Eircom commits to LLU deadline

clearz

Just saw this article and thought I'd post it here. Does this mean that LLU will finally become a reality this year or is it just more bs from Eircom/Comreg?

http://www.siliconrepublic.com/news/news.nv?storyid=single8281

watty

http://www.comreg.ie/_fileupload/publications/ComReg0725.pdf

Read the source

watty

Of course the weaseling will be in the fine print

Executive Summary
Since the last update ComReg has engaged in extensive discussions with eircom with a
view to resolving all material obstacles to the implementation of a robust and scaleable
LLU product. ComReg has reached agreement with eircom on all material issues which
were impeding the development of LLU, most of which are to be implemented by end
September 2007.
The major issues that have been resolved in principle are that eircom has agreed to:
1. Implement all requested migration paths to LLU from other wholesale products.
Return paths are also to be developed, which should improve consumer
confidence in the LLU product.
2. Introduce changes to the existing product in stages between now and September
2007 which should lead to significant improvements in product performance.
3. Provide a standard Service Level Agreement (SLA) which should meet industry
requirements.
4. Conclude negotiations on and implement an enhanced SLA.
5. Conclude negotiations on and supply appropriate LLU backhaul.

I have no idea if this is good or bad.

The main issue IMO is that the wholesale line rental for LLU circuit is 3x what makes it viable.

damien

BT Ireland welcomed it and said it was what they wanted. Lots of stealth charges in this thing though. But now I think it is finally endgame for BT, are they going start walking the walk?

Blaster99

This sounds like potentially very good news.

How feasible is a widespread BT Ireland LLU service, does anyone know? I guess they will minimally get involved in the NBS.

jack_christie

How does this affect the much fabled €ircon Next Generation Networks rollout? Thought they were saying opening the LLU would be hindered by the incredible investments in new network technologies...yada yada...

watty

Yes the NGN rollout could make LLU unavialable in some places. But at €17 or so to eircom per month per person how do you offer an innovative service and avoid making a loss?

Liam Byrne

????? Didn't eircom agree to this back in August last year, according to ComWreck's report ?

I know people posted here that they still had to change their phone numbers when switching to anything other than an eircon reseller, but wasn't the "official" line that LLU and GLUMP was available ?

Or is this just LLU, without the G, M and P ? If so, companies like Smart will be left still fighting for fairness, since companies won't bite if they have to spend a fortune changing their phone number on signage, letterheads, business cards, websites, etc.

So what's the story ? What's the opinion of the experts on the boards ? Will people be able to switch without the hassle or wha' ?

christophicus

I hope Smart can finally do what they intended to do all those years ago now. It really does make my blood boil the way Eircom nearly killed Smart.

Also could this mean that the bottem end metro package could possibly be number transferable now?

watty

The problem with porting numbers to or from Metro is the cost and time. It's always been possible. I don't think these announcements change the cost or time involved.

Liam Byrne

watty wrote:

The problem with porting numbers to or from Metro is the cost and time. It's always been possible. I don't think these announcements change the cost or time involved.

How about the willingness to do it ? Since ComWreck - according to their quarterly reports - are supposedly constantly pressuring eircon to do it, and there's an obvious disadvantage to potential Smart and Metro customers if they have to change number, it's pretty obvious that it suits eircon to make it as awkward as possible.

That's not really eircon's fault; it might be, if it were still our semi-state body like it should be (at least the infrastructure bit) but most companies will abuse their monopoly status to maximise their return and cripple their competitors unless they are forced to do otherwise.

Maybe the strengthening of ComWreck's powers will improve things, and maybe that's prompted eircon to start improving their service in this regard, but until GLUMP is a given the lucrative commercial market is always going to be elusive, despite how good and good value Smart's product is.

ComWreck aren't without blame, though, if you look at their licking eircon's ass last Oct/Nov and the fact that their own website muddied the water for ages in terms of the fact that Smart were (and are) still very much available.

The day GLUMP is a given and eircon have to do it is the day we will have proper competition for broadband.

watty

I would suggest anyone that can't get a number ported from eircom to NTL cable, Metro, Smart or Magent inside a week (It ought to be less than 2 working days) or at all send registered mail to Comreg & eircom and their new phone provider every 2 days outline the facts of their case.

NTL can absolutely do their end, but given the experience of Digiweb with Metro (a similar scenario since NO there would be NO line at all) they may not want to. The actuall mechanisim depends almost entirely on eircom.

1) We need the wholesale line rental cost examined. without that at least halving, the is no comercial incentive to compete with eircom on DSL via LLU or GLUMP.

2) We need the cost reduced to 1/10th, the paperwork abolished (Online with customer account numbers etc) and the changeover time from weeks to days. Automatic removal of CPS etc. If there is CPS, eircom may not say that is why porting is failing. Ideally the customer should be able to do this rather than the new telephony provider. The €50 charge is a rip off. I don't beleive the new LLU report addresses these number porting issues. It should be as easy as it is with a Mobile.

3) Backhaul seems to be an aspiration. Without competitively priced backhaul based on real costs that than eircom's inflated charges, no one can connect their DSLAMS or what ever else innovative solutions for local loop out of the exchange.

Blaster99

Liam Byrne wrote:

So what's the story ? What's the opinion of the experts on the boards ? Will people be able to switch without the hassle or wha' ?

I'm not an expert, but this is the solution where the porting process is automatic and includes bitstream products. The latter was BT's big stumbling block because they have built-up a loss-leading customer base as a reseller and they want to convert these to LLU customers when they start to roll out LLU in earnest.

I don't think it's a generic porting process, though, so you're not going to be able to port from Metro to Blueface type of thing.

jack_christie

watty wrote:

I would suggest anyone that can't get a number ported from eircom to NTL cable, Metro, Smart or Magent inside a week (It ought to be less than 2 working days) or at all send registered mail to Comreg & eircom and their new phone provider every 2 days outline the facts of their case.

Changing Broadband service has to be as easy as changing mobile operators. Something like less that four hours or overnight at worst. Otherwise its the same bull**** €ircon service.

Are people still going to have be without broadband for a month when changing operators?

BarryM

damien.m wrote:

BT Ireland welcomed it and said it was what they wanted. Lots of stealth charges in this thing though. But now I think it is finally endgame for BT, are they going start walking the walk?

Having read the piece I agree, and I wonder Damien why Ireland Offline 'welcomed' the announcement. My understanding of Offline's position is that ComReg is/was supposed to achieve de-regulation, proper de-regulation that is. If my memory serves me right we are over 5 years down the road since €ircon was sold off and even longer since Ireland 'de-regulated' under pressure from the EU.

It seems to me to be too little too late. I wonder how many of the alternative operators will pay something between €66 and €99 to get LLU for their subs, or to be more precise how many subs will be willing to fund this??

It may be water under the bridge, but this is another slap in the face for the citizens who used to own €ircon and its predecessors, who bought the shares, lost money in many cases, and then saw Sir Anthony step in and waltz off with a fortune, etc.

I have a friend who lives in rural France, 900km from Paris in a village of 1,500 inhabitants. He has a deal from Neuf, one of the many alternative operators who entered the market after government mandated de-regulation of France Telecom. He gets, for €35 a month, 1Mb broadband, telephone calls to fixed lines in France and 38 other countries and a no fee mobile phone with 10 mins credit per month. Thats it, and of course no more payments to France Telecom who 'handed off' his line in 48hrs. When do you think we can expect a similar offer in Ireland?

Bye, Barry

dahamsta

Bit surprised by that meself tbh. I was expecting a sting in the tail, but nothing. Did the meeja cut the release short, or was there no sting?

damien

BarryM wrote:

Having read the piece I agree, and I wonder Damien why Ireland Offline 'welcomed' the announcement. My understanding of Offline's position is that ComReg is/was supposed to achieve de-regulation, proper de-regulation that is. If my memory serves me right we are over 5 years down the road since €ircon was sold off and even longer since Ireland 'de-regulated' under pressure from the EU.

ComReg did good this one time. No matter what they have done in the past and what they screw up in the future, the people involved in bringing this new framework about in the past few months get my respect and I think deserve the respect of many others.

I think it is very clear exactly what IrelandOffline think of what ComReg has done up to this point in time but remember, you can always step forward for the new Committee on June 9th and make sure that in future IrelandOffline makes it a rule to always remind ComReg of their past, even if they make right every wrong they have done.

BarryM

damien.m wrote:

I think it is very clear exactly what IrelandOffline think of what ComReg has done up to this point in time but remember, you can always step forward for the new Committee on June 9th and make sure that in future IrelandOffline makes it a rule to always remind ComReg of their past, even if they make right every wrong they have done.

I would be glad to but I live 'down the country' and I'm not sure that Ireland Offline does its business online?? I was once at a meeting organised by IO - a long time ago where Mary O'Rourke waffled and was roundly criticised by the audience. That is where my impression of IO's role was formed.

I wasn't specifically criticising IO - I was just wondering why they are so quick to congratulate. Neither do I want to hark back to ComReg's past but on reading the ComReg doc it did strike me there were plenty of 'outs' and the prices seemed high.

I have always wondered who's side ComReg is on, I went to a meeting they organised in Sept last concerning future business prospects and telecomms and was disappointed - it had some very good presentations on telecomm based businesses but bugger all from ComReg on how they intended to help.....In fact the keynoter said 'never trust an incumbent telecom operator to offer you any deal that will dilute their earnings' - hardly new but it did point up ComReg's job, to make that happen.....

Anyway, let's see what actually happens. I still await the €35 a month deal my friend has in France......

Bye, Barry

BarryM

watty wrote:

3) Backhaul seems to be an aspiration. Without competitively priced backhaul based on real costs that than eircom's inflated charges, no one can connect their DSLAMS or what ever else innovative solutions for local loop out of the exchange.

Exactly, the doc is full of aspiration. As long as eircom (btw, did you notice that eircom is in lower case throughout the doc??) is the carrier for backhaul then the pricing will reflect incumbent type pricing.... which is probably why eircom agreed to the deal.

ComReg should tackle the overhang of eircom's continued domination of the network backbone.

Bye, Barry

damien

BarryM wrote:

(btw, did you notice that eircom is in lower case throughout the doc??)

That's the writing standard for eircom. There is no uppercase for the eircom font. Meant to be trendy back in '98 or something.

damien

BarryM wrote:

I would be glad to but I live 'down the country' and I'm not sure that Ireland Offline does its business online??

Nobody on the Committee lives in Dublin. We communicate with each other almost exclusively online via a few mailing lists, IM and IRC.

SeaSide

damien.m wrote:

ComReg did good this one time.

Coincidence?

http://www.mulley.net/2007/03/08/comreg-broadband-strategy-manager/

damien

SeaSide wrote:

Coincidence?

Probably. It's not ComReg I'm going working for.

BarryM

Latest criticism of comreg - todays Irish Times -

EU criticises ComReg for lack of action on competition
Jamie Smyth, European Correspondent

European telecoms commissioner Viviane Reding has criticised the communications regulator, ComReg, for not taking action to force more competition in the telecoms market.
She also described the take-up of broadband technology in the Republic as "inadequate" and warned that the economy would suffer unless action was taken now.
In an interview with The Irish Times , Ms Reding said ComReg had done a good job identifying where problems lie in the market but had failed to implement changes.
"ComReg has been slow in implementing the remedies and has so far committed to the commission less than one-third of the remedies available to them," she said. "It needs to speed up the application of the remedies in order to get the market opened."
Remedies are tools such as price controls or mandated access to networks that are available to regulators to force dominant firms to allow competition. To use these tools, regulators such as ComReg must clear them with the European Commission.
A ComReg spokeswoman said the regulator had decided to re-examine parts of the telecoms market before proceeding towards implementation because of its experience of the appeals procedure in Ireland.
ComReg has recently lost some key decisions on appeal.
Small telecoms firms cite delays to liberalisation as a key issue in the Irish market, while Ms Reding singled out the slow pace of local loop unbundling, a process by which Eircom gives competitors access to its network, as a big problem.
"The only way to have more competition is to have infrastructure-based competition, where competitors can access the last mile [ of Eircom's network] . . . I regret this has taken so long in Ireland," she said. "Only now are we getting total local loop unbundling." In international markets, giving competitors access to former monopoly networks - which run into every home and business in a state - has encouraged the roll-out and uptake of broadband. But in the Republic, Eircom has only recently agreed to implement a system for local loop unbundling. It should be in place by the autumn.
Several other dominant operators in Europe are also frustrating the process of liberalisation by refusing to give rivals easy and economical access to networks.
Ms Reding said she would reform the telecommunications rules in the EU to give regulators more power to force dominant companies to open up their networks. One of the new remedies she will propose next month is "functional separation", whereby dominant firms must split their network and services firms into two units.
Under this system, which has already been introduced voluntarily by British Telecom, a completely separate management structure must be created for each firm. This is meant to ensure that the network arm of a former monopoly gives competitors equal access to its core network.
"Functional separation could be one way of solving the problem [ of access] but it won't solve this problem today, as the new rules will not be passed until 2009/10," said Ms Reding, who has ruled out a more stringent plan that would force firms to sell off either their network or services arms.
Ms Reding said broadband services were critical to the knowledge economy and to boosting economic growth. She said the current broadband penetration rate in the Republic of 12.3 per cent was "inadequate" when compared to other EU states such as the Netherlands and Denmark, which enjoy penetration rates of about 30 per cent.
"Things like e-learning and e-government are the tools to advance the economy. Without broadband you can't advance," she said.