*New* UCD CAR PARKING POLICY

Vorsprung

Anyone know if this will stop me dropping the car at Belfield and then walking down to Vincent's? I do that about once a week when I've got evening lectures up there or if I'm planning on studying there.

Cheers!

dajaffa

bigjimthefirst wrote:

Anyone know if this will stop me dropping the car at Belfield and then walking down to Vincent's? I do that about once a week when I've got evening lectures up there or if I'm planning on studying there.

Cheers!

If you have a valid student card you'll be fine, otherwise it'd depend on the car park attendant.

Red Alert

You realise he'll make people pay for the in-car meters too?

dajaffa

Red Alert wrote:

You realise he'll make people pay for the in-car meters too?

Yep, 30 yoyos a pop

machiavellianme

Why are people so against this? Nobody has a god given right to free parking.
If you go to shopping centres/town etc you have to pay. Whats the difference here? Students dont own UCD. Nor do staff. The same way Tesco dont own Dundrum Shopping Centre but they have the right to charge us for the priviledge of parking on the ground which they lease. UCD can also charge if they see fit. When I started (ten years ago) no such problem existed because very few people had cars. Now nearly everyone seems to have a car and feels they have a right to park on private property. If you dont like the charges, dont park there. Its that simple. I can understand the staff getting upset. They have a valid point that it amounts to 50 cent less per hour in pay, but only if they drive. Granted, many of them need to drive as there may not be public transport available at all times (as needed to check on experiments running in science/engineering etc during the night or for other services).

Red Alert

Superquinn in ballinteer have free parking, Dundrum down the road don't, however I have the choice any day to switch between one and the other. Tesco in Dundrum do not have any say in the running of the car parks, they have an agreement allowing them to give free parking but the centre's management controls the car parks.

UCD is different, the decision to go there is a three/four year time scale, not a daily one. The same way I think it's wrong for hospitals to fleece people who want to be at the side of their loved ones when they're sick or dying.

Ernie Ball

machiavellianme wrote:

Why are people so against this? Nobody has a god given right to free parking.
If you go to shopping centres/town etc you have to pay. Whats the difference here? Students dont own UCD. Nor do staff.

Who does? The administration?

UCD can also charge if they see fit.

Who is 'UCD'?

Can the administration unilaterally decide to reduce the wages of all staff? I don't think so.

Students have less of a case. Especially since it's an absolute certainty that a large proportion of them are driving in from Foxrock, Donnybrook, Dundrum and the like...

Ernie Ball

Red Alert wrote:

UCD is different, the decision to go there is a three/four year time scale, not a daily one. The same way I think it's wrong for hospitals to fleece people who want to be at the side of their loved ones when they're sick or dying.

You know, there'd be less incentive for the administration to misplace its priorities in this way if students were paying fees, as they should.

dajaffa

Ernie Ball wrote:

You know, there'd be less incentive for the administration to misplace its priorities in this way if students were paying fees, as they should.

The whole reason behind the potential introduction of parking fees to UCD is to disincentivise people from parking there and to use other forms of transport to get to college. It's not a money making exercise, or at least it's not intended to be (I think that if it becomes profitable the unions want the money ring fenced for improving transport facilities in the college). Basically if the car parks were half empty and there was no problem getting parking, this wouldn't be on the table.

Red Alert

But I don't see any extensive lobbying from UCD to the council to be allowed increase car parking, nor do I see any real attempt (such as Student/Staff card operated barriers or license plate readers) at securing the car parks.

If we're really pushed for parking space i'd have no hassle with a restricted days permit system either, as long as it's free. (People who do have very complicated journeys could apply for an all-week pass or similar).

Ernie Ball

dajaffa wrote:

The whole reason behind the potential introduction of parking fees to UCD is to disincentivise people from parking there and to use other forms of transport to get to college. It's not a money making exercise, or at least it's not intended to be

I think that that's a very naive view. If that were the case, there are plenty of ways to disincentivise people from parking (annual permits, for example) that don't also give them disincentives for spending time on campus full stop. The hourly meter scheme has only one advantage over the others: it pulls in much more money.

(I think that if it becomes profitable the unions want the money ring fenced for improving transport facilities in the college). Basically if the car parks were half empty and there was no problem getting parking, this wouldn't be on the table.

Again, I think you're far too charitable to the motives of the current administration. These people are first and foremost about the money, which is why they show more interest in property development than they do in developing the intellectual infrastructure of the college (been to the library lately?).

Ernie Ball

An obvious solution to this false problem, by the way is this:

1) All UCD staff as well as students living outside a certain distance (or travel time, since Dublin Bus is useless) to the college are given free annual permits.

2) Everyone else either goes to the pay and display car parks or gets clamped.

3) If this doesn't solve the problem, expand the radius outside of which free permits are granted.

The investment in manpower/capital is minimal and so is the revenue. Why do you think it's never been proposed?

tywy

Ernie Ball wrote:

An obvious solution to this false problem, by the way is this:

1) All UCD staff as well as students living outside a certain distance (or travel time, since Dublin Bus is useless) to the college are given free annual permits.

2) Everyone else either goes to the pay and display car parks or gets clamped.

3) If this doesn't solve the problem, expand the radius outside of which free permits are granted.

The investment in manpower/capital is minimal and so is the revenue. Why do you think it's never been proposed?

I don't think that's really fair. I live in Terenure, it's not that far from Belfield but takes AGES to get there in the morning so generally I cycle unless I'm sick or injured from sports or something. Now to get the bus would involve getting up super early and sitting on it for 1 hr 20mins instead of driving for 45 minutes maybe in traffic.

So someone who has decent public transport like the DART for example can drive a car over me who has crap public transport and it takes ages.

They can't start charging for parking until there is decent public transport to Belfield that makes driving less attractive.

dajaffa

Ernie Ball wrote:

I think that that's a very naive view. If that were the case, there are plenty of ways to disincentivise people from parking (annual permits, for example) that don't also give them disincentives for spending time on campus full stop. The hourly meter scheme has only one advantage over the others: it pulls in much more money.

It really isn't. They've tried permits before and it wasn't effective, and the reason why they don't want to go down that road is that if it were say €50 everyone would just buy one + it would remain quite likely that the car parks would all be full come 10am in term time. Do you really think the staff unions would accept paid parking if there wasn't a problem there that couldn't be fixed by another method? Imo the reason for the system coming in this year is to eliminate the park-n-riders and see the extent of the shortage when the spaces are occupied only by staff + students (bar the hourly charge car parks)

Ernie Ball

dajaffa wrote:

It really isn't. They've tried permits before and it wasn't effective

It wasn't enforced. That's different from not being effective.

and the reason why they don't want to go down that road is that if it were say €50 everyone would just buy one + it would remain quite likely that the car parks would all be full come 10am in term time.

Not if those living near campus (or on campus) were forbidden to have one. Also, it is false that 'everyone would buy one': simply make the price high enough to hurt.

Of course such a plan discriminates against the less well-off where a plan based on distance does not.

Do you really think the staff unions would accept paid parking if there wasn't a problem there that couldn't be fixed by another method?

I'm afraid I don't understand the question. The staff unions have not accepted and will not accept paid parking for staff. Students, however, will have to look out for themselves.

Imo the reason for the system coming in this year is to eliminate the park-n-riders and see the extent of the shortage when the spaces are occupied only by staff + students (bar the hourly charge car parks)

If that were the case, a free permit system is cheaper than paying actual humans to check IDs on a daily basis.

The reason for this 'system' (it really is far too charitable a word) is that their preferred 'system'--like so much of what they do--was unilaterally decided with no input whatever from the 3 trade unions at UCD. Those unions resisted but the admin still needed to be seen to be doing something, so they pulled this out of . . . the air.

In fact, the admin has been adamant all along that 'park and riders' are not the problem. In this, they may be right. The problem is students, particularly students who live close to campus, driving in on a daily basis (not to mention students who live on campus leaving their cars parked there permanently, for example in the car park next to Belgrove residences).

Ernie Ball

tywy wrote:

I don't think that's really fair. I live in Terenure, it's not that far from Belfield but takes AGES to get there in the morning so generally I cycle unless I'm sick or injured from sports or something. Now to get the bus would involve getting up super early and sitting on it for 1 hr 20mins instead of driving for 45 minutes maybe in traffic.

Did you read what I wrote?:

Ernie Ball wrote:

All UCD staff as well as students living outside a certain distance (or travel time, since Dublin Bus is useless)

dajaffa

Ernie Ball wrote:

Not if those living near campus (or on campus) were forbidden to have one. Also, it is false that 'everyone would buy one': simply make the price high enough to hurt.

I'm afraid I don't understand the question. The staff unions have not accepted and will not accept paid parking for staff. Students, however, will have to look out for themselves.

In fact, the admin has been adamant all along that 'park and riders' are not the problem. In this, they may be right. The problem is students, particularly students who live close to campus, driving in on a daily basis (not to mention students who live on campus leaving their cars parked there permanently, for example in the car park next to Belgrove residences).

People living on-campus should be entitled to park there, that's what the res car park are for. I don't think there's a big problem with them clogging up the other car parks.

An no union has accepted the paid parking, it is not on the cards right now, though it could be in the future. Regarding staff unions, IF the college implemented paid parking in a few years, when there was a proven alternative and it was clearly a money-making exercise they'd kick up a big fuss and possibly halt it. If it was designed to make money UCD would go like UL + charge a set fee for using the car park no matter how long you park there for each day (I think this might be for staff + students only, not too sure)

Sarn

dajaffa wrote:

it would remain quite likely that the car parks would all be full come 10am in term time.

Ultimately this is why I start work at 7.30. Not a problem at all finding a space that early Unfortunately I daren't leave during the day as I'll never find a space later.

The problem with a system that would charge by the hour (as has been mentioned before) is that it would disincentivise students who drive to campus from staying on campus (although an added bonus would be the freeing up of spaces in the library ). Secondly, courses requiring high contact hours on campus (e.g. students with labs) would incur a greater parking charge compared to others.

We'll just have to see how effective the new system will be.

Ernie Ball

dajaffa wrote:

People living on-campus should be entitled to park there, that's what the res car park are for. I don't think there's a big problem with them clogging up the other car parks.

What res car parks? There are car parks near Belgrove and Merville, but those are not 'res car parks', they are simply car parks. Cars parked there belonging to those who live in the residences are taking up space that should be available to commuters.

It should be a condition of residence on campus that one is not allowed to keep a car. There is absolutely no reason why UCD should be providing free permanent car parking space to students who live on campus and therefore have no need for a space in order to get to UCD. The whole point of on-campus housing is that you do not need to commute, therefore you do not need a space. Many US universities have such policies.

An no union has accepted the paid parking, it is not on the cards right now, though it could be in the future. Regarding staff unions, IF the college implemented paid parking in a few years, when there was a proven alternative and it was clearly a money-making exercise they'd kick up a big fuss and possibly halt it. If it was designed to make money UCD would go like UL + charge a set fee for using the car park no matter how long you park there for each day

Do you have any basis at all for these claims? UCD has just attempted to put in place a system that had nothing to do with 'set fees no matter how long you park'. They have shown no sign of even having considered such a system.

Ado86

The fact that there are so many residential spaces in Merville and the other campus accomodations is so stupid, why do people in campus- who dont have any need for a car to get to college get the space without any hassle- yet the people who have to travel for ages to get to college are getting told that they shouldnt drive to college that they should get public transport ??
Last year I commuted for an hour and a half each way- taking up 3 hours of my day- more like wasting 3 hrs a day ! If I was to do it on public transport it would have taken even longer- so there is no incentive for me to go on public transport ? I dont think so.
I wouldnt mind paying for a permit for UCD even if it was a couple of hundred euro, if I was assured that I would have a space in the car park. My course is over a 30 hour week. Is it fair that I would have to pay more as my days are longer ?!?