Liverpool Rumours And General Discussion 2007/2008

el rabitos

mike65 wrote:

Heh! hey its not like Liverpool need the money!

He'll go to either Pompey or Man City I'd say.

Mike.

selling crouch would no doubt come back to haunt us. its become the liverpool way. he's just one of those players that will come back to cost us if we sell him. sell him abroad if theres any takers. i'd hate to see him go to newcastle or man city or something.

personally i'm not a big fan of crouch, but we should recoup what was paid for him and a couple of million more, easily. his value wont be helped by sitting on his ass for the year though.

he needs too many opportunites to score, like defoe, and i wouldnt want to be relying on either of them to win me a match.

PiE

Sissoko should not be allowed to pass the half-way line. Ever. Why on earth he was allowed to push forward and cause 99% of our attacking play to break down through poor passes, poor decisions and poor positioning... it boggles the mind.

When Gerrard is not playing in the middle, Alonso needs to grow a pair and accept some attacking responsibility, he's far too happy to let the game bypass him these days.

Mr Alan

PiE wrote:

When Gerrard is not playing in the middle, Alonso needs to grow a pair and accept some attacking responsibility, he's far too happy to let the game bypass him these days.

FACT

mike65

Alonso's average distance from goal must have halved in 3 seasons.

Mike.

Mr Alan

i hope ya mean doubled mike?!

mike65

Sorry, our goal!

Mike.

Mr Alan

yea i really hope he changes his style back to the way ha was in his first season with us

~Rebel~

Sorry about the Ayala thing lads, the opportunity doesn't pop up too often tho, so i felt it was my duty to take advantage...


On Alonso, yeah i agree totally, he really needs to go back to the style of play he used to have when he bossed the field in Spain and the first season in England. Its not even like he's on bad form missing his passes or something, he's just not even bothering to try anymore. Very very frustrating. I wouldn't mind seeing him and Masch in the center for a game or 2 so he'd have no excuse but to move forward a bit more rather then tripping up over Masch.

Mr Alan

true enough, sure look wat happened last time the two of em played in the middle - he scored a brace!

zing

Aurelio back for tomorrow night's squad but Riise has picked up a groin injury which prob explains why he didn't even make the bench. Momo also out but no details as to why.

http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/drilldown/N157011070917-0924.htm

event

very strange decision by rafa at the weekend, i cant understand resting players at this stage of the season.

if liverpool want to win the league, its games like this they need to win.

raven136

the team sent out was good enough to win the game,crouch has been moaning he isnt getting game time but was awful yesterday.whats the point in having a big squad and not using them.
Also its getting lost that we actually lost there last season adn are still unbeaten.Rafa rotates and always will,people need to accept and realsie that

Malice

event wrote:

very strange decision by rafa at the weekend, i cant understand resting players at this stage of the season.

if liverpool want to win the league, its games like this they need to win.

Portsmouth is always a difficult place to go to. We were lucky not to lose with Kanu's miss and someone else (Benjani?) coming close with a shot. On the other hand, if Yossi had scored in the first half or the Vorinator's shot had dipped under the bar Rafa would be hailed as a tactical genius.
We lost there last season as I recall.
If Liverpool want to win the league we have to beat (or at least not lose to) Man Utd, Arsenal and Chelsea and improve our away form. So far we've beaten Villa and Sunderland and drawn with Portsmouth. All three are games we've lost/drawn in the past. You could say that we dropped two points but I think the performance was so lifeless it's more like one gained.

yom 1

As was said rafa sent a team out more than capable to do the job they didnt. But in all fairness there is not many here who before the season started would have been upset with 11/15 points, unbeaten, a game in hand over Chelsea and United and only 2 penalties conceded one of which was as dodgy as fcuk.

More of the same please (points wise not boring goalless draws:p )

Malice

yom 1 wrote:

only 2 penalties conceded one of which was as dodgy as fcuk.

Haven't we conceded three penalties? Villa, Chelsea and Portsmouth? I think all three were dodgy but that's probably just because I'm biased

yom 1

malice_ wrote:

Haven't we conceded three penalties?

Sorry should have been clearer.

Only 2 goals conceded which were from penalties not open play

PiE

I think he means conceded as in they scored the penos.

Delighted Momo's injured, I think the squad selection is better when Rafa hasn't got him as an option.

Malice

yom 1 wrote:

Sorry should have been clearer.

Only 2 goals conceded which were from penalties not open play

I think I was just being picky You are dead right, the goals conceded statistic makes excellent reading. It's well documented how good our defensive record has been over the last few seasons. What has let us down is not scoring enough. I realise we're just off the back of a 0:0 but I think the early signs are there that players will score more this season.

PHB

yom 1 wrote:

As was said rafa sent a team out more than capable to do the job they didnt.

Maybe, but rotation is one of the toughest parts of being a manager. Maybe playing such a strong team against Derby and then deciding to play that team against Portsmouth was the wrong way around, ultimately, it's the points that count, and the team that played Derby prob woulda beat Portsmouth, and the team that played Portsmouth prob woulda beat Derby.

event

ah i just thought there was no need to rotate yet

its only a couple of games into the season, players cant be tired yet. if he was going to rotate, why not next week at home to birmingham, that would be an easier game surely?

im just suprised he hasnt learned yet

raven136

people need to take it easy,rafa rotates,thats why liverpool are always so fit at the end of the season.we didnt lose and havent yet.

Guy:Incognito

raven136 wrote:

people need to take it easy,rafa rotates,thats why liverpool are always so fit at the end of the season.we didnt lose and havent yet.

What good is being fit when we are out of contention for the league ? So the lads can go off on holidays nice and relaxed?

mike65

Team for the 'morrow

---

Reina
Finnan--Carra--Agger-Arbeloa
Pennant-Alonso-Gerrard-Babel

---

Torrres---Kuyt/Crouch.

Bench - GK, Hyypia, Lucas Leiva, Aurelio, Crouch/Kuyt, Yossi, Vornonin

I can see a case for Crouch starting against a defence that won't have met too many his height.

Mike.

zing

Didn't get to see the game at the weekend but I'm not disappointed by the result - probably because I was expecting it. It's been said on here (by myself amongst others) that we need to get 13 of the 15 points available in Sept to keep ourselves in the race - I'd assumed those 2 points would be lost against Pompey (both because of them being a tough enough team to beat but also because of the international break). We're still on course for that.

Naturally it's always disappointing to drop a couple of points but I'll still be happy if we get the 6 points from Birmingham & Wigan. Three tough games then in Oct and starting the month with 17 points & a game in hand would be a good position to be in - I'm assuming Spurs will get over their poor start to the season.

raven136

Stekelly wrote:

What good is being fit when we are out of contention for the league ? So the lads can go off on holidays nice and relaxed?

i believe fitness and rotation had something to do with liverpool winning a champions league,contesting another and winning the fa cup in 3 seasons

PHB

Probably also something to do with your league positions too.

Guy:Incognito

raven136 wrote:

i believe fitness and rotation had something to do with liverpool winning a champions league,contesting another and winning the fa cup in 3 seasons

I'd glady give up good cup runs to win the league.

Plus takign the league for granted and going easy kind of makes it handier to play well every couple of weeks in Europe.

~Rebel~

Yeah, if we still see ourselves as ONLY a cup team then by all means rotate away in the league and just get the 4th place to go with our cup runs. But i'd be massively annoyed with this, we're better then that, or at least we could be if we show some bottle and go for it.

Someone above said that team was strong enough to get the win - well it wasn't! That team was quite close to being as weak a team as we could send out from the 1st team without including kids, which is a testement to our squad, but we were weak in too many areas. I always figured we'd be solid at least with that team (in fact i was wrong as we really deserved to lose) but as soon as I saw the teamsheet i wondered where the bejesus the goals were going to come from. Unsurprisingly we got none, and didnt even really threaten with the starting 11. Pompy away is a tough tough fixture and Sissoko was not the man to be relying on to get forward and create something. Bruise the midfield, grand, but not anything else. As well as this we had our weakest potential pairing up front. Crouch who has looked pretty rubbish this year next to Voronin, who looks good but would have had to make something from nothing in the team. Any one of these players in with the rest of the first team is fine, but not all of them.

zing

Just watching SSN - Alonso apparently limped out of training today so could be doubtful for tomorrow night.

Zapp Brannigan

Looking forward to tomorrow night. I reckon we should be alright, Porto are lacking a classy striker. Although Quaresma has the ability to change a game, I reckon Arbeloa/Finnan will keep him in check.

Malice

Fat Sam Allardyce is having a go at Benitez here Apparently Benitez is lucky to still be in a job. He would have been sacked had he not reached two Champions League finals in three seasons. Oh and because he's a foreigner he doesn't understand that the league comes first

redspider

~Rebel~ wrote:

Yeah, if we still see ourselves as ONLY a cup team then by all means rotate away in the league and just get the 4th place to go with our cup runs. But i'd be massively annoyed with this, we're better then that, or at least we could be if we show some bottle and go for it.

I agree with you Rebel. If Rafa and Liverpool FC's owners are going to optimize this season on the league first, and the CL 2nd, then the strongest team (or at least a very stong one), should have been put out against Pompey away. Once a win is secured, then and only then rest the players. Its true that a lot of players were on international duty and were being stretched through this series of quick games, with two internationals (Sat, Wed) and matches on Sat and then Tue, so 4 games in 11 days, but if the players werent injured, better put them on win the game and seek a draw in Porto.

In a way I partially blame Gerrard for his over-usage at England as he at times puts playing for his country on an equal pedestal as playing for Liverpool. That's all well and good except that it doesnt fit in with someone that should be optimising for Liverpool and wanting to win the league for Liverpool.

The team selection was a clear indication that Liverpool/Benitez are still optimising for the CL, at least on this occasion. Lets see what happens with future decisions. But its two potential points lost.

Redspider

Mr Alan

TBH, the way i'd look at it is, Benitez thought we could win the game at portsmouth with the team he set out, if it wasn't for poor performances from Crouch and Alonso, i think we would've won, also i think he felt if he played Torres or Gerrard they could run an increased risk of picking up injuries (especially considering both players came off in one of their internationals with knocks and Gerrard was still carrying an injury)

Read somewhere yesterday a list of a few players who picked up injuries at the weekend after their international exertions, and all i could think was that i was glad Gerrard or Torres weren't on it.

The talk of massive changes by our friends at Sky and other scare mongerers are nonsense, Gerrard and Torres were the only two changes imo(and gerrard didnt even play our last game), Carragher was always gonna take his place back, Babel is by no means a certainty and i think none of Alonso/Masch/Sissoko are certainties anymore.

so basically, although it would have been nice to pick up 3 points, we got 1, at a ground we didn't pick up any last year, we are still unbeaten, have yet to concede a goal from open play, and have a game in hand over Chelsea and Utd, i'm very happy with progress being made.

PS- Utd lost at Fratton park last year and still won the league, we got a point without two of our most influential players and in a poor performance. Sounds ok to me.

redspider

> we got 1, at a ground we didn't pick up any last year

Yes, and how many pts were we behind last season ???? Much more than 1!

Allardyce wrote:

'Being a foreigner, Rafa doesn't understand it's supposed to be Premier League first and Champions League second.'

I was no fan of Allardyce before this and am less of a 'fan' now. He fails to understand that there is more money in the CL than in winning the league (ie: the difference between 1st and 4th), and until this changes all managers and owners will have eyes for the CL, and rightly so, if they think they can do well in it.

Also in terms of footballing difficulty, the CL is by far the hardest. Just look at Arsenal, Man Utd and Chelsea to see how many titles they have won recently and how many CL's they have won - none for the latter.

Allardyce should be looking at his own patch instead, and thinking about why Newcastle lost to Derby rather than how Rafa is a foreigner and is good at the CL, etc.

Bugger off .... you'll understand that!

Redspider

Mr Alan

redspider wrote:

> we got 1, at a ground we didn't pick up any last year

Yes, and how many pts were we behind last season ???? Much more than 1!

But how many points better off are we already this year than we were last year?

PiE

I remember at the start of last season we were comparing the progress made from the season before that, claiming that draws away to Middlesbrough were good progress etc. Deja vu.

I agree we should have put out a stronger side for what was always gonna be a tough game, but on the other hand the team needs to learn how to play without Gerrard and, I suppose, Torres.

It's a fairly tough CL group, but I think a loss/draw to Porto tonight would be of less significance to our qualifying from the group than what the 2 points dropped on Saturday could be to our league position at the end of the season.

The Rooster

I think there's been a load of rubbish spoken about the team picked v Pompey, its as if he played the second XI. For chrissakes the only two men who would definitely have improved the team were Gerrard and Torres. And there was good reason for leaving them out given recent knocks. Plus Gerrard's replacement Sissoko had been brilliant in our last away game v Sunderland, and Crouch should have been gagging to put in a big performances after all his moaning. Not Rafa's fault they and the rest of the front 6 did not perform. You can't play well every week, its how you react to the odd bad performance that really counts.

mike65 wrote:

Team for the 'morrow

---

Reina
Finnan--Carra--Agger-Arbeloa
Pennant-Alonso-Gerrard-Babel

---

Torrres---Kuyt/Crouch.

Bench - GK, Hyypia, Lucas Leiva, Aurelio, Crouch/Kuyt, Yossi, Vornonin

I can see a case for Crouch starting against a defence that won't have met too many his height.

Mike.

No chance of Crouch or Alonso starting IMO. Will defo be Kuyt and Mascho. If there is even the slightest doubt over Carra's recent injury (and I think there will be), big Sami will be brought in.

zing

Momo not injured after all it would appear - remained behind on Merseyside awaiting the birth of his first child.
http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/0500liverpoolfc/0100news/tm_headline=fernando-torres-ready-for-next-step%26method=full%26objectid=19809672%26siteid=50061-name_page.html

evil_seed

my team for tonight would be

---

Reina
Finnan--Carra--Agger-Arbeloa
Pennant-Masch-Gerrard-yossi

---

Torrres---Kuyt.

Although if quaresma is on the right i'd have babel with his pace instead of yossi

Tusky

evil_seed wrote:

my team for tonight would be

---

Reina
Finnan--Carra--Agger-Arbeloa
Pennant-Masch-Gerrard-yossi

---

Torrres---Kuyt.

Although if quaresma is on the right i'd have babel with his pace instead of yossi

But Yossi has been absolutely terrible so far...and he started on Saturday. Has to be Babel.

mike65

Terrible? He was great in the Toulouse tie at Anfield.

Mike.

Mr Alan

---

Reina

---

---

Finnan-Agger-Carra-Arbeloa

---

---

Mascherano

---

Pennant--Gerrard--Babel---

---

---

Torres--Kuyt

---

Thats the team i'd like to see, but i think Hypia might start or Yossi instead of Pennant. We'll find out soon enough anyway

~Rebel~

Yossi has been good, but for one bad game. Unfortunately that bad game was his last one and with Babel rested id say he'll come in. Could see Yossi on the right alright, which wouldn't be the end of the world by any means. Think he'll look much better again back in a stronger team with people actually making runs for him.

Miller I've a feeling you might be right with Hypia! Depends on Carra really i guess, if he was rushed back or if he's fully fit and rested from his weeks out. Hoping for Carra Agger anyway.

Im guessing;

Reina
Finnan, Carra, Agger, Arbeloa
Pennant, Gerarrd, Masch, Babel
Kuyt Torres

Which I think is the strongest XI we have at the moment with Alonso looking out of sorts.

Mr Alan

wouldnt mind Voronin starting either tbh, getting him on a free seems to have been amazing business by the rafatullah

mike65

Okay here's the team I submitted to Fantasy Rafa

---

Reina
Finnan-Carra-Agger-Arbeloa
Yossi-Gerrard-Masch-Babel

---

Torres-Kuyt

Mike.

DeadSkin

From SSN team for tonight;

Reina, Arbeloa, Finnan, Carra, Sami, Gerrard, Pennant, Masch , Babel, Kuyt, Torres

Likes the look of that, fancy a few quid on them tonight.

StickyMcGinty

yea, as mentioned earlier, its pretty obvious which competition is Rafas priority...

Liverpool to win 2-1

Guy:Incognito

Poor start to the game bar the goal.

As I said in the other thread, I'd have to lay a lot of the blame for the peno on Reina. Fair enough Hyypia was done for pace, but it was out near the edge of the box, the guy wasnt going far, Reina never should have been there challanging. Especially the way he came flying out, One way or the other the attacker was going down there, I say he was chuffed when he saw Reina sliding out.


Are we only going to concede penos all season or what?

Vokes

Very depressing stuff watching the defenders just hitting it long to Torress / Kuyt. Carragher always seems to be worst for this

Could probably do with going 5 in midfield with Benyoun and Gerread running in behind Torres.

leninbenjamin

SofaKing wrote:

Very depressing stuff watching the defenders just hitting it long to Torress / Kuyt. Carragher always seems to be worst for this

aye, my optimism for liverpool is beginning to sway. same old bad habits are beginning to emerge.

Could probably do with going 5 in midfield with Benyoun and Gerread running in behind Torres.

they don't need 5, they just need the 4 they have to start doing something. i completely forgot Gerrard was on the pitch til he got dispossessed around the 30 min mark.