Sold gf's car, new owner is being awkward

Owen

Sold herself's 98 Starlet on Tuesday night, after a long drawn out advertising period. A couple in their 50's came to me, and thorougly inspected the car, they looked at every sill, under the bonnet, under the boot carpet, drove it, touched and felt the paint, and eventually after haggling, bought the car. They went away happy.

Got a phone call today from the Husband, who wouldn't be the brightest tool in the box, asking why one of the receipts had strange mileage on it. Herself's car has about 33k Miles on it, and one of the receipts was from Advanced Tyres when she got 4 shoes fitted, and the idiot working the PC typed in the wrong mileage. It says 58xxx Miles, and I think there was about 28 on it at the time, so obviously someone hit the 5 on the number pad, instead of a 2. It's a tyre change, and not a service, and even though the mileage is wrong, I thought they'd like to have the receipt. There is a receipt for a full service after that with the correct mileage on it. The husband wouldn't accept my word for it, and said "I'll look into it and I'll be in touch".

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but a private sale is Caveat Emptor, or buyer beware anyway. Do they have any rights in this situation? The car is clearly a low mileage car, the interior is testament to that. It hasn't been clocked, and this is a stupid mistake made by Advance Tyres. I explained the mistake to this guy 4 or 5 times during the course of the call, and also explained that I want to hear no further about it, as it's a private sale, and there was nothing underhanded about the deal. Hell, I even gave them luck money back and filled the tank to look after them.

I'm extremely annoyed by this. Does the guy have the right to reject the sale? I don't think he does ...

cold_filter

ned78 wrote:

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but a private sale is Caveat Emptor, or buyer beware anyway. Do they have any rights in this situation? The car is clearly a low mileage car, the interior is testament to that. It hasn't been clocked, and this is a stupid mistake made by Advance Tyres. I explained the mistake to this guy 4 or 5 times during the course of the call, and also explained that I want to hear no further about it, as it's a private sale, and there was nothing underhanded about the deal. Hell, I even gave them luck money back and filled the tank to look after them.

I'm extremely annoyed by this. Does the guy have the right to reject the sale? I don't think he does ...

He has no come back at all

Anan1

I'm assuming you've been paid for the car? If so, tell him in no uncertain terms what you think of his attitude.

Owen

We've been paid for the car alright, I'm just worried because he knows the Dealership I work for, and if he was a complete a**hole, he could quite easily phone my employers and tell them the story, making life awkward for me, even though it has nothing to do with my work.

prospect

Nope, unless he specifically asked was the car clocked, and you said no, and he can prove it was.

I know it is little conselation now, but when I sell a car privately, I have a little document done up which we both sign and get a copy of. It basically says the cars is now sold as seen and there is no comeback. I have never heard anything back on the 5 or 6 I have sold, although they were all quality cars that were never likely to give grief (a few Renaults a MK1 Corsa and a Alfa to name a few, )

maidhc

ned78 wrote:

I'm extremely annoyed by this. Does the guy have the right to reject the sale? I don't think he does ...

No, he doesn't.

Unlike the situation where a garage passes a car off as "sold as seen", a private buyer purchasing from a private seller must face caveat emptor in all its glory.

You have the money, he has the car, and that is how it is destined to stay.

(Of course he can phone your employer, and it would be awkward... but you can threaten him with defamation if you feel belligerent.... )

Tea drinker

Well, firstly, take a deep breath, it's not worth getting het up about.
At the end of the day, we're only talking about an old starlet.
The guy will probably calm down, he may have OCD or something, just ignore him. Maybe his wife is like I don't the feel of this blah blah yeh yeh annoying. NOT YOUR PROBLEM! There's nothing to stop him getting the AA to look over it, at his cost of course.
I fully understand about the advance tyre thing, they could write anything down.

It's very frustrating trying to reason with a madman, until you figure out that they are mad, and you can say: "ahh that's the problem!"

As regards work, I wouldn't worry too much about it, what you have said sounds reasonable. Like I said at the start, deep breath, don't lose the head and he has nothing to say to the garage.

prospect

Might be no harm to casually mention this to your boss over a cuppa:

"You won't believe what the fella who bought my GF's Starlet is trying to do......"

Then, if he does ring, your Boss will most likely sympathise with him and then politely tell him ito fupp off as it is not the Garages business.

unkel

ned78 wrote:

I'm just worried because he knows the Dealership I work for, and if he was a complete a**hole, he could quite easily phone my employers and tell them the story, making life awkward for me, even though it has nothing to do with my work.

I understand where you're coming from. Of course they have no comeback, but perhaps it is best to continue what you did to prevent escalation: stay polite and play thick - keep giving him the same explanation over and over again and don't entertain any discussion about rejecting the sale / handing money back

C_Breeze

Anan1 wrote:

I'm assuming you've been paid for the car? If so, tell him in no uncertain terms what you think of his attitude.

Oh would u look at that , I agree with anan1!

seamus

You'll find there are people about who are paranoid about everything and everyone and are absolutely determined to not get ripped off. They are a pain in the ass to deal with, and once they have your number, they can be determined to not let it go. This is clearly one of these guys.

It was a private sale, he has no comeback. It was a mistake on the receipt for tyres, anyone would accept that, and any court would accept that.

He can ring your employer all he likes, but any accusations that he makes gives you the right to sue him for defamation. Probably no need to even say that to him, but you are the one in the superior position here.

I would advise that you answer one more call from him. Ignore whatever he says and tell him that the sale is done, you will no longer be answering his calls. He'll piss off quick enough.

unkel

prospect wrote:

Might be no harm to casually mention this to your boss over a cuppa:

"You won't believe what the fella who bought my GF's Starlet is trying to do......"

Clever!

layke

Ned I don't know who you work for but why should your boss care? if I owned a company and some aul lad rang me up I'd ask you what happend and believe you (my employee) before any old randomer.

Also, he can cross check it with the service history (I assume it's log book stamped).

Consumer law says you can return any product within 10 days as long as it's returned in the same condition it was sold (i.e unused). Then again that's a retail law from when i did my service at night during college and i' m not sure if it applies to the car trade or in fact even a 2nd hand sale.

kaizersoze1980

I'll have the same problem when I go to sell my car. Got it NCT'd at 48,000 miles. NCT cert shows mileage as 480,000 :eek:

Owen

layke wrote:

Ned I don't know who you work for but why should your boss care? if I owned a company and some aul lad rang me up I'd ask you what happend and believe you (my employee) before any old randomer.

I wish!

Anan1

C_Breeze wrote:

Oh would u look at that , I agree with anan1!

And it had to be the one time when I was wrong!;) Seriously though, I reckon unkel & prospect's advice is the way to go. Perhaps not as satisfying, but more sensible.

kmick

Next time he rings tell him as far as you are concerned the issue is closed and that if he wants to continue with these 'support calls' you will be forced to block his number if he continues down the mileage route. Don't mention caveat emptor ever again it kinda makes you seem shady. I would not be worried about your work they will not care. If you are going to continue with these support calls I would suggest you tell him he has two/three left and after the next one say now you have 2 left etc until they are gone. Then do not answer any more.

Duckjob

Agree with the other posts. I know as a private buyer you have to be careful not to be ripped off, but some people are a pain in the arse.

If he rings back I would:
- re-affirm that it's a genuine sale and there's nothing underhand going on

- remind him you've already given him an honest explanation to his query

- assuming you presented that receipt for inspection before he bought the car, then I would definitely point out to him that if he had a query with the receipt, then the time to raise it was before, not after the sale.

- firmly tell him the deal is done and the car is genuine.

cormac_byrne

I presume everything about the car is consistent with 33k miles
(except that the tyre change monkey hit the wrong button)

If so, If/when he calls again, tell him you've given him your explanation. If he is still calling you a cheat and a liar, he should contact his solicitor regarding legal action as you have nothing further to say to him and will not be taking the car back.

Also advise him of the National Consumer Agency
and it's website and locall number for reporting clocked cars.

Wish him good luck wasting his time and money pursuing a pointless claim.

http://www.consumerconnect.ie/eng/Learning_Zone/Guides_To_Consumer_Law/Buying_a_Car/



If a private seller has given you information which they know to be false and you are out of pocket as a result, you may be able to take legal action in another court against them. In this situation you may need to seek legal advice.

If you have evidence that a car has been clocked, report this as soon as possible to us on LoCall 1890 432 432, or through our website.

jjbrien

Quick question for you did the car ever go fo an nct? they check and record the milage there by looking at clock on th car and the cars computer. If it has and it matches what you said then your fine and you can show him the nct docs.

gucci

kaizersoze1980 wrote:

I'll have the same problem when I go to sell my car. Got it NCT'd at 48,000 miles. NCT cert shows mileage as 480,000 :eek:

wowser :eek: thats some value you got out of that car!

Kintarō Hattori

I agree with layke Ned.
You have a life outside of the company that you work for. Any boss knows that and it really doesn't matter what you do once your private business dealings are not connected with the company you work for. You sold your own car without involving your company. The individual can ring all he wants, there is nothing your boss can do or say in regards to that. Perhaps just get annoyed that your dealing with weirdo's in the real world.

Relax Ned and as others have said, be polite to this guy, keep telling him the explanation over and over until he see's that you won't be worn down and he will simply get browned off.

BrianD3

Did you explain about the mistake on the receipt *before* you sold the car to him? If not then I can understand him being awkward even if legally he has no comeback in a private sale.

To the people calling him paranoid and a madman - if you were buying a car and while looking through receipts found one with a higher mileage on it would it set off alarm bells. If not, then I would say you are naive. If the seller then tells you that it was because someone pressed 5 instead of 2 on a keyboard would you swallow that without questioning. If you would, again you are naive.

What the buyer has done wrong here is failing to spot the discrepancy before buying the car. But Ned should also have predicted that this could cause a problem and either binned the receipt or explained the situation before selling giving the buyer a choice to walk away and saving everyone hassle.

Duckjob

BrianD3 wrote:

If the seller then tells you that it was because someone pressed 5 instead of 2 on a keyboard would you swallow that without questioning. If you would, again you are naive.

If Ned78 had a chronological series of receipts before and after the tyre one which showed a clear progression of mileage in the order of 28xxx, then in fairness an 8 year old could probably deduce that it was a typo.

layke

gucci wrote:

wowser :eek: thats some value you got out of that car!

Hehe sure for mine the tool who wrote my milage down wrote a 1 instead of a 0 so it now has an extra 100k on the clock. Idiots.

seamus

BrianD3 wrote:

Did you explain about the mistake on the receipt *before* you sold the car to him?

He probably forgot about it. I would.

To the people calling him paranoid and a madman - if you were buying a car and while looking through receipts found one with a higher mileage on it would it set off alarm bells. If not, then I would say you are naive. If the seller then tells you that it was because someone pressed 5 instead of 2 on a keyboard would you swallow that without questioning. If you would, again you are naive.

It would trigger an alarm, but I wouldn't ring the seller. I'd check all of the other documentation, before and after that receipt. If they showed a correct mileage, then I'd drop it. I'm already out of pocket, there's **** all else I can do anyway. Checking out the receipts would be purely satisfying my own curiosity to see if I'd been screwed.

biko

BrianD3 wrote:

Did you explain about the mistake on the receipt *before* you sold the car to him? If not then I can understand him being awkward even if legally he has no comeback in a private sale.

To the people calling him paranoid and a madman - if you were buying a car and while looking through receipts found one with a higher mileage on it would it set off alarm bells. If not, then I would say you are naive. If the seller then tells you that it was because someone pressed 5 instead of 2 on a keyboard would you swallow that without questioning. If you would, again you are naive.

What the buyer has done wrong here is failing to spot the discrepancy before buying the car. But Ned should also have predicted that this could cause a problem and either binned the receipt or explained the situation before selling giving the buyer a choice to walk away and saving everyone hassle.

QFT, the person buying the car might not be as slick a salesman/buyer as some ppl here pertain to be. Ringing back to ask question about an obvious issue after the sale seems a justifiable thing to do. The buyer did not actually say he wanted money back, did he?

Darragh29

Understand your situation there OP. When I started in business I had to deal with this on a regular basis, in particular people automatically distrusting you when you have been honest. I have managed to filter out the few odd customers who you could never please and have been delighted to see them going else where with their business because now they are wasting someone else's time. I had to tell a small number of customers who were at the same sh*te as your man who bought you gf's car, to not come back as they were impossible to please. This raised a few eyebrows at first here amongst staff as it was perceived by some as arrogant and rude. But now that we have a core of extremely good customers who we will bend over backwards for, who actually appreciate the high level of service that we provide, there is a consensus now that we don't have ackward customers because we got rid of the few that we had and now we would see one coming and give the usual excuses to move them on to someone else.

I had to learn the lesson you've learnt, and with a bit of hindsight (which is always a great thing), you'd probably look back and now regret not running with your gut feeling and the fact that they were being so picky with the car when looking at it, feeling paintwork, looking under the bonnet when they probably may as well have been looking into space, spending too long looking at the car, these little things are subtle pointers that suggest that the person is likely ackward to deal with either in the process of agreeing to sell or as you have found out now, subsequent to a sale.

What I'd do to get some relief now is have an extremely abrupt conversation with them face to face and tell them that they have a fu*king neck annoying you any further, you stand over the mileage of the vehicle and that they are an impossible couple to deal with and to never come near you again. Insult them if you have to, if they as much as drop their jaw to your boss, take them to the fu*king cleaners for slander.

I had a customer in here a week or two ago looking for a timing belt done on a Renault Laguna. We had done a service for him on his wife's car, think it was a VW Golf, and even though we valeted & washed the car before delivering it back to him/her (we also collected it for him/her), he appeared to be a bit rude when paying his bill, nothing serious, just handed in a cheque and no thank you very much or kiss my arse or nothing, asked a few stupid questions in a rude manner about the parts we used and were we sure we replaced the parts we were charging him for. He rang up here last week looking for a price for a service & timing belt for his own Laguna. I recognised him from his attitude over the phone and when he said to me, "have any of your mechanics done a timing belt on a Laguna?", I knew it was the same guy. We do timing belts here on Laguna's on a weekly basis, but I didn't feel like I had to justify the experience of my staff to this muppet, so I said "yes, we have loads of experience doing timing belts on Laguna's but unfortunately we are booked up for the next 6 weeks." This job was worth a few hundred Euro to us as he wanted a service as well as a timing belt, but the point I'm making is that no amount of money is worth the hassle and grief a pr*ck like this can bring into your workplace.

With the full benefit of hindsight, you'll likely see a muppet like this coming before he even comes around the corner next time!

Owen

BrianD3 wrote:

Did you explain about the mistake on the receipt *before* you sold the car to him? If not then I can understand him being awkward even if legally he has no comeback in a private sale.

No, as I wasn't aware of it myself. It's her car, and I became aware of it after the sale when the owner brought it to my attention. As I have said, there is a further receipt that shows the most recent mileage at service time and that corresponds with the actual mileage if you were to follow on from that chronologically.

eo980 wrote:

You have a life outside of the company that you work for. Any boss knows that and it really doesn't matter what you do once your private business dealings are not connected with the company you work for. You sold your own car without involving your company. The individual can ring all he wants, there is nothing your boss can do or say in regards to that.

Ideally, that would be the case. Unfortunately, my situation is somewhat different. But I do appreciate the kind words.

jjbrien wrote:

Quick question for you did the car ever go fo an nct?

That's a great idea ... I'll just tell him to call the bloody NCT, the car has a mechanical Odometer, but they'll still have a record of it hopefully.

And lastly, Darragh29, thanks for the great advice, it's very heartening to see others dealing with the same thing!

biko

Darragh29 wrote:

What I'd do to get some relief now is have an extremely abrupt conversation with them face to face and tell them that they have a fu*king neck annoying you any further, you stand over the mileage of the vehicle and that they are an impossible couple to deal with and to never come near you again. Insult them if you have to, if they as much as drop their jaw to your boss, take them to the fu*king cleaners for slander.

I hope you're not located in Galway because I'm looking for a car and tbh you come across like a bit of a cnut.

Ned, the mileage is a bit of a hassle but as it was an honest mistake by the garage nothing can come from it. You're well covered.

cormac_byrne

ned78 wrote:

That's a great idea ... I'll just tell him to call the bloody NCT, the car has a mechanical Odometer, but they'll still have a record of it hopefully.

http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/motors/2005/1207/1132330272721.html

"The National Car Test service does record a vehicle's mileage at every test but it will not share that information, even with a dealer or private buyer looking to check the mileage of a questionable car"