The (ongoing) Family Feud

hobie

Well it sure $$$$$ up the traffic situation this morning ...... took me $$$$$ ages to get from Homebase to Ivans .....

Limerick Dude

Liam Byrne wrote:

There are 2 things involved in this story that would make me ignore it:

1) As long as the scumbags are knocking each other off, and not the general public, there's no loss

2) As long as the media don't start hyping it all up again, there's no loss

Fingers crossed that if enough of these type bump each other off we'll be left with one "winner" whom the Gardai can lock up and the city can reach its potential without the usual reputation-draggers jumping on the bandwagon to have a go.

I used to think like that, but your wrong with your first point. Gang members killing each is not a good thing, you swore if enough of them were killed then the problem would just go away. If there are more killings, there will be more hatred between familys and then more people will get involved which in turn will cause more violence etc

irishproduce

hobie wrote:

Well it sure $$$$$ up the traffic situation this morning ...... took me $$$$$ ages to get from Homebase to Ivans .....

Ya same here but I had to drive up through the thomondgate area. Its like something from NYC withh all the roads sectioned off with police tape

Liam Byrne

Limerick Dude wrote:

I used to think like that, but your wrong with your first point. Gang members killing each is not a good thing, you swore if enough of them were killed then the problem would just go away. If there are more killings, there will be more hatred between familys and then more people will get involved which in turn will cause more violence etc

Well, I didn't actually "swear" that, and I'm fully aware that it's an over-simplification; there's also a chance that some day an innocent bystander would be beside a scummy thug and the prick pulling the trigger wouldn't have a good aim, resulting in a genuine tragedy.

I mean, where would the north be now if all the terrorists from both sides had gone into a field and fought each other, instead of shooting and bombing innocent people ?

Despite all the media hype over the years where they slander our city, no-one innocent has been hurt or killed, unlike in Dublin. And those are the people that I view as important; anyone bringing a knife or gun into town, or selling drugs, deserves everything they get and we're better off without them. Wishful thinking and simplistic, yes, but in the absence of judicial support for the Gardai where thugs are put away for proper amounts of time, at least it's one way of having one less drug or gang leader around.

I can't help smiling smugly at the lack of the usual media ****e that accompanies stuff like this, though - I can only guess that it's because in the lead-up to this there was strong focus on the Dublin shooting in December, and the media finally realised that old adage of people in glasshouses.

yayamark

there's also a chance that some day an innocent bystander would be beside a scummy thug and the prick pulling the trigger wouldn't have a good aim, resulting in a genuine tragedy QUOTE]

surely brian fitzgerald was an innocent bystander!

Karmafaerie

yayamark wrote:

Liam Byrne wrote:

there's also a chance that some day an innocent bystander would be beside a scummy thug and the prick pulling the trigger wouldn't have a good aim, resulting in a genuine tragedy

surely brian fitzgerald was an innocent bystander!

I can see your point, but that was not what LB meant.
He was referring to somebody just walking down the street, and being in the wrong place at the wrong time.
Brian Fitzgerald wasn't an accident.
He was killed for a reason. He disagreed, and stood up to the scum, so they killed him.
Maybe if we had a proper legal system and Garda presence he'd have been able to go to the Gardai and do something about it.
He wasn't however, and sadly is no longer with us.

It is completely different however to the case of Anthony Campbell for instance, who was completely innocent, and unrelated to crime in any way.

I'm sure that is the kind of thing that LB was referring to.

Gryzor

with this type of mentality...things will be along time changing...

Meanwhile, city council workers were clearing up the remnants of bonfires lit in Southill and Ballinacurra West by people who took to the streets on Thursday night to celebrate Mr Campion’s murder.

from the exmainer

Liam Byrne

I was stunned at the angle taken in the Limerick Leader.....

Firstly, they mentioned a "busy city centre street", which to me implies someplace like O'Connell/William/Thomas/Roches St area.

Secondly, the opening paragraph described how it was "a young father of three".

Desciptions like that, inducing pathos in the reader, are fine if it's an innocent person, but didn't this guy have previous convictions, not to mention connections to the feud, etc, etc ?

Regarding the "innocent bystanders" comment; Karma clarified what I meant.

Yes, the Brian Fitzgerald incident should not be forgotten; it was possibly even more tragic and more of an indictment of law enforcement and sentencing that it implied that these scum can have their own way; in actual fact it should make us even more resolved to stand up to these scum so that it can never happen again.

But there is an underlying fact - Mr Fitzgerald, RIP (commendably and for the betterment of the community) got himself involved and should be remembered as a hero; my point, however, was that Limerick is not as dangerous as other places if you're not involved in anything, and the newspapers consistently fail to point this out.

But aside from that, the mention of Mr Fitzgerald was valid; maybe it is time that we stopped being defensive and got the whole city, as a unit, to stand up to these scum ? Not an individual, who then becomes a target, or as vigilantes, but the whole city - mayor, council, army, law enforcement and all 100+,000 of normal people ? Imagine all of that marching toward one of these thug's house in a unified stance against crime and drugs ?

Although given the bonfires, etc, I think the average IQ of the city is probably being adversely affected by those drugs, etc.

talkingclock

Liam Byrne wrote:

Although given the bonfires, etc, I think the average IQ of the city is probably being adversely affected by those drugs, etc.

Was thinking that myself as well. From the Corbally/Grove Island Supervalue/Leisure Centre you could see alone 4 bonfires. That whole part of the city was covered in black fog. The lowlevel scum has even done two bonefires on Lock Quay (where the canal starts)! Then crossing Athlunkard Bridge you could see one in the Island Field. Well, I'm not surprised to see them there, what else can you expect from the lowlifes there, the other four coming from the Garryowen area (i guess). Some as big as if they burn the whole house...

Insane! Pure insanity!!! Put a roof over those parts of the city and you have Europes biggest nuthouse.

Liam Byrne

talkingclock wrote:

Insane! Pure insanity!!! Put a roof over those parts of the city and you have Europes biggest nuthouse.

To be fair, tc, you'd have to get a good few people to leave first. I'm not one for tarnishing any entire area or population in one fell swoop. There are a lot of decent people in places like Moyross, many of whom have a far better community spirit than many of the yuppie SUV supposedly "better" areas.

Fact is, though, the people who'd be leaving those areas before you put on the roof are probably the ones that already want to leave because they know they're far too near the psychos, scum and idiots.

bullets

irishproduce wrote:

TBH I dont really care what they do to one another, let them wipe one another out, makes the place a little tidier.

While I agree with you on this point, It also raises the question.
If these poeple if you can call them that start murdering each other
and some how one side becomes totally dominant what will happen is they wont see Murder as a big deal or even think twice
about starting to Murder anyone else that gets in their way or even annoys them. What could happen when they decide to start intimidating and pushing their weight around the place with the general public and see themselves as
untouchable.

~B

ricey

bucks73 wrote:

It did not start that way. If that fight did in fact happen, it happened after the feud had begun. It is pure urban myth to say it started everything. Greed, money and drugs started the feud.

Anthony Galvins book Family Feud gives the full story from the beginning. Without naming names, it all began when 2 men, who had been partners, fell out because of greed. One of these men tried to murder the other outside a school but his gun jammed. This man then ended up getting gunned down in a pub in town. From then on it was tit-for-tat.

Spot on, exactly how it all happend

talkingclock

Liam Byrne wrote:

To be fair, tc, you'd have to get a good few people to leave first. I'm not one for tarnishing any entire area or population in one fell swoop. There are a lot of decent people in places like Moyross, many of whom have a far better community spirit than many of the yuppie SUV supposedly "better" areas.

You might be right. I've been a bit hot-heated yesterday seeing all the smoke and that...

DarkJager

What could happen when they decide to start intimidating and pushing their weight around the place with the general public and see themselves as
untouchable.

Then the general public will have no other choice but to personally take care of removing these prime examples of human waste from our city....

Cardinal

DarkJager wrote:

Then the general public will have no other choice but to personally take care of removing these prime examples of human waste from our city....

Oh yeah!? That'd be great. A bit of vigilantism is just what the city needs to promote the image of the city.

DarkJager

Well how far would you let them push you Cardinal??? I have no time for scumbags at all, and I'd happily teach any of them lesson or two if they started with me...

yayamark

DarkJager wrote:

Well how far would you let them push you Cardinal??? I have no time for scumbags at all, and I'd happily teach any of them lesson or two if they started with me...

and i'm there beside u with the numchucks, balaclava and a bottle of there own medicine! :mad:

Karmafaerie

DarkJager wrote:

Well how far would you let them push you Cardinal??? I have no time for scumbags at all, and I'd happily teach any of them lesson or two if they started with me...

I love this. You talk about not letting them push you around, but when was the last time you went to your local TD to try and effect change?

Getting the local populace kitted out like Chuck Norris is hardly the answer.

If you want to make a difference then you let your local politicians know what you want. If enough people around this country got up off their collective ar$es and did their talking with their voting then this problem could be curbed. If not stamped out completely.

Ireland is afflicted with a bad case of voter apathy.
If enough people became vocal about it, then our politicians would be forced into doing something.

Plus it'd be a whole lot more effective than a Homer Simpsonesque vigilante mob!:rolleyes:

billy the squid

DarkJager wrote:

Then the general public will have no other choice but to personally take care of removing these prime examples of human waste from our city....

Don't be letting your keyboard fingers write cheques your fists can't cash.

The promotion of violent behaviour will not be tolerated here either. keep that in mind or there will be (proverbial) slaps handed out.

talkingclock

Karmafaerie wrote:

Ibut when was the last time you went to your local TD to try and effect change? ... If you want to make a difference then you let your local politicians know what you want. ... If enough people became vocal about it, then our politicians would be forced into doing something. .... Plus it'd be a whole lot more effective than a Homer Simpsonesque vigilante mob!:rolleyes:

You have a very romantic and sentimental view of our local polticians.

Who has allowed this to happen over the years? Who of yer local politicians was putting things in order between those gangs? The situation didn't came up suddenly from last Sunday night to Monday morning...

yayamark

Karmafaerie wrote:

I love this. You talk about not letting them push you around, but when was the last time you went to your local TD to try and effect change?

Getting the local populace kitted out like Chuck Norris is hardly the answer.

If you want to make a difference then you let your local politicians know what you want. If enough people around this country got up off their collective ar$es and did their talking with their voting then this problem could be curbed. If not stamped out completely.

Ireland is afflicted with a bad case of voter apathy.
If enough people became vocal about it, then our politicians would be forced into doing something.

Plus it'd be a whole lot more effective than a Homer Simpsonesque vigilante mob!:rolleyes:

lol local td who do u think we should go to. willie o dea!
i can see it now willie with his gun telling them all to cop on!

ya oh look there goes that pig flying again

Karmafaerie

talkingclock wrote:

You have a very romantic and sentimental view of our local polticians.

Who has allowed this to happen over the years? Who of yer local politicians was putting things in order between those gangs? The situation didn't came up suddenly from last Sunday night to Monday morning...

yayamark wrote:

lol local td who do u think we should go to. willie o dea!
i can see it now willie with his gun telling them all to cop on!

ya oh look there goes that pig flying again

The definition of a politician is someone who'll do as little as possible to get your vote.
In order for a politician to be made to do something, the public have to make them do it!
No politician is going to do something that s/he doesn't have to do, but if everyone got up off their ar$es and made it clear that unless they did something they wouldn't get elected, things would change.
That's when you'd see politicians bending over backwards to try and make a difference, otherwise they'd have to go out and get an actual job.

This is the exact apathy I'm talking about. Everyone's willing to complain, and when somebody says "hey lets try and do something", all we get is, ah what difference will it make!

If 90% of the population of Limerick City (of a voting age), made it clear that their vote would go to whoever would stamp out the problem, then you'd see a change.
(A hell of a lot more of a change than a few guys with sacks filled with door knobs!)
The same goes with the rest of the country.

Look at Rudy Giuliani for instance.
New York had a horrible crime problem, and the voting public demanded a change.
They voted in a Republican Governor (New York is a big Democrat stronghold), cause he promised to make a difference.
And he did, cutting the crime in New York down to a fraction of what it was.

Now nobody is comparing Limerick (or anywhere in Ireland), to New York.
But that only means that it's a much easier job over here.

If you want change get off your ass and do something about it, rather than sitting around complaining.
People in Ireland tend to just let things slide, so our politicians know that they can get away with doing the bare minimum.

Let 'em know that they'll have to work, and they will.
I wonder how many people that sit around here complaining even vote!:rolleyes:

ricey

Now nobody is comparing Limerick (or anywhere in Ireland), to New York

Why not theres enough Irish there.

yayamark

the mayor in new york had the resources we don't
i don't think we can ever compare rudolph to willie o dea or peter power.
maybe rudolph the red nose reindeer to willie o dea

Karmafaerie

yayamark wrote:

the mayor in new york had the resources we don't
i don't think we can ever compare rudolph to willie o dea or peter power.
maybe rudolph the red nose reindeer to willie o dea

Guess what, Rudy had more money and resources, but he also had a hell of a lot more crime!

During it's worst stage, there was 2,245 homicides in New York, which in 8 years dropped down to 633!!!

That doesn't include the thousands, and thousands, of muggings, rapes, and robberies etc.

Compare that to the 2-3 in Limerick, and you'll see what kind of effects we could get.

The crime-capita ratio was a hell of a lot worse than Limerick.
And the crime-resources ratio would have been the same.

Over here people are just willing to accept things, as long as they can still sit around and complain that is!

yayamark

Karmafaerie wrote:

Guess what, Rudy had more money and resources, but he also had a hell of a lot more crime!

During it's worst stage, there was 2,245 homicides in New York, which in 8 years dropped down to 633!!!

That doesn't include the thousands, and thousands, of muggings, rapes, and robberies etc.

Compare that to the 2-3 in Limerick, and you'll see what kind of effects we could get.

The crime-capita ratio was a hell of a lot worse than Limerick.
And the crime-resources ratio would have been the same.

Over here people are just willing to accept things, as long as they can still sit around and complain that is!

have u got figures for the
1. crime capita ratio to compare new york to limerick
2. crime resources ratio to compare new york to limerick

if u don't its not a valid arguement

Karmafaerie

yayamark wrote:

have u got figures for the
1. crime capita ratio to compare new york to limerick
2. crime resources ratio to compare new york to limerick

if u don't its not a valid arguement

There are no such figures.
They have never been correlated in New York (or at least not publicly released), except once by a university in LA, but those figures were proven wildly inaccurate.

As for Limerick, again there are no figures that can be reliably used.
The official population of Limerick city is some 52,000, but all crime figures are taken from the Limerick garda district which encompasses all of the city, all of the county, and all of county Clare!!!
Which means that the garda district has a population of some 300,000.
Often when figures are given out they compare the crimes for the whole populace, as if it was just in the city limits, increasing the seeming crime by a factor of 6!
This is one of the reasons that Limerick is portrayed as full of crime.
They are treating the crime of a populace of 300,000, as if it was only 52,000!

The only figures I could refer you to are the CSO figures (keep in mind that when it says Limerick, that means Clare as well) but the 2006 figures won't be out for another few months.


But, if you are seriously trying to say that crime is worse in Limerick than it was in New York city during the 90's you need your head examined!:rolleyes:


Also, the person who wants to attack all the scumbags "with a pair of numchucks," is the last person who should be talking about valid arguments!!!

yayamark

Karmafaerie wrote:

There are no such figures.
They have never been correlated in New York (or at least not publicly released), except once by a university in LA, but those figures were proven wildly inaccurate.

As for Limerick, again there are no figures that can be reliably used.
The official population of Limerick city is some 52,000, but all crime figures are taken from the Limerick garda district which encompasses all of the city, all of the county, and all of county Clare!!!
Which means that the garda district has a population of some 300,000.
Often when figures are given out they compare the crimes for the whole populace, as if it was just in the city limits, increasing the seeming crime by a factor of 6!
This is one of the reasons that Limerick is portrayed as full of crime.
They are treating the crime of a populace of 300,000, as if it was only 52,000!

The only figures I could refer you to are the CSO figures (keep in mind that when it says Limerick, that means Clare as well) but the 2006 figures won't be out for another few months.


But, if you are seriously trying to say that crime is worse in Limerick than it was in New York city during the 90's you need your head examined!:rolleyes:


Also, the person who wants to attack all the scumbags "with a pair of numchucks," is the last person who should be talking about valid arguments!!!

Wow

where do i begin?

As I said if u don't have the figures its not a valid arguement

When u say the "Limerick garda district" i presume you mean division. The Limerick Garda Division does not cover all of Clare only parts of it.

Your remark about getting my head examined is uncalled for in what i thought was a civilised thread about crime in Limerick city

My remark about numchucks was to be taken as sarcasam. I didn't even know how to spell it. had to google it to get spelling and proper meaning

Timmy_d

I heard that there was another shooting in limerick last night,man shot dead but papers and radio have blacked it all out for fear of publicity ,anyone hear anything?

billy the squid

don't be silly timmy.