Have FF missed a great opportunity?

stepbar

Deleted User wrote:

I know some of it was squandered. I know that happens in every other democracy in the world but life goes on and people don't flog themselves and whinge 24/7 over it. It's just the way things go.

Mind you, Noel Dempsey said the same thing of the e-voting debacle. :rolleyes:

thebman

murphaph wrote:

Just out of curiosity Conor, should FF get back in and the economy take this downturn, will YOU accept FF as being responsible?

Nah just like Bertie with electronic voting, it'll be the oppositions fault for questioning them! If they hadn't held us up, we would easily have been able to rig the election, I mean introduce electronic voting.

BTW anyone who works in IT or has any idea about computers knows that FF are either so unbelievably dumb when it comes to technology that they didn't know the machines were useless because of security holes or where trying to organise a way to rig elections.

In either case their inability to admit their mistake is sickening and should be punished by kicking them out of government IMO. As I work in IT, I want a government that understands it and this government has a 10 year track record, proving it hasn't a clue.

AidoCQS

This whole thread is emblematic of how FF put their careers and electioneering ahead of real issues that real people have to deal with

brim4brim

brim4brim wrote:

FF are either so unbelievably dumb when it comes to technology

Yeah, I think it's Bertie himself who makes all the calls on computers, not some civil servants...:D

Man, the vitriol here gets stronger and stronger!

Agent J

Deleted User wrote:

Yeah, I think it's Bertie himself who makes all the calls on computers, not some civil servants...:D

Man, the vitriol here gets stronger and stronger!

Cullen should be publically flogged with a stripped CAT5 cable for his role in it.

Bertie is guilty of shifting the blame and misrepresenting the french elections with reguard to the pencils remark

Agent J

Agent J wrote:

misrepresenting the french elections with reguard to the pencils remark

Is that a hanging offence? Oh for the good old days when people who misrepresented French elections and made pencil remarks were burned at the stake...

jmayo

Deleted User wrote:

Yeah, I think it's Bertie himself who makes all the calls on computers, not some civil servants...:D

Man, the vitriol here gets stronger and stronger!

The reason a lot of people, particularly those not employed by public sector, are pis*ed off is because they see in their daily working lives people taking responsiblility.
A concept alien to both the government and the public sector.

Bertie may quote JFK but there is no damm way he will ever quote Harry Truman "The buck stops here".

You may make a joke about the e-voting, rather typical of FF.
FF/PDs pushed it even though there were lots of experts and non-experts stating it was flawed.
So yes, the Taoiseach and government were at fault for wasting taxpayers money on a system, and also continuing to waste the money by having to pay for the storage of same useless devices.

But to add insult to injury, Bertie then berates anybody that questions his e-voting debacle and accuses them of being ludities.

Regarding PPARS some managers in HSE should be fired for toalt incompetence or else fraud.
The project should have been pulled years ago. Bu yet again Bertie has stated that it was a success because it did work to a fashion. Yes eventually after being hugely over budget and delayed by 5 odd years.

Agent J

I said he was guilty of it. I never said what should be done with him. If you want to suggest hanging... by all means.

Ahern is guilty of not sticking his hands up and admitting that they got it wrong.

Which they did. Extremely so.

He also went on to say that the french has e voting and they has results in hours. They didnt. It took days and was only a small amount of the electorate voting that way. We also have the recent scottish examples of when things screw up and need i even mention the US.

If you wish defend the Evoting system then by all means go ahead......

stepbar

Deleted User wrote:

Yeah, I think it's Bertie himself who makes all the calls on computers, not some civil servants...:D

Man, the vitriol here gets stronger and stronger!

Martin Cullen??? Whose boss is Bertie??? Why didnt Bertie sack Cullen? Ah no, give him another job.... in transport. Well done Bertie :rolleyes:

jmayo

jmayo wrote:

A concept alien to both the government and the public sector.

I work in the private sector.

Hasn't it been a great 10 years all round?

It wasn't so long ago when the Irish private sector meant a building site in Cricklewood.

Agent J

Deleted User wrote:

I work in the private sector.

Hasn't it been a great 10 years all round?

It wasn't so long ago when the Irish private sector meant a building site in Cricklewood.

Can FF ever admit they got something wrong?

Agent J

Agent J wrote:

Can FF ever admit they got something wrong?

You haven't read my posts.

I've often said FF got things wrong, many things. I said Bertie should have gone last year. But I could say it 100 times, and I'll still get someone who doesn't know the first thing about FF (except that they hate them) saying 'you lot blindly follow Bertie and you lot never admit mistakes'...

Agent J

I have read some of your posts and to be fair you arent exactly on par with some of other blindly led FF on this board.

However what i really mean is FF leadership.

There are a few glaring cock-ups in the last ten years that someone should have been fired for and not just moved minstery.

I dont hate FF. I like some of the stuff they have brought in and done. However its when something goes wrong and this ingrained attitude that no one need resign.. we'll just move them around. It drives me mad. In the private sector it wouldnt be allowed happen. I'm still very pissed of with the actions right after the last election.

To be honest im still trying to figure out the difference between FF & FG......

Agent J

Agent J wrote:

There are a few glaring cock-ups in the last ten years that someone should have been fired for and not just moved minstery.

I completely agree. FF should have clamped down on those incompetents that bring the party down. In fairness to FG, when Phil Hogan made the budget speech mistake a few years back, he went straight away.

Agent J wrote:

In the private sector it wouldnt be allowed happen.

Again, I agree.

But then again, would the likes of Cullen and Roche get a job in the private sector in the first place?

Agent J wrote:

To be honest im still trying to figure out the difference between FF & FG......

We did better on the North! But apart from that, even if they can't get into bed with each other, it's high time the two parties started fumbling around with each other anyway.

murphaph

Deleted User wrote:

It wasn't so long ago when the Irish private sector meant a building site in Cricklewood.

At least of you fell off the scaffolding you'd not be waiting on a trolley in A&E.

Anyway, can you answer my question. Here it is again:

If the economy goes south following a FF election victory, will you accept that as being FF's fault?

Lemming

Deleted User wrote:

I work in the private sector.

Hasn't it been a great 10 years all round?

It wasn't so long ago when the Irish private sector meant a building site in Cricklewood.

If I recall from a thread quite some time ago, where I had the misfortune to come across your posts for the first time, you mentioned something about being involved with the construction industry.

I could be mistaken .. but I do seem to recall you bleating on about all the new 4x4s sitting in FF driveways or something equally banal during the course of it all.

Hotblack Desiato

Deleted User wrote:

Yeah, I think it's Bertie himself who makes all the calls on computers, not some civil servants...:D

The minister placed the order for the full batch of e-voting machines against the advice of his senior civil servants. No passing the buck please.

marie_85

Agent J wrote:

To be honest im still trying to figure out the difference between FF & FG......

One of them has a contract... you may have missed it though, it was a very understated idea. Their leader really should have mentioned it more :rolleyes:

Lemming

Lemming wrote:

ROFL are you for real Conor? I see the arrogance of FF seems to extend to its fan-boi base as well

Lemming wrote:

it very much f*cking matters

Lemming wrote:

You can keep your 'netiquette' to yourself Conor. I couldn't care less what you think or whether or not I've offended some sensibility of yours.

Lemming wrote:

I hold you (and always have done) with utter contempt

Lemming wrote:

I had the misfortune to come across your posts for the first time

Wow.

Wowoweewee.

PM me your hate stuff. Let's keep this forum for politics.

Lemming

Deleted User wrote:

Wow.

Wowoweewee.

PM me your hate stuff. Let's keep this forum for politics.

And in typical Conor74 style, avoiding the question by attempting to sling mud combined with the usual selective quotation. It's nice to see you can cut and paste deary, but it wears after a while.

*clap*

*clap*

*clap*

So Conor74 ... would you care to answer the question on whether or not you are connected to the construction industry?

oscarBravo

Lemming, less of the personal stuff please, you know the rules.

thebman

Deleted User wrote:

Yeah, I think it's Bertie himself who makes all the calls on computers, not some civil servants...:D

Lol, maybe the bosses should change the employees if they don't like the job they are doing.

murphaph

Judging by conor's failure to answer my simple question I think we can all assume he would not expect FF to take responsibility for any future downturn in the economy which is hypocrisy at its worst seeing as he is only yoo happy for FF to take all the credit for the good times. Typical FF I suppose. I believe FF would be booted out very fast if they stopped disenfranchising young people of their vote. Students should be able to vote at college or at a minimum voting should be on a Sunday. But that wouldn't help FF stay in power.

is_that_so

murphaph wrote:

Judging by conor's failure to answer my simple question I think we can all assume he would not expect FF to take responsibility for any future downturn in the economy which is hypocrisy at its worst seeing as he is only yoo happy for FF to take all the credit for the good times. Typical FF I suppose. I believe FF would be booted out very fast if they stopped disenfranchising young people of their vote. Students should be able to vote at college or at a minimum voting should be on a Sunday. But that wouldn't help FF stay in power.

No logic to this at all. Can I be held responsible for something I sold, breaking down in four years time? All governments take credit for the good and blame the previous one for bad unfixable things. I know we all love to bash the government but there are limits.
If it was a case of say massive overborrowing then I would agree.
I agree with weekend voting and my opinion on the original question , not having read all the posts is yes, absolutely. But they don't seem to see it and are obsessed with keeping power, a bit like a child "it's my toy and you can't have it".
My hope is that after today we will give them the opportunity of that period of reflection in opposition.

murphaph

is_that_so wrote:

No logic to this at all

Yes there is. Conor wants FF to take all the credit for any positives we've seen over the past decade. I don't really believe FF would be completely to blame for an economic downturn should they get re-elected, but by the same token I DO accept that certain actions of the rainbow government who departed in 1997 also played a part in securing our economic success since then. Government actions cause results which overlap.

oscarBravo

oscarBravo wrote:

Lemming, less of the personal stuff please, you know the rules.

What was it about his 5th abusive and personal comment that made it stand out?

Lemming wrote:

So Conor74 ... would you care to answer the question on whether or not you are connected to the construction industry?

I'm not sure (i) what is meant by 'connected' or (ii) why is it relevant. I live in a house, so I guess I am 'connected'. I know little or nothing about the construction industry, have never been on a site, don't work in that industry, don't own a Landcruiser and don't wear Caterpillar boots.

murphaph wrote:

Judging by conor's failure to answer my simple question I think we can all assume he would not expect FF to take responsibility for any future downturn in the economy

Don't assume at all. Bad premise for an argument.

If FF are responsible, then they have to take responsibility. On the other hand, if for example there's an oil crisis or a terrorist attack on the IFSC, then blame may lie elsewhere. Not sure about your 'typical FF' comment, after all when this country was in the pits in the mid 80s didn't the FG Government and their apologists since then wring their hands and blame decisions made almost 10 years beforehand? That's what politicians, not just FF, do. They blame others.

jmayo

is_that_so wrote:

No logic to this at all. Can I be held responsible for something I sold, breaking down in four years time? All governments take credit for the good and blame the previous one for bad unfixable things. I know we all love to bash the government but there are limits.
If it was a case of say massive overborrowing then I would agree.

Actual yes the government should be blamed for the housing bubble and the fact that over past 5 odd years the economy has become based on residential construction and public service.
They have neglected other areas of economic development, they have allowed costs skyrocket.
They left tax incentives in place so that developers could build loads of houses in counties like Leitrim and Roscommon. Two prime examples.
Take a look at Daft or Myhome and see the volumes of houses for sale in these counties.

The government have been happy that the cash has been rolling in from this industry and their friends are getting rich.
But they have no thought to the fact most people on normal salaries can no longer afford a house unless they sign up for 40 year mortgage.
The quality of life has gone down for lots of people because they can no longer live in their own community and they have to commute for up 3/4 hours a day.
But it would be typical, they take responsibility for nothing.

How much will prices go down if FG get in, and what steps will they take to break any suggested ties between Government and the construction industry?

Lemming

Deleted User wrote:

What was it about his 5th abusive and personal comment that made it stand out?

Show me one abusive post ..... the fact that I quite clearly said I have absolute contempt for your political following is not an insult. It is a statement.

I'm not sure (i) what is meant by 'connected' or (ii) why is it relevant. I live in a house, so I guess I am 'connected'. I know little or nothing about the construction industry, have never been on a site, don't work in that industry, don't own a Landcruiser and don't wear Caterpillar boots.

It's quite revelant to establish whether or not you have a, how shall we put it .. "vested interest" in seeing Beeeerrrrrrrrrtie remain in power and like to visit the tents in Galway once a year.

I do however see that you are self-employed and a member of John O'Donoghue's constituency. You havent' ever been at the FF tent in galway have you?

And you still haven't answered the question. I never asked you if you worked in the construction industry. One does not have to be directly engaged in construction to be connected to the construction industry.

The fact that you own a house is neither here nor there, and another smarmy attempt to side-step the question.

So ... to clarify, are you in receipt of monies as a result of engagement with the construction industry in either direct or indirect capacity.

Lemming

Lemming wrote:

So ... to clarify, are you in receipt of monies as a result of engagement with the construction industry in either direct or indirect capacity.

Ummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

For the nth time, if you want to go into the personal stuff, either abuse or a job interview, take your obsession with me off the boards and PM me.

At least I think I've finally found the person whose been stealing my underwear off the clothes line...