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Rezoning for new Gaelscoil in Mayfield refused

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    #122
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    TML91 wrote: »
    The scanned attachments do talk about the possibility of the site at Mayfield Cross. Thanks for uploading them.

    Were you given any reason as to why it was stopped?

    No, this is all quite a while ago now, before my time. I have been told by the school that all other sites investigated were deemed unsuitable for various reasons by the Dept. of Education.


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    #123
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    RoverJames wrote: »
    In the interim why not get some sugarsoap and do a job on the mouldy portocabin wall, bit of fablon on the roof and some sealant would do no harm.

    This is not a helpful comment. You know full well that any work like this has to be carried out through the Department of Education for health and safety and insurance reasons.


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    #124
    gbee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,388 ✭✭✭gbee


    professore wrote: »
    This is not a helpful comment. You know full well that any work like this has to be carried out through the Department of Education for health and safety and insurance reasons.

    See how silly this statement is. I'm assuming you are a parent for the purpose of my reply, but you'd let a health & safety rule prevent you from doing work that without such doing is directly effecting you child's health & safety.


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    #125
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    gbee wrote: »
    See how silly this statement is. I'm assuming you are a parent for the purpose of my reply, but you'd let a health & safety rule prevent you from doing work that without such doing is directly effecting you child's health & safety.

    As silly as preventing a school being built due to pylons being over a goalpost perhaps?

    As silly as a small group of people preventing nearly 300 children from having a suitable school built to save a small corner of a field?


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    #126
    gbee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,388 ✭✭✭gbee


    professore wrote: »
    As silly as preventing a school being built due to pylons being over a goalpost perhaps?

    Pylons are a radiation risk. Going for a walk or playing a match or two will be no harm. Staying on close proximity for the typical 8 hour working day, five days a week for the school term, well I'd not put my child in this environment.

    And don't get me started on micro wave transmitters and tetra transmitters in fields right next door to other schools.

    Radiation is a risk with exposure, level of exposure and duration of exposure and children are more susceptible than adults. As example in Fukushima Dai-ichi and Toyko 100Bq of short lived radiation was the maximum legal infant level, whereas 300Bq was allowed for adults, not the same as a pylon obviously, but the principal applies. The pylon is permanent.


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    #127
    Stark
    Registered Users Posts: 20,995 ✭✭✭✭Stark


    Bull****. Electricity pylons produce low levels of non-ionising radiation. If you're worried about that, better make sure your child never watches TV, listens to a radio, eats microwaved food, uses a mobile phone etc. I hope you didn't have an ultrasound when you were pregnant either as the foetus would have been exposed to non-ionising radiation.

    Better make sure they're kept in a darkened room as well.


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    #128
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    gbee wrote: »
    Pylons are a radiation risk. Going for a walk or playing a match or two will be no harm. Staying on close proximity for the typical 8 hour working day, five days a week for the school term, well I'd not put my child in this environment.

    And don't get me started on micro wave transmitters and tetra transmitters in fields right next door to other schools.

    Radiation is a risk with exposure, level of exposure and duration of exposure and children are more susceptible than adults. As example in Fukushima Dai-ichi and Toyko 100Bq of short lived radiation was the maximum legal infant level, whereas 300Bq was allowed for adults, not the same as a pylon obviously, but the principal applies. The pylon is permanent.

    There are pylons everywhere, in fact I have some at the back of my house. The reason I assume they are being objected to I presume is if they dropped they might contact the goalpost and cause an electric shock risk. Nothing to do with radiation. By that logic you should pull all the wires out of your house as these generate radiation too.


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    #129
    gbee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,388 ✭✭✭gbee


    Stark wrote: »
    Bull****. Electricity pylons produce low levels of non-ionising radiation. If you're worried about that, better make sure your child never watches TV, listens to a radio, eats microwaved food, uses a mobile phone etc. I hope you didn't have an ultrasound when you were pregnant either as the foetus would have been exopsed to non-ionising radiation then as well.

    Better make sure they're kept in a darkened room as well.

    Funny you mention some of these things, as you know there is legislation before the European Parliament on mobile phones and children with the possibility of an age limit being implemented.


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    #130
    gbee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,388 ✭✭✭gbee


    professore wrote: »
    By that logic you should pull all the wires out of your house as these generate radiation too.

    I'm a radio enthusiast, I know all abut this and have chokes and shields on most of my power sockets.

    Flash over is a real threat in regards to a powerlines and the proximity of goalposts. Any antenna can be at risk when the right weather conditions prevail.


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    #131
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    gbee wrote: »
    I'm a radio enthusiast, I know all abut this and have chokes and shields on most of my power sockets.

    And a hat made of tinfoil? :D
    gbee wrote: »
    Flash over is a real threat in regards to a powerlines and the proximity of goalposts. Any antenna can be at risk when the right weather conditions prevail.

    You are trying to backpedal now ... you realise it's nothing to do with radiation.


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    #132
    gbee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,388 ✭✭✭gbee


    professore wrote: »
    And a hat made of tinfoil? :D You are trying to backpedal now ... you realise it's nothing to do with radiation.

    No it's two points. The radiation is there constantly there is a formula to work out the risk, thirty metres away and there is no more risk.

    Flashover is a physical and spontaneous effect when the atmospheric conditions can cause a short between lines themselves or any nearby high object, goal posts are a common concern as are temporary cranes and scaffolding, one does not even have to touch HT wires for flash-over to occur.

    The key here is the weather conditions and if the goal posts and the HT wires are within the susceptible limits of each other, flashover will occur occasionally. I don't know about the exact goal post in the Tank Field.


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    #133
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    gbee wrote: »
    No it's two points. The radiation is there constantly there is a formula to work out the risk, thirty metres away and there is no more risk.

    Radiation follows an inverse square law, i.e. doubling the distance halves the exposure. So it would depend on how much radiation was given off by the pylons in question and what the safe level is considered to be to establish a definitive distance. At the moment there is no legislation covering this, which is why I have pylons behind my house - I would prefer they were not there. Anyway the school itself will be a GAA pitch away from the pylons, which is well in excess of 30 metres.
    gbee wrote: »
    Flashover is a physical and spontaneous effect when the atmospheric conditions can cause a short between lines themselves or any nearby high object, goal posts are a common concern as are temporary cranes and scaffolding, one does not even have to touch HT wires for flash-over to occur.

    The key here is the weather conditions and if the goal posts and the HT wires are within the susceptible limits of each other, flashover will occur occasionally. I don't know about the exact goal post in the Tank Field.

    Thank you for the explanation.


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    #134
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 23,339 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    professore wrote: »
    This is not a helpful comment. You know full well that any work like this has to be carried out through the Department of Education for health and safety and insurance reasons.

    What's good for the goose.........
    professore wrote: »
    It was initially supposed to be a lighthearted look at the issue and not to be taken seriously but unfortunately people have no sense of humour when it comes to this issue.

    I'm sure someone wiping down a mouldy wall wouldn't be too much of an issue with insurance and health and safety though.


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    #135
    gbee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,388 ✭✭✭gbee


    The mould can be very dangerous, and it should be washed awY and painted over to seal in The pores.

    A Biblical tale about death, which I can't remember, one of the Egyptian plagues, was considered to be caused by the black mould.

    I'd be washing it off anyway, if it's the black stuff, wash and paint and the paint does not have to match.


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    #136
    TanG411
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,836 ✭✭✭TanG411


    gbee wrote: »
    The mould can be very dangerous, and it should be washed awY and painted over to seal in The pores.

    A Biblical tale about death, which I can't remember, one of the Egyptian plagues, was considered to be caused by the black mould.

    I'd be washing it off anyway, if it's the black stuff, wash and paint and the paint does not have to match.

    The mould can be cleaned off with a brillo pad, hot soapy water, and some elbow grease. No need for the Dept. of Education or any Health and Safety officers.

    Maybe it can be a volunteer project? :) Get some people to paint the walls afterwards as well.


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    #137
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    RoverJames wrote: »
    What's good for the goose.........

    Touché.


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    #138
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    TML91 wrote: »
    The mould can be cleaned off with a brillo pad, hot soapy water, and some elbow grease. No need for the Dept. of Education or any Health and Safety officers.

    Maybe it can be a volunteer project? :) Get some people to paint the walls afterwards as well.

    Yes it can of course, and is on a regular basis by the school staff. Without some serious remedial works it will be an ongoing project though, as they are damp through.

    Issues such as one bathroom for the whole school and serious overcrowding , freezing conditions in winter and boiling in summer due to poor insulation can't be solved like this though unfortunately.

    I am not sure about painting, as the prefabs are rented, surely this would have to be cleared by the owner of the prefabs?

    Planning has been applied for in the meantime to build a second story on the prefabs - something I have never heard of in my life before.

    What are we paying taxes for????? There are better facilities in third world countries.


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    #139
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    Someone has made up a model of what the school will look like in 2020:

    153416.jpg


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    #140
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 23,339 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    professore wrote: »
    I am not sure about painting, as the prefabs are rented, surely this would have to be cleared by the owner of the prefabs?

    Surely whoever owns them has to maintain them?


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    #141
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    RoverJames wrote: »
    Surely whoever owns them has to maintain them?

    I would have thought so.


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    #142
    florodon2
    Registered Users Posts: 28 ✭florodon2


    Hope this thread is still 'live'. Some interesting contributions in this thread. Will add my own, if the thread is 'live'.


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    #143
    TanG411
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,836 ✭✭✭TanG411


    florodon2 wrote: »
    Hope this thread is still 'live'. Some interesting contributions in this thread. Will add my own, if the thread is 'live'.

    The thread is still open, so no reason why you can't contribute. :)


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    #144
    gbee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,388 ✭✭✭gbee


    I forgot about this thread. Some may have seen in the Evening Echo a few weeks back that the Gaelscoil had been offered sites at tinkers Cross and the Mayfield Community School Grounds, this being the 'preferred' choice of the City Council.

    Some €100,000 spent on planning applications when they were told they won't get planning on their existing site and the initial deal was for two years only.


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    #145
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    gbee wrote: »
    I forgot about this thread. Some may have seen in the Evening Echo a few weeks back that the Gaelscoil had been offered sites at tinkers Cross and the Mayfield Community School Grounds, this being the 'preferred' choice of the City Council.

    Some €100,000 spent on planning applications when they were told they won't get planning on their existing site and the initial deal was for two years only.

    If you read back through the thread you will find real evidence to show that everything you have said above is wrong.


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    #146
    gbee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,388 ✭✭✭gbee


    professore wrote: »
    If you read back through the thread you will find real evidence to show that everything you have said above is wrong.

    No, it was confirmed to me by the current Lord Mayor. If this is worng then the City Council have it wrong.


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    #147
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    gbee wrote: »
    No, it was confirmed to me by the current Lord Mayor. If this is worng then the City Council have it wrong.
    In 2005 Cork city councillors decided to sell at an agreed price, and subject to planning, a 2.3 acre portion of the 11-acre Tank Field site [ to the Department of Education, which had sought planning permission for a new building for the Gaelscoil.

    Councillors voted 15-13 in late 2007 to rezone a portion of the site to allow the school project to proceed but because a two-thirds majority was needed, the rezoning did not go ahead. In April 2008 An Bord Pleanála granted planning permission for the school.

    This is a direct quote from the Evening Echo article. Also uploaded are various attempts from the school to have alternative sites approved over several years and with the rejection letters.

    Talk is cheap. I have learned over the years that politicians will tell you what they think you want to hear. Whether it is actually true or not is irrelevant.


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    #148
    florodon2
    Registered Users Posts: 28 ✭florodon2


    First thoughts: Is it true that the Gaelscoil requires 2.56 acres? I had to look at the Dept of Education site to see what they say about buildings and sites. According to the Dept of Education Guidelines for School Site Area Analysis, the size is calculated on a 2 storey building with 16 Classrooms. This is available on the website of the Dept, Document TGD-025 Page 6. This states that the site required is between 2.56 and 3.70 acres. According to another document from the same site, Document Building Location & Orientation TGD-020 page 15, "Allowance for future building and external expansion must be at least 33%." As I read it, the Gaelscoil requires 2.56 acres, plus 33%, and that equals 3.41 acres in total. This is the minimum the school requires. That 3.41 acres would certainly prevent Brian Dillons Club having enough space for a full sized pitch. I wonder if the players and their parents of Brian Dillons Club realise that they could lose their pitch?


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    #149
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    florodon2 wrote: »
    First thoughts: Is it true that the Gaelscoil requires 2.56 acres? I had to look at the Dept of Education site to see what they say about buildings and sites. According to the Dept of Education Guidelines for School Site Area Analysis, the size is calculated on a 2 storey building with 16 Classrooms. This is available on the website of the Dept, Document TGD-025 Page 6. This states that the site required is between 2.56 and 3.70 acres. According to another document from the same site, Document Building Location & Orientation TGD-020 page 15, "Allowance for future building and external expansion must be at least 33%." As I read it, the Gaelscoil requires 2.56 acres, plus 33%, and that equals 3.41 acres in total. This is the minimum the school requires. That 3.41 acres would certainly prevent Brian Dillons Club having enough space for a full sized pitch. I wonder if the players and their parents of Brian Dillons Club realise that they could lose their pitch?

    Can you provide a link? Thanks


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    #150
    florodon2
    Registered Users Posts: 28 ✭florodon2


    Still new to boards, and don't know how to upload jpg or the like. Dept of Education link is as follows, just go down to TGD-20 and TGD -25. http://www.education.ie/home/home.jsp?maincat=&pcategory=17216&ecategory=54380&sectionpage=12251&language=EN&link=link001&page=1&doc=50432


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    #151
    florodon2
    Registered Users Posts: 28 ✭florodon2


    Found some links which might be of help to others also. This is to Cork City Council

    http://planning.corkcity.ie/InternetEnquiry/rpt_ViewApplicDetails.asp?validFileNum=1&app_num_file=1134819


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