Sunderland Transfer Rumours/Discussion 2007/2008

themont85

Poor Liam Miller, he was supposed to be the next great Irish legend at United but it just hasn't worked out for the guy.

Bungalow Bill

Liam Miller has played virtually every game he has been available for this season. He is ahead of Etuhu, Yorke and Leadbitter in the pecking order for centre midfield.

It really is a strange one, he must have had words with Keano, a real pity because it was only a few months ago he was being lauded for his domineering performance against Arsenal.

GuanYin

kryogen wrote: »

thats strange isnt it? always thought Keane liked Miller, maybe hes finally realised hes not good enough to cut it at top level?

No, I'd say there is much more to this than is known at present. I imagine that something happened and that Miller is being booted for it.

Keane isn't going to say, so it will take a leak or a very good question by journos at the friday press conference to get to the bottom of it.

Musta been bad though.

~Rebel~

PSI: Las Vegas wrote: »

No, I'd say there is much more to this than is known at present. I imagine that something happened and that Miller is being booted for it.

Keane isn't going to say, so it will take a leak or a very good question by journos at the friday press conference to get to the bottom of it.

Musta been bad though.

Agreed. He's not a fantastic midfielder, but he's not their worst either, and the fact he's already being touted for a loan move to the end of the season does hint at "get out...Now".

Had it been under normal circumstances i'd imagine there would be no need for this announcement till just before the end of the season. They could use every half decent player they have with the relegation fight on their hands.

redspider

Yeah, the Liam Miller thing is unusual. Its not as if he wasnt able to get himself into the first team or anything, as he was playing regularly and was far from the worst in the team. I got to see him a few weeks ago versus Liverpool.

But this is not good timing. The trend I see at Sunderland is that, as many speculated beforehand perhaps, that Roy would have bust ups with various players. His influencers in management are Alex Ferguson and Brian Clough who took short shrift with players and I expect Roy will expose a similar trait in management. He got rid of a load of players when he arrived, and is now getting rid of a lot that he took on. All this 'churn' is not going to sit well with any potential players, and far from Sunderland emulating a Portsmouth, a club that manages to attract players, I dont think Sunderland will be able to do that judging by what's gone on up until now in the Sund-Ireland project. That to me is a portender for seasons stuck fighting the relegation battle before probably relegation itself. Also due to the lack of success, I dont see there being that many new Ireland fans for Sunderland. Non-relegation will be the success benchmark this year, but is it a question of when rather than if in future seasons?

Redspider

Dubit10

I'd say that keane will never make it as a manager.He has spent more than every other team in the league (Man utd aside) on players and the team is fighting to stay up:D.Cant believe people thought he would make a good manager because from what i have heard and read he is a right **** to deal with.To me he is the roddy collins of the english premiership.

sweetie

BBC gossip site attributes it to Miller's time-keeping :eek:
no source though

Xavi6

Yeah all the papers apparently have it as a time keeping issue. Ah well, bit of unrest in the camp won't do any harm.

PHB

I think Keane is trying to mould players just like Fergie was. Professionalism is the key.

scruff321

Dubit10 wrote: »

I'd say that keane will never make it as a manager.He has spent more than every other team in the league (Man utd aside) on players and the team is fighting to stay up:D.Cant believe people thought he would make a good manager because from what i have heard and read he is a right **** to deal with.To me he is the roddy collins of the english premiership.

you dont think he'l make it as a manager??do you know anything about football?? that is a ridiculous statement! he is in his second season as a manger and has already won the championship and will keep sunderland up im sure of it! the reason why he has spent so much money on what are mainly average players is the fact that players are reluctant to come to sunderland not just for football reasons either.i think daryl murphy is really doing the business plus keane made some decent signings in the tranfer window.

kryogen

do you really think Keane will fail? do you think he will allow himself to fail? such a single minded competitive determination to succeed will ensure his future in management..... he is not in the job 18 months yet, you can hardly judge him can you....he spent alot of money, he needs a big squad, its vitally important and gives him an edge over the likes of Reading and Derby when it comes to the business end....

did he spend more then the pool? they spent a fair bit this summer with babel and torres and of course the other guys who cost less but it all adds up, i reckon Keane is going to sell off alot of the dead weight in the summer to buy better players if they stay up (which i think they will) their home form is impressive and if they can keep that up they will be safe

i am still of the opinion that the team came up too soon and this has hindered his development but im sure he will overcome it...

If there is unproffessional behavious in the dressing room it needs to be rooted out so you can build for future success, just like Fergie did at united when he got rid of the members of the booze culture....I think Keane has a plan, and going from past experience, im sure he will succeed

Nunu

Dubit10 wrote: »

I'd say that keane will never make it as a manager.He has spent more than every other team in the league (Man utd aside) on players and the team is fighting to stay up:D.Cant believe people thought he would make a good manager because from what i have heard and read he is a right **** to deal with.To me he is the roddy collins of the english premiership.

They've spent big alright this season, on a lot of players, but Keane has not been able to attract some players because of Sunderlands strict wage structure.

I'm not sure what the set limit is? There have been a few players who have shown no interest because of this and so he has had to settle for others when signing a few of them. A couple of examples are Nugent and Savage who went where the bigger wages were.

If Sunderland stay up it will be success, especially seen as it's their first season back up.


Spending 07/08 (does not include undisclosed transfers):

Liverpool: £54.5M
Man Utd: £51M
Tottenham: £50.5M
Sunderland: £43M
Chelsea: £41.25M

GuanYin

Miller isn't going anywhere. This is a mindgame with Keane and Miller. Keane has said, he's transfer listed but "if he improves and noone comes in for him he may have a future here"... of course he's transfer-listed at a time where noone will come in for him (noone he'll go to anyway).

Miller, who apparently is devestated by events, will buckle up, he'll stay and KEane will have gotten an important point across.

kryogen

Yeah good shout there PSI, was just reading Keane's comments and thinking along the same lines myself

OPENROAD

Would really love them to go down, that said the teams below are so bad they should be ok. So as much as it pains me to say Keane will have achieved his objective i.e. keep Sunderland up. You do have to wonder about his spending though. Next season he will be expected to get Sunderland moving up the table.

ziggy

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KdjaCL

Hmmm cant judge keane after 18 months where he bought his players but can judge Stan after 2 games where he picked the best available....hmmm interesting.



kdjac

PHB

ziggy wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Won't stop you from assuming he'll fail though because you disliked his actions as a player though will it?

Keane's done relatively well so far as a manager, maybe spent some money on poor players, but if he keeps Sunderland up, something he is looking like he could well do, he'll have done the following in two years

A. Taken a side that was struggling drastically in the championship to the top of the league and to the premiership

B. Kept them in the premiership

If that happens, I'd put good money on them being relatively safe next season, ending up between 10th-14th

eirebhoy

That's because it was pretty easy to make a judgement on Stan quick enough.

Neil3030

Nunu wrote: »

Liverpool: £54.5M
Man Utd: £51M
Tottenham: £50.5M
Sunderland: £43M
Chelsea: £41.25M

Wage bills should really be taken into consideration with these spending tables. For example, you pay a guy £50,000 a week that's £2.5m a year. Sunderland would drop right down a table of overall expenditure on players if these costs were factored in.

~Rebel~

His actual management seems pretty good, what lets him down is undoubtedly his work in the transfer market, but of all the things to be weak on starting off, this is probably the least important. It can easily be fixed with experience, better scouts, building contacts within other clubs rather then just those he's worked with in the past and even just more watching of foreign leagues.

IMO the basis is there for a very good manager.

ziggy

This post has been deleted.

PHB

The thing is, you have to look at the whole picture. 40 million is lots of money, but over the course of 5 years, which its nothing. The other teams might not have spent 40 million last year, but they've been spending money for years consistantly. Sunderland were massively behind, which is why they had to spend so much to catch up.

Look at Chelsea. 150ish million is a year for 2 years in order to catch up with United and Arsenal. Now that they have, their spending last year was like 12. It's about catch up. To compare him to those other teams is just silly.

SantryRed

I see only staying up for Sunderland as a failure this year.

They've spent nearly 45million on players for this season and in my opinion they should be at least mid table with spending of that sort.

ziggy

This post has been deleted.

BaZmO*

KdjaCL wrote: »

Hmmm cant judge keane after 18 months where he bought his players but can judge Stan after 2 games where he picked the best available....hmmm interesting.

In fairness though it took 3 games to judge Stan. His first game in charge was actually a great success and then....well we all know the rest.


As PHB has mentioned already, you can't judge a team on one year's spending. You have to look at the bigger picture. If your starting point is a team full of Championship players it takes an awful lot more than 40m to get up to Premiership standard.

So far Keane has done very well. And he has the team in a very good position to stay up.

OPENROAD

PHB wrote: »

The thing is, you have to look at the whole picture. 40 million is lots of money, but over the course of 5 years, which its nothing. The other teams might not have spent 40 million last year, but they've been spending money for years consistantly. Sunderland were massively behind, which is why they had to spend so much to catch up.

Don't really have an issue with the money but the players he has brought in don't really do it for me. I think they will stay up but he will have to prove he can take them further nxt season. Don't really buy your argument re other teams have spent over the years so Sunderland are catching up now.

PHB

I think there has been a lot of good money spent personally, at the same time, some bad money spent. I think people over emphasise this point.

Richardson 5.5
McShane 2.5
Gordon 9
Jones 6
Bardsley 2
Reid 4
Evans loan
Prica - 2

All good signings, for decent prices

Bad signings would certainly be
Chopra - 5
Higginbotham - 2.5

Keep in mind, Sunderland the last time they were up broke the record for the ****test points total ever. The team wasn't up to scratch. Keane largely inherited this team, and has replaced most of it now with his own players.

kryogen

its hard for Sunderland to attract top quality players at the moment, nobody could be sure they would be playing prem football after this first season, the wage structure at Sunderland also doesnt allow them to pay the money that alot of players would want, if they can stay up this season then im sure the wage structure will be loosened a little, hopefully they can start to attract better players then. It was important to get a big squad to mount a serious challenge on fighting relegation....I'd liken it to Benitez, he felt he had to buy 3 average players rather then one great player because of financial issues and squad problems....

Keane had a championship squad, still does for the most part and it was important to have plenty of bodies in each position. Im sure alot of guys will be flogged this summer and better players will come to the club. Some of his signings have turned out fine, i mean Jones has been good, richardson would do a job at most mid table teams so thats whats required at the moment, Higginbottem is a decent player, Miller has played well for them, Gordon was a good signing, Mcshane will turn out well i feel Phil Bardsley will do a job for them, then theres Johnny Evans, Andy Reid and Daryl Murphy.....

they are all decent players for a mid table team, with a little bit extra quality in certain areas they could push for a top half finish next season

Keano

kryogen wrote: »

its hard for Sunderland to attract top quality players

This will always be the case. Look at David Nugent - he could be playing Premier League football and helping his England chances now his playing in the championship...

Dubit10

Watched parts of the game today.Jesus christ lads sunderland are the worst team ive seen in the premiership this season and that includes derby.You'd wonder what keane is doing for them in training to make them this bad.He has managed to turn mc shane into a shocking looking player from what looked like a lad who had a promising career in the game.Cant believe he has not got the boot when you think of the money that the board have given him.It's sad to see one of the true greats of the game been made look like a mug in the management game:(

themont85

Dubit10 wrote: »

Watched parts of the game today.Jesus christ lads sunderland are the worst team ive seen in the premiership this season and that includes derby.You'd wonder what keane is doing for them in training to make them this bad.He has managed to turn mc shane into a shocking looking player from what looked like a lad who had a promising career in the game.Cant believe he has not got the boot when you think of the money that the board have given him.It's sad to see one of the true greats of the game been made look like a mug in the management game:(

Jesus whats with everyone calling for Keane to be sacked. He got them from bottom of the championship to the title in a season. He's obviousely made a few mistakes in his signings but every manager-Fergie, Benitez ect have all made crap signings. What is overlooked is he got in a good keeper, Richardson and Jones to name but a few of the decent players he has signed. Sunderland needed to splash a hell of a lot of cash last summer. He came into the Premiership with a Championship squad of players. They had a very small base of good players to choose from and drastically needed to supplement this. Most expected them to struggle this year, what did you expect Sunderland to be beating a top 5 side like Everton?

kryogen

knee jerk reactions and comments are always going to be around after games, decisions went against them today, they defended well, and to say that derby are a better team is a joke in fairness. decisions went against them last week too, chopra's goal disallowed and he was a mile onside!!!!!!!!!! they could easily be in 12th place now with a little luck. get a grip

King John V

With Crouch rumoured to leave Anfield in the summer and Sunderland's premiership status looking relatively safe right now, what are people's views on a possible summer deal? A Crouch/Jones strike force could be quite interesting.

PHB

Crouch is a very good player, and him and Jones would be a very interesting strike partnership. Personally I think they need somebody with a bit of pace up front to strech teams more.

King John V

I was reading a funny article today about how 'sugar puff' sales crashed in the north east back in the mid 1990s. Here's why:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LhJtTtBhgZw&eurl=http://sniffingtt.blogspot.com/2008/01/kevin-keegan-is-big-media-slut.html





The young Sunderland fans didn't seem to like it.

Raskolnikov

With Reading relegated, will Keane turn his attention to snapping up Doyle and Hunt?

As for the rest of the Irish contingent, Ian Harte has already been released and I would expect Kavanagh, Miller and Connolly to follow him out the door.

King John V

Raskolnikov wrote: »

With Reading relegated, will Keane turn his attention to snapping up Doyle and Hunt?

Certainly looks likely. Rumours suggest a £10m bid could be on the cards to bring the duo to Wearside. Given the tranfer rumours about Hunt in January it looks very likely.

estebancambias

I think Aston Villa will sign Doyler.

OPENROAD

Hunt might be a good buy but don't rate Doyle. I am not sure Keane will continue to go down the irish route.

King John V

If he went with Doyle I don't think the Irish factor would come in to it like you said. But last year Doyle did net around 13 and another 7 this year in a struggling team. If he improved on that form he'd certainly boost the Sunderland attack. So I'm sure that alone is worth a punt.

estebancambias

The thing is Doyles actually play didn't get bad this season, its just his confidence in front of goal did.

The problem is though Jones and Doyle in my opinion are carbon copies of each other.