How to become Sys Admin.

Velocitee

This is a jobs/tech/IT certification issue so altogether not sure where to put it so put it here, mods feel free to move if it's in the wrong place (and thanks )

I have the feeling this will turn into a long post, however,

I am (hopefully) finishing up my Computer Science degree in a couple of weeks. I would really love to work as a System Administrator for a company, even if it was just as an assistant to start. However most of the job openings that I can see in this area need experience of anything from 1 to 5 years. Also they require an A+ and/or N+ certification in most cases. I want to do this kind of work because (as you will see) I do like it and I see that some of the contract work etc. once you have experience is excellent (I'm all for getting paid well to do something I like)

Now onto my conundrum,

In my course we received no training in network administration, hardware (i.e. Repair/ component replacement within computers) or anything to do with Windows servers/Active directory/ Exchange etc. We did get a prep course of a couple of weeks before going on work placement to do the basics – (set up a user for example on a windows server) but it was all really basic.

We did however use UNIX system (when forced, lol – I wouldn't be particularly strong at it). I learned VB.NET, basic shell scripting, Java, SQL,C, PHP, XML and HTML among others. In the course we learned about network topologies, security etc. but did not have any practical experience with these – it was all theory .

My own experience is that I went off in my own time and familiarised myself with what I was interested in that was not covered by my course. I give the following just as an example, it is not me blowing my own trumpet (or conversely making me look like an idiot! );

I built my own PC last summer for example, and feel quite comfortable going 'under the hood' of windows, e.g. services.msc, msconfig, ipconfig, etc. (even regedit on occasion <shudder> )I have my own wireless network with multiple computers and shared printers. People in my course have brought systems to me/asked me to take a look at their systems when all is not going well. I am the guy my family/neighbours rings (whether I'm busy or not! ) when they have a problem and generally fix it, be it hardware/ software/viruses/adware etc. and am generally quite quick at finding the problem. I have diagnosed and repaired hardware faults in laptops also. I like this kind of work and it actually annoys me if I can't find a solution to a problem (doesn't happen often with this kind of an attitude! <- ).

I am merely stating the above so you have an idea of my kind of background/aptitude.

Anyway what I'm asking is were there people here in a similar situation who went on to do Sys Admin work and how did they go about it? I mentioned the Admin Assistant earlier as that is ideally how I would like to get into this kind of job. I could study for the A+ and N+ over the summer (at a cost of about 1k between exams and courses I think and about 88hrs between exam and training – online courses) but if I didn't get an Admin assistant position, it would mean that I'd have to stay in my part time job for the summer (a no-no I would think).

Otherwise I was thinking maybe of doing a paid internship in this area as it would look good on a C.V. and could mean that I could afford to live and do my A+, N+. if required (I'm not exactly sure how easy these are to find). Of course I'm open to suggestions about other avenues to take. Would there be any companies looking for admin assistants/ general lackeys and would they be willing to provide on-the-job training given that I would be fresh out of a Comp Sc. degree for instance?

I'm very confused about this and would appreciate any and all advice anyone has to offer

Thanks!

_CreeD_

Do both the A+ and N+ as home-study. Just coming off a college degree you should have no problem with the discipline to do them at home. They're both good courses and not too hard.
No one will hand you their network without experience or certification levels way above those required for someone with the hands on too, so aim to start as a runner/helpdesk guy to start with. Then work your way up. The Certs will not open the door for you but it will push it wider once you get your own foot in. An MCP or 2 wouldn't hurt either, even just 70-270 (XP) and 70-290 (the first Server 2k3 exam and one that's entirely aimed at entry level admin./assistants as it's all about maintenance and not the deeper design areas), it shows some vendor-backed aptitude on your CV that goes beyond just saying you are good with windows. The full MCSE may be way off but if you have time for those 2 it helps a lot, even just with employer search engines to start with.
I don't know how different it is back home now but in the states a Comp. Sci. degree really comes into play as you move up, particularly if you head into management. But it won't be accepted as a means to get a network job straight out of college. Not trying to discourage you. My boss is in the opposite position. He's a great tech/admin, has his MCSE/MCT/NET+/A+ etc. but never went to college. It's definitely holding him below director level at our company as the boss of bosses has an MBA and doesn't know too much about IT certs (the same guy had problems calling me a network engineer as I had a Physics and not an Engineering degree...never mind it's the industry standard term for what I do). Anyway, my point is it is not much use to you starting off in this area but will reap rewards later.

brav

I was kinda in the same boat as yourself.

I was in a Computer Science degree(software developtment) but I lost intrest in software development(I liked creating the odd program and I wasn't bad at it, just knew it wasn't the work I wanted)
Anyway I was about to drop out and go down the cisco route etc, but it was the start of 3rd year and work placement was coming up so I said I might as well go for that anyway.

I ended up getting a job and they actually let me do a lot of network work, obviously not on any routers but the odd switch, plus setting up new racks, wiring them up etc.

When the placement finished I went back to college for a few weeks(had to repeat 3rd year) but then I said feck it, I had no interest in Software dev anymore(just as a hobby) so became a dropout.
In the meantime one of the network engineers from the placement had his own small business on the side(IT support for a few companies) and most weekends/evenings I was working for him. He left the company and then went at the business fulltime.

A job came up in the place where I did a placement and they wanted him to come in as a contractor for IT Support. He was busy and suggested me.

So now I am still at that company(a year later) as a contractor, and will be for 1 more year. I'm on 30k+ a year without any qualifications and much prefer doing this work than soft dev.
I'm not working with networks, just maintaing server environments and the odd desktop/laptop problem and your normal IT stuff(PABX, AD, Websites).
I pland on doing CCNA etc but not yet as I don't have time/money(will be going on a year trip to OZ etc) but I am currently studying for Server+, will do Net+ after that and maybe A+, but prob Security+ before that.

Static M.e.

Velocitee.

Where are you from/live? when are you finished your degree?

Velocitee

Hey, thanks for the advice + personal experiences so far. Very useful.

It looks like I will be doing the A+ and N+ certs. I had planned to do these anyway so it's not too big a deal (more lines to add to the C.V ) It just means I'd have to do them in the evenings ASAP after I finish college. Also based on _Creed_'s advice I'll be doing the 70-290 server 2k3 exam as well I'd say.

Static M.E - at the moment I'm based in Cork with and I'll be finished college end of next week.

That's something else I forgot to mention - I've no problem working in another county if needs be and I've a full driving license.

Any more advice/experiences welcome!

Moonbeam

Apply for a graduate entry level sys admin role?

Velocitee

Moonbeam wrote:

Apply for a graduate entry level sys admin role?

Maybe I'm not looking correctly but there don't seem to be many jobs that fit this description (despite my best efforts! )

In the last few days I've been looking at monster.ie and jobs.ie but can't seem to find anything that matches this

I've no problem getting a job and doing the training alongside it if required, in fact it would suit me quite fine

aidan_walsh

If you're looking for Graduate entry level work you will most likely be better off looking at your college's careers office, or at a site like GradIreland. Sites like Monster tend to be more focused on people with experience looking to change career, as far as I can see.

Velocitee

aidan_walsh wrote:

If you're looking for Graduate entry level work you will most likely be better off looking at your college's careers office, or at a site like GradIreland. Sites like Monster tend to be more focused on people with experience looking to change career, as far as I can see.

didn't know about gradireland - looks very good!

Aidan, you are a legend!

Velocitee

right - I've decided to do my A+ as a starter, will order the material ASAP

What's next though? N+ or 70-290 Windows server exam??

Which is the cert that employers like to see/ that will be of most benefit to the daily duties of a sys admin so I can cover that first.

Cheers
V

Naikon

I reckon the RHCE Linux/MCSE and CCNA will benefit the most alongside some security certifications like ethical hacking/network security exams etc.
CCNP if you are more network oriented than systems where RHCE/other linux/Unix certs will benefit more.

Moonbeam

It really depends what sort of sys admin you want to be..

Windows or Unix for a start?


Maybe a masters?
CCNA is never a bad idea either.

Velocitee

would prob be windows sys admin work,

would you consider N+ first or server 2003 first?

which one do employers prefer to see?

I haven't looked into CCNA yet

_CreeD_

Don't just look at it from a point of view of padding your resume, think about what you might need to actually do the job (the 2 should be the same but often aren't). For sheer impressiveness on it's own the Server cert is better BUT will be easier to learn and gain strength by having at least the basics of network infrastructures behind it...I've met a few MCSE's who didn't have a clue about network topologies or even how routers and switches really work, it's like being a mechanic who didn't understand how the tires managed to stay on the car. You can do the Net+ pretty quickly. The Net+ combined with the A+ count as one elective for the MCSA 2003 btw so you'd already be part way up the Microsoft ladder (they don't count for the MCSE though). The MCSA is a kind of halfway point on the MCSE track, it covers pretty much everything you'd need to know to maintain all network services, the rest of the MCSE leans more towards design.

Static M.e.

just on a side point, if you get the A+ and Net + you can use them both towards a single elective MCP.

So depending on your viewpoint you could already have..

Joe Bloggs A+ , Net +, MCP.....

Opps, didn't read _Creed_'s post fully!

Velocitee

thanks for the replies!

handy that A+ and N+ are treated as MCP

I see on the FÁS website that they have online Ecollege courses for A+ and N+ , does anyone know if FÁS do the exams for these as well?? I think I'll ring them to get some more information anyway. failing that are there alternative places in cork where I could go to get the certification for the A+ and N+ exams - (I checked the sticky but PFH was all I could see and they haven't listed any dates for testing these on their website) ?

also < this > looks to be the course to do on the Microsoft side of things (might as well get it over with fully ) - I am employed part time but it is not IT related - would I still be eligible for this course?? Should I even do this course if they are bringing out server 2008 - when will they be offering server 2008 MCSA courses?


Thanks (and I realise this is dragging on a bit! )

brav

PFH do the testing through VUE.

You have to apply for the test though the VUE site, you have to create an account but after this you can view available dates etc.

I'm not sure if FÁS do the tests for N+, but PFH/VUE definatly does.

As for the MSCA course, no harm in doing it now, when Server 2008 comes out you could prob just do a new module on server 2008

Static M.e.

Can't you still get Fas funding 70% to do an MCSE?

If you could get the funding, that would be my first choice.

Velocitee

Alright, looks like I have a lot to think about on this one!

Well you can't say computer courses aren't varied!

Thanks for all the help,
V