Clocked Car alert

testicle

rubyred wrote:

It's not an invitation to treat when they don't own the item in question. You can't advertise someone else's property without their consent. That would be like me advertising your house on www.myhome.ie when you had no intentions of selling it.

Or advertising someone else's house....

Cartell report and HPI report sent via email to unlucky buyer.

digitally-yours

steve06 wrote:

well the garage advertising the car isn't a crime because it's only an invitation to treat...

Its false representation to be conforming something in stock which they dont have in stock and is not their property.

The thing is that the Advertisement should have been removed after some Normal time that could be up to 3 or 4 days not 2 weeks after sale.

Its covered under the sale of goods act

check here

should be more info here
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1980/en/act/pub/0016/index.html

Implied condition on sale of motor vehicles.
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1980/en/act/pub/0016/sec0013.html#zza16y1980s13

JHMEG

Rubyred's advice is spot on. I'd go with that.

JHMEG

Ted, the garage details on the surround on the number plate, are they the details of the garage you bought it from? And how many previous owners in Irl has it had (on the reg doc)?

digitally-yours

There you go thats what it will be counted as Misrepresentation

I am not lawyer but i understand law well

Damages for misrepresentation.

45.—(1) Where a person has entered into a contract after a misrepresentation has been made to him by another party thereto and as a result thereof he has suffered loss, then, if the person making the misrepresentation would be liable to damages in respect thereof had the misrepresentation been made fraudulently, that person shall be so liable notwithstanding that the misrepresentation was not made fraudulently, unless he proves that he had reasonable ground to believe and did believe up to the time the contract was made that the facts represented were true.


(2) Where a person has entered into a contract after a misrepresentation has been made to him otherwise than fraudulently, and he would be entitled, by reason of the misrepresentation, to rescind the contract, then, if it is claimed in any proceedings arising out of the contract that the contract ought to be or has been rescinded, the court may declare the contract subsisting and award damages in lieu of rescission, if of opinion that it would be equitable to do so, having regard to the nature of the misrepresentation and the loss that would be caused by it if the contract were upheld, as well as to the loss that rescission would cause to the other party.


(3) Damages may be awarded against a person under subsection (2) whether or not he is liable to damages under subsection (1), but where he is so liable any award under subsection (2) shall be taken into account in assessing his liability under subsection (1).

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1980/en/act/pub/0016/sec0045.html#zza16y1980s45

TedKelly

digitally-yours wrote:

There you go thats what it will be counted as Misrepresentation

I am not lawyer but i understand law well

Damages for misrepresentation.

45.—(1) Where a person has entered into a contract after a misrepresentation has been made to him by another party thereto and as a result thereof he has suffered loss, then, if the person making the misrepresentation would be liable to damages in respect thereof had the misrepresentation been made fraudulently, that person shall be so liable notwithstanding that the misrepresentation was not made fraudulently, unless he proves that he had reasonable ground to believe and did believe up to the time the contract was made that the facts represented were true.


(2) Where a person has entered into a contract after a misrepresentation has been made to him otherwise than fraudulently, and he would be entitled, by reason of the misrepresentation, to rescind the contract, then, if it is claimed in any proceedings arising out of the contract that the contract ought to be or has been rescinded, the court may declare the contract subsisting and award damages in lieu of rescission, if of opinion that it would be equitable to do so, having regard to the nature of the misrepresentation and the loss that would be caused by it if the contract were upheld, as well as to the loss that rescission would cause to the other party.


(3) Damages may be awarded against a person under subsection (2) whether or not he is liable to damages under subsection (1), but where he is so liable any award under subsection (2) shall be taken into account in assessing his liability under subsection (1).

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1980/en/act/pub/0016/sec0045.html#zza16y1980s45

lol As if I wasn't already confused enough as it is.....:)

digitally-yours

Dont be confused you have nothing to loose from this situation if you handle this well you will come out winner from this at the end of the day.

Ok for simpler version click here

http://www.consumerconnect.ie/eng/Hot_Topics/Campaigns/NCA_guide_to_buying_a_car.pdf

check page 18 it says "as Described"


Also on page 19

‘Clocking’ is the practice of changing the genuine odometer reading of the car, generally by reducing it, in order to make the car a more attractive proposition to a buyer. If you have evidence that a car has been clocked, you should report the matter as soon as possible to the NCA on LoCall 1890 432 432, or through the website www.consumerconnect.ie. Any delay in reporting the matter may affect the NCA’s ability to take action.

TedKelly

digitally-yours wrote:

Dont be confused you have nothing to loose from this situation if you handle this well you will come out winner from this at the end of the day.

Ok for simpler version click here

http://www.consumerconnect.ie/eng/Hot_Topics/Campaigns/NCA_guide_to_buying_a_car.pdf

check page 18 it says "as Described"


Also on page 19

‘Clocking’ is the practice of changing the genuine odometer reading of the car, generally by reducing it, in order to make the car a more attractive proposition to a buyer. If you have evidence that a car has been clocked, you should report the matter as soon as possible to the NCA on LoCall 1890 432 432, or through the website www.consumerconnect.ie. Any delay in reporting the matter may affect the NCA’s ability to take action.

Ah much better, thanks very much. It's the handling it well i'm afraid of...lol

testicle

Let us know how you get on!

TedKelly

testicle wrote:

Let us know how you get on!

I certainly will and thanks for your help.

fletch

Yeh good luck Ted, I don't envy your situation, everybody is rooting for ya.

Henry Ford III

Best thread in ages. Go TED!:D

digitally-yours

You have 2 days compose your self

gather all papers think how you will handle the situation and at no time sound weak and make sure you are in control of the situation and his only options are what you tell him not other way arround

Wish you all the best

Any more info required post here and i will make sure i dig that info for ya !

TedKelly

digitally-yours wrote:

You have 2 days compose your self

gather all papers think how you will handle the situation and at no time sound weak and make sure you are in control of the situation and his only options are what you tell him not other way arround

Wish you all the best

Any more info required post here and i will make sure i dig that info for ya !

Sounds easy doesn't it........ Truth is I'm not great at all this stuff. (Didn't even try and get anything off the price of the car when I bought it). Also still undecided. They are open the weekend so was thinking of going down tomorrow morning with reports and looking for full refund & compensation or wait until monday and get in touch with the department of consumer affairs. The hassle of having to go looking for another car is buggin' me too but this car must go!

testicle

digitally-yours wrote:

You have 2 days compose your self

Open 7 days!

Enright

the suspence is killing me! let u knpw if yu go how you got on. Best of luck, stay conposed and professional and to the point, do not be deflected from your cause. YOU have done nothing wrong

colm_mcm

they wouldn't have 2 similar Passats in stock would they? Hardly the wrong pics? Sorry, I can't keep up with this!

Lord Nikon

At least your post count is going up.

TedKelly

neuromancer wrote:

At least your post count is going up.

lol, suppose I should be happy so.

.Longshanks.

Henry Ford III wrote:

Best thread in ages. Go TED!:D

It sure is! Best of luck Ted!

squibs

Just adding a personal experience. My dad's company traded in his 3-year old company car to a local garage. The car was subsequently clocked (by like 40K miles!) on the forecourt to get a better price. The buyer then noticed the wear on the pedals and checked it out with a mechanic, who spotted the telltales signs of a f**ked-with-odometer

She (the buyer) ended up getting the car for free, and the garage owner was relieved to get away so lightly by all accounts.

Rudolph Claus

@Ted - You should bring a friend with you when going to the dealers if you dont really like dealing with that type of stuff, maybe someone you know thats into cars a wee bit even.

Perhaps Doughal or Jack are free?

OKenora

bottom line is the ad on the website makes feck all difference really. There aparrently is documentary proof that the car he sold has done far more miles than it is currently showing. End of, fleece the dealer, scum like that should not be allowed to trade.

100% refund at least would be my aim. Avoid signing anything there on the day and take it away to get a solicitor to look over it. No matter what threats or reductions in refund they use stick to your guns. You have the trump card, documented proof of a clocked car they sold.

It's allright saying the dealer may not have known the car is clocked but afaik it is his responsibility to make sure the goods he has for sale are as advertised. Even if he didn't clock it we all have seen how ridiculously simple it was to unearth the clocked car by a simple check, something a dealer would be expected to have known about and done himself.

Out of curiosity, whats the mileage on your car now Ted Kelly ?

sonners

Hey Ted, some really good advice here.
I think its a good idea that you bring someone with you, maybe get them to do the talking for you. I know this is a sh*tty situation to be in and I dont envy you one bit but you should start thinking about what you can get out of this. As the lads said, you have the trump card, make him pay for the hassle he's causing you.
Best of luck,
Go Team Ted

chasm

rubyred wrote:

Just had a quick work with the senior partner here. You need to say nothing to the garage. Contact the AA to do a report on the car (give them the hpi report etc if you have it - if not they'll look it up). Write to the garage with a COPY ONLY of the report and state that if you don't get a full refund together with compensation within seven days you will have your Solicitors issue proceedings against them. once they pay you, you will have to give back the car and have the hassle of buying a new one, but at least you will be able to sell it on at a later date. You will have to pay for the report but will get it back off the garage. I bet you anything they will pay up to keep it all quiet. AFTER you get your money... ring a local radio station and make a big song and dance (just for extra revenge).

In relation to the fact that your car is still advertised as being for sale. Do a separate letter (but send in with the other one - defo not before or they would know that you are on to them) saying that they should remove it from the website within 24 hours. It clearly shows your registration plate and is illegal.

It doesn't matter whether or not they knew the car was clocked - they should have checked it before they sold it.

I think this would be the option i would go for as it means you don't have to worry about how the conversation with the garage will go(ie you dont have to worry about nerves etc). Understandably you like the car (you wouldnt have spent your hard earned cash on it otherwise), but if you decided to keep it and sell it a fews years down the line what would you do about the clocking business if the buyer did checks and noticed that things didnt quite add up?
It would be you that would pay the price in that they either wouldnt buy it or they would want a decrease in the asking price. I wish you the best of luck and hope you get it resolved to your satisfaction.

Seth Brundle

I don't recall seeing it on any of the revious pages but was there any service info provided with the car that you may not have noticed the true mileage on?
It may help your case against the dealer.

CK.1

Here is who you need to report it to...

Evelyn Galvin
ODCA Inspector
Dept Enterprise, Trade & Employment

Tel: (01)4025579
Mobile: 086 8353783
email: evelyn_galvin at entemp dot ie

PeteK*

On CarTell.ie which check is the HPI which gets you all the info where you can tell if you're dealing with a dodgey car?

kikel

Chatmaster wrote:

On CarTell.ie which check is the HPI which gets you all the info where you can tell if you're dealing with a dodgey car?

HPI is the UK vehicle history check

www.hpicheck.com

Tipsy Mac

I think the best thing to do would be consumer affairs to make a list of garages convicted of selling clocked cars and then all motorists simply avoid them. It's almost impossible to stop any other way and most buyers are unaware of how to go about checks particularly with imported cars.

Looking at the rest of the cars on the forecourt I would say the milage on the following would be questionable...

http://www.carzone.com/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=716443

http://www.carzone.com/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=663015

http://www.carzone.com/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=734104

http://www.carzone.com/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=671441