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Shooting Forum - Firearms licencing information


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Lands Preserved

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    #62
    Our man in Havana
    Closed Accounts Posts: 29,476 ✭✭✭✭Our man in Havana


    Acting without Dail and judicial oversight? I am sure there are a few talented SCs out there that would find grounds for a judicial review.


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    #63
    Sparks
    Registered Users Posts: 40,038 ✭✭✭✭Sparks


    I seriously doubt it Bond, the CJA gives the Minister the explicit right to set whatever preconditions on a restricted licence that he wants to, and the explicit right to decide what goes on the restricted list and what doesn't. It's precisely as legal as the temporary custody order of '72, and despite what keeps being said by some, that order was perfecly legal (the policy of not granting licences for pistols that followed obviously wasn't so unquestionable).


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    #64
    Banjax
    Closed Accounts Posts: 103 ✭✭Banjax


    Sparks

    Fair enough, I've been laid up with a broken ankle after coming a-cropper in a silage pit, (hence i'm banjaxed) so I've more time than most to be wasting.

    I appreciate the depth of your feeling on this matter. As you say, I am not to blame for the CJB, but neither did I complain about it being drafted.
    Fair enough, I've never known any legislation to be affected by complaint.
    But I understand the shooting organisations made some efforts, through direct and indirect representations.

    I can only speak honestly for myself. So if I say in so many words that I doubt the gardai will want my house to be more secure than any bank, that's what I think. That's all.

    I never said the clubs aren't doing enough for me. I've never asked any club to do anything for me, and I have not expected them to either. I give my local gun club permission to shoot over my lands, same as I do my local foot harriers, and same as I would any sportsman I thought trustworthy.

    I can't be all you seem to want me to be, I'm not one of those shooters. It's a good pastime that I like very much, that's as far as it goes.
    Having said that I have no issue with anyone else doing as they wish, I have no gripe or bias about full bore rifles, pistols or benelli super shotguns.

    This thread was about what exactly "lands preserved" meant, and that is what I was discussing. How I came to be a scapegoat for all that is evil and wrong about the CJB is a bit of a fecking mystery to me.


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    #65
    Our man in Havana
    Closed Accounts Posts: 29,476 ✭✭✭✭Our man in Havana


    What exactly happened in the 70's ?


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    #66
    Banjax
    Closed Accounts Posts: 103 ✭✭Banjax


    Dessie O'Malley brought an emergency provision into power, whereby all pistols and fullbore firearms were confiscated.

    It was supposed to be a temporary measure, and everyone was told they'd have the guns back in under a year. That's how I remember it, I was a teenager at the time. My uncle has a .303 that he handed in, never saw it again after that.


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    #67
    Our man in Havana
    Closed Accounts Posts: 29,476 ✭✭✭✭Our man in Havana


    I hope and pray that something like that never happens again. How long did it take in the end for it to be repealed?


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    #68
    Banjax
    Closed Accounts Posts: 103 ✭✭Banjax


    I don't think it was repealed as such, but eventually it was successfully challanged after something like 30 years.

    The new CJB could, if I read it correctly and believe the very worst, give the powers that be the legal ability to do so again.


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    #69
    Sparks
    Registered Users Posts: 40,038 ✭✭✭✭Sparks


    That's not quite what happened. The temporary custody order ended in '72. But since the DoJ and Gardai brought in a policy to not issue licences for pistols or any rifle over .22 in calibre, noone could get their firearms back legally. Ownership of the firearms remained with their original owners, but they couldn't legally possess them, so they remained in a sort of legal limbo and in Garda storage up until recently.

    The important point though, is that the TCO was legal. It was the no-licence policy that was challanged, not the TCO.


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    #70
    Sparks
    Registered Users Posts: 40,038 ✭✭✭✭Sparks


    And the CJA (it's the Criminal Justice Act now, alas) doesn't give that power to the Minister to issue TCOs, he had that already. Instead it gives him far more powers over shooting. All of which are difficult to read in the legislation without alarm bells going off in the head of any shooter who knows the history of our relationship with the Gardai and DoJ over the past 30 years or so.


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    #71
    Clare gunner
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,843 ✭✭✭Clare gunner


    Heres a thing;Since Ol Mc Dowell has slitherd off the political stage to join the ranks of the reptiles in the Four courts again.Wouldnt it be intresting to appoint HIM to fight any challanges to any future firearms law??
    What he created,so he can destroy as well.:)


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    #72
    Sparks
    Registered Users Posts: 40,038 ✭✭✭✭Sparks


    Clare gunner wrote:
    Heres a thing;Since Ol Mc Dowell has slitherd off the political stage to join the ranks of the reptiles in the Four courts again.Wouldnt it be intresting to appoint HIM to fight any challanges to any future firearms law??
    Out of curiosity, is it that you don't know how much that would cost, or that you'd rather spend the money on a nearly hopeless fight than on - say - a new range in Limerick?


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    #73
    bunny shooter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,096 ✭✭✭bunny shooter


    Banjax wrote:
    Shooting rights are the same as sporting rights, if you don't understand what I've written I can't make you any smarter.

    In actual fact, neither I nor my relations own the sporting rights to our lands.
    Not that it makes much difference to me.

    The issue of sporting rights came up when Jaycee was discussing the option of payment for the rights to shoot over someones land. If you care to go back and read it you'll see I'm sure.

    I think (I'm not 100% sure) anyone who gives a gun club permission to shoot over the land is asked if they would like to be a member. That's why I was asked.

    So what names exactly do you have for people who give your club permission but have no interest in joining your club?

    Sporting rights include but are not limited to hare coursing, foxhounds, hunting with birds of prey etc

    Re rights, sounds right

    Good manners on behalf of club

    You know what you are


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    #74
    bunny shooter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,096 ✭✭✭bunny shooter


    Banjax wrote:
    Sparks

    I sent you a pm.

    But if nothing matters, why bother to discuss anything?

    My brother is bigger than yours ?


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    #75
    bunny shooter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,096 ✭✭✭bunny shooter


    My advice to all shooters, join a club of some description affialiated to a national body soon. there are stormy waters coming !

    That's me on this thread !!!!!

    See you all elsewhere


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    #76
    Banjax
    Closed Accounts Posts: 103 ✭✭Banjax


    Are you angry and bitter for a living, or is it just a hobby?


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    #77
    Kramer
    Registered Users Posts: 3,224 ✭✭✭Kramer


    bunny shooter wrote:
    That's me on this thread !!!!!

    Thank God :p .
    See you all elsewhere

    Hope not :D .


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    #78
    Clare gunner
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,843 ✭✭✭Clare gunner


    Sparks wrote:
    Out of curiosity, is it that you don't know how much that would cost, or that you'd rather spend the money on a nearly hopeless fight than on - say - a new range in Limerick?

    Typing out loud Sparks,;) Thing is tho,will we be able to open new ranges with the terms &conditions in the CJA on ranges building ,running thereof,etc as well???
    It might come down to a fight,before ranges can be built as well.


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    #79
    thelurcher
    Registered Users Posts: 627 ✭✭✭thelurcher


    For some very good reasons I've decided to leave my local gun club this year - I have permission to shoot everywhere club can and a few more in the area that won't let them in - but can I still shoot pheasant, snipe, woodcock etc.
    Can't see why not but just want to be sure in case of f**cking match with members when season starts.


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