Ship question.

UrbanFox

Why are the uppermost parts of the superstructures of naval vessels painted black ?

Steyr

Such as? Can you elaborate more? A picture possibly?

testicle

UrbanFox wrote:

Why are the uppermost parts of the superstructures of naval vessels painted black ?

They're not.

OS119

testicle wrote:

They're not.

they are...

http://www.royal-navy.mod.uk/server?show=nav.5373&imageIndex=84


http://www.royal-navy.mod.uk/server/show/ConMediaFile.18879

http://www.royal-navy.mod.uk/server?show=nav.1832&imageIndex=8

it has two purposes - firstly is disguises the muck and grime that builds up anywhere arounf the funnels, so it looks smarter with less hassle, and secondly it markedly increases the visibility of the ship to very low flying aircraft. grey ship + grey sea + grey sky + 60ft off the deck at 500kts = a very expensive hole in the side of a very expensive ship.

the Type 45 daring class destroyers cost significantly more each than the whole Irish defence budget. understandably the RN wants to keep them in working order...

testicle

Oh sorry, I was thinking of the Bridge.

P51 class don't, the others do.

Victor

OS119 wrote:

and secondly it markedly increases the visibility of the ship to very low flying aircraft. grey ship + grey sea + grey sky + 60ft off the deck at 500kts = a very expensive hole in the side of a very expensive ship..

Ah, but you're screwed when the other guy is using optically guided weapons. :eek:

Fratton Fred

OS119 wrote:

they are...

http://www.royal-navy.mod.uk/server?show=nav.5373&imageIndex=84


http://www.royal-navy.mod.uk/server/show/ConMediaFile.18879

http://www.royal-navy.mod.uk/server?show=nav.1832&imageIndex=8

it has two purposes - firstly is disguises the muck and grime that builds up anywhere arounf the funnels, so it looks smarter with less hassle, and secondly it markedly increases the visibility of the ship to very low flying aircraft. grey ship + grey sea + grey sky + 60ft off the deck at 500kts = a very expensive hole in the side of a very expensive ship.

the Type 45 daring class destroyers cost significantly more each than the whole Irish defence budget. understandably the RN wants to keep them in working order...

I didn't know about the aircraft thing, but the funnels and the ends of guns are usually painted black, as you say, to cover up any burn marks/soot etc.

OS119

Victor wrote:

Ah, but you're screwed when the other guy is using optically guided weapons. :eek:

the black bits - where practicable - get painted grey in wartime ops, just to make gun/rocket attacks marginally more difficult, but TBH any air force planning on using optically guided weapons near either a Type 42 or Type 45 is unlikely to attempt to do so a second time.

AShM missiles are pretty cheap these days, every bugger and his dog make/sell weapons with an open water range of 50 miles or so, so attacking a warship up close is a very silly use of a multi-million dollar aircraft and crew - particularly given the massive increase in efficacy of CIWS, most of which are competent Anti-Missile systems, so hitting an aircraft with such a system is much easier than it was twenty-odd years ago.

Fratton Fred

OS119 wrote:

the black bits - where practicable - get painted grey in wartime ops, just to make gun/rocket attacks marginally more difficult, but TBH any air force planning on using optically guided weapons near either a Type 42 or Type 45 is unlikely to attempt to do so a second time.

AShM missiles are pretty cheap these days, every bugger and his dog make/sell weapons with an open water range of 50 miles or so, so attacking a warship up close is a very silly use of a multi-million dollar aircraft and crew - particularly given the massive increase in efficacy of CIWS, most of which are competent Anti-Missile systems, so hitting an aircraft with such a system is much easier than it was twenty-odd years ago.

This Goalkeeper CIWS system is meant to be awesome. 4200 30mm rounds per minute and the ability to track 12 targets at the same time, choosing which is the biggest threat:eek:

OS119

Fratton Fred wrote:

This Goalkeeper CIWS system is meant to be awesome. 4200 30mm rounds per minute and the ability to track 12 targets at the same time, choosing which is the biggest threat:eek:

the Phalanx/Goalkeeper systems seem to be going out of favour, the main enemy of warships is now supersonic AShM's, gun based systems have a too small interception/kill envelope for a supersonic target - they both tend to kill targets at 350 to 500m from the ship, if the warhead if the missile detonated at that range the ship could be very badly damaged, and even if the missile only breaks up at 500m its still 500kg of lumps of metal travelling at 1200mph heading for the ship.

far too dangerous given the cost of modern warships.

PAAMS Aster15 and RIM116 RAM are the future, continual guidence, longer range, greater KP, ability to engage multiple targets similtainiously... the mutts nuts!

the guns look good, but they were a technological dead-end - and a backwards step in terms of anti-missile defences.

Fratton Fred

OS119 wrote:

the Phalanx/Goalkeeper systems seem to be going out of favour, the main enemy of warships is now supersonic AShM's, gun based systems have a too small interception/kill envelope for a supersonic target - they both tend to kill targets at 350 to 500m from the ship, if the warhead if the missile detonated at that range the ship could be very badly damaged, and even if the missile only breaks up at 500m its still 500kg of lumps of metal travelling at 1200mph heading for the ship.

far too dangerous given the cost of modern warships.

PAAMS Aster15 and RIM116 RAM are the future, continual guidence, longer range, greater KP, ability to engage multiple targets similtainiously... the mutts nuts!

the guns look good, but they were a technological dead-end - and a backwards step in terms of anti-missile defences.

True, the PAAMS missile, I believe is being tested at the moment by the RN.

An Old friend was telling e about the Goalkeeper though, he was involved with the first UK trials, he said it is a great "Boys Toy":D

They were targeting an object towed by a harrier, the goal keeper shot up the target, then started to follow to work it's way up the cable the harrier was towing until they aborted the test:)

OS119

Fratton Fred wrote:

True, the PAAMS missile, I believe is being tested at the moment by the RN.

a friend of mine from university helped to design/build the Sampson radar, its pretty incredible - particularly when you consider what a menace the lad was was/is when faced with any form of DIY!

according t'Bungling Baron, it can detect a tennis ball at 100,000ft at 100 miles while detecting and IFFing a similar sized object at 6ft at 30 miles against ground clutter and firing two ASTOR 30's in 0.2 seconds, with a combined PK of 100%.

we'll see obviously, but Type 45 looks like being pretty startling in its AAW role.