Liverpool Rumours And General Discussion 2007/2008

zing

Tauren wrote: »

no - its a perfectly valid point - a vocal majority seemed so happy when G&H bought the club because at the time they promised to build the stadium for you, now that isn't the case you want them out so, among other things, DIC can build the stadium for you without Liverpool iteslf spending a penny.

DIC will most likely borrow to buy the club and will most likely borrow to build the stadium. They could pay for them both with a single cheque but are unlikely to - they are investors after all and will make their money work for them as they see best. It's similar to what Hicks has been doing for years through his companies but the difference between DIC and G&H in that regard is that they can afford to take on such debts whereas G&H don't appear to be able to.

Helix

zing wrote: »

Shame on him for not turning us into a breeder club snapping up all the young starlets of tomorrow and selling them on for big profit a few years down the road. Most players depreciate in value as they get older and/or the number of years on their contracts shrinks.

i think its more that hes signed flop after flop

spockety

Tauren wrote: »

no - its a perfectly valid point - a vocal majority seemed so happy when G&H bought the club because at the time they promised to build the stadium for you, now that isn't the case you want them out so, among other things, DIC can build the stadium for you without Liverpool iteslf spending a penny.

You haven't bothered to read the previous posts have you?

You actually think that the problem is mostly that Hicks and Gillett reneged on their promise to build the stadium?

*sigh*

It has nothing to do with them offering the managerial position to Jurgen Klinsmann?
It has nothing to do with them disrespecting the current manager by openly discussing that?
It has nothing to do with them airing Liverpool FC's dirty laundry in public for the first time in the club's history?
It has nothing to do with them promising not to load any debt on the club only to turn around a year later and attempt exactly that?

I could go on.

Needless to say, Liverpool fans feel they have been shown the true colours of the owners, and they want them out. If it was your club, you'd feel the same.

Helix

spockety wrote: »

It has nothing to do with them airing Liverpool FC's dirty laundry in public for the first time in the club's history?

was that not benitez?

Ruskie4Rent

Helix wrote: »

thats what a lot of you are like in fairness

Overly ambitous with an average squad, seemingly blind faith in an average manager....thats not at all like liverpool fans.;)




Joking. Please don't kill/ban me.:(

citytillidie

I just wonder do these supporters of other teams posting on here know as much about the team they follow, they seem to be obsessed with Liverpool


Well i guess you can only obsess about "Englands most decorated team Liverpool Football Club" Quote from Martin Tyler

Mitch Connor

spockety wrote: »

You haven't bothered to read the previous posts have you?

You actually think that the problem is mostly that Hicks and Gillett reneged on their promise to build the stadium?

*sigh*

It has nothing to do with them offering the managerial position to Jurgen Klinsmann?
It has nothing to do with them disrespecting the current manager by openly discussing that?
It has nothing to do with them airing Liverpool FC's dirty laundry in public for the first time in the club's history?
It has nothing to do with them promising not to load any debt on the club only to turn around a year later and attempt exactly that?

I could go on.

Needless to say, Liverpool fans feel they have been shown the true colours of the owners, and they want them out. If it was your club, you'd feel the same.

Well, those are all problems - but the fact is they have not acted completely improperly imo. They offered the job to Kinsmann when Liverpool were playing poorly and looking like going out of the CL. His job should have been under threat really. They shouldn't have discussed it in public. However, Rafa's initial child like tantrum with "I'm just concentrating on the team and the training" hardly helped matters in the first palce. Rafa is hardly innocent in all this.

As for my club - i do want the owners gone, and to take their debt with them - but then i didn't want them here in the first place. The only thing they have done better then G7H is keep stum and in the background - but thats cause they'd probably be lynched by the more scumbaggy element of our support if they did differently.

dobsdave

citytillidie wrote: »

I just wonder do these supporters of other teams posting on here know as much about the team they follow, they seem to be obsessed with Liverpool


Well i guess you can only obsess about "Englands most decorated team Liverpool Football Club" Quote from Martin Tyler

It always amazes me how many supporters of other teams come in to this forum.(Especially the villa fans of late).
Not bad for a team struggling in fifth and on the verge of bankrupcy.;)

Mitch Connor

the United fans are just getting payback for Mr Alan.

PHB

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

United and Arsenal fans alike were dreading the sale of both players while competing fans were delighted with themselves. No doubt you will claim that you were glad that RVN was sold for footballing reasons.

That's the thing though. There's a reason we aren't football managers and Wenger and Fergie are. The idea of selling Ruud or Henry was absurd, but it paid off. Those radical changes make the difference, make it change how the team play, get the best out of players.

This season, they have gone from being a predominantly defensive team to an attacking team. This is reflected in the number of goals they have scored this season when compared to last.

Unfortunately, it is also reflected in the number of goals we have conceeded.

That is certainly true. There has been a shift from defence to attack somewhat, not to a high enough level I feel, but there's definately been a change. I do think that that was always gona expose Liverpools defensive frailties but that's another debate (not just in terms of weakness at CB, everybody knew about that, but in terms of Carragher's lack of pace (which is the prime reason for most of his mistakes this year) which is exposed when you become more attacking).

I talked about how I feel Rafa is signing a groud of players that will allow the team to easily switch between two clear cut systems 4-4-2 and 4-2-3-1 that can be altered further by choosing wingers that constantly hug the line or using wide players that tend to drift inside. As things stand, Liverpool have the players that tend to drift infield and can play off a single striker and get you a handful or two goals(Yossi, Gerard and Babel) but have not got sufficient overall quality in terms of players that hug the touchline and whip in crosses.

I like your systems, I thought they were really spot on. However you have to ask yourself the questions? Does it get the best out of your current players? The answer is certainly no. In this season, I'd say most people would agree that the only attacking players who have shown any sort of form have been Gerrard and Torres. There are countless players outside the top 4 who have played better than the rest of Liverpools attack. Why? Because the system is better suited to them. Rafa's system is currently suited to players he doesn't have, and that's why Liverpool are where they are.
If he gets the new signings, then maybe the system will become amazing, but that's yet to be seen.

Even if he does get new signings, all it will mean is that he will have a squad as good as United's, Arsenals and Chelseas. At which point, it will come down to which system gets the best out of those players. Players matter, there's no doubt about that, but the system matters more. For about half a season United played with Giggs and O'Shea in the center of midfield. They went on a massive run of wins. The quality in the middle of course was not there, but the system suited all the players around them to the extent that it all worked out.

I am still confident that we will finish in the top 4 and I am hopeful that we can still catch Chelsea in 3rd place.

I'd still be surprised to see you finish outside the top 4, very surprised, but it's becoming a possibility. The fact that it is becoming a possibility is an absolute joke imo.

~Rebel~

Tauren wrote: »

Well, those are all problems - but the fact is they have not acted completely improperly imo. They offered the job to Kinsmann when Liverpool were playing poorly and looking like going out of the CL.

I dont think there would be quite as much consternation if it was someone like Capello approached, but in all seriousness, if your having trouble on the pitch and need to move up, you dont go for a guy with 1 short spell of international management and NO club management experience...Its enough to make one fear for the future of their club under these guys. They've essentially gone back on everything they said. Yes Rafa hasn't helped himself with results on the pitch, but thats not really what needs to be talked about, the current major issue is the ownership. Clubs will always have issues over management from time to time, but it couldn't have been dealt with in a less dignified manner. I seriously cant get over Tom Hicks. One would think someone with his business experience would have more tact.

Mitch Connor

PHB wrote: »

That's the thing though. There's a reason we aren't football managers and Wenger and Fergie are. The idea of selling Ruud or Henry was absurd, but it paid off. Those radical changes make the difference, make it change how the team play, get the best out of players.

Not to everyone - i know a good few fans who felt the time was right to sell Ruud. Weren't happy about the price though. I was one of them.:D

spockety

Tauren wrote: »

Well, those are all problems - but the fact is they have not acted completely improperly imo. They offered the job to Kinsmann when Liverpool were playing poorly and looking like going out of the CL. His job should have been under threat really. They shouldn't have discussed it in public. However, Rafa's initial child like tantrum with "I'm just concentrating on the team and the training" hardly helped matters in the first palce. Rafa is hardly innocent in all this.

I suggest you read Dion Fanning's article in the Indo from a few days ago which theorises Rafa's precise tactics 'in all this'. It was linked to a few pages back, but I am guessing you haven't bothered to read back on the whole G+H saga in this thread like I recommended you do?

Mitch Connor

spockety wrote: »

I suggest you read Dion Fanning's article in the Indo from a few days ago which theorises Rafa's precise tactics 'in all this'. It was linked to a few pages back, but I am guessing you haven't bothered to read back on the whole G+H saga in this thread like I recommended you do?

I've read enough - and you liverpool supportering boardsies are the be all and end all when it comes to discussing the current plight of liverpool.

spockety

Tauren wrote: »

I've read enough - and you liverpool supportering boardsies are the be all and end all when it comes to discussing the current plight of liverpool.

For God's sake, it's a LIVERPOOL thread for crying out loud, and the current plight of Liverpool is causing serious concern among supporters for the future of the club.

Did you come on here to intentionally enflame us, or do you have something worthwhile and well thought out to actually say?

Jesus Wept

Helix wrote: »

hes still managed to spend over £150m, and hes still managed to sell on almost half the players he bought at a loss

Helix wrote: »

andy gray didnt tell me how much benitez spent. whats your point here exactly?

My point is if you aren't going to mention the money recouped via sales, then you sound like a tit. There are two sides to a balance sheet. To ignore one is incredibly misleading.

Also, nearly every transfer is undisclosed and most are based on performances and appearances.
It always makes me laugh how many people quote figures spent with such confidence that they are wholly accurate.

Savman

LOL @ "obsessed with Liverpool"
Cop on! My interest in your lot ended at the full time whistle last night, just came by for some post match discussion. I might come back in May to shove it in Mr Alan's face when we pip ye to 4th :D

In closing, all I'll say is you don't deserve any better than your league placing.

Good luck.

kida

The-Rigger wrote: »

My point is if you aren't going to mention the money recouped via sales, then you sound like a tit. There are two sides to a balance sheet. To ignore one is incredibly misleading.

Also, nearly every transfer is undisclosed and most are based on performances and appearances.
It always makes me laugh how many people quote figures spent with such confidence that they are wholly accurate.

salaries have to be taken into account also- he isn't there to balance the books - he is there to win things

Do Liverpool fans still believe he is the man to bring them the league. I don't know of any non-pool fans who know think so.

prendy

i hate the way other fans come on here and give out about what we(pool fans) say on here...thats the idea of the forum...go stir sh!te in your own forum.
the title is Liverpool Rumours and General Discussion:

if i want to proclaim Liverpool as the greatest football club in the world and Harry Kewell is the greatest winger of all time then i can in here.

k maybe over the top but this thread seems to be 50% **** stirers

Spud83

kida wrote: »

salaries have to be taken into account also- he isn't there to balance the books - he is there to win things

Do Liverpool fans still believe he is the man to bring them the league. I don't know of any non-pool fans who know think so.

I'm not a pool fan but if he got decent backing, managed one or two good signings in the summer, plus some improvement from current players (Babel etc) I think he could yes. The problem being is the fact that there is not a lot of top class managers floating around, and that any new manager coming in would want to have and probably require a re-building stage which would mean taking steps back. Give him decent backing in the summer, one more season, then I believe he can be judged fairly.

prendy wrote: »

i hate the way other fans come on here and give out about what we(pool fans) say on here...thats the idea of the forum...go stir sh!te in your own forum.
the title is Liverpool Rumours and General Discussion:

Correct that is the title however it is not

Liverpool Rumours and General Discussion: (For Liverpool Fans only).
Giving out about Liverpool fans/Liverpool etc in the Man U/Arsenal/Villa or any other thread would be incorrect. No?

Mitch Connor

spockety wrote: »

For God's sake, it's a LIVERPOOL thread for crying out loud, and the current plight of Liverpool is causing serious concern among supporters for the future of the club.

Did you come on here to intentionally enflame us, or do you have something worthwhile and well thought out to actually say?

Yes, this is a liverpool thread - what is your point? I was pointing out that i do not feel it is a requirement to have read every post in this thread before I can form an opinion on the circumstances - i can read information fro other sites and learn from discussions with liverpool supporters in work or out with friends.

Mr Alan

kida wrote: »

salaries have to be taken into account also- he isn't there to balance the books - he is there to win things

Do Liverpool fans still believe he is the man to bring them the league. I don't know of any non-pool fans who know think so.

Has has won things.

Non liverpool fans opinion matter **** all with this so it doesnt matter.

And Tauren, i dont go into the Utd thread and refuse to read articles that show my opinion as nothing more than a hate filled little rant like you are doing in here.

WE GET IT PEOPLE.

RAFA WILL NEVER WIN THE LEAGUE. HE IS A **** MANAGER. HE HAS BOUGHT FLOP AFTER FLOP.

Ferguson is a genius, despit winning 1 trophy to Rafas two major ones since Rafas arrival. Wenger is God, despite not winning a single since the FA cup in 2005. O'Neill should be Liverpool manager. Liverpool fans want to buy success. rafa started all the ****e with the owners etc etc.

PHB

Lads, let's keep this on topic. All this random **** between people ends here.
If you have something to say that is actually an opinion, fine. If not, stop posting crap.

If you have a problem with somebodys post, report it. Otherwise shut up about it.

spockety

Tauren wrote: »

I was pointing out that i do not feel it is a requirement to have read every post in this thread before I can form an opinion on the circumstances - i can read information fro other sites and learn from discussions with liverpool supporters in work or out with friends.

Given the quality of your recent postings on this thread, I beg to differ.

Mr Alan

alanmurphy83 wrote: »

I'm not a pool fan but if he got decent backing, managed one or two good signings in the summer, plus some improvement from current players (Babel etc) I think he could yes. The problem being is the fact that there is not a lot of top class managers floating around, and that any new manager coming in would want to have and probably require a re-building stage which would mean taking steps back. Give him decent backing in the summer, one more season, then I believe he can be judged fairly.

Finally, a bit of sense.

Savman

prendy wrote: »

if i want to proclaim Liverpool as the greatest football club in the world and Harry Kewell is the greatest winger of all time then i can in here.

Yes you can of course. But being a forum that contains hundreds or maybe thousands of fans of other clubs, people can chime in and, er, disagree.

kida

Mr Alan wrote: »

Has has won things.

Non liverpool fans opinion matter **** all with this so it doesnt matter.

And Tauren, i dont go into the Utd thread and refuse to read articles that show my opinion as nothing more than a hate filled little rant like you are doing in here.

WE GET IT PEOPLE.

RAFA WILL NEVER WIN THE LEAGUE. HE IS A **** MANAGER. HE HAS BOUGHT FLOP AFTER FLOP.

Ferguson is a genius, despit winning 1 trophy to Rafas two major ones since Rafas arrival. Wenger is God, despite not winning a single since the FA cup in 2005. O'Neill should be Liverpool manager. Liverpool fans want to buy success. rafa started all the ****e with the owners etc etc.

take its thats a yes
talk about trophies all you want - the only one you really want is the league

Villain

LOL Its funny Mr Alan actually probably agrees with most people but the love for his club is refusing to let him see that after 19 years without winning the title Liverpool look no closer to winning the title now than they did 10 years ago.

Rafa is a great manager just not when it comes to the Premier League

Chardee MacDennis

Mr Alan wrote: »

Has has won things.

Non liverpool fans opinion matter **** all with this so it doesnt matter.

And Tauren, i dont go into the Utd thread and refuse to read articles that show my opinion as nothing more than a hate filled little rant like you are doing in here.

WE GET IT PEOPLE.

RAFA WILL NEVER WIN THE LEAGUE. HE IS A **** MANAGER. HE HAS BOUGHT FLOP AFTER FLOP.

Ferguson is a genius, despit winning 1 trophy to Rafas two major ones since Rafas arrival. Wenger is God, despite not winning a single since the FA cup in 2005. O'Neill should be Liverpool manager. Liverpool fans want to buy success. rafa started all the ****e with the owners etc etc.

The problem here is teams which have won the league, their fans THINK they have been there and won it with the team so obviously they should tell everyone else how to do it.

Also the obsession with Liverpool is something which i figure comes from Liverpool being Englands most successful club and therefore until United surpass we will have to put up with all this. Unless we start racking up championships (with Rafa hopefully), then we can tell em "we know how to win a league, dont need advice, now get lost!"

But i think it will be a quiet day here when we do it...

Mr Alan

kida wrote: »

the only one you really want is the league

And as a Utd fan you are perfectly able to tell me, a liverpool fan, wat i want?

Yea the league was priority 1 this year. Well actually more that we challange for the league.

BUT where you are wrong is to think that the rest dont matter.

As Liverpool FC we REALLY want to win everything we enter into. At the minute looks like we can forget about the league for another year, another CL would be amazing and another FA cup would be class too. At the moment we can win any competition we enter, except the league it seems. I'm willing to wait and keep winning trophies under Rafa until we are ready to win the league.

Mitch Connor

Mr Alan wrote: »

Has has won things.

Non liverpool fans opinion matter **** all with this so it doesnt matter.

And Tauren, i dont go into the Utd thread and refuse to read articles that show my opinion as nothing more than a hate filled little rant like you are doing in here.

WE GET IT PEOPLE.

RAFA WILL NEVER WIN THE LEAGUE. HE IS A **** MANAGER. HE HAS BOUGHT FLOP AFTER FLOP.

Ferguson is a genius, despit winning 1 trophy to Rafas two major ones since Rafas arrival. Wenger is God, despite not winning a single since the FA cup in 2005. O'Neill should be Liverpool manager. Liverpool fans want to buy success. rafa started all the ****e with the owners etc etc.

You mean the article that presents a THEORY of why Rafa did what he did - as opposed to an article that lays out why Rafa did what he did as FACT. if you have one that is 100% accurate and confirmed by Rafa himself, please present it.

And anyway - the reasoning is immatterial, my post on that part of the subject was in response to G&H airing the dirty laundry in public for the first time in Liverpool history. I pointed out Rafa was not innocent in the airing of dirty laundry, which he isn't, regardless of reasoning.

event

with pool fans, do you honestly think that the background stuff is having an affect on the players?

do you think that this, ultimately, will be the reason of a lack of title challenge this year?

Mr Alan

Villain wrote: »

Rafa is a great manager just not when it comes to the Premier League

You are aware that Rafa holds the record for the most amount of points Liverpool have EVER picked up in one season?

we are against the two of the games all time greats in Wenger and Ferguson, and a club that has spent like no other in history, Chelsea. Its definately an uphill struggle for us in the league over the next couple of years, but Rafa can do it. Or at least Rafa is more qualified to do it than any other manager around.

kida

Mr Alan wrote: »

You are aware that Rafa holds the record for the most amount of points Liverpool have EVER picked up in one season?

we are against the two of the games all time greats in Wenger and Ferguson, and a club that has spent like no other in history, Chelsea. Its definately an uphill struggle for us in the league over the next couple of years, but Rafa can do it. Or at least Rafa is more qualified to do it than any other manager around.

I just don't get the blinkered optimism - he has shown no signs he has learned how to master the premiership.
Hypotetically(not that there is any chance of it happening) would you take Wenger as your manager?

Helix

The-Rigger wrote: »

My point is if you aren't going to mention the money recouped via sales, then you sound like a tit. There are two sides to a balance sheet. To ignore one is incredibly misleading.

Also, nearly every transfer is undisclosed and most are based on performances and appearances.
It always makes me laugh how many people quote figures spent with such confidence that they are wholly accurate.

hows this then:

2007
IN Fee
Javier Mascherano £1,500,000 (loan fee)
Alvaro Arbeloa £2,600,000
Lucas £8,000,000
Voronin £0
Sebastian Leto £1,850,000
Francisco Manuel Duran £0
Charles Hubert Itandje £0
Fernando Torres £26,500,000
Yossi Benayoun £5,000,000
Ryan Babel £11,500,000
Total: £56,950,000

OUT Fee
Florent Sinama-Pongolle £2,700,000
Stephen Warnock £1,500,000
Darren Potter £250,000
Salif Diao £0
Djbril Cisse £6,000,000
Boudewjin Zenden £0
Danny O Donnell £100,000
Craig Bellamy £7,500,000
Mark Gonzalez £4,200,000
Jerzy Dudek £0
Robbie Fowler £0
Gabriel Paletta £0
Total: £22,250,000

2006
IN Fee
Fabio Aurelio £0
Jermaine Pennant £6,700,000
Dirk Kuyt £9,000,000
Gabriel Palletta £2,000,000
Craig Bellamy £6,000,000
Daniel Agger £5,800,000
Robbie Fowler £0
Jan Kromkamp £0
Nabil El Zhar £0
Total: £29,500,000

OUT Fee
Chris Kirkland £3,000,000
Jan Kromkamp £1,000,000
Neil Mellor £250,000
Djimi Traore £2,000,000
Antonio Barragan £680,000
Carl Medjani £0
Dietmar Hamann £0
Fernando Morientes £3,000,000
Josemi £0
Bruno Cheyrou £0
Total: £9,930,000

2005
IN Fee
Momo Sissoko £5,600,000
Mark Gonzalez £4,500,000
Antonio Barragan £0
Jose Reina £6,000,000
Boudewijn Zenden £0
Scott Carson £750,000
Fernando Morientes £6,300,000
Mauricio Pellegrino £0
Total: £30,150,000

OUT Fee
Mauricio Pellegrino £0
Antonio Nunez £0
Milan Baros £6,500,000
El Hadji Diouf £4,000,000
Vladimir Smicer £0
Stephane Henchoz £0
Alou Diarra £2,000,000
Total: £12,500,000

2004
IN Fee
Josemi £2,000,000
Luis Garcia £6,000,000
Xabi Alonso £10,500,000
Antonio Nunez £0
Total: £18,500,000

OUT Fee
Markus Babbel £0
Danny Murphy £2,500,000
Michael Owen £8,000,000
Total: £10,500,000

Total Spending: £135,100,000 (150+ should the mascherano deal happen)
Total Income: £55,180,000

32 players signed in just under 4 years, and theres still 6 players he inherrited still at the club. that means hes made 32 signings for the additional 10 places for a matchday squad, and still doesnt have what he wants, or seemingly know what he wants

Helix

Mr Alan wrote: »

You are aware that Rafa holds the record for the most amount of points Liverpool have EVER picked up in one season?

what trophy did you win for that?

~Rebel~

Villain wrote: »

LOL Its funny Mr Alan actually probably agrees with most people but the love for his club is refusing to let him see that after 19 years without winning the title Liverpool look no closer to winning the title now than they did 10 years ago.

Rafa is a great manager just not when it comes to the Premier League

kinda funny, 10 years ago, Liverpool were on the back of finishing 7 points off top...ill take that

Villain

IMO Mr Alan he has made too many bad decisions in relation to team selection and tactics, especially away from home. Consistency is needed to sustain a league challenge and I hnestly believe that consistency cannot be reached with teh ammount of rotation Rafa does. Just my opinion

Mr Alan

Tauren wrote: »

You mean the article that presents a THEORY of why Rafa did what he did - as opposed to an article that lays out why Rafa did what he did as FACT. if you have one that is 100% accurate and confirmed by Rafa himself, please present it.

I mean an article that makes sense in explaining why a man like Rafa would act like he did, as opposed to your THEORY which doesnt hold any water.

Simple fact is that if Rafa didnt act like he did, the spotlight would never have been on the owners.

~Rebel~

Helix wrote: »

what trophy did you win for that?

Oh for the love of god, the main stick people have been beating Liverpool and Rafa with today has been that he cant amass enough points in the league, dispite being great in other competitions. Mr Alan's point was very obviously that as well as winning these other competitions that he has also amassed our record PL points total thus negating that argument, and showing that it is of course possible for him to win the league.

Helix wrote:

How's this then;
--list of transfers--

? The post you quoted was saying that these figures are often inaccurate due to most transfers now being private unless a club on the stock exchange is listed. For just one random example, you have Paletta down as 0 where it might have been for money, or to secure Insua on a permanent contract, you dont know, neither do i, as it was never released.

_blank_

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Oh for the love of god, the main stick people have been beating Liverpool and Rafa with today has been that he cant amass enough points in the league,

No it isn't.

Rafa, seemingly, can't WIN the league.

It doesn't matter if he has a club record points total, it wasn't enough to win the league.

Villain

It is funny rebel thinking 7 points away 10 years ago and after all the money spent they are now 14!

Mr Alan

Villain wrote: »

IMO Mr Alan he has made too many bad decisions in relation to team selection and tactics, especially away from home. Consistency is needed to sustain a league challenge and I hnestly believe that consistency cannot be reached with teh ammount of rotation Rafa does. Just my opinion

Rafa, realistically rotates no more or less than the other top managers. The positions he rotates are quite simple because there is no outstanding canditate for that poisition like the other teams have. Reina-Arbeloa-Hypia-Carragher-Mascherano-Gerrard-Torres have been ever present. The other positions have been decided by availabilty of players and their form.

People say Babel should start, ignoring the fact that every time he has, he has been ****e. People say Crouch should start ahead of Kuyt, except that Crouch hasnt scored all season except for last night.

And btw, our away form has been super this year.

~Rebel~

DesF wrote: »

No it isn't.

Rafa, seemingly, can't WIN the league.

It doesn't matter if he has a club record points total, it wasn't enough to win the league.

Winning the league is about getting the most points. Rafa has gotten a decent points total therefore it is possible this points total can be still improved upon.

I just hate all this "he cant win the league" stuff, the world isn't that black and white, of course he Can win the league, its a different question whether he will or not.

Villain thats true, a lot of that blame has to go to Ged. Most of his smaller transfers are the ones he's lauded for, but his big money ones were pretty much all failures. At least Rafa has largely only messed up on the small ones while his big ones have been quite good (possible exception of Kuyt for 10mill, though when you look at chopra for 6 it puts it in perspective a bit, having said that he still def looks a few mill overpriced this season. Last season looked worth the 10 imo)

Villain

Mr Alan wrote: »

Rafa, realistically rotates no more or less than the other top managers. The positions he rotates are quite simple because there is no outstanding canditate for that poisition like the other teams have. Reina-Arbeloa-Hypia-Carragher-Mascherano-Gerrard-Torres have been ever present. The other positions have been decided by availabilty of players and their form.

People say Babel should start, ignoring the fact that every time he has, he has been ****e. People say Crouch should start ahead of Kuyt, except that Crouch hasnt scored all season except for last night.

And btw, our away form has been super this year.

Actually your right Mr Alan about the rotation, just found some nice facts, and unlike some here I am only too happy to admit when my opinion is wrong. Have a read of: http://www.thefootballreview.co.uk/articles/article.aspx?id=23

Mr Alan

fair play Villian.

prendy

Villain wrote: »

It is funny rebel thinking 7 points away 10 years ago and after all the money spent they are now 14!

i dont find that funny!:(:(

but people forget mr fergusen took time to create a title winning outfit.
liverpool have always given their managers 100% support and dont sack managers when blips in form occurs.
what angers me and alot of fans is the lack of backing rafa is receiving from the board.:mad:

spockety

Steve Finnan has retired from International football with 50 caps.

Jesus Wept

Helix wrote: »

hows this then:

2007
IN Fee
Javier Mascherano £1,500,000 (loan fee)
Alvaro Arbeloa £2,600,000
Lucas £8,000,000
Voronin £0
Sebastian Leto £1,850,000
Francisco Manuel Duran £0
Charles Hubert Itandje £0
Fernando Torres £26,500,000
Yossi Benayoun £5,000,000
Ryan Babel £11,500,000
Total: £56,950,000

OUT Fee
Florent Sinama-Pongolle £2,700,000
Stephen Warnock £1,500,000
Darren Potter £250,000
Salif Diao £0
Djbril Cisse £6,000,000
Boudewjin Zenden £0
Danny O Donnell £100,000
Craig Bellamy £7,500,000
Mark Gonzalez £4,200,000
Jerzy Dudek £0
Robbie Fowler £0
Gabriel Paletta £0
Total: £22,250,000

2006
IN Fee
Fabio Aurelio £0
Jermaine Pennant £6,700,000
Dirk Kuyt £9,000,000
Gabriel Palletta £2,000,000
Craig Bellamy £6,000,000
Daniel Agger £5,800,000
Robbie Fowler £0
Jan Kromkamp £0
Nabil El Zhar £0
Total: £29,500,000

OUT Fee
Chris Kirkland £3,000,000
Jan Kromkamp £1,000,000
Neil Mellor £250,000
Djimi Traore £2,000,000
Antonio Barragan £680,000
Carl Medjani £0
Dietmar Hamann £0
Fernando Morientes £3,000,000
Josemi £0
Bruno Cheyrou £0
Total: £9,930,000

2005
IN Fee
Momo Sissoko £5,600,000
Mark Gonzalez £4,500,000
Antonio Barragan £0
Jose Reina £6,000,000
Boudewijn Zenden £0
Scott Carson £750,000
Fernando Morientes £6,300,000
Mauricio Pellegrino £0
Total: £30,150,000

OUT Fee
Mauricio Pellegrino £0
Antonio Nunez £0
Milan Baros £6,500,000
El Hadji Diouf £4,000,000
Vladimir Smicer £0
Stephane Henchoz £0
Alou Diarra £2,000,000
Total: £12,500,000

2004
IN Fee
Josemi £2,000,000
Luis Garcia £6,000,000
Xabi Alonso £10,500,000
Antonio Nunez £0
Total: £18,500,000

OUT Fee
Markus Babbel £0
Danny Murphy £2,500,000
Michael Owen £8,000,000
Total: £10,500,000

Total Spending: £135,100,000 (150+ should the mascherano deal happen)
Total Income: £55,180,000

32 players signed in just under 4 years, and theres still 6 players he inherrited still at the club. that means hes made 32 signings for the additional 10 places for a matchday squad, and still doesnt have what he wants, or seemingly know what he wants

Is this meant to strengthen your point?

You said he spent £150 million, now you say £79.92 million.
Bit of a difference there I'd say.

And then you quote all the figures from every transfer as if they are factual when most are undisclosed and performance based as stated.

PHB

offs That's terrible news!