Is hitting your dog ok?

peasant

Just another quick point:

Those same hands that you may use to hit your dog are the hands it's supposed to trust when it comes to removing ticks, clipping nails, brushing, etc, etc...

I'd rather not break that trust and risk a bite every time I need to lay a hand on one of my dogs.

Ciaran500

peasant wrote:

Just another quick point:

Those same hands that you may use to hit your dog are the hands it's supposed to trust when it comes to removing ticks, clipping nails, brushing, etc, etc...

I'd rather not break that trust and risk a bite every time I need to lay a hand on one of my dogs.

There's a hell of a difference between going to hit a dog and trying to remove ticks, clipping nails, brushing, etc, etc...


Most of the time I wouldn't slap our dog unless they get completely out of hand, if it does get to that point as soon as I even try to hit him he will take off for his bed and stay there till things have calmed down. I've never, ever had a problem with trust when trying to do any of the things listed above. Even when I had to remove a piece of glass from his foot which had him yelping there was no aggression shown towards me.

BryanL

peasant,your getting in between them with legs and shins!!!!!!but wouldn't slap them just growl?
why would they ever again trust yours legs
seems like you don't live by your own example
Bryan

peasant

BryanL wrote:

peasant,your getting in between them with legs and shins!!!!!!but wouldn't slap them just growl?
why would they ever again trust yours legs
seems like you don't live by your own example
Bryan

Have you ever watched dogs sorting a caffuffle between themselves ...or even better, and older dog calling some youngsters to rule?

"Wading in" is exactly what they do, and they're quite physical about it. Good amounts of pushing and shoving going on there.

When our latest addition was quite young, veeery exuberant and didn't know when to stop, our old fella once even just turned around sat on her ...that shut her up

But he didn't bite or snap !

Cool, calm, decisive and quick, that's what you want to be.
Not panicked, not hesitant and certainly not violent.

David Michael

Interesting debate.

I think I'd better say sorry to my parents doggie. One for the odd slap on the nose. Then I suppose I'd better apologise for having her tail removed as a young pup. Not too mention the cognitive therapy rape come litter thing too


Crap... only last week we had all 6 puppies mutilated with tail removal too.

Our man in Havana

Annika30 wrote:

Being the 'top dog' has nothing to do with slapping and fighting with the other dogs. All that will do is get your dogs to distrust and fear you. The dog who is most active in enforcing order in a pack is usually not the top dog, but rather a second-in-command acting under the authority of the leader.
Why on earth would you have 10 dogs, how do you find the time for all of them, I am struggling with 3 dogs?
Annika

How many dogs I have love is nothing what so ever to do with you! Just because you can not cope with with 3 dogs does not mean we can not cope with 10! In fact we used to have 11 but one recently had to be put to sleep (RIP Willie)

My dogs are rescues - they were dumped near my house & the dog warden would not collect them - so they stayed & became part of the family! If I have to discipline my dogs & they are not responding to voice commands - then I would rather smack my dog than risk getting bitten when they are fighting! My dogs trust us implicitly & I can do anything with my dogs. I also trust my dogs around other people. So for us the occasional smack seems to work! Tis better to smack them when they are fighting than to risk getting bitten! Max is a very dominate male - he is the top of the pack & he shows he is by having a go at all the large males!

I do know the difference between a smack & abuse! I do not beat them! I do not hit them with sticks! They are well disciplined happy, healthy & well loved. They are our babies!

peasant

To everybody that occasionally "smacks" their dogs:

You DO realise that by bringing your hand near the dogs head (and therefore its teeth) you are actually extending an invitation to get bitten ...yes?

Especially so, if said dog is in an excited state because it's just been fighting.

Do it to the wrong dog at the wrong time and you WILL get bitten. If your lucky, it will be by accident. Or on purpose, if your not so lucky.

Our man in Havana

Who said I smacked em near the head??? When my dogs are going for it - my hands are no where near their heads!!!! I smack them near the hind leg.

In an ideal word - saying stop would stop snarling biting dogs - in reality NOPE!

David Michael

peasant wrote:

To everybody that occasionally "smacks" their dogs:

You DO realise that by bringing your hand near the dogs head (and therefore its teeth) you are actually extending an invitation to get bitten ...yes?

Especially so, if said dog is in an excited state because it's just been fighting.

Do it to the wrong dog at the wrong time and you WILL get bitten. If your lucky, it will be by accident. Or on purpose, if your not so lucky.

how does cutting its tail off sit with you?

artieanna

I would have to say that the punishment may depend on the dog or the situation...

For example: I find with my dog that she's not very confident and needs encouragement alot of the time. Sometimes she hasen't the courage to do what is asked of her so punishment by slapping will only make her more fearful.

There are other times, when I go for a walk and bring a neighbours lab with me. I throw a stick and my girl is fiercely competitive and MUST get the stick and the praise. However, the lab gets the stick & praise a few times as is only fair, well my girl can totally lose her temper and bite him, to which I give out to her and occasionally smack her on the back leg. Then we move on and continue the game. She knows that this is not acceptable behaviour and rarely does it.

I think we must use our personal judgement and apply punishment suitable for the particular dog or situation...It should never be severe or inflict pain on an animal..

Alfasudcrazy

I think a mild tap that does not hurt accompanied by some stern words is all that is needed. If I see one of the dogs with another by the throat and almost choking him I think some punishment is needed. They must always know who is boss.

enda1

Out of curiorisity, if you are attacked by a large dog, whats the best form of defense? Your not going to outrun one so I'm guessing that isn't the way to go.

Grab their neck or something maybe?

Annika30

Bond-007, I wasn't attacking you I just asked you a question. Like I said before I think it's easy to misinterpret things that are said on the board.

Annika

Nala

David Michael wrote:

how does cutting its tail off sit with you?

That's the third time you've told us you cut your dogs and puppies' tails off, are you trying to get a reaction or are you genuinely worried about being cruel? :rolleyes:

Well I'm sure your dogs will look just lovely with no tails, who cares if it hurts them? We are entitled to mutilate our creatures that have no say in the matter and cause them pain just so they look nice! Duh!!!

peasant

Just to clarify (semantics) here;

I do of course touch my dogs with my hands occasionally and I do also give them what some may call a "slap" ...as in a "nudge, nudge ...are you listening" kind of "slap" ...usually accompanied by a sharp "EYH!"

But I never hit them, and there never is any force behind the "slap".


As for breaking up a full blown fight between three or more full grown males?
Never had to do it ...but I'd think I'd prefer a bucket of water or a hard blow on a really loud whistle to going in there myself (as I might not come out the winner)

David Michael

Nala wrote:

That's the third time you've told us you cut your dogs and puppies' tails off, are you trying to get a reaction or are you genuinely worried about being cruel? :rolleyes:

Well I'm sure your dogs will look just lovely with no tails, who cares if it hurts them? We are entitled to mutilate our creatures that have no say in the matter and cause them pain just so they look nice! Duh!!!

No it is just a matter of realism. I don't cut of Dogs tails. Lambs...yes. Dogs...the vet. Some breeds have this done. Say boxers.

Some one who kicks the living sh1t out of their dog is an abuser. Some one who slaps their dog as part of obedience is not. It is not about being humane. There are a lot more inhumane things done to pets than a tap on the nose. It is insane for the OP to think that the slapping of a dog is cruel. I think everyone can agree hitting a dog hard is not required. But obedience "slapping" is not that great in the scale of being "humane"

Nala

David Michael wrote:

No it is just a matter of realism. I don't cut of Dogs tails. Lambs...yes. Dogs...the vet. Some breeds have this done. Say boxers.

So just because the vet did it that means you haven't been cruel to your animals??? Was their having tails causing you some sort of problem?

What vet do you use, so I know never to go to them? Would prefer to think I send my animals to someone who has enough ethics not to cut an animal's body parts off unless it's for the animal's own good.

What breed do you have?

David Michael

Nala wrote:

So just because the vet did it that means you haven't been cruel to your animals??? Was their having tails causing you some sort of problem?

What vet do you use, so I know never to go to them? Would prefer to think I send my animals to someone who has enough ethics not to cut an animal's body parts off unless it's for the animal's own good.

What breed do you have?

Eh we agree.

Boxer.

You totaly missed my point. I'd prefer if you are going to spout on about hitting dogs? look at the bigger picture. Getting a dog laid and not asking permisson? Injecting stuff in to it and not asking permisson? Chopping its tail off? hacking its nails?

The OP thinks hitting your dog in inhumane.

I'd say the two are incompatable. cruel V's not being cruel is debateable. i go for non cruel.

"humane" is just stupid. i am not a dog but i think my non cruel treatment of our dog is humane regardless of the odd tap on the nose/ass.

humane is moot.

Hootie

just getting back to what started this debate off it seems to me that the person has another problem. I wouldn't be the biggest fan of terriers and find them quite vicious compared to other dogs, and it seems that there could be a dominance issue that flares up every so often. Now when you add a new baby into that equation and the fact the dogs will not be getting as much time and freedom to roam the house as before (only natural with new baby) there could in fact be a jealous reaction that could also flare up. You will need to be very careful here and may look at starting to introduce them to the outside world. Only a suggestion but what do others think?

Sigma Force

Personally I think striking or slapping a dog is more a sign of owner frustration/anger than any real training.

Totally agree. Some actually almost make it a habit to hit their dog makes them feel better and get their frustrations out which is terrible. Not to mention I have seen people strike their horses one little s**t punched his horse in the nose :mad: On the subject of horses they can be trained without touching them using sticks to guide them instead, can't remember the proper horsey term for it.

Bottom line is animals should not be hit, if an owner has to break up a fight or something serious like that that's a different story pushing the dog hard away etc might be the only way of stopping it harming another dog etc etc that kind of extreme situation someone might have no choice.
But regularly hitting and slapping a dog esp. on the nose and also the lovely art of sticking a dogs nose in their own wee or poop is so outdated and plain cruel and doesn't work. Dogs noses are very sensative.

Nala

David Michael wrote:

Eh we agree.

Boxer.

You totaly missed my point. I'd prefer if you are going to spout on about hitting dogs? look at the bigger picture. Getting a dog laid and not asking permisson? Injecting stuff in to it and not asking permisson? Chopping its tail off? hacking its nails?

The OP thinks hitting your dog in inhumane.

I'd say the two are incompatable. cruel V's not being cruel is debateable. i go for non cruel.

"humane" is just stupid. i am not a dog but i think my non cruel treatment of our dog is humane regardless of the odd tap on the nose/ass.

humane is moot.

What are you on about???

And injecting a dog and cutting it's nails can be for it's own good.

Why did you decide to have your boxers' tails cut off? How was that for the dogs' own good?

peasant

David Michael wrote:

...
humane is moot.

It is actually.

You can treat your dog "humanely" all day long and still not treat it right.

Dogs are dogs ...human standards and values do NOT apply.
A dog needs to be treated like a dog. According to ITS needs and in a language that IT understands.

A dog has to be measured by dog standards not human ones ...the one thing that most dog owners get wrong.

LovelyTom

Hitting animals is horrible! and I've seen it quite a lot even in public places like parks etc.

Tar.Aldarion

No, you shouldn't hit them, if you have to hit them you are not rearing them right. However, I think cutting off somethings tail/neutering it is far worse than giving a dog a tap to keep him in check.

Rigsby

Tar.Aldarion wrote:

No, you shouldn't hit them, if you have to hit them you are not rearing them right. However, I think cutting off somethings tail/neutering it is far worse than giving a dog a tap to keep him in check.

What have you got against neutering ?

Tar.Aldarion

I somehow feel that gelding an animal for birth control is a bit much...

Jimkel

peasant wrote:

You can treat your dog "humanely" all day long and still not treat it right.

Very good point;)

But I think you'll find trying to have an honest debate here wont work because as soon as you say you "tap your dog on the nose" to get their attention when their getting brave and unruley all of a sudden the Bleeding hearts come out and hit ya with their holistic rethoric "Hitting is wrong" you can say "I never said I hit my dogs" but all they hear is "I am cruel to animals" no matter what you say, the bleeding hearts will only hear "Animal cruelty" I bet some of these people thinks it's "Humane" to dress their dogs up and carry them in handbags. Now thats animal cruelty

Rigsby

Tar.Aldarion wrote:

I somehow feel that gelding an animal for birth control is a bit much...

Could you elaborate ??

Jimkel

Annika30 wrote:

Jotter, I am aware of what letters comprise the word Humane, but its meaning does not relate to the classification of species, but rather to the attritributes which we strive to instill in our treatment of the rest of the animal world. Humane refers not to specifically to us, rather to how we act towards each other and towards those we have responsibility in our position at the top of the food chain. To simply interpret a word because it looks like another is to show an impoverished understanding of the holistic nature of language and is equally a distraction from what is most important, i.e. that we should strive to remove all forms of cruelty from our world.

Annika

BS, enjoy your steak or whatever animal you choose to eat,I Will, God didnt give me teeth designed for tearing flesh so I can be a veggie. Nature is harsh and cruel, and we are not exempt.

I Hate animal cruelty in all it's forms but I Loath bleeding hearts who refuse to see the grey area between tapping a dog on the nose and kicking a dog around.

LovelyTom

Why would you want to physically harm a creature that you're supposed to love and care for... hitting an animal isn't going to put it in it's place it's going to make it less trusting and unhappy... it's just wrong