Sorry Day for Ireland

is_that_so

eolhc wrote:

but if you look at what happened, democratic election with high turn out, i don't see how its a sorry day.[/B] Don't think having the election on a different day would have made much difference.

A 5% increase on a previous all-time low is hardly a high turnout. It was still below 70% which does make it a sorry day. Dublin South East was 53%. Many other democracies can achieve far better numbers and France recently got to 84%.

Boston

is_that_so wrote:

A 5% increase on a previous all-time low is hardly a high turnout. It was still below 70% which does make it a sorry day. Dublin South East was 53%. Many other democracies can achieve far better numbers and France recently got to 84%.

Would you like it if we achieved the same level of turnout for the same reasons france did. Stop with the BS comparisons.

irishash

is it just me or is the whole "better the devil you know...." argument one of the most insane, stupid and downright idiotic reasons for voting ever.

i mean to say just because people know how s**t bertie and the government have been over the last 5 yrs they would still prefer this than taking a chance on some other government having a go at it all. it could not be any worse could it.

in america next yr, that nation will have to pick a new leader - neither one of the 2 candidates (whoever they will be) have been president before. if this was the type of election we had in ireland, i guess nobody would vote. after all no experience means you can't lead right ??

DeVore

The capacity of the opposition to do any better is extremely slim. The capacity for them to really bugger things up is breathtaking. Its a risk/reward calculation.

I'm no fan of FF but if the alternative proved to be as bad as it COULD be, it would be disasterous. I doubt many were willing to take that chance.

DeV.

is_that_so

Boston wrote:

Would you like it if we achieved the same level of turnout for the same reasons france did. Stop with the BS comparisons.

I am unclear what exactly you are getting at here.
Why and how people vote is their own business.

irishash

Boston wrote:

Would you like it if we achieved the same level of turnout for the same reasons france did. Stop with the BS comparisons.

ok - lets forget the result for a second.

do you truly believe that there would not have been a higher turnout for the election if it was held on a friday, saturday or sunday ??

in france, it is in legislation that any referendum or election be held on a sunday. this was a decision made in the 60's due to low turnouts in their elections. ever since every election or vote-day has had a voter turnout above 75%.

the voter turnout was high last thursday based on previous elections, but not as high as elections in the 50's, 60's, 70's and 80's.

Also Starring LeVar Burton

CerebralCortex wrote:

I'm on your side OP so are all my friends. The only young people I've encountered who have voted FF are rich kids or they have family affiliations which is the same as being rich.

Wow, nice to see how narrow minded some people actually are.
-I'm 20 years old. -In no way rich. -No family affiliations with FF.
I voted FF, because I didn't want to see FG get in power. I didn't agree with their policies and much preffered FF's. Honestly I wanted to see a SF/Greens coalition, but I knew it could never happen, so although I gave them a vote, I also voted FF!

I know plenty of other young people who voted FF aswell, because they didn't want to see FG get in. None of whom are rich or with family affiliations.
To come onto as website like this and to make such assumptions is extremely obnoxious.

Heinrich

CaptainNegative wrote:

Wow, nice to see how narrow minded some people actually are.
-I'm 20 years old. -In no way rich. -No family affiliations with FF.
I voted FF, because I didn't want to see FG get in power. I didn't agree with their policies and much preffered FF's. Honestly I wanted to see a SF/Greens coalition, but I knew it could never happen, so although I gave them a vote, I also voted FF!

I know plenty of other young people who voted FF aswell, because they didn't want to see FG get in. None of whom are rich or with family affiliations.
To come onto as website like this and to make such assumptions is extremely obnoxious.

If you could outline one or two of the FF policies promised in the 2002 election manifesto which were delivered I would consider what you are saying. Or are you, as others have done, basing your point on the televised debates and the waffle on the election posters?

Let's talk about the €300 pw pensions when that comes about.

MisterAnarchy

CaptainNegative wrote:

Honestly I wanted to see a SF/Greens coalition.

I will refrain from commenting on that scenario.

Boston

is_that_so wrote:

I am unclear what exactly you are getting at here.
Why and how people vote is their own business.

There was a huge strength of feeling in france surrounding the election. France is, by all accounts, facing a lot of social and economic strife, When you're getting week long riots and high unemployment, election turn outs are good. This forum and the strength of feeling expressed on it is not indicative of the wider population.

irishash: With polling stations open from 7:30 am to at least 10 pm afaik, I don't see how having it on a work day could have affect turn out at all at all.

Heinrich: Would you outline the election promises upheld by Labour, the Greens or FG? What's that none? Why that's? Oh yea cause when you're not in power you can talk a lot of **** and promise a lot of things.

The Muppet

Heinrich wrote:

Or are you, as others have done, basing your point on the televised debates and the waffle on the election posters?

Being unable to hold your own in a debate would not instill public confidence in any prospective Taoiseach. Admiiting that his proposed tax plans favoured higher earners wasn't very clever. Being creative with the figures when speaking of putting new gardai on the street and being vague about the source of the finance for the extra hospital beds were not helpful to him either.

Were viewers of the debate expected to ignore these major gaffs and vote him in regardless?

irishash

my question :

Irishash wrote:

do you truly believe that there would not have been a higher turnout for the election if it was held on a friday, saturday or sunday ??

your answer :

Boston wrote:

With polling stations open from 7:30 am to at least 10 pm afaik, I don't see how having it on a work day could have affect turn out at all at all.

so i will say again, do you truly believe that there would not have been a higher turnout for the election if it was held on a friday, saturday or sunday ?? And yes or no will be accepted as an answer. if you want to state a reason for your answer, please do.

one vote can change a voter turnout, so the student that is from donegal, doing exams in galway on the voting day and the following day, could not afford to go home to vote, and did not have enough time and information to get the postal vote sorted. that is one vote affected by the day. i am sure not the only one, student or not.

and before i hear the argument for the postal votes again, i for one would not apply for a postal vote BEFORE I knew what day the election would be held on because i may not need to cast my vote if it was on a day I could easliy get home. i travelled on a 150 mile round trip to cast my vote leaving dublin at 5pm after work and got back at 11.30pm. not an easy trip, but would have been better if i did not have to come back.

johnnyrotten

maoleary wrote:

Now they (FF) think they're invincible. Well done, all. Economy was never created by them, sustained by them, or helped.

They raped it to death, and last Thursday, we thanked them for it. F**kin well done lads.

LARGE YAWN!:rolleyes:

woodser

I've taken the following quote from the wicklow thread because it contains an interesting statistic.

Apparently the large new charlesland estate in greystones (which by the way has its own forum here on boards and is like a small town within a town at Greystones) went 66% plus for Fianna Fáil

woodser wrote:

Wow just got the box by box breakdown tally for Wicklow. Of the 3080 votes cast in Charlesland Recreation centre ie Charlesland & Eden Gate. Roche got almost 1200 and Behan 933. Both FG took 840. Cawley McManus and DeBurca got hardly anything there.Can certainly say Charlesland and Eden Gate are FF territory now .FF got around 25000 in the whole of Wicklow Charlesland and Eden Gate gave them almost 10% of this .I hope they remember.

Boston

I fail to see any ambiguity in my reply, its a clear cut answer. No matter what day you pick, someone won't be able to go. I'm a final year student studying for exams and I was able to vote, the vast majority of students are now finished college and exams for the summer break. Fact.

Marathon Man

CaptainNegative wrote:

I voted FF, because I didn't want to see FG get in power. I didn't agree with their policies and much preffered FF's.

I can't see how you prefered FF's policies because they are exactly the same as FG's.

irishash

Boston wrote:

I fail to see any ambiguity in my reply, its a clear cut answer. No matter what day you pick, someone won't be able to go. I'm a final year student studying for exams and I was able to vote, the vast majority of students are now finished college and exams for the summer break. Fact.

so the voter turnout would have been no different if the election was on a weekend day - this is what you are saying ??

i agree in that no matter what day the election was held on, some people would not have been able to vote or care about voting - but i also think you should agree that this figure would have been lower if the day was a weekend day. and therefore turnout could have been higher.

Boston

irishash wrote:

so the voter turnout would have been no different if the election was on a weekend day - this is what you are saying ??

i agree in that no matter what day the election was held on, some people would not have been able to vote or care about voting - but i also think you should agree that this figure would have been lower if the day was a weekend day. and therefore turnout could have been higher.

Every effort was made to facilitate people. There is nothing to suggest that their would have been a significant different in turnout.

irishash

Boston wrote:

Every effort was made to facilitate people. There is nothing to suggest that their would have been a significant different in turnout.

everything except a better day.

johnnyrotten

is_that_so wrote:

What is your point here exactly?

My point is that its a democracy and the people have voted for the TD's

and its a great day for Ireland - The alternative was a joke!

Boston

Thats a matter of opinion. No facts to back it up. Of the students, how many would have travelled home specifically to vote, especially during exams? Few and far between.

Marathon Man

FF aren't in yet.

Zaph

If the election was held after the college exams were over you'd have people giving out that many students go abroad for the summer and they're being deliberately disenfranchised. Personally I think the turnout would have been bigger if the election was on a Sunday, but not massively so. As has already been mentioned numerous times on Boards, there are many students studying for exams, and packing it all in to go down home to vote would be too much of a distraction for a lot of them. No matter when it's held, somebody is going to be annoyed by the timing, so it seems to me the only solution is to make it a postal vote for everyone and then nobody can whinge any more.

is_that_so

Boston wrote:

There was a huge strength of feeling in france surrounding the election. France is, by all accounts, facing a lot of social and economic strife, When you're getting week long riots and high unemployment, election turn outs are good. This forum and the strength of feeling expressed on it is not indicative of the wider population.

Agreed.
I just don't find 68% something to jump up and down about, hence the recent French example. I would certainly see 75%+ as a more genuine plebiscite but it ain't gonna happen.

Heinrich

Boston wrote:

Heinrich: Would you outline the election promises upheld by Labour, the Greens or FG? What's that none? Why that's? Oh yea cause when you're not in power you can talk a lot of **** and promise a lot of things.

No! Off topic...

mloc

Students not at home can avail of postal voting.

MOST of my friends voted FF. I am 22.

5 more years of waste and lack of ministerial responsibility.

Fantastic..

wow sierra

This thread is wrecking my head - we have two people who say they couldnt afford to go to college but who go on to say they are in college.?????

Theres the angry guy/girl who has an excellent IT/Computer qualification who cant get a related job - but then professional pride I assume, has him contradicting himself saying he has an excellent IT job?????? I'm sorry but I dont get this???

On topic 42% of the people who could be arsed to vote voted FF first preference, not the mention all those who gave them 2nd, 3rd preferences etc. This group of 1 million or so(sorry if thats not exactly right!!!) are a hugely diverse age profile, educational background, geographical location etc. Their reasons were equally diverse and personal.

I'll give two I heard from first time FF voters - totally radom from personal experience. One guy cos he has 5 adult children, none of whom had to emigrate to get a job. Two twenty something first time voters - they are sick of people blaming the Government for everything that is wrong with any aspect of life and not making any effort to take control of their own lives(not a direct quotation but the gist!!!!!!!) Just two random unsolicited comments a few days before the election. My own personal favourite is - The nurses keep looking for support by saying every family has a nurse in it - try finding a family who doesnt have a well paid construction worker in it. Do the math.

SeanW

And what happens when the construction bubble bursts? We can't maintain our economy on building things alone - and the pursuit of anything else has been hindered by ridiculously high costs and inflation and the shambolic state of everything else.

When it all goes to Hell, which it will, we'll be left to stew in our unmanaged traffic jams, overcrowded trains, Stone Age broadband, non functional public services, and end up getting sick and dieing on a hospital trolley.

We've voted for more incompetence, more gombeen men, and handed the country over to the developers, publicans and and the rest of the FF gobsh***s crew. This disasterous decision by the electorate will set Ireland back 10 years. At least.

legs11

what he said............;)