Would Utd-West Ham have played out a draw?

Nunu

I just realised had Chelsea won their last 2 games against Arsenal and Utd, it would be going into the final game with Chelsea 2 points behind. Knowing what we know now I wonder would the Utd game have been played out to a draw because both teams would only need a point to get what they need. I'd like to think they wouldn't but it would have been very tempting for both teams.

I can't remember a similiar situation arising before?

One things for sure if the state of affairs was like that going into tomorrow Jose would be in overdrive...and could you imagine what he'd say if it did end in a draw:D

fullstop

Well it's not very easy to jus purposely play out a draw. If somebody hits one lucky (or unkucky!) shot and it flies in the top corner then its not easy to just 'give' the other team a goal without it looking a bit suspect.

Savman

If...

dcarroll

was there something like this in an international tournament a few years back, euro 2004 i think, sweden-denmark maybe? think it had to finish a certain scoreline, 3-1 or 3-2 for them both to qualify and it did with the team finishing third in the group (italy?) going mad

Anyone remember this?

Nunu

dcarroll wrote:

was there something like this in an international tournament a few years back, euro 2004 i think, sweden-denmark maybe? think it had to finish a certain scoreline, 3-1 or 3-2 for them both to qualify and it did with the team finishing third in the group (italy?) going mad

Anyone remember this?

Of course...I was at that bloody game, so I should remember!
It ended 2-2, meaning Italy were knocked out of the tournament despite beating Bulgaria. I can't remember how it worked out, but I think it was a 2-2 draw or higher scoring draw would guarantee both teams passage to the knockouts, no matter what Italy did because they all finished level on points so it went down to a mini table between the 3 (excluding Bulgaria)

Edit: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_UEFA_European_Football_Championship_-_Group_C

bucks73

Well I seriously doubt United would play for a draw. The fact that its their last home league game of the season alone would ensure a full team going for a win, as will be seen on Sunday. If they needed a point to win the title you can be sure Fergie would send them out looking to ensure all 3 points.

Royale with Cheese

It happened this season in the champions league. Porto and Arsenal played out a 0-0 draw which saw both teams through to next round. Moscow didn't get the result they needed anyway so it didn't matter much in the end.

BaZmO*

Savman wrote:

If...

...my aunty had balls....


Anyhoo, I thought it was quite strange that Fergie said before the Chelsea game that he was resting the key players so that he could field a full squad against West Ham as it wouldn't be fair to the other teams in the relegation battle in he fielded a weakened team on Sunday.

bucks73

Its only fair. Had West Ham come up against the team that played on wednesday night, Sheff Utd and Wigan would be seriously peed off.

gucci

wigan would still be whinging, theyre doing enough of it the last few weeks. the way west ham have been performing the last few games id say they would hold man utd to a draw anyways, even if utd needed a win......but all this is speculation of course, if i hadnt missed training that morning i could be playing for man utd!!

BaZmO*

It may be fair but they're not obliged to do it. I just thought it was strange that he came out and gave that reason.

And how fair would it be if one of the big Utd. players was to get injured and thereby miss an FA Cup Final. Personally I think it's Fergie getting his own back on West Ham.

eirebhoy

I'd say it would have been similar to the Denmark-Sweden game. Played as normal for 70-75 minutes and if it's still a draw then neither team would really want to risk going forward with little time left to equalise.

PHB

I can't imagine United would leave it up to chance, but, I think if there was 15 minutes left in the match, and it was a draw, and United had the ball, they might just keeping passing it around the back line.

herbieflowers

I don't expect Fergie to play a full strength sde, he might give a few players a runaround for 20mins or a half but it'll probably just be squad players - Kuszcak, Heinze, Brown, O'Shea, Fletcher, Smith, Solskjaer and maybe some first teamers - I certainly wouldn't risk my best 11 in a pointless match, there's always the possibility of a player getting injured especially given WH's circumstances (over-enthusiasm etc)

PHB

Fergie has said he will put out a full strength side, because he thinks it would be unfair to the rest of the relegation battlers not to.
Personally, I think it's because he knows the fans want revenge after 95.

herbieflowers

Bull**** imo, would you risk it? Regardless of the past or his "fairness to other teams", it'll be strong but squad strong, not like v Chelsea on Wednesday but I'd imagine the FA Cup final comes before some petty squabble which happened over a decade ago..It may be full / half strength for 45mins, certainly not for the whole game

Savman

West Ham need a point right? And its just an exhibition match for the Champs who, no matter what Fergie says, will not want to get injured before the Cup Final.
Bore draw written all over this.

LuckyLloyd

dcarroll wrote:

was there something like this in an international tournament a few years back, euro 2004 i think, sweden-denmark maybe? think it had to finish a certain scoreline, 3-1 or 3-2 for them both to qualify and it did with the team finishing third in the group (italy?) going mad

Anyone remember this?

Funniest moment in recent footballing history was, for me anyway, when Cassano scored the injury time winner versus Bulgaria and took off on a pumped and emotional celebration off the pitch - only to start spewing big juicy man tears when he was informed of the result of the other game. The change in his expression was like some sort of mime act.

And then after the match Dunphy, Giles and Brady had their infamous waffle about the state of the Italian game and how playing "the big fellas" at the youth levels was ruining the development of the beautiful game there. Classic stuff.

herbieflowers

you mean this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q1jyWnCm2-8 ?

thebaz

back in Italia '90 , after Niall Quinn scored against Holland , wasn't Mick McCarty rumoured to have had a word in Ruud Gullits ear ... and the last 10 minutes were played at a pedestrian pace , when the back pass rule was still allowable -- thats if my memory serves me right

Necronomicon

eirebhoy wrote:

I'd say it would have been similar to the Denmark-Sweden game. Played as normal for 70-75 minutes and if it's still a draw then neither team would really want to risk going forward with little time left to equalise.

I still remember when it got to that stage in the game and both sides were just lobbing the ball back and forth to each other!

leninbenjamin

tbh i don't see what the fuss is about. if two teams have earned the right to go through on a draw, that means they've still been better than the other teams up til then, so if they go through on dodgy circumstances they've still been the best overall.

PHB

THe problem isn't that United aren't putting out a strong team because they have won the premiership, it's that they are doing it for an external competition. The league is based on the assumption it's the most important, and that you will always want to get as many points as you can. PLyaing weakened teams messes up this assumption, which is why people don't like it.

Fergie has explicitly stated he wont go for a weakened squad, what possible reason could he have to lie?

herbieflowers

Depends on his and our interpretation of weakened...he says not weakened or whatever but he's not naive enough to to gung-ho and play hos best side and risk injury, regardless of what he spouts

PHB

Fergie says

"We have to respect the position of the other teams at the bottom," said Ferguson.

"Paul Jewell has done a fantastic job at Wigan, as has Neil Warnock at Sheffield United. I cannot be putting a team on the pitch that disrespects those teams.

"We also have our own reputation to think about, so although I am a great friend of Alan Curbishley, he understands the position I am in and knows I will be playing my strongest team on Sunday."

ronbyrne2005

A lot of the united players that didnt play against Chelsea will need a competitive game before cup final and will also want to play at home on last day of season where it will be a celebratory occasion with united receiving trophy etc. I cant see why he would play a weakend squad under these circumstances. Some players may not go fully into tackles but they will play a strong albeit not too motivated team.

homerjay2005

this would never have happened, even now that the title is won, fergie will demand that united win the game tomorrow.

mr_angry

I still can't see any of the United players going in for any dodgy 50-50s the same way West Ham players will be. Regardless of what team is on the field, the United players wont be able to help the mentality that there's nothing really riding on the game for them.

Of course, that doesn't mean that United wont win anyway. I think if the Irons are a couple of goals down, it could well be the Sheffield Utd - Wigan game that ends in a very convenient result. I don't think anybody there should be jumping on their high horse concerning the West Ham match.