Liverpool Rumours And General Discussion 2007/2008

Attractive Nun

Definitely. Drogba is a better player IMO, and Rooney is on a similar level, but on current form Torres is by far the best in the league.

Mr Alan

Personally think Drogba and Torres are similar quality but that Rooney is a level below to be honest. Always thinks he is a little over-rated.

Helix

Mr Alan wrote: »

hold on a second mate, Liverpool won the CL in 2005 and the FA cup in 2006, we were also in the CL final again last year. We have a top chance in the CL again this year as well as the FA cup. Hardly past glories.

look at the state the club is currently in

and compare all the money that has been spent in the benitez era to the league postitions at the end of each season

yis cant afford the new stadium, every day there are rumours coming out that the manager is about to be sacked/quit/join a spanish club/isnt talking to the owners/owners arent talking to him, the rotation system is a shambles, the players range from looking disinterested nobodies to worldbeaters from week to week, the only consistency is in dropping points to teams below you etc etc etc

Helix

Chucky the tree wrote: »

LOL. Please become a bookie?

its a draw for me i reckon

Mr Alan

Helix wrote: »

look at the state the club is currently in

and compare all the money that has been spent in the benitez era to the league postitions at the end of each season

yis cant afford the new stadium, every day there are rumours coming out that the manager is about to be sacked/quit/join a spanish club/isnt talking to the owners/owners arent talking to him, the rotation system is a shambles, the players range from looking disinterested nobodies to worldbeaters from week to week, the only consistency is in dropping points to teams below you etc etc etc

We've been third the last 2 seasons.

I'm not sure if we can afford the new stadium (either are you), i am not their bank manager. But i do know that if they cant afford it, they will most likely sell to DIC, who can definately afford it.

Newspaper talk?! See the link i left a couple of pages back with Balague talking about all the speculation.

The owners issued a statement after their meeting with Rafa saying that they back him totally and that he is going nowhere. Rafa constantly re-affirms his dedication to the club. And they have just spent a record sum on a defender for Liverpool on a player that Rafa wanted. Yet you choose to believe stories you read in the NOTW instead.

I agree our performances are not good or consistant enough.

Villain

I've said it before but I'll say it again, Rafa is a great great manager in Europe, in the premier league he just doesn't get it and if he hasn't got it by now I don't think he will.

Stky10

The-Rigger wrote: »

Ray Houghton: 'Voronin was a real bad buy'.

:rolleyes:

Good man Ray, he was free.

Still way too expensive for what we've got. It shows up again that pre-season friendlys mean absolutely nothing in evaluating players and teams.

BTW its almost exactly a year ago the knives were out for Rafa when we got knocked out of both cups within 3 days by Arsenal. Ended up in the champions league final by year end, and he was thought a genius again.

We're not as bad as made out to be, but something needs to be done to the players who's level of performance lately has been just pi$$ poor.

_blank_

Stky10 wrote: »

but something needs to be done to the players who's level of performance lately has been just pi$$ poor.

It's up to the manager to get the performance from the players.

If the manager cannot get the performances on a regular basis, in the league, then it's time for him to go unfortunately.

It's all well and good getting through to the final of the CL every second year, but now Liverpool are in real danger of not even qualifying for that competition if their league performances don't pick up.

Mr Alan

Des, just out of curiousity, do you think Rafa should get the sack?

_blank_

Mr Alan wrote: »

Des, just out of curiousity, do you think Rafa should get the sack?

If I was the Liverpool chairman I would be seriously considering that option, yes.

As someone else said, I think Rafa just doesn't "get" English football at all.

I don't know why.

If I was Liverpool Chairman I'd be talking to Mourinho and Hiddink, see if one of them would take the job, if either of them said they'd take it, then I'd have Rafa gone.

And you know what? It doesn't matter what "style" José plays, he knows how to win the Premiership, and that is what Liverpool Football Club needs to do, and soon, because Utd are going to win it this season, and then it'll be 18-17.

Liverpool won't win the title under Rafa. If they are happy enough with CL Final appearances every second year, then keep Rafa, if they want the title, get someone else in. Someon who knows how to win the Premiership. Not La Liga, The Premiership.

Chong

Question to Mr Alan:

How much do you and pool fans alike want the premier league?

You prob have said somewhere back , but I am too lazy.

Also do you really think Rafa is the man to bring a premier league title?

Chong

My last post makes it look Mr Alan is a pool spokesman.

_blank_

Is this Rafa's third or fourth season?

Either way, he hasn't brought in the right players to win the league with.

That in itself is an indictment of the man.

I like Rafa, he's a genuine bloke, but he'll never win the Premiership.

Now, Jaws is on, do I watch this or go to the pub?

_blank_

Willstev wrote: »

My last post makes it look Mr Alan is a pool spokesman.

He thinks he is tbh:)

HashSlinging

Des how long did it take united to win the league... 26 long years.. gotta put things in perspective man. I dont know how long it took abromavich to buy the league but it wasnt done the year he put pen to paper.

We should be looking at qualifying straight for the champions league, this year if we got second place I'd be over the moon, winning the thing it was never gonna happen.

United are on a roll at the moment. At Liverpool we are getting our first team regulars back after a bad stint so I think we should be in a good position for second place.

Chong

I hope your not implying DesF is a Man Yoo Fan.

Des as a Man U fan, one can but dream.

Dr Galen

i'll give ya my answer.....

How much do you and pool fans alike want the premier league?

more than anything else. The CL etc have been great magic nights but for me the league is what we NEED to win. Its always been the staple of the club, success in the league, its the sign of a consistantly high performing team.

Also do you really think Rafa is the man to bring a premier league title

if u had of asked this during the summer after Torres signed I'd have said yes definitely. Now i'm not so sure. I'm having doubts. It might have taken Utd years to win the league under Fergie but you could see he had the right ideas and more or less knew what he had to do to win it. I'm beginning to doubt if Rafa does. In the CL there is little doubt that he is the man, but his methods don't seem to click too well with the premier league. We seem to have reached a plateau, and i don't know if Rafa can bridge that gap that appears to be widening between us and the other 3 big four teams

_blank_

HashSlinging wrote: »

Des how long did it take united to win the league... 26 long years.. gotta put things in perspective man. I dont know how long it took abromavich to buy the league but it wasnt done the year he put pen to paper.

Hmm, point taken, fair enough. It took Ferguson, what, seven years to win the title?

Fair point I suppose.
There's a "but" coming. Wait for it

HashSlinging wrote: »

We should be looking at qualifying straight for the champions league, this year if we got second place I'd be over the moon, winning the thing it was never gonna happen
.

Wait a minute, I could find posts from June/July/August/September/October/November/December/January maybe, from 'pool fans, claiming that Liverpool would win the title this season.

Now, you are entitled to your own opinion, of course, but the majority of Liverpool posters in here, and even some 'pool fans I know in real life, were staunchly of the opinion that they would win the title in '07/'08.

HashSlinging wrote: »

United are on a roll at the moment, we are getting our first team regulars back after a bad stint so I think we should be in a good position for second place.

Look, everyone, please don't take this comment as being trollish, I don't mean it to be in the slightest.

Second place? This is delusional imo. Arsenal and Utd are way ahead of Liverpool, at least two years in terms of talent, bedding in and maybe even attractiveness for the "best" players.

Oh yeah, the "but".

You see, Liverpool expect to win titles. Why, I don't know. History, tradition yadda yadda, whatever it is. Right now, they are struggling to qualify for the CL, never mind winning a title. We are two and a half seasons away from it being twenty years since Liverpool won a title. They aren't, imo, going to win it with Rafa at the helm, so if they want to

1. Win it again before that milestone
2. Stop their arch rivals equaling and bettering their record

They will have to get someone in who can win the league.



Look, it looks like I've been taking a dump on Liverpool all day ffs, I'm not.

HashSlinging

Off with his head so. Anyway back to reality, we have a crap defence atm, which at great expense has been strengthened, I really think the bigger picture is going to be good , im not playing the "support rafa or else" brigade, but things could be a lot worse, and I think fans mouthing off about sacking rafa should look at newcaslte for evidence of what the worst case of "fan power" can achieve...nothing

Mr Alan

DesF wrote: »

Either way, he hasn't brought in the right players to win the league with.

reina,alonso,mascherano,lucas,arbeloa,torres,babel....do you not think Liverpool could win the PL with these players if they strenghtened again in the summer?

DesF wrote: »

but he'll never win the Premiership.

how do you know?

DesF wrote: »

Now, Jaws is on, do I watch this or go to the pub?

Jaws....hands down. Not going out, is the new going out.

SteM

Mr Alan wrote: »

reina,alonso,mascherano,lucas,arbeloa,torres,babel....do you not think Liverpool could win the PL with these players if they strenghtened again in the summer?

The problem with this thinking is that you are expecting the other 3 teams ahead of Liverpool to not strengthen.

Mr Alan wrote: »

Jaws....hands down. Not going out, is the new going out.

Seconded!

Mr Alan

DesF wrote: »

Wait a minute, I could find posts from June/July/August/September/October/November/December/January maybe, from 'pool fans, claiming that Liverpool would win the title this season.

Des, you as much as anyone who uses these boards know the nature of football. and i am sure there was a lot of people (incl myself) who thought that Liverpool had a chance at winning the title this year, but as fans, that is our right! no one said,"oh liverpool are gonna win the title this year, easy money". wat people may have been saying is, "this could be Liverpools year"(never heard that before!) and if our home form was better, it could've been, but it hasnt been. but if we cant hope wat else are we meant to do!? why bother!?

DesF wrote: »

Second place? This is delusional imo. Arsenal and Utd are way ahead of Liverpool, at least two years in terms of talent, bedding in and maybe even attractiveness for the "best" players.

Liverpool have finished above arsenal the last two years, wengers policy of buying, nearly exclusively, the best youth from around the world seems to be paying dividends, BUT, they still have yet to win something at all, and have not won a trophy in wat? 4 years? would Rafa have been given the same luxury of that time?

I still think we will finish closer to the leaders this year than we did last.

DesF wrote: »

You see, Liverpool expect to win titles. Why, I don't know. History, tradition yadda yadda, whatever it is. Right now, they are struggling to qualify for the CL, never mind winning a title. We are two and a half seasons away from it being twenty years since Liverpool won a title. They aren't, imo, going to win it with Rafa at the helm, so if they want to.

Liverpool expect to win things because, consistantly we have been winning things.

I heard a stat not long ago saying something like, in the last ten years, no club from the major leagues in the world has won more trophies than Liverpool. So lets not pretend we are ****ing newcastle or something, Christ we won the CL in 2005 and very nearly again in 2007, we are a quality team. The only setback is, we havent won the league in so long, and its the one the fans want. there is question marks over whether or not Rafa can win the title, and there will remain to be until the day he lifts it.

So the question is, do we give the man who made us a force in Europe again, more time to deliver the ultimate prize (for us anyway), i still think we should unless there is a noticable decline in the way things are going for us.

lpool2k05

To be honest im sick to death of watching liverpool!!their dreadful!!We defo need a change of management and new ideas because the players dont give their all under rafa and where the hell is crouch????????????

_blank_

Mr Alan wrote: »

reina,alonso,mascherano,lucas,arbeloa,torres,babel....do you not think Liverpool could win the PL with these players if they strenghtened again in the summer?

Rafa strengthened last summer I thought?

How many more "strengthenings" is it going to take?

Mr Alan wrote: »

how do you know?

Indeed, I apologise. I should have added an "imo" after that.

As a serious answer though. I know, barring some miracle, Rafa isn't going to win the league this season, and I don't think he'll get another shot at it. I reckon he'll be gone in the Summer, if not sooner.

Mr Alan wrote: »

Jaws....hands down. Not going out, is the new going out.

Nah, me bird is in France for a fortnight, I'm going out on the lash, nothing to stay in for

I do enjoy these discussions Al.

Mr Alan

Mr Alan wrote: »

reina,alonso,mascherano,lucas,arbeloa,torres,babel....do you not think Liverpool could win the PL with these players if they strenghtened again in the summer?

See this is where it gets complicated.

We need to streghten faster than these, something I have doubts if the Americans are able to finance.

Lets remember, they said we would be able to compete with Chelsea and Utd in the transfer market, but even taking this window for example....Berbatov and Anelka are for sale, we are in need of strenghtening up front, yet we are not even linked with either as it goes without saying that we cant afford them!

Part of me is praying for DIC to come in and properly run LFC because i personally think the yanks are a bigger obstacle to us winning the PL than Rafa at this moment in time.

Mr Alan

DesF wrote: »

Rafa strengthened last summer I thought?

How many more "strengthenings" is it going to take?.

I dont know, but Rafa said when he arrived it was a five year plan. So i'd give him next season and then make a decision on his future.

DesF wrote: »

I do enjoy these discussions Al.

I dont.

I feel like crying (no i'm not sending pics ).

Feel like stopping supporting football at the minute, not worth the stress.

_blank_

Mr Alan wrote: »

Des, you as much as anyone who uses these boards know the nature of football.

More probably

Mr Alan wrote: »

and i am sure there was a lot of people (incl myself) who thought that Liverpool had a chance at winning the title this year, but as fans, that is our right!

Yeah, fair enough. But there comes a point when you have to accept that your rivals are better than you.

There's a difference between blind loyalty and reality you know.

Mr Alan wrote: »

no one said,"oh liverpool are gonna win the title this year, easy money".

I said "Liverpool won't win the league this year, easy money" though.

Mr Alan wrote: »

wat people may have been saying is, "this could be Liverpools year"(never heard that before!)

Well I could say "This could be Elvis' comeback year". Never heard that before.

Mr Alan wrote: »

and if our home form was better, it could've been, but it hasnt been.

again, if my aunty had balls. You see, and here's the thing, it's always an "if" in the recent past with 'pool fans.

IF we win or game in hand.
IF we didn't drop them points against our rivals.
IF we strengthen in the summer.

Mr Alan wrote: »

but if we cant hope wat else are we meant to do!? why bother!?

I'm as passionate about my team as you are about yours, you know that. But I know we aren't going to win anything any time soon. I don't even have a hope that we will. Should I stop supporting them, after all, what's the point?

Mr Alan wrote: »

Liverpool have finished above arsenal the last two years, wengers policy of buying, nearly exclusively, the best youth from around the world seems to be paying dividends, BUT, they still have yet to win something at all, and have not won a trophy in wat? 4 years? would Rafa have been given the same luxury of that time?

The difference is that Wenger has proven that he can win the league. He should be given the respect he deserves, and he is getting that respect in the form of time to biuld another team capable of challenging for the title. Not finish second, third or fourth, actually challenging.

At this point in time Liverpool are outside the CL places, and quite frankly, don't look like they will break away from the "group of four" all on the same points there after third place. One loss to either of them other three teams will see Liverpool in proper trouble, and I don't think it's a stretch of reality tomcontemplate such a loss happening.

And this is the difference between Rafa and Wenger. Rafa doesn't look like he can mount a challenge for the title.

Mr Alan wrote: »

I still think we will finish closer to the leaders this year than we did last.

Big swinging mickey.

It doesn't matter if you finish one, three, six, eight or fifteen points behind the leaders. If you don't win, you don't win, and ultimately this is what football is about.

Liverpool should be more concerned about gaining a CL spot than trying to climb the ladder to the leaders.

Mr Alan wrote: »

So the question is, do we give the man who made us a force in Europe again, more time to deliver the ultimate prize (for us anyway),

Rafa is a great Euro manager, no doubt about that. Tactics spot on. No-one disputes that.

But as you said. What the fans, what the fans demand, what the club demands is a league title.

How sick will you feel when Utd equal then better the 18 time champions record?

Rafa has shown no signs of being able to handle the Premier League. He just can't do it. I don't know why, I can't explain it.

Stky10

Mr Alan wrote: »

Part of me is praying for DIC to come in and properly run LFC because i personally think the yanks are a bigger obstacle to us winning the PL than Rafa at this moment in time.

Dunno if they'd make any difference really. They'd have a bigger bank balance yeah, but its really open to debate how much of it they'd be willing to spend, and how much profit they'd like to make from the club, and their investment. When they were involved in bidding the last time, it was purely as a money making venture. They're effectively a state run company thats meant to turn as big a profit as possible, not be a sugar daddy to international sports teams.

Any other company that invests would look at the club in a similar light. So the only other option is some multi-billionaire like Abramovich who doesn't care about investment return. Is that ideal either?. Short term maybe, but long term, I can't imagine it being good for the club.

But it shows how little effect G+H have, that from what we can tell they haven't increased turnover, created new markets etc. The club is still being run the same as it was nearly a year ago when they took over. The new stadium is still only a pipe dream, and Parry is still running the show locally. So while other teams are growing and expanding, if anything, we're going backwards.

Mr Alan

DesF wrote: »

More probably

True, we all know the EL fans are the chosen ones!
(only joking,lets not open that can of worms!)

DesF wrote: »

Yeah, fair enough. But there comes a point when you have to accept that your rivals are better than you.

There's a difference between blind loyalty and reality you know.

That point came last week.

DesF wrote: »

I said "Liverpool won't win the league this year, easy money" though..

thats why i am sending you your winnings!

DesF wrote: »

Well I could say "This could be Elvis' comeback year". Never heard that before.

Well if Elvis bought a shiny new suit in the summer (Torres), your hope would be justified!

DesF wrote: »

again, if my aunty had balls. You see, and here's the thing, it's always an "if" in the recent past with 'pool fans..

I hate that expression. But it was possible for Liverpool to challenge this year. We just needed things to go for us and our players to play well. That hasnt happened.

DesF wrote: »

I'm as passionate about my team as you are about yours, you know that. But I know we aren't going to win anything any time soon. I don't even have a hope that we will. Should I stop supporting them, after all, what's the point?.

Well there is a difference there Des. At the moment, Liverpool fans expect to win things, because we have been winning trophies almost every year for the last decade!

DesF wrote: »

The difference is that Wenger has proven that he can win the league. He should be given the respect he deserves, and he is getting that respect in the form of time to biuld another team capable of challenging for the title. Not finish second, third or fourth, actually challenging.

rafa has proven he can win leagues and that he can buy talent. If we stick by him, i still think he can win us our league.

DesF wrote: »

At this point in time Liverpool are outside the CL places, and quite frankly, don't look like they will break away from the "group of four" all on the same points there after third place. One loss to either of them other three teams will see Liverpool in proper trouble, and I don't think it's a stretch of reality tomcontemplate such a loss happening..

No we are not, we are still in 4th, with a game in hand.

DesF wrote: »

It doesn't matter if you finish one, three, six, eight or fifteen points behind the leaders. If you don't win, you don't win, and ultimately this is what football is about. Liverpool should be more concerned about gaining a CL spot than trying to climb the ladder to the leaders..

Yes it does. Because i didnt at the start of the season realistically we would win the league this year. Just wanted us to!

I just wanna see us getting closer to our rivals.

DesF wrote: »

Rafa is a great Euro manager, no doubt about that. Tactics spot on. No-one disputes that.

But as you said. What the fans, what the fans demand, what the club demands is a league title.

How sick will you feel when Utd equal then better the 18 time champions record?

Rafa has shown no signs of being able to handle the Premier League. He just can't do it. I don't know why, I can't explain it.

I'm hoping for Arsenals young'uns to be dominate for a couple of years while Rafa gets his team together!

Our European record Utd will probably never catch, so i'm still happy with that

Helix

Mr Alan wrote: »

reina,alonso,mascherano,lucas,arbeloa,torres,babel....do you not think Liverpool could win the PL with these players if they strenghtened again in the summer?

ill be honest and say no, not with benitez in charge

pool fans said the exact same thing this time last year, yis strengthened and are nowhere near winning the league, same goes for pretty much every single season before that for as long as i can remember

Helix

Mr Alan wrote: »

We just needed things to go for us and our players to play well

yeah, like every other team in the premier league

Mr Alan

Helix wrote: »

ill be honest and say no, not with benitez in charge

But do you accept you could be wrong?

Helix wrote: »

yeah, like every other team in the premier league

no. about 15 teams had .000001% chance of winning the league this year, even if things went there way. Wat has let us down this year is our home form. If that was anything like it has been for the last number of years, we'd be right in the mix. It hasnt been. I dont know why.

Villa fans getting way too cocky on these boards lately!

d22ontour

Mr Alan wrote: »

Wat has let us down this year is our home form.

While i agree with to an extent it is also wrong.Liverpool imo always a tough team to beat at anfield for most teams while Liverpool playing away kinda sucked.It all comes back to the consistency word and imo Liverpool don't have it.The signs were there 5 games ago that yis were running out of steam and i have been proved right.Points wise are only a potential 9 behind but .... If these performances don't improve ,well then last seasons 21 points difference could become a reality again to whoever wins the league.

Helix

Mr Alan wrote: »

But do you accept you could be wrong?

nope, benitez doesnt have it to win the league in england

Mr Alan wrote: »

no. about 15 teams had .000001% chance of winning the league this year

i beg to differ, there were ever only 3 clubs with any chance of winning the league this season

Mr Alan wrote: »

Wat has let us down this year is our home form. If that was anything like it has been for the last number of years, we'd be right in the mix. It hasnt been. I dont know why.

what let yis down last year? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? ]

theres ALWAYS a bloody excuse with liverpool fans

sure look at reading, all that stopped them winning the league last year was that they didnt win all their league matches. if they did theyd definitely have won the league

Mr Alan wrote: »

Villa fans getting way too cocky on these boards lately!

my comments dont have anything to do with who i support tho?

Mikeyt086

Every year for the last 15 years Liverpool fans have been saying all thats needed is to strengthen the squad.

To bo honest, all thats needed is a manager who is capable in the transfer market. If Liverpool had Sven at the helm or Wenger then no doubt would they have won a fair share of titles in the last 10 years, its obvious poor players being brought in have hindered title challenges, not least the current one.

Clearly you all see something everyone else doesnt about Benitez, because from the outside looking in, he is steering the club in the wrong direction. I really cant get my head around the support he still has.

I know Gillet and Hicks know little about Soccer, but they are saying "We are not winning. Why not?", Which is what Benitez should be saying but instead in every interview he blames luck or conditions, its so cleary the players he is buying. This thread backs that point up as if you look back youll see "Our players didnt perform today." alot.

Let it be known im not having a go a Liverpool here im just stating my opinion on the clubs situation.

Mr Alan

Mikeyt086 wrote: »

To bo honest, all thats needed is a manager who is capable in the transfer market. If Liverpool had Sven at the helm or Wenger then no doubt would they have won a fair share of titles in the last 10 years, its obvious poor players being brought in have hindered title challenges, not least the current one.

Rafa is more than capable in the transfer market.

Rafa hasnt been the manager for the last ten years.

:mad:

Helix

Mr Alan wrote: »

Rafa is more than capable in the transfer market.

then why has he sold on so many players hes bought in (and at a loss i may add)?

surely a manager who was capable in the transfer market wouldnt be consistently making such balls ups?

Tusky

That stuff about Martin O Neil not wanting to come to Liverpool because they are on their way down and living on past glories were as Villa are on the up made me laugh cute.

Liverpool came 3rd the last two seasons, won the champions league in 2005, fa cup in 2006 & and are in the champions league year in, year out. Theres no doubt they are underperforming compared to the great successes of old but I'd say Martin O Neill would eat his own kneecap for the job. Not that I would want him here or want Rafa out though.

On the game, awful. A while back I was really frustrated and angry when we lost or drew but its stopped bothering me as we are no longer competing for the title. I do think that Rafa needs to buy some extra attacking talent but there is something wrong at the club. It could be all the negativity from behinds the scenes effecting the players...I'm not sure.

The fact is, the players at the club now are better than the result we have been getting.

Middlesborough 1-1 draw
Luton 1-1 draw
Wigan 1-1 draw
Manchester City 0-0 draw
Derby 2-1 won
Portsmouth 4-1 won
Chelsea 0-2 loss
Man U 0-1 loss
Marseille 4-0 win
Reading 3-1 loss

3 wins
4 draws
3 losses

from our last 10 games in all comps. That is a miserably inconsistent run of form. Take a look at our top scorers in the league.

Torres - 11
Gerrard - 6
Kuyt - 3
Babel - 3
Voronin - 3
Benayoun - 2
Alonso - 2
Sissoko - 2

Its quite obvious that our strikers (apart from Torres) have been letting us down severely. Below are the league stats.

Voronin - 12 apperances, 3 goals
Kuyt - 17 apperances, 3 goals (not including set pieces he has 1 from 17...)
Crouch - 11 apperances(only 4 starts), 0 goals.

So in total between them. 40 apperances 10 goals. Not good enough. Not even nearly good enough. So overall I'm really disappointed. I'm still very confident that we will finish in the top 4, we may even push Chelsea. I like Rafa and would like to see him given one more full season after this one before any decision is made on his future.

One point about Torres though. Wow. What a player. Thats 15 goals from his last 18 games. Would be top scorer if it wasnt for that pesky robot Ronaldo. (Theres no way that guy is human)

Mr Alan

Helix wrote: »

nope, benitez doesnt have it to win the league in england

How do you know this beyond a shadow of a doubt? You dont.

Helix wrote: »

i beg to differ, there were ever only 3 clubs with any chance of winning the league this season

In your opinion. Which could be wrong.

Helix wrote: »

what let yis down last year? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that? and the year before that?

We havent had good enough squads, and at a quick count, have you put in one too many "year before thats"?

Helix wrote: »

sure look at reading, all that stopped them winning the league last year was that they didnt win all their league matches. if they did theyd definitely have won the league

I think you've kind of enbarrased yourself with this whole ill thought out post. Sorry

Mikeyt086

Bad strikers - Exept that genius.
Bad wingers - Exept Babel's potential.
Bad defenders - Agger injured.

If titles are wanted, proven class in needed, Torres style. Instead Rafa has taken a gamble on Skrtel, granted he could be a Vidic, but its no guarentee. Thats why i dislike Rafa, he would rather 4 average/poor players than 1 he knows we give class.

Mr Alan

Helix wrote: »

then why has he sold on so many players hes bought in (and at a loss i may add)?

surely a manager who was capable in the transfer market wouldnt be consistently making such balls ups?

this has all been addressed in posts a few pages back. Check it out. Its to do with finances, a couple of bad buys and stuff like that, good reading, i highly recommend it.

And i believe! if you check it out a lot of the players Rafa has sold on have been at a profit and after getting a year out of em.

Tusky

Helix wrote: »

then why has he sold on so many players hes bought in (and at a loss i may add)?

surely a manager who was capable in the transfer market wouldnt be consistently making such balls ups?

The players that he has sold that he himself brought in have all been cheap players. Stop-gaps, gambles if you will. The most expensive one was Morientes at about 6m but with his pedigre, you can hardly blame him for that one. The gambles have been known to come off as well, Arbeloa is an example of that.

Off the top of my head.

Bellamy - made money
Gonzalez - broke about even
Carson - should make about 9m on him
Sissoko - should make about 4m on him
Krompkamp - broke even
Fowler - broke even

I think Rafa has done well in the transfer maket. In three years, Agger, Arbeloa, Reina, Mascherano*, Alonso, Babel, Lucas, Torres.

My biggest criticism of Rafa in the transfer marker, and I said this at the time as well, was making the squad, rather than first 11 stronger during the summer. The only player that really strengthened the first 11 was Torres. Babel, Benayoun & Lucas added to the squad but not the first 11. I would have prefered him to buy an established world beater of a winger instead of Babel (who I like and may turn out to be a great buy) & Benayoun.

Mikeyt086 wrote: »

Bad defenders - Agger injured.

:rolleyes:

2nd best defensive record in the league despite going through a bit of a crisis. Finnan, Carragher, Arbeloa, Aurelio & Hyypia are not bad defenders.

Mikeyt086 wrote: »

Instead Rafa has taken a gamble on Skrtel, granted he could be a Vidic, but its no guarentee. Thats why i dislike Rafa, he would rather 4 average/poor players than 1 he knows we give class.

Youre talking out of your arse in regards to the Skrtel comment. He was bought as back up for Agger & Carragher. No point in buying someone who expects to play week in week out. Also, had you heard of Agger or Vidic before they were signed ?

Mr Alan

Mikeyt086 wrote: »

Bad strikers - Exept that genius.
Bad wingers - Exept Babel's potential.
Bad defenders - Agger injured.

If titles are wanted, proven class in needed, Torres style. Instead Rafa has taken a gamble on Skrtel, granted he could be a Vidic, but its no guarentee. Thats why i dislike Rafa, he would rather 4 average/poor players than 1 he knows we give class.

carragher, finnan, reina, arbeloa bad defenders? :rolleyes:

ok then arsene who would you have bought for about 6 million instead of Skrtel to plug the gap in the squad we currently have defensively?

Peyton Manning

I disgaree on the whole 'only 3 teams were in the running' this season. I genuinely thought Liverpool had purchased the final piece of the puzzle in Babel and Torres. I gave them a much better chance than Arsenal but it just hasnt happened. Lord knows why, theres the potential there - a good starting 11 so maybe it is Rafa? Maybe he just doesnt bestow confidence in the players. When you come out and say that 1-1 against Middlesborough isnt a bad result, that has to have a negative effect on a team who were believed to challenge for the title next season. I have nothing against Rafa - unlike Wenger and Jose, he is not outspoken. I really have nothing bad to say about him as a person, I just dont think he's right for Liverpool domestically.

Helix

Mr Alan wrote: »

How do you know this beyond a shadow of a doubt? You dont.

if benitez ever wins the league with liverpool ill legally change my name to rafael benitez

Mr Alan wrote: »

In your opinion. Which could be wrong.

how? is it not pretty clear at this stage?

Mr Alan wrote: »

We havent had good enough squads

but sure we're being told every single pre season by liverpool fans that the squad is definitely good enough and is going to win the league

Mr Alan wrote: »

and at a quick count, have you put in one too many "year before thats"?

ahaah yeah i think theres 2 too many, just think of it as me saving myself posting them in 2 years time, you know, planning for the future and all that

Mr Alan wrote: »

I think you've kind of enbarrased yourself with this whole ill thought out post. Sorry

no more than you have with yours. everything youre saying is ifs. fact is IF reading won every match last season theyd have won the league, and thats equally as relevant as saying IF liverpools home form was better theyd be challenging for the title

christ if villas home form was better WE'D be challenging for the title ffs

if pompeys home record was better THEY'D be challenging for the title

its all nonsense, the fact is liverpools form wasnt better

Helix

Mr Alan wrote: »

carragher, finnan, reina, arbeloa bad defenders? :rolleyes:

good defenders, no pace collectively tho, so what better than go out and pay £6m on a defender who has been slated in past for, wait for it, lack of pace

christ if i was a pool fan id have torn all my hair out during the rafa reign. £150m+ spent on mediocrity for the most part

Mr Alan

Helix wrote: »

christ if villas home form was better WE'D be challenging for the title ffs

if pompeys home record was better THEY'D be challenging for the title

its all nonsense, the fact is liverpools form wasnt better

see thats where you point runs astray.

Liverpool are better than Villa and Portsmouth,our league performances for years and years have shown that. both those teams form has been pretty excellent and yet we are still ahead of ye. We should be doing better with our home form because thats the way we have been for years, anfield is usually a fortress, this year for some reason, its not.

Tusky

Helix wrote: »

good defenders, no pace collectively tho, so what better than go out and pay £6m on a defender who has been slated in past for, wait for it, lack of pace

christ if i was a pool fan id have torn all my hair out during the rafa reign. £150m+ spent on mediocrity for the most part

Have you seen him play ? The guy is very very fast. Youre talking out of your arse.

What type of centre half is Martin?

He is more like Carra than Agger. He is a player who is strong and physical, he is good in the air and quick. I think he will settle here quickly.

Mr Alan

Helix wrote: »

good defenders, no pace collectively tho, so what better than go out and pay £6m on a defender who has been slated in past for, wait for it, lack of pace

christ if i was a pool fan id have torn all my hair out during the rafa reign. £150m+ spent on mediocrity for the most part

christ how are you fitting all that ****e out your arse?!

according to Rafa, the new slovak lad is quick, do you know something he doesnt?

during Rafas reign we have been in two champions league finals, winning one. And won an FA cup. pulling our hair out!? hardly!

Helix

Archimedes wrote: »

I genuinely thought Liverpool had purchased the final piece of the puzzle in Babel and Torres. I gave them a much better chance than Arsenal but it just hasnt happened.

with a different manager id agree