Can anybody tell me about this IRA poster?

SpitfireIV

O'Leprosy wrote:

Funny thing I notice, neither Fratton Fred or Croppyboy1798 are critical of each other in all of their responces in this discussion ? That's very, very, strange from someone using the name Croppyboy and from Carlow ? Croppyboy1798 even uses a similiar phrase to Fred " You're clutching at straws mate . "

" Coming to agreements and accepting that the North will stay united with Great Britian as a majority want that. " Again a VERY unusual statement from someone from a nationalist background, especially using the term " Great Britian " ???

O'Leprosy, given your past conduct in this particular forum I dont know why I'm even bothering to dignify you with a responce, but just in cause you've put the slightest doubth in anyone elses mind I take the time to clear up things for you....

Croppyboy and Carlow.........you OBVIOUSLY have no idea of the events of 1798 do you? Carlow was one of the districts involved in the 'third phase' of the Rebellion (one of the VERY few counties to actually rise), between 500-600 United men were slaughtered in the streets of Carlow town in the early hours of the 25th of May.

Not to mention the Fr Murphy connection, Tullow, Kilcomney, the many Carlow men who took to the Wicklow mountains in July of that year to continue the fight.

Theres more to Carlow then you might think and dont seem to know

If you'll look to my signiture you will see a quote from a favourite book of mine, and which every true Carlow man should have on his bookshelf, 'Carlow in 98' by William Farrell. Take heed of that phrase too.

So whats so strange to you about a Carlow person with an interest in 1798???


I DONT have a nationalist background, I'm interested in a certain period of history, doesnt mean I'm a 'ra head! I dont feel any resentment, bitterness or hate towards Britian, none what so ever, I enjoy British history, art, architecture, design and story as much as I do Irish. Perhaps I have an ability to embrace two cultures without living under a rock, or shaking my fists at a Union Jack and pledging to fight for a lost cause.


Why arent I critical of Fred?? Well he seems to be one of the people here actually living in the present and has his head screwed on.........enough said?

SpitfireIV

O'Leprosy wrote:

So you/fred,shutuplaura tec are not unionist Trolls - looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, has feathers like a duck, walks like a duck, smells ( I bet !!! ) like a duck - but yer not a unionist.....a mean a duck .

I could get into a debate with you O'Leprosy, but I think thats what you want and what your sole intention of laughable posts are about.

I'm finished with you, have a good night

Tchocky

*Pulls off John Bull mask*

Fratton Fred

O'Leprosy wrote:

So you/fred,shutuplaura tec are not unionist Trolls - looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, has feathers like a duck, walks like a duck, smells ( I bet !!! ) like a duck - but yer not a unionist.....a mean a duck .

I'm no doctor, but you are actually starting to sound like you are suffering paranoia:eek:

Fenian

CroppyBoy1798 wrote:

Jesus......God forbib that we should actually try and achieve anything in this country by peaceful means! So whats the tactic then seen as the 'democratic route is closed'??

Another bombing campaign?

Few more civilians slaughtered to drive the point home that ye want 're-unification'??


With all due respect, its 2007.........not the 1920's or 60's.

Like I said in an earlier post, FF have had 80 years to achieve re-unification through peaceful means, and haven't.

Maybe another bombing campaign is what's required, I don't know, I'm not a military strategist.

What does it matter what year it is?

Tchocky wrote:

Has there ever been a period when the entire island was united politically, apart from when we were in the Commonwealth?
Entire, independent unification.

I can't remember one, so "re"unification is a bit of a stretch. Of course, I may be forgetting something.

Yes, you are forgetting something. In 1919 when the first democratically Dail was elected.

O'Leprosy wrote:

So you/fred,shutuplaura tec are not unionist Trolls

TBH, I don't think Shutuplaura is a Unionist. Nor CroppyBoy1798, just anti-Republican.

Fratton Fred wrote:

Tht was left until 1641 wasn't it

The "historians" who wrote the the reports of those "massacres", were all anti-Irish.

I think it was Shutuplaura who posted an articile about the massacres that supposedly took place. I have it somewhere on my HD. I'll post it later once i find it.

Fratton Fred

Fenian wrote:

Like I said in an earlier post, FF have had 80 years to achieve re-unification through peaceful means, and haven't.

Maybe another bombing campaign is what's required, I don't know, I'm not a military strategist.

What does it matter what year it is?



Yes, you are forgetting something. In 1919 when the first democratically Dail was elected.




TBH, I don't think Shutuplaura is a Unionist. Nor CroppyBoy1798, just anti-Republican.



The "historians" who wrote the the reports of those "massacres", were all anti-Irish.

I think it was Shutuplaura who posted an articile about the massacres that supposedly took place. I have it somewhere on my HD. I'll post it later once i find it.

So all the massacres that took place were commited by the British and are justification for murdering innocent people.

Well documented massacres by Irishmen are just Unionist propoganda.

Why do extremists always sound the same, wether they be Fascists, Communists whatever, the excuses are always the same.

Fratton Fred

csk wrote:

I have to say I'm surprised at you coming out with that. I thought you were above that sort of crap.

That was in response to O'Lep and fenian trying to justify bombing a train station because britain was had an empire. It appears that you can do what you like against the British beacuse of that. Shoot dead a few Terrorists on active service and you are the scum of the earth, but blow up unborn babies and you're grand, as long as they're British.:rolleyes:

csk wrote:

and why is that? What makes those people so special?

Nothing makes them special, other than the fact they live there and moving from the UK to Irish rule directly affects their way of llife. Someone living in Mayo, other than aspiring for a united Ireland, is not affected in the same way.

You are telling people they have to give up jobs, the NHS, start paying VRT, 12% stamp duty etc, just because of a romantic idealology of a unified Ireland, Surely the only people who can really decide on that are those directly affected?

Maybe the real problem is that asking those involved will not give the answers people want, so they will resort to bombs and terror.

Someone in Cork telling the people of Northern Ireland they have to comform to their wishes or else they will restart a terror campaign, tell me how that is any better that what the British did for the last 500 years?

Erin Go Brath

Fratton Fred wrote:

Why do extremists always sound the same, wether they be Fascists, Communists whatever, the excuses are always the same.

Does that go for extremists who think that the British Goverment has the right to illegally occupy 1/6th of our country too?

Fratton Fred

Erin Go Brath wrote:

Does that go for extremists who think that the British Goverment has the right to illegally occupy 1/6th of our country too?

No, but it applies to extremists who claim an occupation is illegal, when it is not.

What makes it "Your"/"Our" country? I can understand an Ulsterman claiming that, but a Dub?

Erin Go Brath

Fratton Fred wrote:

No, but it applies to extremists who claim an occupation is illegal, when it is not.

What makes it "Your"/"Our" country? I can understand an Ulsterman claiming that, but a Dub?

I beg to differ. The Provisional movement have recently sold out, to get a piece of the pie, i grant you, which is why Sinn Fein are going to go down the pan. What gives them the right? They are a disgrace to the origins of the party, likewise FF. Watch the amount of new organisations, labelled dissident been set up as a result of SF's betrayal. The island of Ireland belongs to the people of Ireland, it's non-negotiable!

Excerpt from the 1916 Proclamation:

"We declare the right of the people of Ireland to the ownership of Ireland, and to the unfettered control of Irish destinies, to be sovereign and indefeasible. The long usurpation of that right by a foreign people and government has not extinguished the right, nor can it ever be extinguished except by the destruction of the Irish people. In every generation the Irish people have asserted their right to national freedom and sovereignty; six times during the last three hundred years they have asserted it to arms. Standing on that fundamental right and again asserting it in arms in the face of the world, we hereby proclaim the Irish Republic as a Sovereign Independent State, and we pledge our lives and the lives of our comrades-in-arms to the cause of its freedom, of its welfare, and of its exaltation among the nations."

BTW i'm a Limerick man, but I've every entitlement to call people from the occupied counties my countrymen. :mad:

Tiocfaidh ár lá!!!

Fratton Fred

Erin Go Brath wrote:

I beg to differ. The Provisional movement have recently sold out, to get a piece of the pie, i grant you, which is why Sinn Fein are going to go down the pan. What gives them the right? They are a disgrace to the origins of the party, likewise FF. Watch the amount of new organisations, labelled dissident been set up as a result of SF's betrayal. The island of Ireland belongs to the people of Ireland, it's non-negotiable!

Excerpt from the 1916 Proclamation:

"We declare the right of the people of Ireland to the ownership of Ireland, and to the unfettered control of Irish destinies, to be sovereign and indefeasible. The long usurpation of that right by a foreign people and government has not extinguished the right, nor can it ever be extinguished except by the destruction of the Irish people. In every generation the Irish people have asserted their right to national freedom and sovereignty; six times during the last three hundred years they have asserted it to arms. Standing on that fundamental right and again asserting it in arms in the face of the world, we hereby proclaim the Irish Republic as a Sovereign Independent State, and we pledge our lives and the lives of our comrades-in-arms to the cause of its freedom, of its welfare, and of its exaltation among the nations."

BTW i'm a Limerick man, but I've every entitlement to call people from the occupied counties my countrymen. :mad:

Tiocfaidh ár lá!!!

so if the British had issued a declaration, that would have made it legal? and what about the people of Ireland who don't want what you want, oh I forgot, it's non-negotiable (A bit like British rule was;) )

Erin Go Brath

Fratton Fred wrote:

so if the British had issued a declaration, that would have made it legal? and what about the people of Ireland who don't want what you want, oh I forgot, it's non-negotiable (A bit like British rule was;) )

The Unionists will be treated fairly and equally within a United Ireland, which is more than can be said for the Nationalists in the artifical statelet, under UK rule. The point being that a UI will benefit everybody, whereas retaining the status quo clearly benefits just the WASPs with their superiority complex, and corrupt and biased police force.

BTW I know a 32 County Socialist Republic is too hard a sell for Unionists to swallow. What I'm advocating is a 32 County Federalist arrangement with devolved powers for the 6 Counties, so Unionists and Nationalists up north have a say in the running of the Country. That would be the fairest way of doing things, and a huge step forward from the shambolic Westminister regime up there.

Fratton Fred

Erin Go Brath wrote:

BTW I know a 32 County Socialist Republic is too hard a sell for Unionists to swallow. What I'm advocating is a 32 County Federalist arrangement with devolved powers for the 6 Counties, so Unionists and Nationalists up north have a say in the running of the Country. That would be the fairest way of doing things, and a huge step forward from the shambolic Westminister regime up there.

that's an interesting proposition actually, but let me put the following to you:-

Mrs Ryan, is Catholic and has always voted Sinn Fein, for stormont and UK elections as she believes Sinn Fein look after her interests, being a Catholic and all. Life is not too bad for her now, there is a reasonable amount of peace and her son has a good job and her daughter is even thinking about returning from England, now it is safe to do so and there is plenty of work, thanks to the amount of civil service jobs moved to NI. She is moving house in six weeks which means a bigger mortgage and having to tighten her belt. She has friends and family both sides of the border (not tht ou know where it is anymore) all of whom she visits regularly (and always fills the car up in Cavan because the petrol is cheaper) and her son plays Football for the local GAA club.

How will Mrs Ryan feel that someone from Limerick has forced her to lose her job, Pay 12% stamp duty instead of 2% and now pay 21% VAT for her groceries. She will even have to pay for her visits to the Doctors now. There goes her new house and her job, but at least a few republicans in the south can pat themselves on the back.

OK, this is one scenario, but what gives you the right to tell Mrs Ryan you know what is best for her and her family? What gives you the right to change things and spark off more troubles, just so you can say that you got your way?

How does two different "Countries" on this Island actually affect you other than your own political beliefs?

Nothing.

SpitfireIV

Fenian wrote:

Like I said in an earlier post, FF have had 80 years to achieve re-unification through peaceful means, and haven't.

So whats happening up North now?? Are both sides of the devide not sitting down and talking things through? Ceasefires have been declared and for once there is a lasting peace.

Fenina wrote:

Maybe another bombing campaign is what's required.....

Thats great........really great, and what will that achieve exactly? Throw us back another 20 or 30 years?

Fenian wrote:

What does it matter what year it is?

Yes, I think it does. Things are different now here in Ireland, in Europe, and right across the world from what they used to be. If you dont think it matters what year it is, why is this being discussed in a history forum? Open a thread in Politics or Current affairs on the subject and I would wager you you'd find very few who would hold beliefs such as yourself. Most have moved on.

Fenian wrote:

TBH, I don't think Shutuplaura is a Unionist. Nor CroppyBoy1798, just anti-Republican.

I wouldnt say 'anti-Republican', I just know a lost cause when I see it, no more than I'd put my life savings on the worst horse in the Grand National

Erin Go Brath

Fratton Fred wrote:

that's an interesting proposition actually, but let me put the following to you:-

Mrs Ryan, is Catholic and has always voted Sinn Fein, for stormont and UK elections as she believes Sinn Fein look after her interests, being a Catholic and all. Life is not too bad for her now, there is a reasonable amount of peace and her son has a good job and her daughter is even thinking about returning from England, now it is safe to do so and there is plenty of work, thanks to the amount of civil service jobs moved to NI. She is moving house in six weeks which means a bigger mortgage and having to tighten her belt. She has friends and family both sides of the border (not tht ou know where it is anymore) all of whom she visits regularly (and always fills the car up in Cavan because the petrol is cheaper) and her son plays Football for the local GAA club.

How will Mrs Ryan feel that someone from Limerick has forced her to lose her job, Pay 12% stamp duty instead of 2% and now pay 21% VAT for her groceries. She will even have to pay for her visits to the Doctors now. There goes her new house and her job, but at least a few republicans in the south can pat themselves on the back.

OK, this is one scenario, but what gives you the right to tell Mrs Ryan you know what is best for her and her family? What gives you the right to change things and spark off more troubles, just so you can say that you got your way?

How does two different "Countries" on this Island actually affect you other than your own political beliefs?

Nothing.

Great story, don't know where you come up with this stuff, but i'll indulge.

The crux of the whole problem here, is NI's over dependence on UK Civil Services jobs. Agree with you there.

What you failed to mention is the lack of private sector jobs up North, (EG. 0 fortune 500 companies in NI, compared to 50 in ROI). These are the kind of jobs that the North needs to develop.

I'm pretty sure it was a ploy by the UK Government to have NI completely dependent on the UK, through Civil Service Jobs, to make re-integration as difficult as possible. The North will always be in the halfpenny place compared to the Republic with this attitude. The UK can decide to keep the North poor if needs be to suit its agenda.

Do you honestly think the North wouldn't be better off in the long run being reinegrated with the Republic, it's natural economic hinterland?

Fenian

CroppyBoy1798 wrote:

Ceasefires have been declared and for once there is a lasting peace.

The RIRA and the CIRA are not on ceasefire.

What you call "peace", I call normalisation.

CroppyBoy1798 wrote:

Thats great........really great, and what will that achieve exactly? Throw us back another 20 or 30 years?

Maybe it will throw us into the future, where we are free from foreign rule.

CroppyBoy1798 wrote:

Yes, I think it does. Things are different now here in Ireland, in Europe, and right across the world from what they used to be.

Things are not different in Ireland, we still have a foreign government claiming sovereignty over a portion of our island.
That hasn't changed in a long time.

CroppyBoy1798 wrote:

Open a thread in Politics or Current affairs on the subject and I would wager you you'd find very few who would hold beliefs such as yourself

I said earlier that people who hold the same ideals as myself only represent 2 or 3% of the population. I know Republican ideals are unpopular.
Just because they are unpopular doesn't mean I'm going to forsake them.

CroppyBoy1798 wrote:

I wouldnt say 'anti-Republican', I just know a lost cause when I see it, no more than I'd put my life savings on the worst horse in the Grand National

LOL, fair enough.

I'd prefer to support something I believe in, a three legged donkey or not.

Fratton Fred wrote:

How does two different "Countries" on this Island actually affect you other than your own political beliefs?

There is a huge effect.
When the island is re-unified, sectarianism will be a thing of the past (just like it is now in the south)

Just because I don;t live in the north, doesn't mean I should turn a blind eye to what goes on up there.

fratton Fred wrote:

That was in response to O'Lep and fenian trying to justify bombing a train station because britain was had an empire

I never justified killing civilians because Britian had an empire. I justify killing civilians because Britian is violating Irish national sovereignty.
That doesn't make it any less horrific, I jusr except that civilian casualties (that are in the minority)are inevitable.

Fratton Fred wrote:

Someone in Cork telling the people of Northern Ireland they have to comform to their wishes or else they will restart a terror campaign, tell me how that is any better that what the British did for the last 500 years?

The IRA never ran a "terror" campaign, they ran a military and economic one.

Fratton Fred wrote:

No, but it applies to extremists who claim an occupation is illegal, when it is not.

The occupation of Ireland by Britian is illegal.
What right does Britian have to claim sovereigny over any part of Ireland?
Just because Britian is an Imperialistic power, it doesn't give them the right to rule us (any of us).

Fratton Fred wrote:

What makes it "Your"/"Our" country? I can understand an Ulsterman claiming that, but a Dub?

I know this was directed that Erin Go Bragh, but I'll answer is anyway.
Ireland is divided into 4 provinces. What goes in any of those provinces is the concern of every irishman/woman.

ejmaztec

Erin Go Brath wrote:

Great story, don't know where you come up with this stuff, but i'll indulge.

The crux of the whole problem here, is NI's over dependence on UK Civil Services jobs. Agree with you there.

What you failed to mention is the lack of private sector jobs up North, (EG. 0 fortune 500 companies in NI, compared to 50 in ROI). These are the kind of jobs that the North needs to develop.

I'm pretty sure it was a ploy by the UK Government to have NI completely dependent on the UK, through Civil Service Jobs, to make re-integration as difficult as possible. The North will always be in the halfpenny place compared to the Republic with this attitude. The UK can decide to keep the North poor if needs be to suit its agenda.

Do you honestly think the North wouldn't be better off in the long run being reinegrated with the Republic, it's natural economic hinterland?

I'd say that the main reason for the lack of Fortune 500 companies in the North, is that no investor in his right mind would wish to take the risk of setting up a business in the war zone that it became since the 1960s.

I've met many businessmen in the UK who decided to pull out of the North altogether over the years, mostly because one side or the other threatened to blow up their premises, or them. These businessmen were Catholics and Protestants. Some of them even went into businesses together, something that would never have happened in a million years, had they stayed in the North.

Since the heat has died down, investment is being pushed for, and some of the threatened ones are gradually making their way back home.

I would also say that the UK has not intentionally kept the North poor. It has always wanted the North to stand on it's own two feet, mainly due to the British tax-payer complaining at the drop of a hat about any money being spent away from the mainland.

They were so desperate at one stage, they even bank-rolled DeLorean, whilst the Irish government wouldn't touch him with a barge-pole. We all know how that turned out

McArmalite

Erin Go Brath wrote:

The crux of the whole problem here, is NI's over dependence on UK Civil Services jobs. Agree with you there......I'm pretty sure it was a ploy by the UK Government to have NI completely dependent on the UK, through Civil Service Jobs, to make re-integration as difficult as possible. The North will always be in the halfpenny place compared to the Republic with this attitude.

As the relationship between unionism and the british state was once described - it is a relationship not found anywhere in nature, it was a case of one type of parasite breeding off another type of parasite.

Fratton Fred

McArmalite wrote:

BTW, McArmalite = O'Leprosy, surprise, surprise Fratton Fred " West"

I think we had already gathered that, so you created a new user specifically to wind me up?

Please stop referinf to me as Fred West, Fred West was a serial killer and I take great offence to that.

seamus

When the island is re-unified, sectarianism will be a thing of the past (just like it is now in the south)

Or, instead of having a bunch of pissed-off drug dealers masquerading as Republicans, we'll have a bunch of pissed-off drug dealers masquerading as Unionists, and attacking targets in the Republic.

Like it or not, the Unionists represent at least half of the population of the North. They deserve to have their opinions heard just as much as the Republicans do. They belong there, irrespective of how their ancestors ended up there. Stormont and home rule is the fairest and most sensible solution.

SpitfireIV

Fratton Fred wrote:

I think we had already gathered that, so you created a new user specifically to wind me up?

Please stop referinf to me as Fred West, Fred West was a serial killer and I take great offence to that.

Probably best if you just ignored him Fratton Fred, attention is what he wants. Sad really.

Fratton Fred

McArmalite wrote:

" I take great offence to that"

And what's the idea with the head of a pig and " Hands off our Irishbird " avatar ? Trying to offend the Paddy's ??? And HE is the one who complains about me !!!!!

BGRH.

Nice place, full of nice, level headed, bear drinking, bacon buttie eating Irishmen.

You should come along, but you will need to leave your prejudices at the door.

Erin Go Brath

Fratton Fred wrote:

BGRH.

Nice place, full of nice, level headed, bear drinking, bacon buttie eating Irishmen.

You should come along, but you will need to leave your prejudices at the door.

"bear drinking"

How does that work then? Do tell.

Fratton Fred

Erin Go Brath wrote:

"bear drinking"

How does that work then? Do tell.

it's kind of a big hairy type of beer:o

Erin Go Brath

Fratton Fred wrote:

it's kind of a big hairy type of beer:o

Sounds good, i must give it a go.

Fenian

seamus wrote:

Or, instead of having a bunch of pissed-off drug dealers masquerading as Republicans, we'll have a bunch of pissed-off drug dealers masquerading as Unionists, and attacking targets in the Republic.

I asked CroppyBoy1798 this same question.
When was the last time an IRA volunteer was arrested and convicted on drug charges?
If you knew anything about Republicanism, you'd know we are against poisoning our own people, or any people for that matter.

seamus wrote:

Stormont and home rule is the fairest and most sensible solution.

How is it sensible to have an island divided, when on one side you have sectarianism and military rule, and on the other you have economic boom?

That doesn't sound fair to me.

ejmaztec

Fenian wrote:

How is it sensible to have an island divided, when on one side you have sectarianism and military rule, and on the other you have economic boom?

That doesn't sound fair to me.

My previous post explains the reasons for a lack of an economic boom i.e. because there were other kinds of "booms" taking place to prevent it.

Sectarianism isn't fair.

What also isn't and wasn't fair was the lack of consideration given to the huge UK population of innocent Irish people, and their families, having to face the prejudice and backlash resulting from the mainland UK campaign. Many of the bombings in the UK were of non-military targets and these were completely counter-productive in achieving anything constructive. Any moral high-ground was lost after the first civilian fatality. Some of these fatalities were Irish migrants, or their descendants!

I know that my family and other Irish families living in the UK in the 1970s and 1980s, put up with all kinds of crap from ignorant British bigots and tabloid readers. My late mother was driven into a deep depression after some woman that she worked with led her own relentless anti-Irish campaign against her. As far as the ignorant ones were concerned, the island of Ireland was responsible, along with it’s entire population – they knew no better!

This is the same crap that is now being dished out to innocent Muslims.

United Ireland = Economic boom!!!

Dream on...

No chance, the unemployment rate in NI will go through the roof when the civil service jobs are taken back to the UK.

some 60% of all employment is within the civil service, no way can the republic absorb that many jobs without severe cost and tax implications.

Just look at the German economy between 1991 & 2005, reunification had a severe impact on the prosperity of the country.

The troubles destroyed business confidence in NI, peace has allowed some recovery but is well below that in the Republic.

NI is very expensive for the UK (populaton 50 million) to support, it could cripple a country of with a population of only 4 million.

McArmalite

seamus wrote:

Or, instead of having a bunch of pissed-off drug dealers masquerading as Republicans, we'll have a bunch of pissed-off drug dealers masquerading as Unionists, and attacking targets in the Republic.

Like it or not, the Unionists represent at least half of the population of the North. They deserve to have their opinions heard just as much as the Republicans do. They belong there, irrespective of how their ancestors ended up there. Stormont and home rule is the fairest and most sensible solution.

In the words of Fenian " When was the last time an IRA volunteer was arrested and convicted on drug charges? " Tell me, in the 25 years of the troubles, how many IRA men ended up on the IRA wings of a prison for drugs, extortion offences ? I mean therew wasn't a week that went by that these accusations were been made against them - but not one single conviction ?

Good point ejmaztec, though made about Irish people living on 'mainland' britian, a point that's often forgotten. " What also isn't and wasn't fair was the lack of consideration given to the huge UK population of innocent Irish people, and their families, having to face the prejudice and backlash resulting from the mainland UK campaign. Many of the bombings in the UK were of non-military targets and these were completely counter-productive in achieving anything constructive. Any moral high-ground was lost after the first civilian fatality. Some of these fatalities were Irish migrants, or their descendants! "

Well they also were victims of the conflict no doubt. But the nationalists in the north were suffering a 100 times worse intimadation and violence daily, and had been on the receiving end for decades before that. A bit rich asking them to stop their violence back against the british state for Irish people facing a fraction of what they were enduring.

BTW, I also had relations living in England at the time, although they found it obviously very embarrassing, they always said, that apart from the odd idiot, the vast majority of ordinary people over there never harrassed them in any way. But it still didn't change my relations views on the root cause and the only way to end violence between the 2 countries - british withdrawal.

SpitfireIV

McArmalite wrote:

...........Grenadier Guardsman Daryl Hickey who wouldn't be coming back from the sentence given to him by the Afghan justice

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30100-1275153,00.html

You're a sick man! Pathetic