Greens vote for government - 87% of delegates in favour

cm2000

heres to the good folks at ladbrooks who gave me an astonishing 16/1 on ff/green/pd coalition after the infamous rogue pole. only annoyed i only threw a fiver at it.:mad:

ateam

What is the gossip on the ministerial position for the Greens? Environment/Transport/Sport?

Andystoran

I agree that the majority of people that voted for the greens were thinking about them going intogovernment with the alternative FG government.

These voters are all huffing and puffing feeling they have been let down!!!

If the greens can get through the next 5 years and get even a few core policies moving sucessfully the fact that went into goverment with FF will be long forgotten. They will get those votes again and more.

I fear that the fundamentalists could hold the gren party back and bring down this government. Sandle wearing meusli eating........HaHa

Jonny Arson

ateam wrote:

What is the gossip on the ministerial position for the Greens? Environment/Transport/Sport?

I believe FF wont let the Greens get their hands on Transport but Environment is a formality for the Greens.

AFAIK Sargent wont be taking a ministry position so I expect it will be Gormley and Ryan as Green ministers. I'll guess we will see Gormley as minister for Environment

rushbrook

dammit, voted for Trevor Sargent cos I thought they might end
up in government and it would help the local issues in North County Dublin
(having the GP leader in a ministerial position) ... now he resigns and refuses a ministerial position -- feel like I just backed a horse at 100/1 who wins only to find he is disqualified for failing a drugs test !!!

chump

they completely sold out - am astonished!

Not one tangible item!

All FF claptrap - and they bought it.
Let's see how this pans out...

funky penguin

Oh Nonononononononononono NO!!

Damn the Greens and Damn the M3!

BendiBus

funky penguin wrote:

Oh Nonononononononononono NO!!

Damn the Greens and Damn the M3!

Yeah, like if the Greens had refused a deal that would have stopped the M3 in its tracks :rolleyes:

I voted Green and I'm happy to see them take a position of power rather than maintain a warm & fuzzy feeling of principle and achieve nothing.

If the environment is truly a pressing issue then principled failure-to-achieve is not an option. Now's the chance to prove they're achievers rather than protestors.

Real world politics folks.

And if they do a good job in cabinet that will win them more votes, and from a broader cross section of soociety, in the next election than another 5 years as a small opposition party.

mickd

They sold out boo hoo !! I so distraught! Its terrible! There is no Santa Clause Get a Grip! I have never read such arse in all my life that constitutes as political comment. The Greens have decided to join the action and get things done and not stay in opposition spouting the same puerile nonsense I have read here. FF/Greens/PD& Ind for the next five years, Accept it & move on.

BendiBus

BendiBus wrote:

Yeah, like if the Greens had refused a deal that would have stopped the M3 in its tracks :rolleyes:

I voted Green and I'm happy to see them take a position of power rather than maintain a warm & fuzzy feeling of principle and achieve nothing.

If the environment is truly a pressing issue then principled failure-to-achieve is not an option. Now's the chance to prove they're achievers rather than protestors.

Real world politics folks.

And if they do a good job in cabinet that will win them more votes, and from a broader cross section of soociety, in the next election than another 5 years as a small opposition party.

^^^^^

Best post of thethread in my opinion.

Lunar Junkie

BendiBus wrote:

I voted Green and I'm happy to see them take a position of power rather than maintain a warm & fuzzy feeling of principle and achieve nothing.

If the environment is truly a pressing issue then principled failure-to-achieve is not an option. Now's the chance to prove they're achievers rather than protestors.

Real world politics folks.

And if they do a good job in cabinet that will win them more votes, and from a broader cross section of soociety, in the next election than another 5 years as a small opposition party.

Yeah, I voted Green too and I agree with this.. I'd prefer to see them in there and hopefully having some impact than standing on the sidelines holding the moral high ground forever - and who's to say that they'll get the chance next time around if they pass on this one? If they do a half-decent job of implementing some of their ideas and influencing at least some government policy then maybe a wider section of the population will view them as a positive force with the capability to actually pariticipate in the running of the country next time around and not the joke looney leftie tree hugger (insert other stereotypes) ticket that they get written off as. Obviously there's a risk that they'll dirty the purist idealistic image of the party but perhaps it's a risk worth taking if they can make at least a few real-life achievements.

miju

Jonny Arson wrote:

I can't see myself ever voting for the Greens again.

......

Anyway, fair play to Trevor Sargent for standing by his words by resigning tonight. He made the right decision.

they'll never get my vote again either. and fair play to Sargent for sticking by his word.

BendiBus

miju wrote:

they'll never get my vote again either.

What if they do an excellent job in whatever ministries they get? Will you still not vote for them out of principle? Will you damage the economy/environment to prove a point? Are you really green?

K-9

Mick86 wrote:

Trevor Sargent will already have been shown for a charlatan before the Dáil even meets if he leads the Greens into coalition.

Well he's not a charlatan then and I presume all Greens will turns down the black Merc's.

miju

BendiBus wrote:

What if they do an excellent job in whatever ministries they get? Will you still not vote for them out of principle? Will you damage the economy/environment to prove a point? Are you really green?

given how quickly they were willing to abondon their core policies for a sniff of a few mercs i genuinely do doubt that they will do a good job

jhegarty

miju wrote:

given how quickly they were willing to abondon their core policies for a sniff of a few mercs i genuinely do doubt that they will do a good job

I presume they will have to stop giving out about M3, shannon...etc..etc now they are the government ?

K-9

jjbrien wrote:

Does anybody know what exactly do the Greens and FF mean by a new carbon tax? Is it a tax on driving, air travel what do they mean?

FG/Lab where planning on going into coalition with the Greens. You're only bothering to ask this now?

jjbrien wrote:

Votes in 87% in favor they sold thier souls

If it was FG/Lab/greens and the same or anywhere near it agreement, you'd be saying the same?

lostinblanch wrote:

I'm betting that Cowen is already looking at that as a way of raising tax revenue to make up for the losses when the bad times do hit. He'll then turn around and say "it was the Greens." They set themselves up to be shafted there as well.

If it meant that personal taxation went down by the amount carbon tax was introduced then it might be a different kettle of fish. I wouldn't trust FF at all though.

Cowen's record and indeed FF's record on personal taxation is good. If the only one achievement have had in Govt. in the last 10 years well it's personal taxation.

The perfect example being a person on the average industrial wage here pays less PAYE/Social Insurance than in England. Some difference from 10 years ago.

Cowen did say that if the bad times do hit and there is less growth than predicted, personal taxation cuts will go first, public spending increases will stay. Trust FF on that unlike what the other parties said.

K-9

Mick86 wrote:

Power corrupts. The Green Ministers will like the feel of that power and cling on.

So no Govt. then with power!

And I hope whatever Green ministers there are, don't get the oppsition to change that Harney had.

ninebeanrows

What sell-outs, what did they get out of this?

Nothing, just lost all their dignity in a government which will probably last 2 years when Bertie's "dealings" are fully revealed.

Never will be voting Green again, a principle led party sold-out for a few faint sniffs of power.

K-9

Weathercheck wrote:

What sell-outs, what did they get out of this?

Nothing, just lost all their dignity in a government which will probably last 2 years when Bertie's "dealings" are fully revealed.

Never will be voting Green again, a principle led party sold-out for a few faint sniffs of power.

So, go to Enda then and see what you's would have got?

What genuine party expects to get all their manifesto implemented?

funky penguin

BendiBus wrote:

Yeah, like if the Greens had refused a deal that would have stopped the M3 in its tracks :rolleyes:

Yes. I am naive and this is exactly what I believe.


I can only wish them every success in government - I'd be a moron and a masochist to hope otherwise - but I keep asking myself, should I support a party that has sacrificed some of its major principals for power?

My gut says I can't, and I won't. If anyone asked me to do otherwise, then I'd be doing no better myself. The subject of the M3 and Lismullen is very important to me, and I believe that it simply cannot go ahead on its proposed route. It was a major factor in my voting decisions, and it pains me to see the party I voted for sell off my support so easily.

K-9

funky penguin wrote:

Yes. I am naive and this is exactly what I believe.


I can only wish them every success in government - I'd be a moron and a masochist to hope otherwise - but I keep asking myself, should I support a party that has sacrificed some of its major principals for power?

My gut says I can't, and I won't. If anyone asked me to do otherwise, then I'd be doing no better myself. The subject of the M3 and Lismullen is very important to me, and I believe that it simply cannot go ahead on its proposed route. It was a major factor in my voting decisions, and it pains me to see the party I voted for sell off my support so easily.

So if they got their way on Shannon Airport but didn't get Tara how would you feel?

Voipjunkie

Weathercheck wrote:

What sell-outs, what did they get out of this?

Nothing, just lost all their dignity in a government which will probably last 2 years when Bertie's "dealings" are fully revealed.

Never will be voting Green again, a principle led party sold-out for a few faint sniffs of power.

They get a position of power where they can actually achieve something rather than sit like the Labour party in opposition cursing the darkness


Bertie might be gone in 2 years in disgrace or otherwise but it has been obvious since the middle of the election campaign that Cowen is in charge now and it is only a matter of tiem before appearance catches up with reality
Bertie is largely irrelevant.

What if the Greens cuts C02 emissions and improve public transport and the ABA for autistic children and electoral reform and Local government reform carbon levies and ensure than Ireland is not used as a transit point in the US kidnap of civilians


People have to remember that the Green Party manifesto is what they would like to have done if they were in an overall majority since they are not and in all likelyhood will never be they have to compromise and that is true of all the parties.
FG and Lab would have had to compromise FF have compromised and the PDs will take anything as long as they can stay in power for a little longer. Finian McGrath signed a pledge not to support a government that allowed the US to use shannon.

So you are not going to vote green who will you vote for who are you going to put your faith in to remain uncompromised my suggestion is that you vote for the candidate least likely to be elected as anyone elected who wants to be in power will have to compromise that is life.

funky penguin

Seanies32 wrote:

So if they got their way on Shannon Airport but didn't get Tara how would you feel?

As I feel now.

K-9

Voipjunkie wrote:

They get a position of power where they can actually achieve something rather than sit like the Labour party in opposition cursing the darkness


People have to remember that the Green Party manifesto is what they would like to have done if they were in an overall majority since they are not and in all likelyhood will never be they have to compromise and that is true of all the parties.
FG and Lab would have had to compromise FF have compromised and the PDs will take anything as long as they can stay in power for a little longer. Finian McGrath signed a pledge not to support a government that allowed the US to use shannon.

So you are not going to vote green who will you vote for who are you going to put your faith in to remain uncompromised my suggestion is that you vote for the candidate least likely to be elected as anyone elected who wants to be in power will have to compromise that is life.

Vote for the party who will get everything and forget about Govt., and getting any of these policies implemented.

K-9

funky penguin wrote:

As I feel now.

But if you got Tara and didn't get Shannon that would be grand?

nesf

funky penguin wrote:

I can only wish them every success in government - I'd be a moron and a masochist to hope otherwise - but I keep asking myself, should I support a party that has sacrificed some of its major principals for power?

Look, in reality as it stands the Greens are a small fringe party in Irish politics. This isn't going to change hugely in the short term I'm sure we'll all agree. The thing is, they could only get into power and enact some changes if they sacrificed some of their major principles because quite simply a minority partner in Government will only ever be able to get a minority of their policies implemented where their policies don't tightly coincide with the bigger party's.

If you vote for a small party you are not voting for their manifesto to be implemented you are voting for some unknown selection of that manifesto being implemented if any of it gets implemented at all. It really is as simple as that.

Tar.Aldarion

What were they discussing all this time? What do you want us to do FF?
Anyway, good luck to them, and maybe they can get more votes next time around.

nollaig

I wonder what cabinet positions they will get, Will it be transport & environment?

miju

miju wrote:

given how quickly they were willing to abondon their core policies for a sniff of a few mercs i genuinely do doubt that they will do a good job

But they are on record(at least last night) that they wont be taking the mercs,they'll have hybrids...

Weathercheck wrote:

What sell-outs, what did they get out of this?

Nothing, just lost all their dignity in a government which will probably last 2 years when Bertie's "dealings" are fully revealed.

Never will be voting Green again, a principle led party sold-out for a few faint sniffs of power.

Rofl
You'll never vote for them AGAIN...
Did you even have a vote this time?

Have you even read the document and what it says about climate change and carbon taxes?

These kind of posts just make me laugh because they're not in touch with the real world at all in my opinion