What happens if brother & sister mate?

sudzs

What happens if a brother and sister Rotweiller mate succesfully?

Will the resulting puppies be o.k or is it dependant on the broader family history?

Or should it be discouraged out of hand?

Alfasudcrazy

I would not even think about it - had my brother and sister dobermans neutered at 6 months - advise you do the same. :eek:

golden

If there is genetic disorders somewhere down the line the pups have more of a chance of getting that disorder.

peasant

Just look at Alabama


Not a good idea ... the pure-bred genepool is shallow enough, mating siblings should be avoided at all cost.

Hootie

I would not recommend it. I had 2 pedigree brother white retrievers and a neighbor had the sister, I was told that if they did mate you could be fined by the kennel club for misconduct if you tried to sell the pups.

2funki4wheelz

Interbreeding like what golden said, allows genetic 'disorders'.

Basically recessive genes (the 'weaker' less preferable ones with unwanted characteristics) get a chance to emerge so things like deafness, hip dysplasia and eye abnormalities are a lot more likely to affect the litter.

Just avoid it. I was watching a US show on animal rescue and they cleared out a house of lab crosses that had been interbreeding and a huge proportion of the pups had tumors and turned in eyelids because of the interbreeding.

Alfasudcrazy

In my view this is blatant animal cruelty and should be outlawed.:rolleyes:

golden

posted in error sorry

Lizard Queen

If they mate there could be alot of genetic problems with the problem of over breeding of dogs . Most of the animals are related . When big breeds are going to be mated alot of work goes into hip scoring and making sure there will be no problems. The pregnacy may not even go full term if there is a problem. I would recommend neutering . It reduces the risk of tumours,agression,straying,unwanted pups and cancer.If the dog is neutered it will increse your dogs life by 2 years.

fits

I'm gobsmacked that this question has even been asked to be quite honest.
Totally gobsmacked

peasant

somebody cue the "Duelling Banjos"

fits

I'm guessing the 'event' has already occurred, in which case an emergency spay would be a good idea.

Steve_o

Very bad idea, The pups would be seriously defective, its borderline cruelty!

SuzyS1972

fits wrote:

I'm gobsmacked that this question has even been asked to be quite honest.
Totally gobsmacked

Nothing suprises me anymore when it comes to the general Irish public and their dogs

Glowing

Thats a disturbing thought. Are you encouraging this Sudzs?

Alfasudcrazy

SuzyS1972 wrote:

Nothing suprises me anymore when it comes to the general Irish public and their dogs

Sure coming from a person who has to post on a forum to find a place to buy fags - what would you expect. :rolleyes:

Our man in Havana

Try to refrain from personal attacks guys or jokes - I will allow the thread to stay open if this is to be a "proper" discussion on genetics!

I know that inbreeding when it is done has to be maintained carefully & I would not expect dogs to need to be inbred any more than they ordinarily are! I know of small animal breeders who will inbreed to increase the chance of a certain colour or genetic trait but you can only inbreed once then out breed the babies to minimise the risk of problems! Say for instance I have a lilac male gerbil his wife is an argente - the average 6 babies per litter 1 in each litter should be lilac - now if he has a daughter who is lilac if I inbreed the 2 (I don't!) the chances of lilacs should increase etc - then I would have to out breed the babies to stop any mutations accuring!

This happens all over the animal world! Always makes me laugh at the money some royal pythons fetch cause they are odd colours - you can pay a fortune for genetic oddities! I mean I have seen snakes being sold for £25k!!!!!!!!

Sigma Force

Put it this way would you interbreed with your relative?
If the accident has already happened get that dog spayed now. Too many problems can arise not to mention such a large dog could have 12 puppies or more.

Get the female spayed vets will spay pregnant dogs.
Get the male neutered as well.

peasant

Bond-007 wrote:

I know that inbreeding when it is done has to be maintained carefully & I would not expect dogs to need to be inbred any more than they ordinarily are!

I would strongly object to the usage of the word "need" in this sentence.
There is absolutely no "need" for inbreeding, and "maintained carefully" or not ...it shouldn't happen at all.

The reason why it happens at all is so that the offspring (hopefully) comes closer to a desired standard.
But there is no "need" for that other than commercial and vanity reasons.

But seenashow any breed organsition (for dogs anyway) is now nothing else than an "inbreeders club", nobody bats an eylid unless it's siblings or parent and child that get mated (and even that happens often enough)

We got our one and only pedigree dog before we knew what we know now.

Looking at her "bloodline" gives you the shivers. Her "grandfather" on her mother's side and her "father" are one and the same dog. (So her mother really is her half-sister). Several of her ancestors have the same father as well.

And yes ...she definetly is a bit "Duelling Banjos"

Alfasudcrazy

I think this thread should be closed as I find the idea being discussed perverse. I just think of my own two inbreeding and the thought just disgusts me. :mad:

Our man in Havana

Thread reopened by request.

I am happy to leave this open as a honest discussion of gentics. This thread is not for name calling. I just want some honest discussion.

peasant

That:

Looking at her "bloodline" gives you the shivers. Her "grandfather" on her mother's side and her "father" are one and the same dog. (So her mother really is her half-sister). Several of her ancestors have the same father as well.

btw is from a so called "champion bloodline" and the breeder is a life-long member of the British Kennel club as well as a founding and active member of the Bearded collie club ...so not some backyard amateur.

Then also take into account that all modern day Bearded Collies stem from three parent animals, and you're left wondering how they're still alive at all

Our man in Havana

Like syrian hamsters all stem from 1 pregnant female found in the wild! All pet degus come from 10 specimens collected by Americans in Cuba.

peasant

What's interesting though, is that Hamsters still look pretty much like Hamsters and Chinchillas look like Chinchillas.

Now compare that to dogs, where you've got Chihuahuas and Irish Wolfhounds, Italian Greyhounds and Saint Bernards ...opposites that couldn't possibly be more pronounced, all coming from the same genepool.

Are dogs more genetically unstable than other animals?
Or is it just that they got way too much outside influence through very selective breeding?

Anybody know anything?

(Scientific, like ...:D )

Our man in Havana

Hmmmm seems we need to do some more research! I read a bit on genetics cause of the colour thingy in gerbils etc but thats all! Confused the heck out of me!

peasant

The problem with animal genetics is that they are a tad more complimacated than good old Mr Mendel's pink and white sweetpeas ...what with the dominant and recessive combinations and the generations and all that.

Read something about German shepherds recently ...them with the terribly sloped backline of late.

Some breeders are trying to bring back the straight back and can't ...the "straight back gene" (if there is such a thing, which there probably isn't) has been lost in the current population.
They need to bring in "fresh blood" from other countries and even do some cross-breeding from outside the breed.

2funki4wheelz

I'm reading a book 'How Dogs Think' by Stanley Coren at the mo, it has some talk about genetics and is an interesting read about dogs generally.

Mad bit about the early dogs/wolves figuring our what appealed to humans - such as the pup characteristics. Humans upped this puppy-quality by breeding to develop Cavalier King Charles/Pugs etc which stay quite puppy-like. This development bizarrly means these breeds lhave the lowest number of dog language (gestures/behaviour) for adult pack commuincation.

I have to say peasant's remarks are pretty unnerving, even the fact you have to research so much in pedigrees to see what are the possible breed specific problems. I'm sticking with healthy smart corss breeds for the moment!

Sigma Force

Many people studying the behaviour of dogs study their relatives lets take wolves for example which are a good comparason. Wolves don't interbreed with relatives as far as I am aware. Correct me if I am wrong.

Demonique

sudzs wrote:

What happens if a brother and sister Rotweiller mate succesfully?

They end up looking like Prince Charles, who's the product of cousins

Garth

There are times that "linebreeding" I believe is practiced by experienced and informed breeders. Whether that is acceptable or not is not the question here as the OP is obviously not an experienced or informed breeder.

The bottom line is, however, if you have to ask about it on an internet forum, you don't know enough to do it.

As someone else already said, if the animal is already expecting, have her spayed.