Liverpool Rumours And General Discussion 2007/2008

DSB

Haha. Get rid of 1 of your only good players. That is a good move right there.

Chardee MacDennis

you have a point about the fans, while in Liverpool after the everton game I suggested to some scousers that maybe he should be dropped as he's getting too big for his boots and they got very pi$$ed off, a few of them put down their drinks and suggested i drop that line of thought very quickly - in less amicable terms!

still think he is a great player though...

LuckyLloyd

DSB wrote: »

Haha. Get rid of 1 of your only good players. That is a good move right there.

I'd get rid of anyone who thinks they are bigger than the club or the manager. I don't care.

DSB

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

I'd get rid of anyone who thinks they are bigger than the club or the manager. I don't care.

It is the manager who needs to go. Gerrard has been consistently good for the club regardless of what you think of his attitude. No1 of his quality will willingly join Liverpool.

mike65

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/w/west_ham_utd/live_text/6204736.stm

Mike.

machiavellianme

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

I'd get rid of anyone who thinks they are bigger than the club or the manager. I don't care.

Rafa is only 5`10, so most of the team are bigger than him.

Barlow07

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

No here is a man talking ****ing sense. Infact, **** Gerrard and his ****ing ego. Step no.1 for Rafa is stripping him of the captaincy. ****. Do what you are ****ing told for the good of the club. Be happy to play in whatever position you are put. Twat.

I really wouldnt be suprised if Rafa didnt walk away, he's fighting off the Americans for the last couple of months and now the next few weeks questions will be asked about Gerrard and Rafa relationship after tonight. They should leave the man in piece and let him get on with his job. Rafa had a list of targets and had to settle for second best with the likes of Pennant when he should have signed Simoa.

I wont be suprised if he walks at the end of the season and that will leave liverpool looking for a new manager which will probably involve compenstation and plus another £30 - £40million to buy his own players and of course another three years to challenge for the Premier League.

event

**** me, some of you boys are fickle.
A few weeks ago gerrard is one of your best players, now some of you want him dropped?

He probably shook his head as he doesnt think he can play out there as well as in the middle. It wasnt like he was moaning, he shook his head ffs.
Where was pennant tonight? Why was crouch not used?

i said that about pako a while back, about his absence but was told no chance, that he was just 'a fitness coach'

el rabitos wrote: »

well between gerrard and the americans undermining him he never really had much of a chance did he?

any excuse, eh!

Barlow07

DSB wrote: »

Haha. Get rid of 1 of your only good players. That is a good move right there.

I dont think Gerrard has being performing for a while now and because its Gerrard if he was droped the fans would moan plus the fact himself and Carragher would sulk for days, so Rafa is Fooked either way.

el rabitos

event wrote: »

any excuse, eh!

any opportunity, eh.

DSB

Barlow07 wrote: »

I dont think Gerrard has being performing for a while now

Relative to the rest of the team, he definitely has.

LuckyLloyd

event wrote: »

**** me, some of you boys are fickle.
A few weeks ago gerrard is one of your best players, now some of you want him dropped?

He's our most talented player. But attitude is the starting point. A player of his importance can't be acting the twat. It will only serve to demoralize the rest of the team. And then we will REALLY have cause for concern.

event

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

He's our most talented player. But attitude is the starting point. A player of his importance can't be acting the twat. It will only serve to demoralize the rest of the team. And then we will REALLY have cause for concern.

he shook his head ffs, its not like he threw his jersey away or ****ed the manager off.

has no one here ever shook their head at a decision while playing?

machiavellianme

event wrote: »

he shook his head ffs, its not like he threw his jersey away or ****ed the manager off.

has no one here ever shook their head at a decision while playing?

Kuyt is always shaking his head. And clapping himself....Hmmm
They're symptoms of other problems

LuckyLloyd

event wrote: »

he shook his head ffs, its not like he threw his jersey away or ****ed the manager off.

has no one here ever shook their head at a decision while playing?

Not when I was a happy camper and getting on with things I didn't.

astrofool

At least no one can blame rotation, the player's are sh*te no matter what way they're played.

~Rebel~

To be honest, while id welcome Pako back as someone for Rafa to talk to and share ideas with, as well as giving the morale of the players a bit of a lift, I still dont buy that he's the reason for the drop in form.

Lets be honest, we played plenty of shte in the league over the past few years with Pako as a member of staff too. We have a great 6 match run at the start, he leaves and all of a sudden he was the key man. Whatever about the first few games, but short of him being God behind the scenes, Pako's leaving cant be to blame for 4 months of crap in the league.

Was listening on 5live after the match and there were some scousers on saying there was gonna be a Rafa out protest at Anfield over the weekend...We really are quite the joke of the year.

mike65

What do we think about this fan buy-out business?

The press conference is tomorrow there is talk of some big-hitters being involved. Could well be a bottle of smoke but I'm intrigued as to who might be behind this.

Mike.

LuckyLloyd

oh, good god. all of this is over that penalty. i hate that i love football.

Jazzy

this is great.
owners with no money and players that cant score.
im really happy.

Paul Tergat

No way should Rafa be sacked, give the more time to build his team/squad.

and those questioning Gerrard, especially his attitude, well its a joke. The amount of time he's dug in and got his team out of a mess is ridiculous. any suggestions of him being dropped is ridiculous!

~Rebel~

mike65 wrote:

What do we think about this fan buy-out business?

The press conference is tomorrow there is talk of some big-hitters being involved. Could well be a bottle of smoke but I'm intrigued as to who might be behind this.

Mike.

Its a very interesting one. It allows for people like ourselves to become a part of LFC. Id be happy to buy in for 1,000 for example. Its an investment in something that long term would be expected to go up anyway id imagine. Also it allows the big guys who couldn't afford a full buy out and fund everything, like Morgan and this Irish chap that was mentioned recently to put in 50,000 or more. Or is there a limit on what people can invest to the tune of? Id imagine they'll be taking money from anyone in any amounts..

I think it could actually work though. Whats important then is getting the right people in charge, we saw how big a difference that makes in Barcelona pre Laporta and after he won the election.

Villain

Oh god Carra awful tackle what was he doing!!!

Villain

Who was that jesture from Rafa towards at the end, I'm no expert but looked like he was telling someone "thats it your finished"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Chardee MacDennis

Villain wrote: »

Who was that jesture from Rafa towards at the end, I'm no expert but looked like he was telling someone "thats it your finished"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

didnt see that, interesting...

zing

mike65 wrote: »

What do we think about this fan buy-out business?

The press conference is tomorrow there is talk of some big-hitters being involved. Could well be a bottle of smoke but I'm intrigued as to who might be behind this.

Mike.

Been off line for most of last 30 hours or and only playing catch up now so haven't read up on it yet. Sounds great in theory and even if we/they/whoever could get all the money together there is of course one huge obstacle in the way. Well two really and you'll find one of them holed up in Texas and good luck to you trying to find the other one atm as no one else seems to be able to. If they don't want to sell it doesn't matter sort of package the fans or DIC or maybe Kraft or whoever can put together.

zing

Villain wrote: »

Who was that jesture from Rafa towards at the end, I'm no expert but looked like he was telling someone "thats it your finished"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

At least there are no giant screens around Anfield for someone to suggest he was looking at himself on one.

Villain

Yea sky showed it at the end he shook hands with Curb and then turned to face the pitch and waved and crossed his arms as to jesture its over and seemed to say thats it your finished.

Anyone else see it on football first?

ShiverinEskimo

Say Gerrard and Benitez do fall out - do you think Gerrard knows that if/when it comes down to one of them leaving that Gerrard's place in the club is a lot more certain than Benitez'

I mean what does Gerrard have to lose by dissing Rafa - if Rafa benches Gerrard or even for illustration's sake moves to sell him in the summer don't you think that Rafa's feet wouldn't touch the floor on the way out.

Brings back memories of Fergie vs Beckham - difference being manager had more swing at the club.

mike65

If that were the case its Shearer/Gullit all over again. I'd love to know who Rafa was have a go at.

Mike.

LuckyLloyd

p_larkin99 wrote: »

No way should Rafa be sacked, give the more time to build his team/squad.

and those questioning Gerrard, especially his attitude, well its a joke. The amount of time he's dug in and got his team out of a mess is ridiculous. any suggestions of him being dropped is ridiculous!

This is a sensible post. Agree. My little outburst against Gerrard was a bit ridiculous to say the least.

~Rebel~

Rafa is taking a bit too much flak. He's obviously at fault for some of it, but at the end of the day, the lads on the pitch are Not doing their jobs. Few if any are playing to their potential at the moment (though Gerrard Carra and Torres have been better then most). I know motivation is part of a managers job, but he shouldn't have to hold their hands. They're grown ups and professionals. At the moment I think everyone associated with the club is letting themselves down.

Chardee MacDennis

mike65 wrote: »

If that were the case its Shearer/Gullit all over again. I'd love to know who Rafa was have a go at.

Mike.

Kuyt fingers crossed? Crouch to start the next game?

Villain

Villain wrote: »

Yea sky showed it at the end he shook hands with Curb and then turned to face the pitch and waved and crossed his arms as to jesture its over and seemed to say thats it your finished.

Anyone else see it on football first?

No-one else see it?

~Rebel~

Villain wrote:

No-one else see it?

Afraid not, i only saw BBC's highlights, and they're not fans of showing anything that might be controversial.

Villain

Rafa looked really pissed off and was definitely telling someone they were finished, ummm

Mr Alan

think rafas gesture was at the ref rather than a player.

DSB-i couldnt give a ****e about our bet. You remind me of the terms at the end of the season and i'll pay up (a link to the thread in question will help!;))

Rafa needs to play this team for the rest of the league:

---

Reina

---

---

Finnan

---

Agger/Hypia

---

Carra

---

Arbeloa--

---

---

Mascherano

---

Alonso

---

--Gerrard

---

Babel-

---

---

Torres----Crouch

---

Wont happen though. Rafa obviously has a grudge against Crouch for watever reason.

If Gerrard has a problem with playing out on the right, he should be told to **** off, and play where he is told, it may not look like Rafa will be a Liverpool forever, but he is still the boss, and Gerrard could do with a reminding that his best ever season for Liverpool was played out on the right.

Dressing room seems to be lost, which is a thundering disgrace, a lot of these players had the biggest night of their ****ing career only a few short months ago in Athens, that was under the leadership of Rafa, how they can seemingly lose faith in him so quickly is beyond belief for me......even bollox to that, couldnt give a ****e who and wat they have faith in, they should be putting in more of a ****ing effort for the club.

The Gillette&Hicks situation hasnt help, but its not a valid excuse on its own for this run of form. The players and the manager have to take the blame, mainly the players. Unfortunately, you cant sack all the players and if someone pays with their job, it will be Rafa. I still think that would be the wrong decision.

someone on another board said this....and i see exactly wat they mean:

ever had a bird that seemed just right for you?..promised so much?...made for each other?...but faith and circumstances just conspired against it ...and eventually all you could do was just go your seperate ways full of regret and disappointment and thoughts of what might have been?...
...............................................

I still believe given the right backing Rafa can turn this all around and will believe that until the day he leaves us-but things need to change now.

redspider

Well, a fairly poor night for Liverpool all round. I thought in the game we gave as good as they gave, which was pretty poor to average overall. We had the same no. of half chances, and both teams could have scored - a draw would have been a fair result, so West Ham stole 2 pts. Our shout for a penalty wasnt a penalty in my opinion, and their's was a peno alright. Jamie did slip but he put his leg out purposely more out of fatigued desperation than anything else, and not realising he was well covered behind. He knew it as he lay on the ground.

But all of that is meaningless, as a draw wasnt good enough never mind losing. Now the race for 4th is finely balanced. With Liverpool's game in hand, they could on paper regain 4th spot on 43 pts, but with the others on 43, 41, and 41, the chasing pack is very close, and anyone out of the 4 could get it. Even West Ham, Portsmouth or Blackburn could get back in the mix as well.

I didnt see Gerrard's 'refusal', I did notice he was particularly lacking in any of the highlights just shown on BBC. He did chase back at the end, he still cares.

Should Rafa go? Well, No, not now. No point, there's nothing to be gained. Lets see what the season brings us, and decide at the end. Its a bad day at the office, and also a bad season. The league is unwinnable but that trend has been there since early on in the season. I 'called it' at game 7 or 8 or so. The signs just werent there.

Is all lost? No. This team can raise its game above of what was on offer tonight. We still have two avenues - in the CL, which will now get optimised and the FA Cup. Luck in the draw in the latter may get us far in that, it has so far. The CL with the 2-legged matches gives us that saviour place of Anfield. Internazionale are good, but beatable. So ...

"When you walk through a storm
Hold your head up high
And don't be afraid of the dark
At the end of the storm ......"


Walk On ....

Redspider

Villain

Oh I don't think it was the ref, I mean the penalty was a stone wall peno and time wasn't up.

Mr Alan

But (and i havnt seen it so i cant say for definate) lucas neil handled the ball in the box and EVEN merson could admit it was a peno! so i think it wouldve been more in reference to that?

i'd prefer it was directed at one of the players tbh! plus in the interview after Rafa didnt make a big deal out of the peno incident so who knows!:)

~Rebel~

Christ im so depressed. damn football obsession.

machiavellianme

Lock up this thread and bring back the old one. They were happier times of hopes and dreams (except the pages where Kuyt was bought)

Tusky

machiavellianme wrote: »

Lock up this thread and bring back the old one. They were happier times of hopes and dreams (except the pages where Kuyt was bought)

Kuyt came very highly rated if you remember ?

An Citeog

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Its a very interesting one. It allows for people like ourselves to become a part of LFC. Id be happy to buy in for 1,000 for example. Its an investment in something that long term would be expected to go up anyway id imagine. Also it allows the big guys who couldn't afford a full buy out and fund everything, like Morgan and this Irish chap that was mentioned recently to put in 50,000 or more. Or is there a limit on what people can invest to the tune of? Id imagine they'll be taking money from anyone in any amounts..

I think it could actually work though. Whats important then is getting the right people in charge, we saw how big a difference that makes in Barcelona pre Laporta and after he won the election.

There's a difference between what's being suggested and the way things are at Barça. Barça is a club in the truest sense of the word ie. owned by its members. They've got about 160,000 members, all of whom pay around €150 a year. Of that, about €10million goes to towards the football club (possibly €15million since prices have risen over the past couple of years) and the rest to their various other teams (basketball, handball, indoor football etc).

What's being suggested here is the fans buying the club, in the same way as you'd buy the shares of any company. The difference is though imho, Liverpool aren't really that attractive an investment. The main reasons for this are the size of their current debts, the size of their stadium compared to rival clubs (Man United, Arsenal, Barcelona, Real etc.) and the fact that they seem to be comercially incompetent (or at least lagging significantly behind their peers). As noble an idea as it is, I really can't see it being sustainable in the long term. The biggest question being, who's going to finance the new stadium? And that's before even thinking about the cost of bringing in some of the top players Liverpool fans are demanding.

If they were to go down the Barça route, the size of Anfield would be the biggest stumbling block. I'm not sure how big Liverpool's global fanbase is either and how many of them would be willing to pay the annual subscription. Then there's the whole issue of electing a chairman/president or a whole board of directors as is the case with Barça. Laporta was elected as the face of a consortium including 9 others, all very successful businessmen in their chose fields. They each had to put up €2.5million aswell. All 10 of them worked full time without pay for the first year to try and resolve the debt issues and basically expunge the corruption of the previous regime from the club. I'm not saying Laporta was some sort of saint and he certainly had his own egoistical reasons for running for president. Barça is a huge club and is basically the sporting institution of Catalunya and being president carries quite a prestigious status among the people. It's basically his own political forum where he can show how Catalan he is.

Anyway, what I'm trying to say is that I don't think that would work with Liverpool. Would being president of Liverpool FC carry the same sort of prestige? Would people be willing to give up their hard-earned cash without any return? I'm not talking about the €150 members, I mean the larger investors that are being talked about. If you could find a solution to the stadium problem, that would be a huge step in the right direction, but I don't see this fan takeover as anything other than a pipe dream.

Mr Alan

I still dont think we should sell Kuyt

I'd get rid of Voronin before anyway....

Eg-

first choice: torres and one of benzerma/berbatov/Villa/Ronaldo/Eto'o/Huntelaar

back-up/Cups: Crouch and Kuyt!

We'd be laughing!

redspider

By the way, I dont think when Lucas came on that he asked Gerrard to play right, as that would have meant Benayoun playing left. I didnt see enough of the match to know though. Can anyone confirm the formations post the 2 subs?

What I do know is that Rafa should have brought on Babel (who can play left but is right footed) for Kewell. Playing Kewell was a major mistake. He is out of contract this summer and surely will go. I think Stevie (and Carra) would have preferred to see Crouch coming on to try things differently and provide some sort of aerial threat. Kuyt doesnt have that nor does Torres. Another central midfielder as good and all as Lucas is wasnt going to mix things up.

Anyway, its all water under the bridge now. Let the lads have a beer this evening and forget about it. Concentate on the next game, a home win against Sund-Ireland - surely ?!?!

Redspider

Mr Alan

some more info on the new fan buy out idea:

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-news/local-news/2008/01/31/liverpool-fc-fans-set-to-launch-takeover-bid-for-club-100252-20416512/

kryogen

why is it that when i say the things that have been said about gerrard and carragher in the last couple of pages i get called a troll??? is it ok to tell the truth again on this thread now??


anyway, i dont watch the scousers so i didnt see this game, but in fairness, people who are saying they are unlucky and it was only a last minute peno and all that, is that good enough?? a last minute peno wouldnt matter if pool were 2 goals up would they, bottom line, if you dont score you dont win

i wont comment on the latest **** with stevie me cuz i aint seen it but i wouldnt be suprised if it was another petulant action on his part, and can people finally admit carra isnt as good as you all thought? that he is being exposed in a more attacking team this year??

where are pool now.....7th? in fairness i still cant see anybody finishing 4th ahead of ye but ye would need to start getting points on the board wouldnt ye

Mint Sauce

i like this idea, any indications on potentially how much each share would cost, or is all this going to be discussed on the potential site

leninbenjamin

irish-stew wrote: »

i like this idea, any indications on potentially how much each share would cost, or is all this going to be discussed on the potential site

BBC suggesting £5000. no doubt there'll be quite a number of willing fans but not on the scale needed.