Junction Question

mack1

OK, this is something that's bugged me for a while now....

There are many of these type of junctions around Dublin and probably the country, so here goes...

At a traffic lighted junction (a smaller one with no filter lane for turning right or left) with 2 lanes. Left lane had the arrow on the ground indicating this lane is for turning left AND going straight on, right lane had arrow for turning right AND going straight on - simple enough so far.

BUT when the lights change the first light is a RIGHT TURN ONLY filter!

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So a cars going straight are perfectly within their right to be in both lanes, but a car turning right arriving later would be blocked. I've seen this happen many time and the turning car beep the f**k out of the car in what he thinks is right turn only lane (as cars are now blocking the arrows on the road) - so if you're the going straight car what do you do just wait it out? If you're the turning car do what do you do?

Is this just terrible road engineering on the part of the NRA or what!

sesswhat

You're making a common mistake, which is believing that any thought whatsoever goes into road design in this country.

_Kaiser_

There's one of these junctions just up the road here. Common practise seems to be move forward and left to let right turning cars pass.

On the flip side though it's a great chance to get past a slow moving truck or convoy of dawdling cars

daedalus2097

sesswhat wrote:

You're making a common mistake, which is believing that any thought whatsoever goes into road design in this country.

Yep, there's your problem right there... I know it well - have been beeped out of it a couple of times for sitting there too. It's different if you were trying to go straight on a left-only lane (which I've seen as well) but you're perfectly right to sit there and wait for the straight ahead light to go green.

On a similar note, I've been blown off the road and had to swerve out of the way of people when turning right in a 2 lane right turn. The junction is as follows: 2-lane road turning onto a 2-lane dual carriageway. Right hand lane is right turn only, left hand lane is right turn and straight. Yet people in the right lane believe when they turn right they should drive straight for the left lane, oblivious to me sitting beside them also turning right until they think I'm in their way. In that case though I reckon it's more to do with idiots behind the wheel (thinking of the stereotypical big car, "I'm driving for 30 years so I can do what I want" types here) than bad junction design...

BrianD3

The light sequence was probably changed and whoever was responsible for road markings wasn't informed. The junction layout will continue to be a problem until someone complains to the relevant person in the relevant department of the relevant authority

As well as the problem you describe, you can get junctions where traffic in the correct lane for going straight ahead gets held up by traffic waiting for a right turn filter or a gap in the oncoming traffic.

Anan1

daedalus2097 wrote:

Yep, there's your problem right there... I know it well - have been beeped out of it a couple of times for sitting there too. It's different if you were trying to go straight on a left-only lane (which I've seen as well) but you're perfectly right to sit there and wait for the straight ahead light to go green.

It is, as you say, perfectly legal to just sit there. That said, if it can be done safely, i'd move forwards and left a bit to let them get around me.

tc20

It could be that there is a pedestrian crossing in use, hence the right turn only arrow coming on first.
Not sure which junction OP is talking about, but similar kinda one is at the Rathgar village end of Orwell road. Two lanes, altho left lane is for left turn and straight thru', right lane is for right only. Arrows for straight ahead and right come on first, the left lane is stopped by the red light, because pedestrians are crossing. So the guy a few cars back, sees the green light and hits the horn....

With regard to the OPs junction, it does seem to be a case where some earlier indication or signage would be beneficial, but sure then we wouldn't be living and driving in lovely little Ireland :rolleyes:

OldmanMondeo

General rule is keep to the inside lane if proceeding straight or turning left. This of course would not be the case for turn left only lanes.

What the op is looking for is common sense from all road users.

And just to add to the pot, how about 2 lanes comming to a roundabout, I am turning left, traffic is in the right hand lane, red van on my right decides, whileon the roundabout, to turn left. Only for I noticed what he had decided to do, he would have taken the side off my car. Gave the usual blow of the horn and flashed the lights.

R.O.R

Stopped at a set of traffic lights this morning heading towards Annesley Motors in Ballybough. 2 Lanes going straight forward or left turn from the left lane. 1 car at the front of each lane so pulled up behind the car in the left lane. Lights changed to green for going straight on and the Micra in front doesn't move - then she decides to indicate left (Red light apart from straight on as a pedestrian crossing on the road to the left). Silly bint in front gets a nice slow hand clap from me and the wife, but not much else you can do so we wait patiently for the 30 seconds it takes for the light to change to green for turning.

Only on the second beep did I bother to turn around to see what was going on. Feckin Idiot in one of those 90's Polish Registered, German Made barges (A8 I think) beepin and gesticulating that the light is on green - briefly considered getting out and explaining the rules of the road to him but realised it would probably be pointless, a lot of Irish have trouble understanding me, yet alone Poles + he looked bigger than me.

PauloMN

mack1 wrote:

- so if you're the going straight car what do you do just wait it out? If you're the turning car do what do you do?

What can you do? If you are going straight on but there's only a green right turn filter and a red light, you have to stop. F**k any arsehole beeping in that situation, it won't be their problem if you move across/over the line and cause an accident. Irish people love to beep at the merest inconvenience.

To answer your question (which is not a difficult one) - both cars must wait. When I learned to drive, I was always taught "green means go if the road is clear" - that means cars, bikes, pedestrians etc.. Green is not some sort of inherent right for people to turn into assholes.

That said, if I was aware of the junction and its layout, I'd be inclined to keep left if going straight. I'm inclined to do that regardless of the junction, unless I know I can definitely go straight on in the right-hand lane, and if there's a specific reason for me to avoid the left-hand lane, like a build-up of traffic or something.