Dobies and rots and other breeds

Doctor DooM

michelleans wrote: »

No dog breeds should be banned. Only the irresponsible dog owners that do not train or socialise them and make them dangerous should be banned from owning dogs.

I have a german shepherd also considered a "dangerous" breed :rolleyes: My dog loves all people, especially children and other dogs, he plays so gently with my budgie even. It's all about how you raise them. I've handled many many dogs - rottweilers german shepherds and dobermen included and never gotten bitten by one. However I have been bitten by terriers :cool:

Here's my baby

Said it before, what a beautiful dog.

It is all in the training.

The Artist

It is all in the training, says SDooM

+1

Bainne2

I walk dogs at a pound in Dublin most Sundays and I am always more weary (and occasionally told to watch out for) some of the terriers as opposed to the restricted breeds. The staffies are always the ones who want all the attention, in fact I think they'd be the ones who I would have found to be the most affectionate. I really believe that bad dogs are made, not born, and it's unfair to claim a whole breed is dangerous.

Imagine if I said that all Americans were going to die of obese related problems because that is what we read about a select few in the media. It wouldn’t be accepted as it would be labelling a whole community based on the actions of a few people. But that's exactly what society is doing when it calls a whole breed dangerous because of the mishaps of some bad examples.

The only possible result if legislation was brought into place to ban certain breeds is that those that it is trying to target, irresponsible dog owners, either won’t pay attention to the law and continue on as normal, or move their dog fighting paraphernalia underground and keep undercover or else move to a different breed. Those that want a macho dog by their side will always have one unless they are educated differently.

Instead of blaming the breed when an incident involving dog aggression occurs, blame the deed. It is never the dogs fault, a dog should never be left alone with a child or be in the presence of one that doesn’t know how to act around them, nor should a dog ever be left with an adult who cannot control it. Very rarely do dog attacks happen without provocation. Better legislation should be put in place around ownership. Regarding dog attacks, I feel these would be greatly reduced if, at the slightest hint of aggression, be it from a Doberman or a chichauah that the problem was tackled, via socialisation, also no dog should ever be out of an owners control, if your dog doesn’t have a recall, don’t let him off lead.

I'm also not sure I agree with the garda system. I certainly wouldn't want to be allowing the garda who lives up my road to be handing out licenses. His dog is kept in the back garden all the time, is still not house-trained 4 yrs on, is fed on crappy hyper active food, is rarely (perhaps once every two weeks) taken out for walks, is allowed wander any where and everywhere which means it attacks my dogs (and with three dogs on leash and one comes up to me I'm very very tempted to just let my three off, even if one of them is dog -aggresive occasionally, as I often feel my safety is being comprimised when he comes close), runs out infront of cars, still isn't neutered, is human aggresive and basically is a brat. - we would have to train the gardai first.

cotton

Seeing as we're doing pics..........
I've had the couch, now I'll have you!

cotton

Or the same dog a bit more serious............

The Artist

cotton wrote: »

Seeing as we're doing pics..........
I've had the couch, now I'll have you!

DONT TOUCH MY PINK......... LEAF!

The Artist

i just loged on to anvil site nice to see voluntary organistation doing that.must be hard work for them and found a logo on their web.

cotton

Anvil stands for Animals Need A Voice in Legislation.
They work extremely hard, beyond belief, trying to be a voice for animals in this country. Have a look around the site, there is so much information there that everyone can use.
I firmly believe that if anyone wants to see a change in the disgraceful animal welfare laws we have now, we've got to support Anvil & all the work they do.

kerrysgold

Bainne2 wrote: »

I walk dogs at a pound in Dublin most Sundays and I am always more weary (and occasionally told to watch out for) some of the terriers as opposed to the restricted breeds. The staffies are always the ones who want all the attention, in fact I think they'd be the ones who I would have found to be the most affectionate. I really believe that bad dogs are made, not born, and it's unfair to claim a whole breed is dangerous.

Imagine if I said that all Americans were going to die of obese related problems because that is what we read about a select few in the media. It wouldn’t be accepted as it would be labelling a whole community based on the actions of a few people. But that's exactly what society is doing when it calls a whole breed dangerous because of the mishaps of some bad examples.

The only possible result if legislation was brought into place to ban certain breeds is that those that it is trying to target, irresponsible dog owners, either won’t pay attention to the law and continue on as normal, or move their dog fighting paraphernalia underground and keep undercover or else move to a different breed. Those that want a macho dog by their side will always have one unless they are educated differently.

Instead of blaming the breed when an incident involving dog aggression occurs, blame the deed. It is never the dogs fault, a dog should never be left alone with a child or be in the presence of one that doesn’t know how to act around them, nor should a dog ever be left with an adult who cannot control it. Very rarely do dog attacks happen without provocation. Better legislation should be put in place around ownership. Regarding dog attacks, I feel these would be greatly reduced if, at the slightest hint of aggression, be it from a Doberman or a chichauah that the problem was tackled, via socialisation, also no dog should ever be out of an owners control, if your dog doesn’t have a recall, don’t let him off lead.

I'm also not sure I agree with the garda system. I certainly wouldn't want to be allowing the garda who lives up my road to be handing out licenses. His dog is kept in the back garden all the time, is still not house-trained 4 yrs on, is fed on crappy hyper active food, is rarely (perhaps once every two weeks) taken out for walks, is allowed wander any where and everywhere which means it attacks my dogs (and with three dogs on leash and one comes up to me I'm very very tempted to just let my three off, even if one of them is dog -aggresive occasionally, as I often feel my safety is being comprimised when he comes close), runs out infront of cars, still isn't neutered, is human aggresive and basically is a brat. - we would have to train the gardai first.

very well said, agreed 100%. it's basically racism for dogs. breedism? you'd think educated, supposedly upstanding people like gards etc. would be better citizens in general, but no. e.g. there is a Doctor living up the road from me and he is the same way. Has a GSD and a setter out in the back garden, human and animal aggressive (actually killed their own cat when they got out the other week) never exercised, obviously never been trained/socialised and probably not neutered either.
and I agree with you about the staffies, they are such sweeties. they are supposed to be the ideal breed to have in families with young kids because they are so good-tempered and friendly even though the media try to make out they are "dangerous" I suppose they might be if you are allergic to being licked or something.

togster

The nicest, kindest, smartest dog i have ever encountered was a staff.

cowzerp

togster wrote: »

The nicest, kindest, smartest dog i have ever encountered was a staff.

I love staff's there so friendly and affectionate but smart? not high up on the list of smart dogs in fairness! not saying the 1 you encountered was not smart.

wyk

In most places in the States, there are statutes regarding what sorts of dogs you can keep within city limits, which ones should be registered, etc.

The way it worked where I have lived in Texas, California, and Missouri is you had to register certain breeds that have shown to have attacked people and caused gravious harm in the past with the local animal control. Not doing so was a large fine if the animal was sighted(even if in a confined area under your control). If your dog got loose and was under the guidleines(rottweilers, pit bulls, Akitas mainly etc.), it was another large fine for a first offense($175 in the last city I lived in). A second offense had the dog put down, AND you were cited for another $315. In practice, you generally got a warning the first time. In dangeruos cases, there was no leniency, though. The wardens carried video cameras with them, and had no problems making the charges stick in court when challenged. Most owners paid the fines after seeing the videos, and secured their dogs. It cut down dramatically the amount of loose dogs of certain types in the area, as well as the amount of guard-type dogs under the control of wreckless owners. So, no, wreckless owners didn't simply two-finger this system - they paid or got out of the dog owning business.

I had a 130lb Rottweiler at the time, and I thought the laws worked fine. I knew if that dog got loose, became confused or felt threatened, that he could easily kill a grown man, even though he was as gentle as a lamb in my home. I think the problem is that some dog owners don't understand that it is their dogs decision on when or how they feel threatened or decide to attack - not theirs. Keep any large dog under complete control all the time, every time. Well, that really should go for all dogs.

But, as I have said in the past here, the reason for breed-specific laws are because a 130 lb Rottweiler can kill your teenager simply playing with him, while a Chihuahua is gonna run out of energy or patience before it can seriously injure a small child.

WYK

peasant wrote: »

Other countries have tried this, with the result that money was wasted on administration and testing, testers had to be employed, dog training became more expensive, owners were hugely inconvenienced, whole breeds of dogs stigmatised ...



....and those "owners" that were supposed to be weeded out just gave the two fingers to the whole system and carried right on misusing/abusing their dogs.

wyk

togster wrote: »

The nicest, kindest, smartest dog i have ever encountered was a staff.

A friend of mine has a loving wolf hybrid that is 140 lbs. You want me to let it out of the gate and see how much it will dote on you? Yes, he has to register it with the local authorities, or he risks them confiscating the canine.

WYK

togster

cowzerp wrote: »

I love staff's there so friendly and affectionate but smart? not high up on the list of smart dogs in fairness! not saying the 1 you encountered was not smart.

So smart. Not in a typical canine way as in she did no tricks etc. She was almost human smart. She understood what people were saying, if that makes any sense at all. She knew people by their names. If you said "Mike" is coming over she would always get excited. If you said "Shane" is coming over she would sulk because she didn't like him.

Snoop Dogg

its bad the way Doberman pinschers are banned i wanted to get one until i heard i cant get one cuz its illegal ,but yet ive seen one up the road from me, but its okay for them to have one cuz they live in sutton and there so much better at keeping dogs than us common folk :mad::mad::mad::mad: my @rse

Wolfsberg

Snoop Dogg wrote: »

its bad the way Doberman pinschers are banned i wanted to get one until i heard i cant get one cuz its illegal ,but yet ive seen one up the road from me, but its okay for them to have one cuz they live in sutton and there so much better at keeping dogs than us common folk :mad::mad::mad::mad: my @rse

LOL

Lauragoesmad

To be honest, I'm kinda coming round to the idea that the restricted dogs should be bred out of extinction. Not because of anything that the dogs have done but because of the raw deal they get in life. My dog Bessie is never allowed to play with the other doggies when we are out walking. Almost everyone glares at her with horrible looks and I know by her little stance that she feels threatened when they do. Numerous people have pulled their children away from her even when she is muzzled. I don't think its fair to have these dogs living with so many people who hate them.:(
The day before yesterday I was in St Annes with her and I had her muzzle off so I could give her a treat while feeding the ducks and a lady came up to me with her grandchild that was 2. I was amazed that she let him pet Bessie and I think Bessie was as shocked as me! Bessie loved him and he was even feeding her bread! Bessie was in such a good mood for the rest of the day. This kind of interaction for her would be brilliant but unfortunately, it only happens once in a blue moon in this dog ignorant country!
ok, rant over!:o

andreac

Snoop Dogg wrote: »

its bad the way Doberman pinschers are banned i wanted to get one until i heard i cant get one cuz its illegal ,but yet ive seen one up the road from me, but its okay for them to have one cuz they live in sutton and there so much better at keeping dogs than us common folk :mad::mad::mad::mad: my @rse

THERE ARE NO BANNED DOGS IN IRELAND!!! PLEASE GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT!!!!!!!!!!!

Honey-ec

Snoop Dogg wrote: »

its bad the way Doberman pinschers are banned i wanted to get one until i heard i cant get one cuz its illegal ,but yet ive seen one up the road from me, but its okay for them to have one cuz they live in sutton and there so much better at keeping dogs than us common folk :mad::mad::mad::mad: my @rse

andreac wrote: »

THERE ARE NO BANNED DOGS IN IRELAND!!! PLEASE GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT!!!!!!!!!!!

I think it's safer all round in this case if we let this person continue to think they can't get a Dobermann, if this is the level of research they put into their potential acquisition...

andreac

Honey-ec wrote: »

I think it's safer all round in this case if we let this person continue to think they can't get a Dobermann, if this is the level of research they put into their potential acquisition...

You could have a point there Honey.

kildara

Snoop Dogg wrote: »

its bad the way Doberman pinschers are banned i wanted to get one until i heard i cant get one cuz its illegal ,but yet ive seen one up the road from me, but its okay for them to have one cuz they live in sutton and there so much better at keeping dogs than us common folk :mad::mad::mad::mad: my @rse

Do you mean that the dogs are banned by certain local councils? Which is why you have seen some around?

xxboylarzxx

snoop lives in kilbarack and they are banned in that area!and sutton is verryclose by(they arnt banned in this area) therefore big snoop is angry:mad::(:mad:

Andy

Broad

I have retrievers. I have three children and the kids and dogs get on brilliantly. They are the sweetest most gentle creatures you could imagine (the dogs that is..) but I would not allow them to play with children not my own without me keeping an eye on them. My vet says that she is wary of an unknown retriever or lab when doing a procecure on them without sedation, more so than with a well-raised german shepherd or rotweiller. It is all in the treatment of the dogs when they are young, and on-going training. She says that small terriers can be really fierce though.. but are small enough generally to not cause major harm.

All dogs will respond to good training, affection and attention no matter what their breed particularly if they are house raised with people as opposed to being left in a run for much of the day or put into a shed at night. Vet thinks that house rearing is the main factor in raising very friendly dogs.

Any opinions on this?

Snoop Dogg

thank you boylarz,yes dey are banned in dublin county council,so F whoever said get your facts right ,ther is a list of 11 dogs which are banned .if you dont belive me look it up on irish kennel club, why dont you get yor facts right!:mad::mad::mad:;) some people

Snoop Dogg

kildara wrote: »

Do you mean that the dogs are banned by certain local councils? Which is why you have seen some around?

yea as i said above ,banned only in dublin county council,other districs can have them,which i dont understand cuz the other districts are 2 seconds away from me!

Snoop Dogg

Lauragoesmad wrote: »

To be honest, I'm kinda coming round to the idea that the restricted dogs should be bred out of extinction. Not because of anything that the dogs have done but because of the raw deal they get in life. My dog Bessie is never allowed to play with the other doggies when we are out walking. Almost everyone glares at her with horrible looks and I know by her little stance that she feels threatened when they do. Numerous people have pulled their children away from her even when she is muzzled. I don't think its fair to have these dogs living with so many people who hate them.:(
The day before yesterday I was in St Annes with her and I had her muzzle off so I could give her a treat while feeding the ducks and a lady came up to me with her grandchild that was 2. I was amazed that she let him pet Bessie and I think Bessie was as shocked as me! Bessie loved him and he was even feeding her bread! Bessie was in such a good mood for the rest of the day. This kind of interaction for her would be brilliant but unfortunately, it only happens once in a blue moon in this dog ignorant country!
ok, rant over!:o

st annes haha 2 minutes away from me ,fair play to that owel one and the kid!

Snoop Dogg

Broad wrote: »

I have retrievers. I have three children and the kids and dogs get on brilliantly. They are the sweetest most gentle creatures you could imagine (the dogs that is..) but I would not allow them to play with children not my own without me keeping an eye on them. My vet says that she is wary of an unknown retriever or lab when doing a procecure on them without sedation, more so than with a well-raised german shepherd or rotweiller. It is all in the treatment of the dogs when they are young, and on-going training. She says that small terriers can be really fierce though.. but are small enough generally to not cause major harm.

All dogs will respond to good training, affection and attention no matter what their breed particularly if they are house raised with people as opposed to being left in a run for much of the day or put into a shed at night. Vet thinks that house rearing is the main factor in raising very friendly dogs.

Any opinions on this?

dogs do what there trained to do(not all) can you blame them for doing their job?

cloudy day

Snoop Dogg wrote: »

dogs do what there trained to do(not all) can you blame them for doing their job?

What is their job.? If you mean gaurding and agression, well this is precisely the reason why these breeds are banned by the council. Heavy powerful breeds of dog's (in heavily populated urban areas with lots of kids and small dogs) which can cause serious damage to people if they attack them.

The problems always revert back to one thing, owners and bad handling training of these dogs. But it is the dog that suffers, not the owner.

fatmammycat

cloudy day wrote: »

What is their job.? If you mean gaurding and agression, well this is precisely the reason why these breeds are banned by the council. Heavy powerful breeds of dog's (in heavily populated urban areas with lots of kids and small dogs) which can cause serious damage to people if they attack them.

The problems always revert back to one thing, owners and bad handling training of these dogs. But it is the dog that suffers, not the owner.

Exactly- bad owners are a complete liability, more so when coupled with a dog that can do serious damage.
I owned a dobermann for years, he was an absolute gentleman- but I socialised him from an early age and trained him to a really high standard. He was naturally aloof with strangers but never fearful or aggressive. Dobies are actually quite goofy and love love love playing games, and are smart as hell for figuring things out. They really adore being with their owners and are incredibly loyal. Its horrible to see these dogs so maligned and left bored out of their minds in gardens.

andreac

Snoop Dogg wrote: »

thank you boylarz,yes dey are banned in dublin county council,so F whoever said get your facts right ,ther is a list of 11 dogs which are banned .if you dont belive me look it up on irish kennel club, why dont you get yor facts right!:mad::mad::mad:;) some people

People are not allowed to own them in certain areas alright, but there are no banned breeds as such in Ireland. I own one of these breeds so i do know what i am talking about.
So please dont tell me to go F myself or i will report you.