Suikoden II

Smellyirishman

So after people constantly telling me to pick this up I finally relented after seeing Retr0gamer hit it up as his number 1 game. I've been playing it for the past week after work, and had a marathon run this weekend.

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****Spoilers from here on in, otherwise this entire thread would be totally greyed out. If you haven't played, go and do so, reading this will probably ruin everything for you.****

***




Loved the game, it was such a refreshing break from the regular "modern day" games that I have been playing for the last while. Your hand was never gripped too tightly and you were genuinely on your own at times, and it was great. My "dumbed down" mind was not totally able for it though, I didn't get the hints through-out the game and was left with Ending 1 which left a slightly sour taste in my mouth as I was almost as bad as Luca Blight at that stage!

Of course, I did some reading after finishing the game and found out about all the other endings, which did cheer me up (Yeay, Nanami is alive!) but I was still kinda disappointed having seen the worst ending first . If only I had known! Even when I saw the ending "fin" screen with Jowy waiting at the "stone of promise" I thought... wouldn't it be cool if we did meet up there again... (And I had been thinking it all the way through the game >.<) It didn't even dawn on me to go and check...even after finding his empty clothes on the throne, and the general saying that you could reunite the two runes. Duuur

It's too late to go back now because I'd have to play through it all again to get the 108 stars (I probably should have done some research before playing but didn't want to spoil anything) and I just don't have the time. The ending really let me down I think. You might argue that it was a good portrayal of the grim side of war, but I wanted my happy ending! I knew it was in there somewhere, I was just too thick to get it! I did reload afterwards and get the second ending though, which was much more satisfying, although much more depressingly sad! , I guess I'm just annoyed that I didn't think of it first! (My mind was slightly fried after about 6 hours non-stop RPGing)

I also realised just how deep the game is once I was reading afterwards, with all the typical RPG mini-games that go on and the music/window collecting (I did get some windows, but didn't know WTF they were for). I missed out on a lot of that though, because I was hurrying through the storyline (and royally f**king it up as I went ). I do feel inclined to give it another go though now, with a walk-through for all the stars so I can get the ending, it's just a matter of time.

I don't know why I'm writing this, and I apologise for the sloppy writing, gotta run, but maybe we'll get some good conversation out of it? I'd love to hear all of your opinions on the game.

Would you recommend any of the other games? I know there is some semblance between the prequels and sequels, but it doesn't follow the same heroes right? I saw Retro's review on Suikoden IV (but didn't fully read in case of spoilers), seems like a decent followup.

Raskolnikov

I acutually prefer Suikoden 1 to be honest! Not enough that I didn't sell my copy for £60 though

steviec

Suikoden 1 was good, very short by comparison though but that can be a good thing from the point of view of getting through it.

Suikoden 3 was also good, it wasn't released in Europe though so you have to go through a lot of hassle to get it running on a PS2 (cost me a fortune) - 3 took a very different approach by splitting between three main characters before eventually giving you the choice which one to play as towards the end. I enjoyed it, it had some major difficulty spikes though, but that may have just been how I levelled my party.

I never played 4, had enough people warn me off it to not bother trying. 5 is great however. I haven't completed it yet but will eventually get round to it - unfortunately uni work got in the way of me finishing it last time. Really enjoyed what I've played of 5 though, it's very much up to the second game's standard in terms of story so far at least.

Retr0gamer

I can die happy now knowing I made at least 1 person experience this wonderful games.

Suikoden 1 is a great game but storywise it's a little simple compared to the rest most of the series. The best thing about it is that a lot of the characters return for Suikoden 2 and a lot of the younger members a re now grown up. You missed a little of Suikoden 2's charm by playing it first especially a scene right near the beginning of that game.

Suikoden 3 was very good as well. The way you could play 3 different characters was handled well and the story was quite good. There was also a really big surprise that wasn't to be missed if you got all 108 stars of destiny. The only problem I had with it was the poor handling of the major battles and it wasn't as epic as other games in the series.

Suikoden IV I couldn't recommend unless you are a die hard fan of the series. The story isn't great, neither are the characters and most annoying of all is the ridiculous random encounter rate especially on the ship which moves torturously slow. Even fans of the series won't enjoy it.

Suikoden V really is a fabulous game. It starts off really slowly but it's worth sticking this out because after about 5 hours into the game it really takes off with a bang. The story is excellent, almost Suikoden 2 standard and it has some really good characters. My only real problem is that it was so close to being the classic Suikoden 2 was. It just doesn't have the brutality of Suikoden 2 and it would have benefitted from a more evil bad guy like Luca Blight.

Spoilers for Suikoden 2 follow, don't say I didn't warn you:

As for Suikoden 2, I just thought it was a fabulous game. I actually preferred the bad ending to the good one since it was more in line with the tone of the game, still even the good ending is very depressing. It's hard watching the credit sequence after finishing the game.

Thought Nanami's death was handled very well in the game. I love how just before the battle that claimed her life she goes to see you alone and breaks down asking you to run away with her. It even gives you the option to run away which leads to another ending were you do. It makes you feel a little responsible for her death.

And then there is Luca Blight, what a fabulous bad guy he was. Absolutely cruel and ruthles, and that 'Die Pig!' scene was excellent. It's a shame that some of his backstory was cut from the Western versions since it was too disturbing. Basically Luca Blight when he was 5 or 6 went to a peace conference with his family at Muse and on the way back they were attacked by City State troops disguised as Bandits. His father the king escaped but Luca and His mother were captured. Luca had to watch while the bandits raped his mother before Highland troops arrived to rescue them. It's why he hated the City States so much and also his father who he blamed the incident on for running away. It also explains his hostility towards his Sister since she was born because of the rape and reminds him constantly of it. He says to her during the game that he would kill her if she didn't remind him so much of his mother. He's a genocidal nutjob but you really feel sorry for him and admire his military strength.

I could go on and on about this game but I'll leave it there for now.

Smellyirishman

Retr0gamer wrote:

Spoilers for Suikoden 2 follow, don't say I didn't warn you:

As for Suikoden 2, I just thought it was a fabulous game. I actually preferred the bad ending to the good one since it was more in line with the tone of the game, still even the good ending is very depressing. It's hard watching the credit sequence after finishing the game.

And then there is Luca Blight, what a fabulous bad guy he was. Absolutely cruel and ruthles, and that 'Die Pig!' scene was excellent. It's a shame that some of his backstory was cut from the Western versions since it was too disturbing. Basically Luca Blight when he was 5 or 6 went to a peace conference with his family at Muse and on the way back they were attacked by City State troops disguised as Bandits. His father the king escaped but Luca and His mother were captured. Luca had to watch while the bandits raped his mother before Highland troops arrived to rescue them. It's why he hated the City States so much and also his father who he blamed the incident on for running away. It also explains his hostility towards his Sister since she was born because of the rape and reminds him constantly of it. He says to her during the game that he would kill her if she didn't remind him so much of his mother. He's a genocidal nutjob but you really feel sorry for him and admire his military strength.

I could go on and on about this game but I'll leave it there for now.

I think the 2nd ending with no return of Nanami is probably the best in terms of the overall storyline.

That information on Luca is brilliant, thanks for that, shame they took it out. Looks like I will have to check out some of the other iterations while I'm at it.

Retr0gamer

I command you to play Panzer Dragoon Saga next!

Smellyirishman

Retr0gamer wrote:

I command you to play Panzer Dragoon Saga next!

Yes Sir! (Actually, maybe that was your number one, was it? Although I have just started on a FFVII re-run in memory of my childhood)

I was going to do PDS in time, but SII was the easier one to "get my hands on" and I had heard more about it.

Retr0gamer

It depends on what mood I'm in. Currently I'm in a very panzer dragoon mood.

Zapp Brannigan

So Suikoden V gets good? I played it and I got to some sort of town that was on water and I just gave up. I was so bored with the game.
Is it gonna get better and more importantly should I rebuy the game (I traded it in)

LanceStorm

i cannot speak highly enough of the series, suikoden 1 was the first game i bought for the playstation when it came out and ill always have a special place in my gaming heart for it!! the 'death of gremio' had me in tears as a kid...

i recently re-played suikoden 2 thanks to the wonder of Roms and it still stands the test of time!! gameplay will always triumph over graphics!!

which is never more true than with 4, my god, it was awful, just awful, and i would consider myself a diehard fan of the series!! ive never cared less about a main character in all my life, and especially the design, shorts??!

my question however is where did you get your hands on 5??

Retr0gamer

Zapp Brannigan wrote:

So Suikoden V gets good? I played it and I got to some sort of town that was on water and I just gave up. I was so bored with the game.
Is it gonna get better and more importantly should I rebuy the game (I traded it in)

Yes, it gets a hell of a lot better. The prologue is very long and can be a bit boring but it does set the backstory for the rest of the game. You are just at the very start of the game. When you least expect it the game takes a sudden unexpected twist. I found the start dull as well but I read the reviews beforehand and they all said that it was worth waiting out the dull prologue. They were right, when the action kicks off it really does kick off with a bang and in the space of 20 minutes its suddenly no longer a boring court life but a story of war, vengeance, friendship and redemption on par with Suikoden 2. It's definitely worth sticking out until you at least get your suikoden trademark castle at the very least. Before then you will be hooked.

Zapp Brannigan

Ok cool you've convinced me. I'll have a look for it in work and see about giving it another go.

Sephiroth_dude

i have either suikoden 4 or 5 i cant remember now,but i stopped playing it half way through i got so bored.Im currently trying to get a copy of either suikoden 1,2 or 3 but any online store i've looked in there all to damn expensive heck there charging 86 quid for star ocean on amazon

Zapp Brannigan

Picked it up in work for 15 euro, will launch it to it today. lost my save so I'm starting from the beginning

Retr0 if I don't like it, I'm coming after you.

LanceStorm

but where exactly did you get it??

Zapp Brannigan

Game in Blanchardstown SC. There's only one left though.

Sephiroth_dude

For all ye rpg fans out there go to this site www.rpgdreamers.com and check all the reviews they've down on all the oldschool rpgs and ps2 rpgs,you'll never buy a bad rpg again AND ITS suikoden 5 that i have so im gonna launch into that tonight maybe

Sephiroth_dude

Smellyirishman wrote:

So after people constantly telling me to pick this up I finally relented after seeing Retr0gamer hit it up as his number 1 game. I've been playing it for the past week after work, and had a marathon run this weekend.

***

****Spoilers from here on in, otherwise this entire thread would be totally greyed out. If you haven't played, go and do so, reading this will probably ruin everything for you.****

***




Loved the game, it was such a refreshing break from the regular "modern day" games that I have been playing for the last while. Your hand was never gripped too tightly and you were genuinely on your own at times, and it was great. My "dumbed down" mind was not totally able for it though, I didn't get the hints through-out the game and was left with Ending 1 which left a slightly sour taste in my mouth as I was almost as bad as Luca Blight at that stage!

Of course, I did some reading after finishing the game and found out about all the other endings, which did cheer me up (Yeay, Nanami is alive!) but I was still kinda disappointed having seen the worst ending first . If only I had known! Even when I saw the ending "fin" screen with Jowy waiting at the "stone of promise" I thought... wouldn't it be cool if we did meet up there again... (And I had been thinking it all the way through the game >.<) It didn't even dawn on me to go and check...even after finding his empty clothes on the throne, and the general saying that you could reunite the two runes. Duuur

It's too late to go back now because I'd have to play through it all again to get the 108 stars (I probably should have done some research before playing but didn't want to spoil anything) and I just don't have the time. The ending really let me down I think. You might argue that it was a good portrayal of the grim side of war, but I wanted my happy ending! I knew it was in there somewhere, I was just too thick to get it! I did reload afterwards and get the second ending though, which was much more satisfying, although much more depressingly sad! , I guess I'm just annoyed that I didn't think of it first! (My mind was slightly fried after about 6 hours non-stop RPGing)

I also realised just how deep the game is once I was reading afterwards, with all the typical RPG mini-games that go on and the music/window collecting (I did get some windows, but didn't know WTF they were for). I missed out on a lot of that though, because I was hurrying through the storyline (and royally f**king it up as I went ). I do feel inclined to give it another go though now, with a walk-through for all the stars so I can get the ending, it's just a matter of time.

I don't know why I'm writing this, and I apologise for the sloppy writing, gotta run, but maybe we'll get some good conversation out of it? I'd love to hear all of your opinions on the game.

Would you recommend any of the other games? I know there is some semblance between the prequels and sequels, but it doesn't follow the same heroes right? I saw Retro's review on Suikoden IV (but didn't fully read in case of spoilers), seems like a decent followup.

where did you manage to pick this up?

Smellyirishman

Sephiroth_dude wrote:

where did you manage to pick this up?

<.<

>.>

*cough*

Sephiroth_dude

Smellyirishman wrote:

<.<

>.>

*cough*

come on,out with it :P

Just tryed amazon there and they were charging between 80 and 235 quid for it :O and they dont deliver games to ireland anymore :O

Smellyirishman

Sephiroth_dude wrote:

come on,out with it :P

I'd rather not be banned.

Zapp Brannigan

Retr0, good call!
This game finally got going after 5 hours or so. What a shocker

Arshtat and Ferid, dead!

Retr0gamer

Suikoden games never really start until you get your own castle. That bit was a shocker. That's not the end of the shocking revelations though

Smellyirishman

Oh no! What is it?

Damn! I must finish FF7 ASAP and play the remaining Suikoden! (After I finish PDS )

Retr0gamer

Screw FFVII. Panzer Dragoon Saga takes a dump from an almighty height all over it.

Smellyirishman

Sorry Retro, it's too late, once I'v popped, I just can't stop. Plus, FF7 is bringing back some crazy nostalgia.

LanceStorm

ahhh i really wanna play V now!! im heading off for a few months in 2 weeks time, if i ordered it now id have it in about 3-4 days, could i finish it in about a week??

Sephiroth_dude

i doubt it....its a big enough game apparently........unless you play it non stop for a few days :P