketch/pic and OS map of area. If you go too loaded into one, you may be digging a hole for yourself so if it is left vague enough to allow for amendments, within reason, during actual design stage. If you know single storey or two storey/storey and half should be enough info re the house. Info like percolation areas of no interest to junior planners, as most don't have a clue what one does.....

Coco's have a tendancy to "forget" what was actually agreed in pre plannings anyway so use it only as a very basic guidance.

Ramonapixie

I think you should supply as much info as you can. Mal 1 is spot on with what he said. I dont agree that the less you give them the less they can hold you to either. You are not tied down to anything during the course of a pre planning meeting, you are there for advice,to sound out ideas and to get an indication of how a planner may view the application should one come in. At best you can get a favourable response. They cannot tell you you will get pp. Planners dont get too "bogged" (pardon the pun) down with septic tanks because that is more the remit of the environmental services dept. In my opinion you should seek advice from there also as well as the roads dept for entrance advice, if you need it.
Good Luck:pac:

bellsapiper

Hey all

I could possibly be posting this in the wrong place so apologise if I do. My father has land in which he wants to get permission to build and then sell it onto me "subject to planning permision". So what exactly does my dad have to apply for? Outline planning? If so do you need certain sizes and layout of the house extra? We havent a clue where to start.

Any help would be appreciated:)

sydthebeat

bellsapiper wrote: »

Hey all

I could possibly be posting this in the wrong place so apologise if I do. My father has land in which he wants to get permission to build and then sell it onto me "subject to planning permision". So what exactly does my dad have to apply for? Outline planning? If so do you need certain sizes and layout of the house extra? We havent a clue where to start.

Any help would be appreciated:)

Hi

the best thing to do is for you to actually apply for permission on the site yourself, so then you would be still be buying "subject to permission" but you wouldnt have the hassle of going through a needless outline permission at all. You dont need to be the landowner to apply for permission on the land, you just need a letter from the landowner giving you permission to make the application.

You see, if you apply for permission yourself, all the necessary conditions can be directly applied to you ie local needs, occupancy conditions etc.

john242

I am looking for a bit of advice in regards to sterilised land and the planning process. A relative has agreed to purchase a plot of land subject to planning permission and has had an application prepared by a local architect. The planning has been refused on the bases that the land is sterilised. The council has agreed that he would meet all the other criteria for local needs for the development and didn’t in principle have an issue with the design so the only stumbling block on the progression is the sterilise land or would appear to be anyway.
My question, is there any way around the land sterilisation, i.e.: can you rescind it or have it lifted, would it have a time limit or if he were to purchase the land now will the sterilisation pass to him as the new owner or would the purchase effectively nullify it.