To Grind Or Not To Grind.

Rozabeez

I think JC grinds are stupid. If you're getting grinds in Higher Irish, JC, why? Is it to pass a higher subject or to keep on a higher subject for LC? If you can't hack it for JC you sure as hell can't hack it for LC. Pesky kids.

OctavarIan

JC 2K3 wrote:

My point was maths advice is available for free on the internet, why pay someone for it?

For better service.

Darren1o1

JC 2K3 wrote:

What's your point?

My point was maths advice is available for free on the internet, why pay someone for it?

Read my points before you make comments or shall i make a "less stress" book of them.

I said for these forums in order to ask a question, you would have to have a basic understanding of that question. ie to ask a question on differentiation, you would at least need a basic understanding of the subject.

From my experience with the people who get grinds they do not have this basic understanding of a particular topic(s) and therefore have to pay for this. If they understood the basics themselves they could go find the answers.

JC 2K3

cocoa wrote:

sure, Q and A on the net can work just fine for some people but I know that for me personally and to a bigger extent for other people, it's a hell of a lot easier to understand when someone writes it down in front of you and is explaining it verbally at the same time than text on the screen. You can get there from the screen, but the physical presence is easier.

Meh, I always learned from textbooks and asked questions after. Perhaps I am just different. However, I would argue that a forum is the same as a verbal explanation as posts are personally addressed and one can ask questions. It's text, but it's interactive text.

cocoa wrote:

Ermm, in regards to business I would disagree but business is just weird in general anyway. Call me crazy and arrogant but I could quite comfortably get a B1 in business purely by having a quick read of the book the night beforehand. The condensed version has all I personally would need and would make things faster, I estimate it would save me about two hours over the course of 5 weeks. Unless the book costs over €40 then I consider it a sound investment.

I quit business at the start of sixth year but while I did it I really did find it a bit strange as a subject and ironically it is a subject where the "revision business" works.

I don't do business, but that simply indicates a bad core business book.

Darren1o1 wrote:

I have said this!! My point is some people cannot make these notes. They do not know what is the most relevant information and therefore need guidance, that is what these aim to do.

I am in university and i always study from my own notes. However other students who would student from my notes do not have as much knowledge or understanding of the subject and are looking to get a reasonable mark. Therefore they borrow someone notes i.e. mine and get an understanding of the crical points and can therefore pass. Whereas the person making the notes has a deeper understanding and can go that little further

Can't make the notes or aren't bothered to?

Ok, I'm not going to definitively state that it's all 100% down to laziness and that there are no underlying factors, however, laziness and the illusion that spending money on extra learning resources will increase one's grade is a big factor in how much these revision products sell IMO.

Mary-Ellen

Hi everyone,

Thought you might like to hear (read) the other side

I give grinds, I don't do it for the money (although it comes in handy)
I'm a student with no interest in going into teaching btw

I do them because I relaly like the subject I do and I think a lot of people tend to have a negitive opinion about.

Some students can fall behind (I'm not blaming teachers) and once they get lost enough they don't know where to start catch up and having someone to help them on an individual basis can really help.

Guess I'm trying to say there are good and bad reasons for getting grinds just like there are good and bad reasons for giving them.

I've answered some questions here too and I like to think it's pretty punctual and helpful :rolleyes:

Best of luck to everyone in the leaving:)

JC 2K3

OctavarIan wrote:

For better service.

Bollocks.

Darren1o1 wrote:

Read my points before you make comments or shall i make a "less stress" book of them.

I said for these forums in order to ask a question, you would have to have a basic understanding of that question. ie to ask a question on differentiation, you would at least need a basic understanding of the subject.

From my experience with the people who get grinds they do not have this basic understanding of a particular topic(s) and therefore have to pay for this. If they understood the basics themselves they could go find the answers.

You weren't clear on your initial post.

And many people on this forum would be willing to explain basic concepts to people and answer any questions someone might have.

Darren1o1

JC 2K3 wrote:

Meh, I always learned from textbooks and asked questions after.

This shows an understanding of the topic that maybe some people don't have. hence needing them.

JC 2K3 wrote:

Can't make the notes or aren't bothered to?IMO.

Both actually, as you can see in my previous posts i have not disputed this fact. But as from my experience in doing grinds with people it is usually, Can't.

Darren1o1

JC 2K3 wrote:

Bollocks.


You weren't clear on your initial post.

And many people on this forum would be willing to explain basic concepts to people and answer any questions someone might have.

Explaining concepts such as differentiation on a forum are just cumbersome and inpractical and may take hours of going back and forward. Why not get someone with experience to sit down with you for an hour and get it over and done with? There is an element of choice and it in the end depends on the person.

Corruptedmorals

I'm getting biology grinds, every Tuesday, have had them 3 times now. He comes to my house. Stays 2 hours- and refuses to accept more than like, 30ish. Biology is by far my worst subject, and I find the textbook states something without really explaining why or how. This guy is way more familiar with the old course, but his explanation of things is really really helpful, I understand way more concepts than I did.

I don't want to hear about how I'm stupid or I should have listened (I did..) or whatever, that's just arrogance. Not everyone can absorb learning the same, especially if you despise the subject and the teaching method consists of reading out the chapters. Biology has actually become interesting now. Having an understanding of the topics has really helped in answering the questions, so yeah, it's worth it. I also have to get a C1 in Biology (points, not requirement)

I don't agree with grinds schools though, but some of the revision books can help in condensing very broad subjects (Biology, Geography) and the French ReviseWise has lots of nice phrases. Our teachers are photocopying notes from them as well, only ReviseWise though. I think they'd be useless in something like History or English.

Darren1o1

Corruptedmorals wrote:

Biology is by far my worst subject, and I find the textbook states something without really explaining why or how. This guy is way more familiar with the old course, but his explanation of things is really really helpful, I understand way more concepts than I did.

I don't want to hear about how I'm stupid or I should have listened (I did..) or whatever, that's just arrogance. Not everyone can absorb learning the same, especially if you despise the subject and the teaching method consists of reading out the chapters.

Corruptedmorals wrote:

some of the revision books can help in condensing very broad subjects (Biology, Geography) and the French ReviseWise has lots of nice phrases. Our teachers are photocopying notes from them as well, only ReviseWise though. I think they'd be useless in something like History or English.

^
My point exactly.

These are the people i help with maths

fuinneamh

OctavarIan wrote:

That's quite frankly, bull****. It's a pity schools don't teach people to not be narrow-minded snobs.

In general unless your having trouble with understanding a concept the leaving cert is all about rote learning and practicing exam questions. There is many examples of students who have been getting remedial aid in school all the way up achieving their goals because they worked their asses off. One success was passing his leaving cert to get to kildalton, another guy got over 450 even though he has had reading problems all his life.The reason most people are disapointed at the end of the year in my school is that they doss supervised study or spend most of the day in class with the career guidance teacher. So how can you not say that how well you do in the leaving cert is down to laziness?

Of course there are the wild exceptions that illness can occur on the day or a tragic death near the time of the leaving cert but in general you can't say your result is down to anything other than laziness.

Darren1o1

fuinneamh wrote:

but in general you can't say your result is down to anything other than laziness.

:rolleyes: People should not be so narrowminded, there are many reasons. Just because you have not come across them does not give you the right to broadly call anyone with bad leaving cert results lazy. You should be careful not to get knocked off your high horse, you might not like it down here with us real people.

shazzyshaz

hmm i see this whole board is one big arguement. -immaturity at leaving cert! i suppose everyone is getting cranky too. *looks at people above*

Darren1o1

shazzyshaz wrote:

hmm i see this whole board is one big arguement. -immaturity at leaving cert! i suppose everyone is getting cranky too. *looks at people above*

Nope, just finished my thesis for my bachelors and finishing my finals:D 4 years over thank god!

I am tired of people who are so lucky to talents for certain subjects slating people as "lazy" for having to seek alternate ways to learn. I'll admit that can be true in some cases but what i am saying is, it is not always the case.

shazzyshaz

Darren1o1 wrote:

Nope, just finished my thesis for my bachelors and finishing my finals:D 4 years over thank god!

I am tired of people who are so lucky to talents for certain subjects slating people as "lazy" for having to seek alternate ways to learn. I'll admit that can be true in some cases but what i am saying is, it is not always the case.

darren im in complete agreement wit u! What degree are u finishing??
lucky u anyways!! im headn into the LC-3weeks cannot believe it:(:(

cson

shazzyshaz wrote:

hmm i see this whole board is one big arguement. -immaturity at leaving cert! i suppose everyone is getting cranky too. *looks at people above*

Language of Argument is a key component in hons. English. So I wouldn't consider arguing to be immature as such, conversly it could actually improve your skills in this area in English.

For me grinds and to a larger extent grind schools are simply evidence of the inequality that exists in the Irish education system.

Darren1o1

shazzyshaz wrote:

darren im in complete agreement wit u! What degree are u finishing??
lucky u anyways!! im headn into the LC-3weeks cannot believe it:(:(

Medical mechanical engineering - DCU
It's changing its name to bioengineering i believe this year.

Good luck with that:D

What are you looking to do?

Darren1o1

cson wrote:

Language of Argument is a key component in hons.

I'd say debating is key in english, not argument. There is a difference. Thats is why we go see debates and not arguments.

shazzyshaz

cson wrote:

Language of Argument is a key component in hons. English. So I wouldn't consider arguing to be immature as such, conversly it could actually improve your skills in this area in English.

For me grinds and to a larger extent grind schools are simply evidence of the inequality that exists in the Irish education system.

inequality- how is it unequal? I go to a grinds school and dont think im any better off for this exam than i was last year in my ''normal school''. plenty of people go to grinds schools and get 100points! the only ones youll hear about are the 600pointers!! not unequal at all. You just havent experienced a grinds school so peoples imagination conjures it up to be a magical land, thats all. ok maybe it is great. haha!

shazzyshaz

Darren1o1 wrote:

Medical mechanical engineering - DCU
It's changing its name to bioengineering i believe this year.

Good luck with that:D

What are you looking to do?

wow nice one. nice degree to have!

Um well i have dentistry down but i have lost sight of ever achieving that dream. Maybe dental hygiene, but thats only a diploma.grrrrrrrr

i have law and french law down too, as this interests me also.

Haven't a Clue

shazzyshaz wrote:

inequality- how is it unequal? I go to a grinds school and dont think im any better off for this exam than i was last year in my ''normal school''. plenty of people go to grinds schools and get 100points! the only ones youll hear about are the 700pointers!! not unequal at all. You just havent experienced a grinds school so peoples imagination conjures it up to be a magical land, thats all. ok maybe it is great. haha!

They're obviously entitled to another 100 points compared to the rest of us though.

shazzyshaz

how?? i said 600pointers......

cson

Don't know when you did your LC but on the current syllabus the language of argument is a key component. It is listed under the 5 uses of language,

Language of narration
Language of argument
Language of persuasion
Language of information
Language of aesthetics

The leaving cert exam most certainly will contain a composition based on one of these

shazzyshaz

its spelt- arguement

lilmizzme

unnameduser wrote:

signature removed to keep the peace. But lilmizzme if you took the time to have a look at it, the link had nothing to do with grinds.. it was about software that showed mandatory experiments for biology for LC students.

I did look at it before I posted....essentially offering help for money...I fail to see a huge difference between it and others like it and an actual grind...

Darren1o1

shazzyshaz wrote:

Um well i have dentistry down but i have lost sight of ever achieving that dream. Maybe dental hygiene, but thats only a diploma.grrrrrrrr

Don't loss sight, if it what you want go for it! Going through dental hygiene route might take longer but you will get there in the end. Just do your best and you'll be grand. Theres always another way to do something!

We get to do stuff like dental surgical equipment and so on.. Is not to bad of a degree and very interesting even if i do say so myself:D

shazzyshaz

thats brilliant--people like u darren101! doing what u enjoy, tis what makes the world go round!!:D

lilmizzme

shazzyshaz wrote:

its spelt- arguement

are you sure about that?

lilmizzme

Mary-Ellen wrote:

I give grinds, I don't do it for the money (although it comes in handy)
I'm a student with no interest in going into teaching btw

I do them because I relaly like the subject I do and I think a lot of people tend to have a negitive opinion about.

Would you give them for free?

cson

shazzyshaz wrote:

inequality- how is it unequal? I go to a grinds school and dont think im any better off for this exam than i was last year in my ''normal school''. plenty of people go to grinds schools and get 100points! the only ones youll hear about are the 600pointers!! not unequal at all. You just havent experienced a grinds school so peoples imagination conjures it up to be a magical land, thats all. ok maybe it is great. haha!

Consider,
Public School fees: €0
Grind School fees: €thousands.

Why are grind school fees so much more than public school fees? Its not for the fun of it I can tell you. There is also the ridiculous situation by which the Govt. actually pays the salaries of grind school teachers.

Aside from that, in your grind school is there religion? Sports? Extra Curricular Activities?. Public schools have an obligation to provide these.

So really if you cannot see that grind school students have a distinct advantage over public school students you need your head checked.